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Castle Bravo, a [chat]

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Posts

  • VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    poshniallo wrote: »
    This conversation is interesting from an ideological point of view. Comedy as consumer good rather than as non-commodified aspect of oral culture.

    Commodification. It's the craze that's sweeping the nation.

    there are other types of value besides monetary

    I value humor whether I pay for it or not

    BNet-Vari#1998 | Switch-SW 6960 6688 8388 | Steam | Twitch
    Tav
  • InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    Eddy wrote: »
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    yes let us all unite in hatred of meaningless references substituting for humor

    is this why you post imgur stuff ad nauseum? Because you want us all to see the truth behind this post?

    Shots fired.

    PowerpuppiesHakkekagejakobagger
  • AbdhyiusAbdhyius Registered User regular
    Variable wrote: »
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I guess, also, I just could not care less if one of my friends is straight stealing jokes from a comedian. If they are delivering with good timing, at good times in the conversation, and making me laugh? I do not care a single bit. I mean if they are just rattling off a comedians stand up routine for no reason, well, that is awkward conversation.

    My friend's aren't professional comedians, they aren't going to go on stage, they aren't going to try to make money off of the jokes, the comedian who came up with the joke has zero impact on their life from this.

    I see no reason to care at all.

    this I can't argue with

    but me?

    that would piss me off. maybe I value a strong sense of humor too much but someone using someone else's work to pass themselves off as funny and creative is fucked up to me. it may not be monetary, but there is something of value they are earning through dishonesty.

    To me someone who makes me laugh is funny to me. If it is their own jokes, someone else's, whatever, if they are making me laugh they are funny. Jokes in conversations are almost entirely timing, flow, etc anyway. And, once again, if someone says something funny to me I do not assume they came up with it, nor do I assume that they stole it. I simply do not care if they came up with it or stole it, because it was funny and it is making me laugh. If I explicitly ask them if it was original or not, and they lie? Yes, that is messed up, because they are lying. If someone tells a joke and makes no further claims about it I see no reason to assume or care if it is original or not.

    Like, if I am having a conversation with someone and they bring in an idea from some textbook or philosopher they read I do not assume they invented it or that they are quoting someone. It is just a thing they know or believe for whatever reason. If I asked them where it was from I would expect them to be honest with me, but otherwise it is really irrelevant to the conversation at hand. I do not think someone is less smart for having their ideas from things they have read, nor do I think someone is less funny for having jokes from things they have heard. What they are not is professionals in those fields.

    creative vs academic

    if someone was jamming on a guitar and playing other people's music it'd bug me if they passed it off as their own... but I don't expect them to explain who discovered the chords they're using (or whatever, idk how to say that. invented the chords, whatever)

    but you do expect them to explain the song instead of just playing a song?

    they just wanted to play a nice song and didn't really see a reason that you'd care who made it

    I said if they passed it off as their own

    yeah but you left a bit of space there inbetween

    ftOqU21.png
  • OrganichuOrganichu jacobkosh Registered User regular
    Tav wrote: »
    Organichu wrote: »
    Tav wrote: »
    Organichu wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I guess, also, I just could not care less if one of my friends is straight stealing jokes from a comedian. If they are delivering with good timing, at good times in the conversation, and making me laugh? I do not care a single bit. I mean if they are just rattling off a comedians stand up routine for no reason, well, that is awkward conversation.

    My friend's aren't professional comedians, they aren't going to go on stage, they aren't going to try to make money off of the jokes, the comedian who came up with the joke has zero impact on their life from this.

