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[WoW] [Death Knights] I wish I could Death Grip my ottoman

WaltWalt Waller Arcane EnchantedFrozen ElectrifiedRegistered User regular
edited July 2011 in MMO Extravaganza
[Stolen from Zerokku sexcellent post with updates by Projectmayhem - updated for Cataclysm 11.07.10 and continually updated thereafter because I am awesome and I love you]

az_shadowmourne_preview.jpg

Death Knight
Last updated 01/03/10 - Updated some old glyphs and stuff


Death Knight Basics
Overview
The Death Knight is WoW's very first hero class. Players can create one death knight per realm, the player must have a Wrath of the Lich King account and a character of at least level 55 on their account in order to create a death knight. They start off with an epic quest chain from levels 55-58 and even get a free epic mount in the process. The term "Hero Class" refers to their unique lore and elevated starting level.

Many of their abilties revolve around diseases and damage over time abilties as well as "strikes", instant melee attacks that use up a rune and are strengthed by the death knight's own diseases on the target. Think of them as the love child of a warlock and warrior, encased in plate-mail.

Resources
180px-Death_Knight_portrait_with_runes.png
The death knight uses a very unique resource system to govern his spells and abilities known as Runes (bottom bar with six icons). Three rune types exist: blood, frost, and unholy; each with their own specific color and symbol. A death knight has 2 of each rune available to him/her, and only one rune of each type can recharge at a time. Think of the first rune as the "main" rune and the second rune as the "extra tank". There are also abilities that will turn specific runes into what are called "Death Runes" that are essentially a wild card and can act as any of the three rune types. Runes are the death knight's primary resource.

The death knight has a secondary resource to manage, known as Runic Power (blue bar below health), a sort of cross between energy and rage. Runic Power starts at 0 and is gained by using runes and through some talents. While only a few abilties use this resource, It is important to manage it none-the-less. Abilities like Death Coil or Frost Strike are often referred to as "Runic Dumps" abilities that do plenty of damage and use up some of the accumulated runic power.

Class Roles and Specs

The death knight is a dps/tanking hybrid. They can perform both tasks extremely well and provide many useful buffs to the party/raid they are in. They are able to dual-wield and use most two-handed weapons . Like druids, they tank without shields, but with their face. Their tanking mechanics involve high armor and a high chance to parry, as well as self healing strikes and many defensive cooldowns.

Like other classes they have three unique talents trees:

Blood.png The Blood tree enhances the death knight's tanking abilities and vastly improves the ability to heal itself and mitigate damage. Blood death knights are not as disease-dependent as Frost and Unholy. Blood also provides some healing utility and has a useful 10% Attack Power buff that applies to others in their party or raid: Abomination's Might.

Frost.png Frost enhances melee abilities and is the only tree designed for Dual Weild or 2H DPS. It's special abilities focus on the use of Frost Runes (Whoda thunk it?). Frost provides a more crowd control options with Chillblains and Hungering Cold, and some anti-crowd control abilities with Pillar of Frost and Lichborne. Frost also provides some very powerful damage abilities like Frost Strike and Howling Blast. One of the most notable buffs this tree provides is Icy Talons, a 10% melee and ranged haste buff for the party or raid.

Unholy.png Unholy gives the death knight a permanent ghoul pet and enhances its damage done by diseases. It's special abilities focus on the use of wait for it... Unholy runes. It also provides the death knight with a number of magic mitigation bonuses, a gargoyle pet he or she can summon for a brief period of time, and an extra disease. The most notable buff the unholy death knight brings is Ebon Plague, a solid +8% damage for spellcasters.

