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Etrian Odyssey: Nexus - When your cat is an absolute unit.

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Posts

  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    Orphane wrote: »
    EO5 has the breakpoints at 5/10 that they seem to have gone with for ability levels that EO4 started

    i think tinkering this time around is probably going to stem from attempting different race/specialization combinations

    Yeah, though I don't know how much tinkering there is there - the races feel very binary magic or physical.

    Steam: Polaritie
    3DS: 0473-8507-2652
    Switch: SW-5185-4991-5118
    PSN: AbEntropy
  • Dr. FlamingoDr. Flamingo 49 Gilded Disc Perceives the Sun Registered User regular
    In terms of interesting classes, I think 3 just has the most interesting ones. That's actually what got me into the series. I saw a Nintendo Power blurb about "This RPG that has Pirates and Ninja, and Wildlings and Hoplites!" And I'm like, "What's a hoplite? This sounds rad!" And then it said you could multiclass them and I was sold.

    And then I went to look up more info on how to play the game and it led me to the EO3 thread in this forum. And that's how I got here. Huh, this took an oddly self-reflective turn.

    Fencingsaxchrono_travellerCauldFrem
  • OrphaneOrphane Dazzling radiance washes your engine in a gleaming tide. Glory, glory, glory. Registered User regular
    edited October 2017
    harbingers seem super underwhelming early on, mostly because they don't have access to poison in their base skillset

    also not a fan of the whole having to use the miasma armor before being able to inflict any status

    i'm probably going to swap harbinger out for pugilist so i can get some binds

    also make sure to use the memory conch that you can get on Floor 3 and register a bunch of characters so you can feed them xp at seemingly no cost

    Orphane on
    chrono_traveller
  • HenroidHenroid Radio Demon Internet HellRegistered User regular
    I just tried the first stratum boss and that is some interesting shit going on, I approve.

    Man. EO4 came out FIVE years ago. This is the first new game in a while. And don't get me wrong, the remakes of 1 and 2 are interesting as hell, but they didn't push the game formula like this at all. EO5 is quickly becoming my favorite and I'm embracing the pace meant for it. I was worried on the first two floors when party members were getting one-shotted but that's been going away.

    Centrism is just the cowardly way to be a bigot w/o being explicit about it.
    American politics isn't 4D chess, it's just if you give a shit about other people or not.
  • PLAPLA The process.Registered User regular
    EO3 will always win "interesting" because it was the game-jam of Etrian Odyssey. It wasn't a polished game, because it was a big box of ideas to throw at the market and see what sticks.

    The Reapo Man is definitely a class that benefits from a high level. Not as frontloaded as something like Shaman.

  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    Hmm, should a toxipede take forever to kill at level 8? Worried about party composition, even if its just the demo still.

    I think I may be leaning too heavily into not-face-wrecker classes. Harbinger Dragoon Rover Warlock Shaman.

    Steam: Polaritie
    3DS: 0473-8507-2652
    Switch: SW-5185-4991-5118
    PSN: AbEntropy
  • FrozenzenFrozenzen Registered User regular
    EO3 has the most interesting classes true, but also the most overpowered and most useless. Before EO5 I would say my gold standard for balance was 4, even if it was easy it had no real bad classes. EO5 seems to have similarly good balance, even if some classes seem to require parties to be built around them to work.

    TamerBill
  • PLAPLA The process.Registered User regular
    The most overpowered thing in EO3 happens to be the most overpowered thing in EO5, too. Warrior's Might.

  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    Frozenzen wrote: »
    EO3 has the most interesting classes true, but also the most overpowered and most useless. Before EO5 I would say my gold standard for balance was 4, even if it was easy it had no real bad classes. EO5 seems to have similarly good balance, even if some classes seem to require parties to be built around them to work.

    Useless: Y. OP: S. Choose your class unlock correctly.

    Steam: Polaritie
    3DS: 0473-8507-2652
    Switch: SW-5185-4991-5118
    PSN: AbEntropy
    Fry
  • FrozenzenFrozenzen Registered User regular
    Yeah, yggdroid vs shogun was pretty onesided. But worse was how subbing gladiator and dealing physical damage is about 3-4 times as good as everything else. Apart from warrior might I suppose.

    Bringing back a stronger version of wm for EO5 was a very curious choice. But the options apart from that seem pretty diverse.

