One of my coworkers is Native American (Apache, to be specific)
And he made a really good point, that if these guys had tried to build a pipeline through a national park without permission, the government would have shut that shit down immediately
But when it happens to Native American land the fed is strangely apathetic, since apparently tribal sovereignty only matters until it's not politically or economically convenient
Imagine if a pipeline proposal went across the water supply for, say, Aspen, Colorado.
Imagine if a company started to just fucking build a pipeline, before the matter was even legally settled, through the water supply of a wealthy white community.
Imagination is the only realm where that scenario is possible, by the way
Come to think of it, has any presidential candidate in recent memory ever said, "Hey, Native Americans! I promise not to dick you over and to protect you when some other asshole tries to dick you over."
'Cuz out of many, many issues that have come up during campaigns and debates over the past dozen years or so, I can't remember a single time when someone has said one of their promises is to treat the tribes better.
The story was actually covered over here a week ago on Süddeutsche.de, but the common german sentimentality regarding native americans certainly shows.
Mni Wiconi called "Water is Life" in the Lakota language. In the wide plains of the US state of North Dakota Native Americans write these ancient words on their protest posters. Once grazed here thousands buffalo between the rivers Missouri and Cannonball. People slept in pale beige teepees, and the famous Chief Sitting Bull fought bloody battles for the rights of his people. Today the Standing Rock Sioux fight again a battle, a battle for their water.
Your opponent's Energy Transfer Partners. The company wants from Texas just north of the reserve of the Standing Rock Sioux build an oil pipe. The Dakota Access pipeline will be 1900 km long. If Dakota Access is ready, should the pipeline per day around 500 000. barrels of oil (about 80 million liters) transport. It comes from the fracking Bakken oil field in North Dakota and should flow from there through South Dakota and Iowa to an existing pipeline in the state of Illinois. From there it goes to refineries in Texas. Pipelines are the safest way to transport crude oil, say the Manager of Energy Transfer Partners, it would then have less oil trucks on the highways and fewer trains full of oil go through the country that can derail.
Your tube also help in making the US less dependent on oil imports. That was the big goal of the US government for decades. The project will cost about 3.7 billion dollars. The pipeline is already half finished, they should go into operation later this year. There were always protests and actions against the tube, for example of farmers in Iowa, who were concerned about their drinking water. But no one had a chance against Energy Transfer Partners, the construction continued. But then the Indians came.
Susan Sarandon and Leonardo DiCaprio support the protest
Since April already protesting against the portion of the line to be run close to their reserve below the Missouri River. First they were a small group with self-painted billboards, which met for prayer circles. They were always more. Hundreds Indians from other tribes traveled, by car and even by horse, they came from across the country. Environmental groups joined them. Hollywood stars like Susan Sarandon declared their solidarity. Recently the actor Leonardo DiCaprio wrote on Twitter: "The struggle of the Standing Rock Sioux a break of Dakota Access Pipeline inspired me."
A few weeks ago the Sheriff of Morton County has come to a halt the construction. The protesters were a security risk. Nearly 30 of them he has already been arrested and released, including the chief of the Standing Rock Sioux, Dave Archambault. "The company and the government now know that it strains can not ignore us as they have tried the Dakota Access Pipeline," he says. The Indians complain that they had been passed over for the approval of the pipeline. The state of North Dakota and the United States Army Corps of Engineers, an army unit that provides civil services for government contracting, have approved the pipeline in summary proceedings and had the Indians not sufficiently consulted. Together with the group Earth Justice, the Indians had appealed against the project, at the latest on 9 September to decide on the controversial pipeline, a court in Washington.
The natives fear especially leaks in the oil line
The Missouri River is the only water source of the Standing Rock Sioux. They fear that leaks in the pipeline polluting their drinking water. Energy Transfer Partners assured the pipeline is tight and secure. But the Indians look to Canada, where the end of July was flowing from a pipeline crude oil into the North Saskatchewan River. The Indian tribe James Smith Cree Nation felt left alone with the polluted water, the cleaning work is progressing slowly. The bereaved are always the Indians, the Standing Rock Sioux complain. "Every time there is a project of this size, of which the nation can benefit, incurred costs," said chief Archambault. "And these costs bear the Native American tribes."
The protest of the Standing Rock Sioux gets louder. The sheriff has the access road blocked to reserve, supporters must take a detour now, anyway every day new and setting up camp. The Indians have already written an open letter to President Barack Obama. On the Internet you can participate in a petition, more than 100 000 signatures have been collected. A group of young members of the tribe went in shifts from the reserve to Washington, 3200 kilometers long was their protest march. The tribe also collects donations for the costs of legal disputes and the management of the camps. There is even a radio station, Spirit Resistance Radio.