Cataclysm Changes and New Abilities
spell_deathvortex.pngOutbreak - Instantly applies Blood Plague and Frost Fever to the target enemy. / 30 yd range, Instant, 1 min cooldown

inv_axe_96.pngNecrotic Strike - A vicious strike that deals 100% weapon damage and absorbs the next [ 75% of AP ] healing received by the target. For 15 sec, or until the full amount of healing is absorbed, the target's casting time is increased by 30%. / 1 Unholy, 5 yd range, Instant

spell_holy_consumemagic.pngDark Simulacrum - Places a dark ward on an enemy that persists for 8 sec, triggering when the enemy next spends mana on a single-target spell, and allowing the Death Knight to unleash an exact duplicate of that spell. Against nonplayers, only absorbs some harmful spells. / 20 Runic Power, 40 yd range, Instant, 1 min cooldown

inv_misc_rune_10.pngRunic Empowerment - When you use your Death Coil, Frost Strike, or Rune Strike ability, you have a 45% chance to activate a random fully depleted rune. / Passive

inv_sword_61.pngFestering Strike - An instant attack that deals 150% weapon damage plus 840.54 and increases the duration of your Blood Plague, Frost Fever, and Chains of Ice effects on the target by up to 6 sec. / 1 Blood 1 Frost, 5 yd range, Instant


Common Specs
Taken from EJ. Note that these are min/max specs for PvE. These are guideline specs only - they often ignore survivability talents for the sake of an extra 0.1% DPS. Don't be afraid to experiment! Many of these specs have extra points left over to use.

These specs are all current as of 4.0.6, but may be outdated in future patches.
How can I maximize my DPS?
Death Knights DPS using a Priority System (say goodbye to pre-4.x Rotations!). These are your priority lists, taken from Elitist Jerks:

Frost
Single Target
Diseases > OB if FFUU or DD or KM > BS if BB > Frost Strike at RP cap > Rime > Obliterate > Blood Strike > Frost Strike > Horn of Winter

AOE
HB if both Frost runes and/or both Death runes are up > DnD/PS if both Unholy Runes are up > FS > HB > BS > DnD/PS HoW.

Unholy
Single Target
Diseases > Dark Transformation > SS if both Unholy and/or all Death runes are up > FeS if both pairs of Blood and Frost runes are up > DC if SD, 100 RP, will overcap RP with anything else or if RC isn’t up > SS > FeS > DC > HoW.

AOE
Diseases > Dark Transformation > Death and Decay > SS if both Unholy and/or all Death runes are up > BB + IT if both pairs of Blood and Frost runes are up > DC if SD, 100 RP, will overcap RP with anything else or if RC isn’t up > SS > BB + IT > DC > HoW.

Common Abbreviations
BBFFUU - Rune Resources (ie: BB = 2 blood runes active)
AM - Abomination's Might
AMS - Anti-Magic Shell
AMZ - Anti-Magic Zone
AotD - Army of the Dead
BA - Bladed Armor
BB - Blood Boil
BP - Blood Plague
BS - Blood Strike
BT - Blood Tap
DC - Death Coil
DG - Death Grip
DK - Death Knight
DnD - Death and Decay
DRW - Dancing Rune Weapon
DT - Dark Transformation
DS - Death Strike
DSim - Dark Simulacrum
EP - Ebon Plague
ERW - Empower Rune Weapon
FeS - Festering Strike
FF - Frost Fever
FP - Frost Presence
HS - Heart Strike
HB - Howling Blast
HC - Hungering Cold
HoW - Horn of Winter
IBF - Icebound Fortitude
IT - Icy Touch
IUP - Improved Unholy Presence
MF - Mind Freeze
MotFW - Might of the Frozen Wastes
NS - Necrotic Strike
OB - Obliterate
PoF - Pillar of Frost
PS - Plague Strike
RC - Runic Corruption
RE - Runic Empowerment
RI - Resilient Infection
RP - Runic Power
RPM - Runic Power Mastery
SD - Sudden Doom
SF - Scarlet Fever
SI - Shadow Infusion
SS - Scourge Strike
UB - Unholy Blight
UF - Unholy Frenzy
UP - Unholy Presence


Excellent Death Knight resources

Elitist Jerks DK subforum - http://elitistjerks.com/f72/ - Go here for up to date information about Specs, Gemming, Gearing, Priorities, anything and everything related to PvE

Arena Junkies DK subforum - http://www.arenajunkies.com/forumdisplay.php?f=111 - PvPer funfest. Read the stickies to l2p.