    I see no reason to care at all.

    this I can't argue with

    but me?

    that would piss me off. maybe I value a strong sense of humor too much but someone using someone else's work to pass themselves off as funny and creative is fucked up to me. it may not be monetary, but there is something of value they are earning through dishonesty.

    but this is the divide, right.

    it's only dishonest if they labor under the belief that you think they made this comment.

    let's say there's a little throwaway line i heard in a standup performance, once. it's like, 15 words tops. i use it in response to something you say since it fits and the conversation. it makes you laugh. i do not cite it because it doesn't even occur to me that you are thinking i came up with it. maybe i came up with it, maybe i didn't? but in my social circle, there is nothing weird about just mixing your own thoughts and ones you've heard elsewhere.

    so in that situation, what can really be said?

    i guess you could say that you now think i am funnier than i really am

    but i certainly didn't 'pass myself off as funny and creative' with someone else's work. that implies a conscious, active deceit it seems like? i never even considered that you would care about the origin of the line.

    I would say that knowingly using someone else's joke in that situation would be a conscious and active deceit, even if the other person doesn't know or care.

    what is the deceit? i'm only misrepresenting the truth if the understood truth is "john thought that up on his own just now". that is not, i think, the universal assumption. maybe for you it is, so i could consider this in future conversations with you. but with plenty of people, this is definitionally not deceitful in any way.

    Before this conversation, I was under the impression that it was. It might still be! I dunno, this thread isn't a wonderful sample size.

    i mean, it's definitely not. like half a dozen separate people have agreed with my posts on this matter.

    i don't know if the majority of people think like you or if the majority think like me? but it's pretty much indisputably not 99.9% in one camp vs the other

    PowerpuppiesInquisitor
  • AbdhyiusAbdhyius Registered User regular
    Organichu wrote: »
    chu do you have more booze because

    hair of the dog

    i have literally never felt better by doing this

    drinking more to recover from a hangover?

    yeah i'm pretty sure "hair of the dog" is a synonym for "i am an alcoholic"

    no I'm not

    ftOqU21.png
  • AbdhyiusAbdhyius Registered User regular
    I mean no it's not

    ftOqU21.png
    HappylilElf
  • HakkekageHakkekage Space Whore Academy summa cum laudeRegistered User regular
    Weekends are criminally short

    3DS: 2165 - 6538 - 3417
    NNID: Hakkekage
    VariableEvil Multifarious
  • AManFromEarthAManFromEarth Let's get to twerk! The King in the SwampRegistered User regular
    Rabbit update.

    He is shedding his winter coat. He has also chewed apart the power cable to our vacuum.

    Emergency trip to Target is go go go.

    Lh96QHG.png
  • AbdhyiusAbdhyius Registered User regular
    Eddy wrote: »
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    yes let us all unite in hatred of meaningless references substituting for humor

    is this why you post imgur stuff ad nauseum? Because you want us all to see the truth behind this post?

    oh no that's because i like pictures and I share them

    ftOqU21.png
  • VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »

    I said if they passed it off as their own

    yeah but you left a bit of space there inbetween

    I don't know what this means

    BNet-Vari#1998 | Switch-SW 6960 6688 8388 | Steam | Twitch
  • HakkekageHakkekage Space Whore Academy summa cum laudeRegistered User regular
    Rabbit update.

    He is shedding his winter coat. He has also chewed apart the power cable to our vacuum.

    Emergency trip to Target is go go go.

    I didn't know you had a bunny

    Pics or Easter is cancelled

    3DS: 2165 - 6538 - 3417
    NNID: Hakkekage
  • AbdhyiusAbdhyius Registered User regular
    Variable wrote: »
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »

    I said if they passed it off as their own

    yeah but you left a bit of space there inbetween

    I don't know what this means

    sorry

    I mean you had pass it off as their own and then explain every minute detail on the other

    if I pick up a guitar and start strumming or start playing the piano in the hall would you assume that I was passing things off as my own if I didn't say anything about who wrote the music?

    ftOqU21.png
  • TavTav Registered User regular
    Organichu wrote: »
    Tav wrote: »
    Organichu wrote: »
    Tav wrote: »
    Organichu wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I guess, also, I just could not care less if one of my friends is straight stealing jokes from a comedian. If they are delivering with good timing, at good times in the conversation, and making me laugh? I do not care a single bit. I mean if they are just rattling off a comedians stand up routine for no reason, well, that is awkward conversation.