It should remain peaceful, this battle is to be fought without bloodshed, the Standing Rock Sioux stress. "We have to stick together in peace and in prayer," says Archambault. "So we ensure a better life for future generations."
Sioux in North Dakota: Violent protest against pipeline
Protests against the construction of an oil pipeline near a Native American reservation in the USA demonstrators and employees of a construction company who delivered violent clashes on Saturday night. Several people were injured when hundreds of protesters set in an area called Cannonball in the state of North Dakota workers in the way.
The protesters broke through barricades and traditional clashes with security guards. This went with dogs and pepper spray against the demonstrators.
One participant reported that security guards had tried to push back the demonstrators with bulldozers and trucks. Several protesters wore them bloody injuries and dog bites. According to the authorities three guards were injured by fence posts and flagpoles.
feared contamination of drinking water
The planned by the company Energy Transfer Plants pipeline will run about two kilometers from the Sioux Reserve Standing Rock away by the river Missouri. Residents of the reserve accuse those responsible to have been destroyed sacred tombs, places of worship and other cultural property during construction. In addition, the Indians fear contamination of their drinking water. In court, they did not succeed so far to stop the pipeline project.
After the Indians had presented on Friday in court dozens of newly excavated objects as evidence, they were surprised on Saturday by a continuation of the interim interrupted construction. The tribe complained that a large area had been destroyed before the protests against the work. The ruined tombs of ancestors are irreplaceable, declared tribal chief David Archambault.
On September 9, to a federal judge to judge whether the construction of the pipeline will be put on hold by the river, as long as the Master continues legally against it happening.
wasn't there a tribe in canada who said there would be absolutely no pipeline in their territory
as in they would forcibly remove it if it got built
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PwnanObrienHe's right, life sucks.Registered Userregular
Man I don't even know how you get involved in something like that pipeline. I can't imagine hearing the pitch of "we're going to defile of bunch of sacred Native American land illegally to run an oil pipeline through it" without punching that person in the head as hard as you can until Captain Planet has to pull you off him. It almost seems like it would be for their own good. I'm not a very religious or superstitious man but doing that seems to be almost waving your dick in the face of a haunting. It's just so fucking evil that I'm pretty sure there's at least one movie where Chuck Norris roundhouse kicks the corporatism out of the people trying something similar and that guy's so conservative he thinks you should get your kids vaccinated for gay.
The whole goddamn mess sounds like the kind of plotline you'd find in a cheesy kid's movie. The kind where I'd be like, "The villains were a bit unrealistically mustache-twirly, weren't they?"
There was a situation last year where the EPA was cleaning out a mine, fucked it up, and a river turned orange with chemical runoff. You may have seen the pictures.
So this fucked up orange water, it flows down into Navajo land. And Navajo farmers have their lives and their livelihoods put at risk.
So EPA agents approach the impacted Navajo farmers (many of whom don't speak English, by the by - the Diné have the best-preserved language of any tribe, by a country mile, in large part because so many folks speak that language exclusively.).
The EPA agents offer a pittance of $500 to buy fresh water from other sources until the orange river gets sorted out. With the stipulation that you sign a contract saying you'll never sue the US government, no matter what might happen down the line as a result of this shit. In exchange for making it through the next month, you'd give away your chance to be compensated for the loss of god knows how much.
As soon as word of this shit got to the Navajo tribal government, they straight-up banned EPA agents from stepping foot on their land.
It's just...
Okay, so, I'm drunk and I'll just say it. The US is built on fucked-over Indians, and to treat us better is, if anything, anti-American. America is stolen land, it's broken treaties, it's genocide from the fucking jump. Nobody who wants to steer this ship will ever want to treat the indigenous people better because to do so is to acknowledge the fact that maybe America shouldn't have fuckin' happened. Nobody applies for a job by saying in the interview, "This job shouldn't exist."
The best that can ever be hoped is that they won't make it worse.
The problem with what you said Poorochondriac is the mess the epa was trying to clean up was a former gold mine and a toxic mess left behind
There is far more to it then just the EPA as New Mexico tried to "help" and messed up as well
The whole four corners area outside of the Navajo areas is a mess better left not explained
Come to think of it, has any presidential candidate in recent memory ever said, "Hey, Native Americans! I promise not to dick you over and to protect you when some other asshole tries to dick you over."