Walt on
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Posts

  • WaltWalt Waller Arcane Enchanted Frozen ElectrifiedRegistered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Pretty cool Cataclysm blood tanking video:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dfZiEzvA7UY&feature=player_embedded

    Walt on
  • Wicked Uncle ErnieWicked Uncle Ernie Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    I keep seeing "rotation" questions. There is no such thing anymore. The dynamic is now using RP to trigger a rune, allowing you to use your favorite strike more. (Or for UH to increase Rune regen)

    Unholy gets Festering strike, which you use to turn Death Runes and refresh diseases. Death Coil is your #1 priority. Not only can it trigger your 100% rune regen, but it increases ghoul damage and triggers the transform. Followed by Festering if disease timers are low, or if no UH or Death runes are up. Scourge strike for any UH or Death runes. Blood strike will be used once at the beginning of your rotation. Pop gargoyle with personal buffs and BL, if possible. (Frenzy ALWAYS before garg, plus racial and trinkets.)

    Frost is mainly watching your procs. Again diseases up, you have to refresh manually, but HB for FF, which is nice. Use Frost strike to turn runes, keep an eye on KM procs for OBLITERATE or HB in AoE situations Frost strike if oblit isnt available. Use rime when its up. easy.

    Unholy is currently better DPS for equal gear level. Gem for str, and then str, maybe some str. on the side, str. Unless you need hit.

    Everything I've just written is with raiding in mind, and written quickly, but that's the basic gist of it. DPS on a DK isn't quite so mechanical, which i really like.

    I already posted something about how to make threat in the old thread, I have very good gear, but I hold threat off 2 psycho 18-20k DPS mages and a similar Fury warrior. So that advice will hold true to whatever gear level you have. Obviously, if someone far outgears you, holding threat will be an issue. If threat is your problem, Get to hitcap, get expertise capped, make sure your avoidance isnt in the gutter. YES, you'll go through rune starved moments. that's why you glyph DRW and get a good lead on threat right at the start.

    The DK mastery is very cool. It's also not really needed for this content. IF your stats arent all that great, don't scuttle them for mastery. That'll change when you can start getting 100% + mastery.

    Wicked Uncle Ernie on
  • WaltWalt Waller Arcane Enchanted Frozen ElectrifiedRegistered User regular
    edited November 2010
    I keep seeing "rotation" questions. There is no such thing anymore. The dynamic is now using RP to trigger a rune, allowing you to use your favorite strike more. (Or for UH to increase Rune regen)

    Unholy gets Festering strike, which you use to turn Death Runes and refresh diseases. Death Coil is your #1 priority. Not only can it trigger your 100% rune regen, but it increases ghoul damage and triggers the transform. Followed by Festering if disease timers are low, or if no UH or Death runes are up. Scourge strike for any UH or Death runes. Blood strike will be used once at the beginning of your rotation. Pop gargoyle with personal buffs and BL, if possible. (Frenzy ALWAYS before garg, plus racial and trinkets.)

    Frost is mainly watching your procs. Again diseases up, you have to refresh manually, but HB for FF, which is nice. Use Frost strike to turn runes, keep an eye on KM procs for OBLITERATE or HB in AoE situations Frost strike if oblit isnt available. Use rime when its up. easy.

    Unholy is currently better DPS for equal gear level. Gem for str, and then str, maybe some str. on the side, str. Unless you need hit.

    Everything I've just written is with raiding in mind, and written quickly, but that's the basic gist of it. DPS on a DK isn't quite so mechanical, which i really like.

    I already posted something about how to make threat in the old thread, I have very good gear, but I hold threat off 2 psycho 18-20k DPS mages and a similar Fury warrior. So that advice will hold true to whatever gear level you have. Obviously, if someone far outgears you, holding threat will be an issue. If threat is your problem, Get to hitcap, get expertise capped, make sure your avoidance isnt in the gutter. YES, you'll go through rune starved moments. that's why you glyph DRW and get a good lead on threat right at the start.

    The DK mastery is very cool. It's also not really needed for this content. IF your stats arent all that great, don't scuttle them for mastery. That'll change when you can start getting 100% + mastery.

    Added priority lists to OP under "How can I maximize my DPS?"

    Walt on
  • ToldoToldo But actually, WeegianRegistered User regular
    edited November 2010
    I'm just getting back into the whole DKing thing, and I'm running around as UH. The rotation I've been using is IT --> PS --> SS --> FS, then SS --> FS after that (and DC whenever it's up). Am I doing it right...?