  • HenroidHenroid Radio Demon Internet HellRegistered User regular
    I missed it, who has Warrior's Might in EO5?

    Centrism is just the cowardly way to be a bigot w/o being explicit about it.
    American politics isn't 4D chess, it's just if you give a shit about other people or not.
  • OrphaneOrphane Dazzling radiance washes your engine in a gleaming tide. Glory, glory, glory. Registered User regular
    edited October 2017
    Henroid wrote: »
    I missed it, who has Warrior's Might in EO5?

    The multi katana masurao specialization iirc

    sanzu crossing

    Orphane on
  • PLAPLA The process.Registered User regular
    Yggdroid was fun on paper. The summon-system and the big laser were all kinds of fucked, though. It could be used as a decent pseudo-sub for a few other classes, at least.

  • HenroidHenroid Radio Demon Internet HellRegistered User regular
    Orphane wrote: »
    Henroid wrote: »
    I missed it, who has Warrior's Might in EO5?

    The multi katana masurao specialization iirc

    sanzu crossing
    Oh my god. My Masurao has started to do double the damage (almost) of everyone else in my party, that sounds crazy.

    Centrism is just the cowardly way to be a bigot w/o being explicit about it.
    American politics isn't 4D chess, it's just if you give a shit about other people or not.
  • OrphaneOrphane Dazzling radiance washes your engine in a gleaming tide. Glory, glory, glory. Registered User regular
    I plan on going blademaster because i like precision, crits, and survivability better than equipping 4 swords and falling over if you get looked at funny but i mean, who knows

  • HenroidHenroid Radio Demon Internet HellRegistered User regular
    I just beat the 1st stratum boss and had my first peek at the 2nd. It's weird that I've been listening to the music of this game for a year already, but now it has context and feels brand new. Especially the 2nd stratum. There was something relieving about pulling it off.

    I really loved the theme of how to fight the first stratum boss.

    I was having doubts about my ability to continue forward with how hard this game starts off, but really it's no worse than part 1. INCOMING ME EATING MY WORDS.

    Centrism is just the cowardly way to be a bigot w/o being explicit about it.
    American politics isn't 4D chess, it's just if you give a shit about other people or not.
  • TakelTakel Registered User regular
    Puttering around at level 10ish on the third floor. I have to babysit my Masurao because it has the tendency to get one-shot by any big hit. I think I've kinda screwed up my early character progression by spreading out a little too thin instead of bum rushing to level 5 a 'bread and butter' skill but that can be resolved with a few more levels and I'm getting to a point where I'm getting more comfortable with dungeon diving for longer. Upgrading weapons is no joke.

    I'm also probably going to go with blademaster over multi-katana Masurao as I also favour survivability and stability over all-in offence. For the time being, I'm kind of regretting going for a Herbalist instead of a Shaman as my 5th party member. Most of the time, I don't need healing and the poison/blind smokes are less than reliable. The times I do need healing chances are it's the Masurao who got one shot and I could probably have avoided that situation with buffs/mitigation moreso than patch healing though I'll see what happens now that I've got access to line heals. The Dragoon is very close to setting up a rank 5 provoke + guard + that cheap attack that reuses a the previous turn's guard for an offensive wall so that should also help out with the defensive situation.

    Chances are, once I get access to more levels I'm going to swap the herbalist for a defensive spec Shaman for the indirect healing and the buffs. I'm not sure what I want to do with the Warlock as I'm finding the damage to be not as great for the TP cost compared to the Masurao who's auto-attacking for almost the same amount of damage single target, but again, I'll see what happens when I get some more levels to fill out ability combos. The eventual plan is that I'll have a Masurao, Rover and Warlock for offence, covering piercing, slashing and elemental damage. I'm just worried about overall healing as I kinda don't like the hound but I'll see how it works out with again, more levels so I can properly use it instead of currently scrambling for more offensive power.

    Steam | PSN: MystLansfeld | 3DS: 4656-6210-1377 | FFXIV: Lavinia Lansfeld
  • StraygatsbyStraygatsby Registered User regular
    edited October 2017
    Takel wrote: »
    Puttering around at level 10ish on the third floor.