'Cuz out of many, many issues that have come up during campaigns and debates over the past dozen years or so, I can't remember a single time when someone has said one of their promises is to treat the tribes better.
Politicians pander to people that can get them elected
Native Americans don't represent a big enough voting bloc for that to be the case
wasn't there a tribe in canada who said there would be absolutely no pipeline in their territory
as in they would forcibly remove it if it got built
The good news is that force shouldn't be necessary
The Supreme Court of Canada has put aboriginals on a new footing in a landmark ruling that has huge implications for natural-resource industries across the country. Aboriginal communities gain important new economic assets, and powerful leverage over development by outsiders, but not a veto.
In what legal observers called the most important Supreme Court ruling on aboriginal rights in Canadian history – a culmination of all previous rulings – the court determined that native Canadians still own their ancestral lands, unless they signed away their ownership in treaties with government.
For the first time, the court recognized the existence of aboriginal title on a particular site, covering a vast swath of the British Columbia interior. The court also spelled out in detail what aboriginal title means: control of ancestral lands and the right to use them for modern economic purposes, without destroying those lands for future generations.
“The doctrine of terra nullius [that no one owned the land prior to European assertion of sovereignty] never applied in Canada,” the court said in an 8-0 ruling, written by Chief Justice Beverley McLachlin.
Government still has a right to intrude but only if it can reconcile aboriginal interests with wider public purposes – which can include mining and logging projects and, though the court didn’t say so specifically, the proposed Northern Gateway pipeline from Alberta to the B.C. coastal community of Kitimat.
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UnbrokenEvaHIGH ON THE WIREBUT I WON'T TRIP ITRegistered Userregular
edited September 2016
Also our current government really did run on promises of protecting and expanding native rights and reconciliation for past abuses. And appointed a First Nations woman as Minister of Justice/Attorney General.
I worry that these posts are coming across as bragging, but really I'm still kind of adjusting to feeling positive about my government after a decade of Harper-bred cynicism.
Edit: also the Canadian people still have a lot of issues with regards to racism towards First Nations, some regions are really bad, but we have a government that is actually trying to lead on the subject and it is weird and refreshing to see.
Come to think of it, has any presidential candidate in recent memory ever said, "Hey, Native Americans! I promise not to dick you over and to protect you when some other asshole tries to dick you over."
'Cuz out of many, many issues that have come up during campaigns and debates over the past dozen years or so, I can't remember a single time when someone has said one of their promises is to treat the tribes better.
Politicians pander to people that can get them elected
Native Americans don't represent a big enough voting bloc for that to be the case
Nope, Prager University is a conservative rag that mostly promotes all sorts of Breitbart-lite content.
This particular video is by a West Point history prof that did the video for them without knowing Prager's reputation, so naturally it ended up amazing and everyone was kind of confused.
The problem with what you said Poorochondriac is the mess the epa was trying to clean up was a former gold mine and a toxic mess left behind
There is far more to it then just the EPA as New Mexico tried to "help" and messed up as well
The whole four corners area outside of the Navajo areas is a mess better left not explained
This does not contradict anything I said
And I was focusing on the federal government's actions because that is what we are discussing
Nope, Prager University is a conservative rag that mostly promotes all sorts of Breitbart-lite content.
This particular video is by a West Point history prof that did the video for them without knowing Prager's reputation, so naturally it ended up amazing and everyone was kind of confused.
Trump pool report: "One thing I was just handed this, a new poll is just out, I believe its Nate Silver,Trump is leading 46-43 (APPLAUSE)."
He also has a tweet up citing 538 that says he is winning 46-43.
Nobody has any clue what the heck he is talking about except he might have confused an Ipsos poll of Ohio they have listed as being done by 538 and Nate Silver.
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BroloBroseidonLord of the BroceanRegistered Userregular
Trump, gaggling on his plane: "our jobs have been taken like Grant took Richmond."
In an orderly manner with the Confederates lighting the fires that destroyed much of the city before the Union troops could put out the fires? Slowly because it took some time to capture Richmond?
People want to call out the head of US military history at West Point about American history?
I'm not gonna get in a slap fight with Neil DeGrasse Tyson over astrophysics, but these chumps seem to be keen for a barney...
Their feelings are far more valid than any pinko lieberal facts!
The upshot of anti-intellectualism is that you don't have to trust experts any time they say something you don't like
All knowledge is derived from a nebulous idea of "common sense" that's treated as universal when in fact it's a highly individualized mixture of biases and experience
Posts
Imagine if a pipeline proposal went across the water supply for, say, Aspen, Colorado.