    Toldo on
  • WaltWalt Waller Arcane Enchanted Frozen ElectrifiedRegistered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Toldo wrote: »
    I'm just getting back into the whole DKing thing, and I'm running around as UH. The rotation I've been using is IT --> PS --> SS --> FS, then SS --> FS after that (and DC whenever it's up). Am I doing it right...?

    No. But you can be very soon! Check the OP for the Priority List for Unholy spec. What you want to do is see what options are available to you and always pick the option highest on the priority list. Since the priority is not 100% straightforward (like, say, pre-Cataclysm Retribution Paladins), you'll have to watch your runes/RP and make the best decision. It's more challenging at first but it becomes automatic pretty quickly.

    Walt on
  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Toldo wrote: »
    I'm just getting back into the whole DKing thing, and I'm running around as UH. The rotation I've been using is IT --> PS --> SS --> FS, then SS --> FS after that (and DC whenever it's up). Am I doing it right...?

    You are close.

    Basically, put up diseases and then Scourge Strike if you have an Unholy or Death Rune up.
    Let your Blood runes and Frost runes regen and then, when you have one of each, Festering Strike.
    Weave Death Coils into any dead time or to keep yourself from maxing out on RP.
    Pay attention to Runic Corruption and don't DC when it's already active.

    That's the basics. Blow your cooldowns (Gargoyle and Unholy Frenzy) when appropriate.

    Use Dark Transformation as soon as it's ready and try and pool some RP while your ghoul is transformed so you can quickly DC a bunch (without overwriting RC procs!) and get him retransformed as soon as possible when it falls off.

    shryke on
  • fortyforty Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Almost no DPS spec has a "rotation" anymore. It's just a more convenient term than "priority queue" and anyone who isn't being a snobby pedant knows what someone means or is asking about if they use the term "rotation."

    Edit: Stupid fingers.

    forty on
  • Wicked Uncle ErnieWicked Uncle Ernie Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Walt wrote: »
    I keep seeing "rotation" questions. There is no such thing anymore. The dynamic is now using RP to trigger a rune, allowing you to use your favorite strike more. (Or for UH to increase Rune regen)

    Unholy gets Festering strike, which you use to turn Death Runes and refresh diseases. Death Coil is your #1 priority. Not only can it trigger your 100% rune regen, but it increases ghoul damage and triggers the transform. Followed by Festering if disease timers are low, or if no UH or Death runes are up. Scourge strike for any UH or Death runes. Blood strike will be used once at the beginning of your rotation. Pop gargoyle with personal buffs and BL, if possible. (Frenzy ALWAYS before garg, plus racial and trinkets.)

    Frost is mainly watching your procs. Again diseases up, you have to refresh manually, but HB for FF, which is nice. Use Frost strike to turn runes, keep an eye on KM procs for OBLITERATE or HB in AoE situations Frost strike if oblit isnt available. Use rime when its up. easy.

    Unholy is currently better DPS for equal gear level. Gem for str, and then str, maybe some str. on the side, str. Unless you need hit.

    Everything I've just written is with raiding in mind, and written quickly, but that's the basic gist of it. DPS on a DK isn't quite so mechanical, which i really like.

    I already posted something about how to make threat in the old thread, I have very good gear, but I hold threat off 2 psycho 18-20k DPS mages and a similar Fury warrior. So that advice will hold true to whatever gear level you have. Obviously, if someone far outgears you, holding threat will be an issue. If threat is your problem, Get to hitcap, get expertise capped, make sure your avoidance isnt in the gutter. YES, you'll go through rune starved moments. that's why you glyph DRW and get a good lead on threat right at the start.

    The DK mastery is very cool. It's also not really needed for this content. IF your stats arent all that great, don't scuttle them for mastery. That'll change when you can start getting 100% + mastery.

    Added priority lists to OP under "How can I maximize my DPS?"