    Jeez! I'm 10 on the first floor. I gotta stop dickin' around! =)

    Straygatsby on
  • OrphaneOrphane Dazzling radiance washes your engine in a gleaming tide. Glory, glory, glory. Registered User regular
    Takel wrote: »
    Puttering around at level 10ish on the third floor. I have to babysit my Masurao because it has the tendency to get one-shot by any big hit. I think I've kinda screwed up my early character progression by spreading out a little too thin instead of bum rushing to level 5 a 'bread and butter' skill but that can be resolved with a few more levels and I'm getting to a point where I'm getting more comfortable with dungeon diving for longer. Upgrading weapons is no joke.

    I'm also probably going to go with blademaster over multi-katana Masurao as I also favour survivability and stability over all-in offence. For the time being, I'm kind of regretting going for a Herbalist instead of a Shaman as my 5th party member. Most of the time, I don't need healing and the poison/blind smokes are less than reliable. The times I do need healing chances are it's the Masurao who got one shot and I could probably have avoided that situation with buffs/mitigation moreso than patch healing though I'll see what happens now that I've got access to line heals. The Dragoon is very close to setting up a rank 5 provoke + guard + that cheap attack that reuses a the previous turn's guard for an offensive wall so that should also help out with the defensive situation.

    Chances are, once I get access to more levels I'm going to swap the herbalist for a defensive spec Shaman for the indirect healing and the buffs. I'm not sure what I want to do with the Warlock as I'm finding the damage to be not as great for the TP cost compared to the Masurao who's auto-attacking for almost the same amount of damage single target, but again, I'll see what happens when I get some more levels to fill out ability combos. The eventual plan is that I'll have a Masurao, Rover and Warlock for offence, covering piercing, slashing and elemental damage. I'm just worried about overall healing as I kinda don't like the hound but I'll see how it works out with again, more levels so I can properly use it instead of currently scrambling for more offensive power.

    I tend to only use warlock spells exclusively for aoe and just get a decent matk gun so they can plink away from the back row

    They have some interesting stuff with chants for metamagicking spells but that seems like largely for later levels due to the increased tp cost (vastly so if you want to quick chant)

    One thing to note is that equipment can also grant skills so that's one way of supplementing characters

  • TakelTakel Registered User regular
    Correction, 4th floor. I just finished the 3rd floor's survey and took a peek at the 4th floor where my Masurao promptly got double tapped by a monkey mimicing an elemental attack. It's becoming a bit of a joke to me in a 'I wonder what's going to kill my Masurao next' manner. The Warlock isn't actually that far behind in the death sweepstakes. She got OHKO'd at one point and she promptly got an upgrade in gear when I next hit the town. I could just be underlevelled for all I know. I just play EO games where I plow through the floors as efficiently as possible stopping to grind only if the mobs on a new floor horribly annihilates my team (as in one shots people through guards/defensive actions) or I'm still struggling with a current floor's battles by the time I find the stairs to the next floor.

    I should probably try to kill the 2nd floor's FoEs to see what they drop... but I'm worried that the Masurao will, once again, get one shot.

    Steam | PSN: MystLansfeld | 3DS: 4656-6210-1377 | FFXIV: Lavinia Lansfeld
  • OrphaneOrphane Dazzling radiance washes your engine in a gleaming tide. Glory, glory, glory. Registered User regular
    I am glad they didn't bother with the Grimoire stones they were experimenting with in the Untolds in this game because those often felt needlessly rng to get good skills on

    HenroidTakelOats
  • PolaritiePolaritie Sleepy Registered User regular
    edited October 2017
    Quick chant is only 5 TP when maxed, so not too terrible. And it seems important if you want to stack up attacks in buff windows.

    Not sure entirely how to get Warlock going though. Chants are definitely key to it though.

    Also, at level 10, the toxipedes can one shot anyone if they land poison (they don't always try it), so...

    Polaritie on
    Steam: Polaritie
    3DS: 0473-8507-2652
    Switch: SW-5185-4991-5118
    PSN: AbEntropy
  • HenroidHenroid Radio Demon Internet HellRegistered User regular
    One tip I will give about Warlocks is don't rely on the game being like "fire is the only element you need in the first stratum." All three are useful, so pick those up ASAP just to round yourself out.