Imagine if a company started to just fucking build a pipeline, before the matter was even legally settled, through the water supply of a wealthy white community.
Imagination is the only realm where that scenario is possible, by the way
'Cuz out of many, many issues that have come up during campaigns and debates over the past dozen years or so, I can't remember a single time when someone has said one of their promises is to treat the tribes better.
Twitch (I stream most days of the week)
Twitter (mean leftist discourse)
edit: Dakota Access, not the restraining order.
Here's the article and a google translation
sueddeutsche.de/wirtschaft/umweltschutz-indianer-stamm-kaempft-gegen-die-oelwirtschaft-1.3140330
Your opponent's Energy Transfer Partners. The company wants from Texas just north of the reserve of the Standing Rock Sioux build an oil pipe. The Dakota Access pipeline will be 1900 km long. If Dakota Access is ready, should the pipeline per day around 500 000. barrels of oil (about 80 million liters) transport. It comes from the fracking Bakken oil field in North Dakota and should flow from there through South Dakota and Iowa to an existing pipeline in the state of Illinois. From there it goes to refineries in Texas. Pipelines are the safest way to transport crude oil, say the Manager of Energy Transfer Partners, it would then have less oil trucks on the highways and fewer trains full of oil go through the country that can derail.
Your tube also help in making the US less dependent on oil imports. That was the big goal of the US government for decades. The project will cost about 3.7 billion dollars. The pipeline is already half finished, they should go into operation later this year. There were always protests and actions against the tube, for example of farmers in Iowa, who were concerned about their drinking water. But no one had a chance against Energy Transfer Partners, the construction continued. But then the Indians came.
Susan Sarandon and Leonardo DiCaprio support the protest
Since April already protesting against the portion of the line to be run close to their reserve below the Missouri River. First they were a small group with self-painted billboards, which met for prayer circles. They were always more. Hundreds Indians from other tribes traveled, by car and even by horse, they came from across the country. Environmental groups joined them. Hollywood stars like Susan Sarandon declared their solidarity. Recently the actor Leonardo DiCaprio wrote on Twitter: "The struggle of the Standing Rock Sioux a break of Dakota Access Pipeline inspired me."
A few weeks ago the Sheriff of Morton County has come to a halt the construction. The protesters were a security risk. Nearly 30 of them he has already been arrested and released, including the chief of the Standing Rock Sioux, Dave Archambault. "The company and the government now know that it strains can not ignore us as they have tried the Dakota Access Pipeline," he says. The Indians complain that they had been passed over for the approval of the pipeline. The state of North Dakota and the United States Army Corps of Engineers, an army unit that provides civil services for government contracting, have approved the pipeline in summary proceedings and had the Indians not sufficiently consulted. Together with the group Earth Justice, the Indians had appealed against the project, at the latest on 9 September to decide on the controversial pipeline, a court in Washington.
The natives fear especially leaks in the oil line
The Missouri River is the only water source of the Standing Rock Sioux. They fear that leaks in the pipeline polluting their drinking water. Energy Transfer Partners assured the pipeline is tight and secure. But the Indians look to Canada, where the end of July was flowing from a pipeline crude oil into the North Saskatchewan River. The Indian tribe James Smith Cree Nation felt left alone with the polluted water, the cleaning work is progressing slowly. The bereaved are always the Indians, the Standing Rock Sioux complain. "Every time there is a project of this size, of which the nation can benefit, incurred costs," said chief Archambault. "And these costs bear the Native American tribes."
The protest of the Standing Rock Sioux gets louder. The sheriff has the access road blocked to reserve, supporters must take a detour now, anyway every day new and setting up camp. The Indians have already written an open letter to President Barack Obama. On the Internet you can participate in a petition, more than 100 000 signatures have been collected. A group of young members of the tribe went in shifts from the reserve to Washington, 3200 kilometers long was their protest march. The tribe also collects donations for the costs of legal disputes and the management of the camps. There is even a radio station, Spirit Resistance Radio.
It should remain peaceful, this battle is to be fought without bloodshed, the Standing Rock Sioux stress. "We have to stick together in peace and in prayer," says Archambault. "So we ensure a better life for future generations."
Also a short piece on Spiegel.de yesterday with a rather misleading headline.
spiegel.de/wirtschaft/soziales/north-dakota-sioux-protestieren-gegen-bau-von-pipeline-a-1110869.html
Protests against the construction of an oil pipeline near a Native American reservation in the USA demonstrators and employees of a construction company who delivered violent clashes on Saturday night. Several people were injured when hundreds of protesters set in an area called Cannonball in the state of North Dakota workers in the way.