    Sweet, thanks, here's tanking priority:

    No diseases single target. DS every 6 seconds for shield, (if you have enough stats to go around, try to reforge for 66% shields). RS when available. HS when DS/RS unavailable. easy enough. Death Coil is usually not recommended, only use when no runes are up, you're at 100 RP AND DRW is on CD. Always use Rune Tap on cooldown, use it for a DS.

    For snap aggro:

    DS HS HS DS (save RP, no RS.) Pop DRW, then DS HS HS DS DS (rune tap here) (RS when it's up) RS is priority for threat. Depending on RNG you'll either have a lead on threat, or have a giant lead on threat, if RS procced a lot. This is a bit organic, you are reliant of a procced proc, but DRW is huge for threat. with it up you should be over or nearing 60% avoidance. If you have DPS breathing down your throat the entire fight as i usually do, DRW on cooldown. (this is not recommended unless you have kickass healers, but i even turn my back to the boss and take a couple hits to get vengance up there, lol. with a full stack im at 13k Attack power, so its incredible for threat. well...depending on the boss. LK not so much.) Also, use death runes as though they were UH/frost runes for single target. Don't use em for HS.

    Frost Fever is an important Debuff, as is crimson fever (whatever its called) It's easy to pop a BB in place of a HS, doesn't screw your rotation. But an IT will. So, if you find yourself with a decent threat lead, use your Rune Taps on an IT, and BB in place of a HS every 30 seconds.

    AOE snap aggro: Tab targetting is your friend. RS will always be up. Use OMEN. Pop a RS on any mob you may be loosing. Tidy Plates is also awesome for keeping track of adds that may get loose, or have gotten loose.

    Dnd BB BB then disease - pest. BB as much as you can if you have more than 5 mobs, otherwise tab targeting and Heat Striking is more effective. RS then BB the procced runes. DS when you are out of Blood/Death runes.

    Wicked Uncle Ernie on
  • TheLawinatorTheLawinator Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    So, I just resubbed and made one of these since I never got a chance to fully explore the class. What's a solid suggestion for a leveling spec?

    TheLawinator on
    My SteamID Gamertag and PSN: TheLawinator
  • WaltWalt Waller Arcane Enchanted Frozen ElectrifiedRegistered User regular
    edited November 2010
    You can do any spec really. I'd go with either 2H Frost or Unholy, since nice 2handers are easier upgrades while you level.

    Walt on
  • Wicked Uncle ErnieWicked Uncle Ernie Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    So, I just resubbed and made one of these since I never got a chance to fully explore the class. What's a solid suggestion for a leveling spec?

    Blood is tanking, Frost/UH for DPS. you have to fill out a tree entirely in order to get your sub tree unlocked, so you'll be stuck in one tree to begin with. Don't worry about how you spend your points, you can't gimp yourself that much. Just do what you like and have fun....worry about uber DPS and all that later. x2 on the 2H upgrades go DW later.. I'd bet UH would be easier to level with, while tanking would allow you jsut instaqueue for dungeons. Maybe not in Cata, but for now at least.

    Wicked Uncle Ernie on
  • TheLawinatorTheLawinator Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Figured I'd go with blood for now, seems to be working out well.

    Edit: Finished the starter area, got tossed out in SW, where should I go from here?

    TheLawinator on
    My SteamID Gamertag and PSN: TheLawinator
  • tarnoktarnok Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Figured I'd go with blood for now, seems to be working out well.

    Edit: Finished the starter area, got tossed out in SW, where should I go from here?

    Outlands. You can catch a portal to the blasted lands from the mage tower in SW, or as a DK you have nearly all of the flight points in Azeroth already so it wouldn't take long to fly there.

    tarnok on
    Wii Code:
    0431-6094-6446-7088
  • INeedNoSaltINeedNoSalt with blood on my teeth Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Does anyone have any ideas on how to play blood?

    I feel like when I'm tanking in Blood (level 72), I am constantly sitting on cooldowns with nothing up -- no runes, no RP, can't do anything.

    INeedNoSalt on
  • Munkus BeaverMunkus Beaver You don't have to attend every argument you are invited to. Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    edited November 2010
    What spec are you using?

    Munkus Beaver on
    Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
  • INeedNoSaltINeedNoSalt with blood on my teeth Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Whups, Blood spec, looks like this atm: http://wowtal.com/#k=aujmJ96G.a7t.deathknight.

    my main spec is Frost and I feel like I have an easier time just ... doing things in that spec, although blood makes it a lot easier to tank without dying.