    Centrism is just the cowardly way to be a bigot w/o being explicit about it.
    American politics isn't 4D chess, it's just if you give a shit about other people or not.
  • OrphaneOrphane Dazzling radiance washes your engine in a gleaming tide. Glory, glory, glory. Registered User regular
    edited October 2017
    Polaritie wrote: »
    Quick chant is only 5 TP when maxed, so not too terrible. And it seems important if you want to stack up attacks in buff windows.

    Not sure entirely how to get Warlock going though. Chants are definitely key to it though.

    sure quick chant by itself is an additional 5 tp cost but you also have to factor in the tp cost of the chant itself, which is even more TP, combined with the TP of the spell you're boosting

    so that can be easily 10 or 15 or 20 mp tacked on to a spell if you're looking at just docusing chant, which is still a considerable amount early game for fighting regular mobs

    to clarify i definitely think Quick chant is still worth it in terms of saving turns, but i would probably only use it against bosses with Focus Chant

    Orphane on
  • chrono_travellerchrono_traveller Registered User regular
    Man, I have been leveling up my Hound and I was excited to get to level 5, and I didn't look at the MP cost :bigfrown: went from 25 to 45 mp. I can now just barely summon both hound and hawk and have a measly 3 mp left over.

    The trouble with having an open mind, of course, is that people will insist on coming along and trying to put things in it. ~ Terry Pratchett

    George R. R. Martin is not your bitch. ~ Neil Gaiman
  • PLAPLA The process.Registered User regular
    Warlock's basic charge-thing, compression or whatever, is pretty weak if you only use it every other turn like a normal charge-thing, and pretty strong if you spam it every turn like it's just a fucked up passive skill.
    The same more or less applies to the effects of the advanced chants.

    Grimoire-stones are garbage. They're a little less annoying in the second game.

    The sensible masurao is the very soul of reasonable, reliable RPG-warrior. Heaviest armour. Sharpest sword. Just hit the thing. Stop dancing and hit the thing.
    Your spirit-animal is a clod of normal dirt.

    Orphane
  • OwenashiOwenashi Registered User regular
    Between the four 3DS games, does anyone here have an opinion on which makes the best entry point for someone that's only tried out the demos?

  • FrozenzenFrozenzen Registered User regular
    The main issue for warlock is skillpoints. Towards the latter part of the third stratum mine is doing decent work, level 35ish. In 4-5 levels I'll respec for quick chant. Getting skills to rank 4, as well as maxing quick chant and multihit is very point greedy. And you kind of need max quickchant to use it, and probably leave your chant at 4 as well until later.

  • HenroidHenroid Radio Demon Internet HellRegistered User regular
    Man, I have been leveling up my Hound and I was excited to get to level 5, and I didn't look at the MP cost :bigfrown: went from 25 to 45 mp. I can now just barely summon both hound and hawk and have a measly 3 mp left over.
    Seeing those costs convinced me to turn away from the class, until I have the game figured out more. I have a feeling its meant for bosses and FOEs.

    Centrism is just the cowardly way to be a bigot w/o being explicit about it.
    American politics isn't 4D chess, it's just if you give a shit about other people or not.
  • OrphaneOrphane Dazzling radiance washes your engine in a gleaming tide. Glory, glory, glory. Registered User regular
    well, you can just summon the hound/hawk whenever, right

    later on when you specialize you probably give up on the other tree entirely so you probably only care about having 1 hound/hawk out at a time, i guess?

  • PLAPLA The process.Registered User regular
    edited October 2017
    Fun thing about warlocks is that one weapon-skill is somewhat comparable to a warlock's full-powered volt-damage, in cost and in damage, and in number of hits.

    Oh, Rover is absolutely not some fire-once-and-go-back-home type of class. Ideally the pet stays with you for the rest of the day after using the skill once. Then you eat some berries, or whatever.
    There's still uses to having a point or a few in both of the summon-skills. It makes your Target Arrow better, if nothing else.

    Owenashi wrote: »
    Between the four 3DS games, does anyone here have an opinion on which makes the best entry point for someone that's only tried out the demos?

    Maybe EOIV? Or V, because it's new and hip. Or the one with the most fun demo.
    You could go for the first Untold to emulate the old entry-point. The labyrinth was kind of spooky, back then.

    Probably the one with the most fun demo.

    PLA on
  • HenroidHenroid Radio Demon Internet HellRegistered User regular
    Out of the 3DS games specifically part 4 is the best entry-point. The grimoire system in the two remakes is way more complex then it should be and would gross people out / give them the wrong impression of what the games are about.