The protesters broke through barricades and traditional clashes with security guards. This went with dogs and pepper spray against the demonstrators.
One participant reported that security guards had tried to push back the demonstrators with bulldozers and trucks. Several protesters wore them bloody injuries and dog bites. According to the authorities three guards were injured by fence posts and flagpoles.
feared contamination of drinking water
The planned by the company Energy Transfer Plants pipeline will run about two kilometers from the Sioux Reserve Standing Rock away by the river Missouri. Residents of the reserve accuse those responsible to have been destroyed sacred tombs, places of worship and other cultural property during construction. In addition, the Indians fear contamination of their drinking water. In court, they did not succeed so far to stop the pipeline project.
After the Indians had presented on Friday in court dozens of newly excavated objects as evidence, they were surprised on Saturday by a continuation of the interim interrupted construction. The tribe complained that a large area had been destroyed before the protests against the work. The ruined tombs of ancestors are irreplaceable, declared tribal chief David Archambault.
On September 9, to a federal judge to judge whether the construction of the pipeline will be put on hold by the river, as long as the Master continues legally against it happening.
as in they would forcibly remove it if it got built
Twitch (I stream most days of the week)
Twitter (mean leftist discourse)
Except no, it's real.
There was a situation last year where the EPA was cleaning out a mine, fucked it up, and a river turned orange with chemical runoff. You may have seen the pictures.
So this fucked up orange water, it flows down into Navajo land. And Navajo farmers have their lives and their livelihoods put at risk.
So EPA agents approach the impacted Navajo farmers (many of whom don't speak English, by the by - the Diné have the best-preserved language of any tribe, by a country mile, in large part because so many folks speak that language exclusively.).
The EPA agents offer a pittance of $500 to buy fresh water from other sources until the orange river gets sorted out. With the stipulation that you sign a contract saying you'll never sue the US government, no matter what might happen down the line as a result of this shit. In exchange for making it through the next month, you'd give away your chance to be compensated for the loss of god knows how much.
As soon as word of this shit got to the Navajo tribal government, they straight-up banned EPA agents from stepping foot on their land.
It's just...
Okay, so, I'm drunk and I'll just say it. The US is built on fucked-over Indians, and to treat us better is, if anything, anti-American. America is stolen land, it's broken treaties, it's genocide from the fucking jump. Nobody who wants to steer this ship will ever want to treat the indigenous people better because to do so is to acknowledge the fact that maybe America shouldn't have fuckin' happened. Nobody applies for a job by saying in the interview, "This job shouldn't exist."
The best that can ever be hoped is that they won't make it worse.
There is far more to it then just the EPA as New Mexico tried to "help" and messed up as well
The whole four corners area outside of the Navajo areas is a mess better left not explained
Politicians pander to people that can get them elected
Native Americans don't represent a big enough voting bloc for that to be the case
http://www.audioentropy.com/
The good news is that force shouldn't be necessary
I worry that these posts are coming across as bragging, but really I'm still kind of adjusting to feeling positive about my government after a decade of Harper-bred cynicism.
Edit: also the Canadian people still have a lot of issues with regards to racism towards First Nations, some regions are really bad, but we have a government that is actually trying to lead on the subject and it is weird and refreshing to see.
This is one of the most awful things I have read.
Bernie did.
Its a West Point professor answering the question "Was the Civil War about slavery"
Of course the comments are trash fire
This particular video is by a West Point history prof that did the video for them without knowing Prager's reputation, so naturally it ended up amazing and everyone was kind of confused.
This does not contradict anything I said
And I was focusing on the federal government's actions because that is what we are discussing
Wow, that makes that video extra good
Or Squared Dave? Or Dave Double Dip?
Nobody has any clue what the heck he is talking about except he might have confused an Ipsos poll of Ohio they have listed as being done by 538 and Nate Silver.
so that's probably not correct
I'm friends with a Chinese girl I used to work with whose name is Shanshan - I called her DoubleShan, she called me Doublecrazy.
People want to call out the head of US military history at West Point about American history?
I'm not gonna get in a slap fight with Neil DeGrasse Tyson over astrophysics, but these chumps seem to be keen for a barney...
Their feelings are far more valid than any pinko lieberal facts!
Steam: MightyPotatoKing
Steam: MightyPotatoKing
The upshot of anti-intellectualism is that you don't have to trust experts any time they say something you don't like
All knowledge is derived from a nebulous idea of "common sense" that's treated as universal when in fact it's a highly individualized mixture of biases and experience
http://www.audioentropy.com/