    INeedNoSalt on
  • WaltWalt Waller Arcane Enchanted Frozen ElectrifiedRegistered User regular
    edited November 2010
    I'm not the person to ask about this being as I've spent all of an hour in post-4.0 Blood spec but I was tanking just fine at 80 and there times when I couldn't really do anything. I was using DS every six seconds or so to keep the shield going and using heart strike when rune strike wasn't available and I got rune starved a time or two.

    I hear the 20% recharge improvement currently in beta will help a lot.

    Walt on
  • shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Blood is ... usable but not really working properly right now. The major overhauls that at least made it good enough for tanking aren't on live yet.

    Once the rune strike and rune recharge fixes come through, we'll be better.

    shryke on
  • troublebrewingtroublebrewing Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    "Diseases > OB if FFUU or DD or KM > BS if BB > Frost Strike at RP cap > Rime > Obliterate > Blood Strike > Frost Strike > Horn of Winter"

    Not seeing some of these abreviations in the list in the OP. Could somebody translate this into noobspeak for me?

    troublebrewing on
  • Grape ApeGrape Ape Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    "Diseases > OB if FFUU or DD or KM > BS if BB > Frost Strike at RP cap > Rime > Obliterate > Blood Strike > Frost Strike > Horn of Winter"

    Not seeing some of these abreviations in the list in the OP. Could somebody translate this into noobspeak for me?

    "FFUU" refers to 'Frost Frost Unholy Unholy' --> that is, both pairs of frost and unholy runes are up.
    Similarly, "DD" refers to both blood runes being up as 'Death' runes, and "BB" is if you have both Blood runes up.

    Grape Ape on
  • WaltWalt Waller Arcane Enchanted Frozen ElectrifiedRegistered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Grape Ape wrote: »
    "Diseases > OB if FFUU or DD or KM > BS if BB > Frost Strike at RP cap > Rime > Obliterate > Blood Strike > Frost Strike > Horn of Winter"

    Not seeing some of these abreviations in the list in the OP. Could somebody translate this into noobspeak for me?

    "FFUU" refers to 'Frost Frost Unholy Unholy' --> that is, both pairs of frost and unholy runes are up.
    Similarly, "DD" refers to both blood runes being up as 'Death' runes, and "BB" is if you have both Blood runes up.

    I added this to the OP as well as AOE Priorities.

    Let it be known that I've been Frost for a week and I miss Unholy somethin' fierce. PvP Weapon, you can't come soon enough. I miss you Gravegobbler.

    Walt on
  • fortyforty Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    It seems to me that Frost DKs (and DPS warriors) should be given some sort of threat management ability, as they will probably be the most threat constrained specs in Cataclysm.

    forty on
  • troublebrewingtroublebrewing Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    What is OB if not Obliterate?

    also what Prime Glyphs are people using (all specs)? I guess armory isnt showing prime glyphs for whatever reason when I go to look.

    Think I'm gonna try some blood tanking tonight.

    troublebrewing on
  • XehalusXehalus Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    What is OB if not Obliterate?

    also what Prime Glyphs are people using (all specs)? I guess armory isnt showing prime glyphs for whatever reason when I go to look.

    Think I'm gonna try some blood tanking tonight.
    I recommend bookmarking www.wowpopular.com considering it's definately useful for talents/gylph questions.

    Xehalus on
  • WaltWalt Waller Arcane Enchanted Frozen ElectrifiedRegistered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Added Glyphs to OP under Specs

    Walt on
  • troublebrewingtroublebrewing Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    thanks guys. Interesting, I figured DnD was a shoe in for prime glyph.

    OMG WHAT IS OB?

    troublebrewing on
  • WaltWalt Waller Arcane Enchanted Frozen ElectrifiedRegistered User regular
    edited November 2010
    thanks guys. Interesting, I figured DnD was a shoe in for prime glyph.

    OMG WHAT IS OB?