    My friend's aren't professional comedians, they aren't going to go on stage, they aren't going to try to make money off of the jokes, the comedian who came up with the joke has zero impact on their life from this.

    I see no reason to care at all.

    this I can't argue with

    but me?

    that would piss me off. maybe I value a strong sense of humor too much but someone using someone else's work to pass themselves off as funny and creative is fucked up to me. it may not be monetary, but there is something of value they are earning through dishonesty.

    but this is the divide, right.

    it's only dishonest if they labor under the belief that you think they made this comment.

    let's say there's a little throwaway line i heard in a standup performance, once. it's like, 15 words tops. i use it in response to something you say since it fits and the conversation. it makes you laugh. i do not cite it because it doesn't even occur to me that you are thinking i came up with it. maybe i came up with it, maybe i didn't? but in my social circle, there is nothing weird about just mixing your own thoughts and ones you've heard elsewhere.

    so in that situation, what can really be said?

    i guess you could say that you now think i am funnier than i really am

    but i certainly didn't 'pass myself off as funny and creative' with someone else's work. that implies a conscious, active deceit it seems like? i never even considered that you would care about the origin of the line.

    I would say that knowingly using someone else's joke in that situation would be a conscious and active deceit, even if the other person doesn't know or care.

    what is the deceit? i'm only misrepresenting the truth if the understood truth is "john thought that up on his own just now". that is not, i think, the universal assumption. maybe for you it is, so i could consider this in future conversations with you. but with plenty of people, this is definitionally not deceitful in any way.

    Before this conversation, I was under the impression that it was. It might still be! I dunno, this thread isn't a wonderful sample size.

    i mean, it's definitely not. like half a dozen separate people have agreed with my posts on this matter.

    i don't know if the majority of people think like you or if the majority think like me? but it's pretty much indisputably not 99.9% in one camp vs the other

    Well, there's my opinion on your hypothetical for what it's worth.

  • AManFromEarthAManFromEarth Let's get to twerk! The King in the SwampRegistered User regular
    Hakkekage wrote: »
    Rabbit update.

    He is shedding his winter coat. He has also chewed apart the power cable to our vacuum.

    Emergency trip to Target is go go go.

    I didn't know you had a bunny

    Pics or Easter is cancelled

    He came with my fiancé but he's pretty great.

    When I get back I'll see if I can make this work on mobile.

    Lh96QHG.png
  • msmyamsmya Being Fabulous Registered User regular
    edited March 2014
    Hey guys, so , I just woke up.

    Which means I slept for approximately 21 hours, not including breaks

    msmya on
    38993_100.png
  • VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    Variable wrote: »

    I said if they passed it off as their own

    yeah but you left a bit of space there inbetween

    I don't know what this means

    sorry

    I mean you had pass it off as their own and then explain every minute detail on the other

    if I pick up a guitar and start strumming or start playing the piano in the hall would you assume that I was passing things off as my own if I didn't say anything about who wrote the music?

    it would vary depending on what I was hearing

    useful answer right?

    BNet-Vari#1998 | Switch-SW 6960 6688 8388 | Steam | Twitch
    Tav
  • ElendilElendil Registered User regular
    i think comedy is probably super vulnerable to this sort of the thing because it's socially really valuable while also is mostly regarded as something anyone with an asshole is capable of doing

    i can't think of many other art forms where someone would assume you made it unless you were like, established as whatever artist

    maybe writing? cribbing a blog post for like, an interesting facebook status would be a kind of low level dick move too, i think

    TavVariableEvil Multifarious
  • InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    English this year at my school is supposed to be conversation focused.

    So my warm ups need to be conversation focused.

    Having a hard time thinking of ways to make people who don't want to have conversations have conversations.

  • VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    I meant to go to bed an hour ago so I could wake up super early and do homework fffffffffffffffffffffffffuck

    this conversation was too important

    BNet-Vari#1998 | Switch-SW 6960 6688 8388 | Steam | Twitch
  • VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    English this year at my school is supposed to be conversation focused.

    So my warm ups need to be conversation focused.

    Having a hard time thinking of ways to make people who don't want to have conversations have conversations.

    I suggest breaking the ice with a joke

    there's this one about a sandwich

    BNet-Vari#1998 | Switch-SW 6960 6688 8388 | Steam | Twitch
  • InquisitorInquisitor Registered User regular
    msmya wrote: »
    Hey guys, so , I just woke up.

    Which means I slept for approximately 21 hours, not including breaks

    That's uh... That's not good. You gotta take care of yourself girl!

  • TavTav Registered User regular
    Variable wrote: »
    I meant to go to bed an hour ago so I could wake up super early and do homework fffffffffffffffffffffffffuck

    this conversation was too important

    my alarms are set for three hours from now

    but someone on the internet disagreed with me damnit

    VariableHappylilElfAbdhyiusskippydumptruckkedinik
  • HakkekageHakkekage Space Whore Academy summa cum laudeRegistered User regular
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    English this year at my school is supposed to be conversation focused.

    So my warm ups need to be conversation focused.

    Having a hard time thinking of ways to make people who don't want to have conversations have conversations.

    Hey guy, how are you? Are you prepared for the English pop quiz? Do you want to know the answers?

    3DS: 2165 - 6538 - 3417
    NNID: Hakkekage
  • HappylilElfHappylilElf Registered User regular
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    English this year at my school is supposed to be conversation focused.

    So my warm ups need to be conversation focused.

    Having a hard time thinking of ways to make people who don't want to have conversations have conversations.

    Alchohol

  • LudiousLudious I just wanted a sandwich A temporally dislocated QuiznosRegistered User regular
    seriously I have been going to the gym like 4 times a week how come this rose garden did me in

    why

    why

    everything hurts

    and I dropped a wall stone on the side of my leg and got a nasty scrape that hurts way more than it looks like it should

    fuck the outdoors just fuck it

    HakkekageDeebaserKageraApothe0sis
  • TavTav Registered User regular
    also whoo boy did this conversation open me up to scrutiny if I ever post videos of my standup here

    :bz

  • HakkekageHakkekage Space Whore Academy summa cum laudeRegistered User regular
    Ludious wrote: »
    seriously I have been going to the gym like 4 times a week how come this rose garden did me in

    why

    why

    everything hurts

    and I dropped a wall stone on the side of my leg and got a nasty scrape that hurts way more than it looks like it should

    fuck the outdoors just fuck it
    Mother Nature doesn't have barbells

    My sister asked me to open the pickle jar yesterday because apparently I have all these muscles from the gym. But it defeated me.

    3DS: 2165 - 6538 - 3417
    NNID: Hakkekage
  • HappylilElfHappylilElf Registered User regular
    Tav wrote: »
    also whoo boy did this conversation open me up to scrutiny if I ever post videos of my standup here

    :bz

    Sorry Tav

    Already putting plans in motion to gain access to them

    Ludious how are your haxxoring skills?

  • OrganichuOrganichu jacobkosh Registered User regular
    though tedious this has been an informative discussion

    i literally had no idea this was even a thing

    there are specific bits and 'ideas' that i think are very obviously kind of individualized. like if you told louis ck's bit about "imagine your dead grandmom being the cadaver the medical student gets an F on". that is so niche and such a 'realized' joke that i would probably think less of someone who said it, if they didn't attribute it.

    but when patrice o'neal said 'there are too many white people here to get that joke', and jeselnik responded 'you know what no one's ever said? too few black people'

    that is to me just a loose linguistic quip. general racial humor with wordplay. if someone just 'told' that joke without setup and i later found out it was already out in the wild, i might roll my eyes at them being uncreative i guess? maybe? probably not. but if it just fit the conversation- if someone set them up for jeselnik's line, and they used it and didn't credit it, i wouldn't care. if i found out later i'd think 'heh, that was a good time to use that'.

    if i used that line myself organically in conversation i would probably try and credit it because i want him to get more attention and not have people write him off for his horrible tv show. and i think the context for the joke makes it funnier so i'd describe it. but i wouldn't feel like a dog if the conversation flowed past it without me saying anything. that is just a funny quip i heard somewhere. a few years from now i'll probably have forgotten where i heard it, because it's not something i'd closley associate with a given personality. just a funny thing i heard somewhere.

    Abdhyius
  • ShivahnShivahn Unaware of her barrel shifter privilege Eastern coastal temptressRegistered User regular
    Hakkekage wrote: »
    Ludious wrote: »
    seriously I have been going to the gym like 4 times a week how come this rose garden did me in

    why

    why

    everything hurts

    and I dropped a wall stone on the side of my leg and got a nasty scrape that hurts way more than it looks like it should

    fuck the outdoors just fuck it
    Mother Nature doesn't have barbells

    My sister asked me to open the pickle jar yesterday because apparently I have all these muscles from the gym. But it defeated me.

    I've had to ask my sister to open jars for me.

    She is much smaller I have no idea what witchcraft she uses.

    HakkekageCinders
  • AbdhyiusAbdhyius Registered User regular
    for what it's worth I enjoyed this conversation a lot

    ftOqU21.png
    Evil MultifariousHappylilElfVariableTav
  • emnmnmeemnmnme Registered User regular
    Inquisitor wrote: »
    English this year at my school is supposed to be conversation focused.

    So my warm ups need to be conversation focused.

    Having a hard time thinking of ways to make people who don't want to have conversations have conversations.

    Mad libs. If artists have most of their creative blocks by having too many options, limit freedom by having your students pull nouns and verbs out of a hat and having a nonsense conversation. An ice breaker.

    ... this might be terrible advice for an ESL class.

  • AbdhyiusAbdhyius Registered User regular
    talk about the important things in life like jokes

    instead of politics again

    ftOqU21.png
    TavHappylilElfVariable
  • LudiousLudious I just wanted a sandwich A temporally dislocated QuiznosRegistered User regular
    Tav wrote: »
    also whoo boy did this conversation open me up to scrutiny if I ever post videos of my standup here

    :bz

    more like Tav O'Mencia

  • VariableVariable Mouth Congress Stroke Me Lady FameRegistered User regular
    new plan: shower now (soon) and do the homework tonight while watching Mad Men

    alright alright alright

    BNet-Vari#1998 | Switch-SW 6960 6688 8388 | Steam | Twitch
  • Evil MultifariousEvil Multifarious Registered User regular
    i always like it when people from both sides of a discussion agree with my post

    that's how i know i'm winning

    Inquisitor wrote: »
    I fucking hate you Canadians.
    Apothe0sisjakobagger
  • emnmnmeemnmnme Registered User regular
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    talk about the important things in life like jokes

    instead of politics again

  • AbdhyiusAbdhyius Registered User regular
    when we talk about jokes we fucking talk about jokes

    we have pages and pages and we go as in depth as we do about world problems

    which is what I love

    ftOqU21.png
    Variable
  • TavTav Registered User regular
    Abdhyius wrote: »
    talk about the important things in life like jokes

    instead of politics again

    I met a much disliked politician at a student thing

    we talked about comedy for about 5 minutes while students in various different political parties shouted abuse at him

    i think that solidified me taking comedy more seriously than i ever will politics

    VariableAbdhyius
  • LudiousLudious I just wanted a sandwich A temporally dislocated QuiznosRegistered User regular
    i always like it when people from both sides of a discussion agree with my post

    that's how i know i'm winning

    I go for the opposite effect. If I can get both sides of a debate to hate me, I have won

This discussion has been closed.