    Obliterate. I'm adding Frost abbreviations in, for some reason I forgot them.
    EDIT: Added

    Walt on
  • troublebrewingtroublebrewing Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Okay sorry, I just figured it was something else since I saw Obliterate spelled out elsewhere. Thanks!

    troublebrewing on
  • fortyforty Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    It could be Outbreak come Cataclysm!

    forty on
  • INeedNoSaltINeedNoSalt with blood on my teeth Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    how does DW frost compare to 2H frost?

    INeedNoSalt on
  • MgcwMgcw Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    DW is better than 2h at the moment, but both are very good.

    Mgcw on
  • troublebrewingtroublebrewing Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    I noticed it seems like DW has better DPS talents than 2h but I'm sticking with 2h merely because I have an heirloom and I never see any decent weapons drop in instances. I'll probably go DW once I hit 80.

    troublebrewing on
  • Grape ApeGrape Ape Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    I'm actually a little surprised that DW allegedly pulls ahead of 2h for frost.

    You'd think that 2H would be inherently better pre cata content due to current itemization on one handers...

    Grape Ape on
  • WaltWalt Waller Arcane Enchanted Frozen ElectrifiedRegistered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Grape Ape wrote: »
    I'm actually a little surprised that DW allegedly pulls ahead of 2h for frost.

    You'd think that 2H would be inherently better pre cata content due to current itemization on one handers...

    It's especially curious since Shadowmourne is the reason Unholy DPS comes out on top of all DPS specs with BiS gear. Maybe this points to 2H Frost gaining slightly less benefit from weapon damage compared to Unholy? But, that would set it up to always be behind Unholy in 2H Weapon DPS. I have absolutely no math to back this up, by the way.

    Walt on
  • simsim Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    As DW frost, I basically feel like I'm soloing heroics right now.

    Has there been any word on removing the runestrike proc for tanks? It sounds like they can't decide how to make the mechanic work for just tanking mode - I say nerf the damage some and add a threat boost, making it spamable for all.

    sim on
  • Liquid GhostLiquid Ghost DO YOU HEAR THE VOICES, TOO?! Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    I tried DW Frost for a while, but didn't have enough Hit or Expertise to make it work out as well as it could have. I went to 2H Frost and found that I enjoyed it immensely. Tons of KM procs and a pile of Runic Power that I almost had to struggle to burn through. I just need to work out a way to save my runes for Obliterate so I can use it more often with KM instead of having to Frost Strike 90% of the time.

    Liquid Ghost on
  • simsim Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    I tried DW Frost for a while, but didn't have enough Hit or Expertise to make it work out as well as it could have. I went to 2H Frost and found that I enjoyed it immensely. Tons of KM procs and a pile of Runic Power that I almost had to struggle to burn through. I just need to work out a way to save my runes for Obliterate so I can use it more often with KM instead of having to Frost Strike 90% of the time.

    I believe that you need less hit overall as DW than 2H. Reforge into mastery and you won't mind more frost strikes. :winky:

    Nvm - as 2H frost, you're reforging into haste(?). This is why DW hits so hard. You're in frost pres for %dmg increase, equipping mastery to increase frost damage %, and since your runes have much longer CDs FS will likely be your most used skill unless you have lucky empower procs. Oh, and you're also stacking cinderglacier or razorice.

    sim on
  • Liquid GhostLiquid Ghost DO YOU HEAR THE VOICES, TOO?! Registered User regular
    edited November 2010
    I keep forgetting about Mastery. That's probably the last thing I should be spacing out on. I still have my Tankards in the bank, each eagerly waiting to crush skulls for The Great Devourer. Seeing a DK dual-wielding gigantic mugs of ale is an interesting experience. Shame my DK isn't a dwarf.

    Yet.

    Liquid Ghost on
  • ToldoToldo But actually, WeegianRegistered User regular
    edited November 2010
    So, EJ recommends taking Glyph of Anti-Magic Shell. When are you supposed to have AMS up?

    Toldo on
  • WaltWalt Waller Arcane Enchanted Frozen ElectrifiedRegistered User regular
    edited November 2010
    Toldo wrote: »
    So, EJ recommends taking Glyph of Anti-Magic Shell. When are you supposed to have AMS up?
    AMS when there is magic damage to negate the damage and give yourself a fat RP injection.

    Walt on
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