    I was thinking last night about how I'd recommend people get into the series at all. Start with the original, to get the full experience of how shit progresses? Or just start with 3, which is the most dated version now? But then the changes 3 made to the series at that point would be lost / under appreciated.

    Centrism is just the cowardly way to be a bigot w/o being explicit about it.
    American politics isn't 4D chess, it's just if you give a shit about other people or not.
  • TakelTakel Registered User regular
    I personally believe that 4 is the best entry point for absolute beginners. No weak classes, easy to construct a serviceable party composition, the mini dungeons let you grab a quick dive and make you feel you've made progress without having the full map size intimidate you with its blankness. Untold 1/2 after to get series roots maybe, but skip 3 since it had been superseded in every aspect. Three may have advanced the series formula a significant amount, but it doesn't play as nicely as its two numbered successors.

    Grimoire stones are a terrible idea even though they are an attempt to crowbar in a form of cross classing.

    Steam | PSN: MystLansfeld | 3DS: 4656-6210-1377 | FFXIV: Lavinia Lansfeld
  • FrozenzenFrozenzen Registered User regular
    So, initial experiments with quick chant. Don't use it around level 40! I can burn through my warlocks tp thrice as fast for about a 50-100% damage increase. I can't currently kill stuff fast enough to make it worth it.

    Going the elemental route this might be different, but at least with omnimancer it seems like I need amrita II or 15-20 more skillpoints to make it work properly. The 15 points or so spent to get quick chant to 5 and the multi hit chant to 4 would probably do more work invested in skills, or reserve magic (switching up elements increase damage). I do like the design of the elemental caster in this game, they scale as well as runemasters but have more interesting mechanics.

    And on the topic of rovers, you should pick one animal and focus on it. Hounds are pretty good healers, and Hawks are beastly damagedealers. My hawk using hound burns through tp incredibly fast, but does way more damage than my warlock or pugilist, even if the pugilist gets all the procs from one-two punch.

  • OrphaneOrphane Dazzling radiance washes your engine in a gleaming tide. Glory, glory, glory. Registered User regular
    the elemental spec warlock has a passive which has a chance to make spells free (34% at rank 10) and also a chant that reduces spell damage but makes it cost less (5 TP, 1/4th original spell TP cost, 90% of original damage at rank 10; which means 10 TP from quick chant + chant but reducing max rank spell costs by 14-30 TP depending). they ALSO have a buff spell that will make spells refund a portion of their cost to a random party member for a number of turns

    so i think their mana sustain is going to be much better overall than the physical spellcaster

    I'm wondering if the Gift race passives (TP refund based on spell cost + low flat amount) work even when the free cost passive procs because then that gets kinda crazy

  • FrozenzenFrozenzen Registered User regular
    I haven't looked at the gift race passive numbers actually, the master level one could be pretty useful for omnimancers if it can proc of both the chant+the spell you cast each round.

    And yeah, elemental warlock does seem to have better sustain tools. But I really like how the omnimancers multihits can decimate hard random encounters with stun procs or binds, which are fairly reliable when hitting 2-6 times per round. And the game has some brutal random encounters already towards the end of the third stratum, I'm guessing it gets worse.

  • OrphaneOrphane Dazzling radiance washes your engine in a gleaming tide. Glory, glory, glory. Registered User regular
    edited October 2017
    hippogriff seems really nasty mostly because its moveset seems to be completely random other than following up sky dive with rest

    edit: nm, this boss just dicks over physical classes in general and heavily favors elemental damage

    i'm actually kind of salty because this boss seems to be on another level entirely compared to the first stratum boss

    like, i had people go down against the first stratus boss because i didn't know what it did; I have people go down here because it literally just does more damage than I have the ability to mitigate and can easily use several different multitarget attacks at will

    so i either need to retool my party completely, swapping out 2 party members because they just can't contribute enough with my current level or go grind out 5 levels

    Orphane on
  • PLAPLA The process.Registered User regular
    I would rather not use chants at all than using low-level Quick Chant. 15 isn't reasonable.

  • FrozenzenFrozenzen Registered User regular
    PLA wrote: »
    I would rather not use chants at all than using low-level Quick Chant. 15 isn't reasonable.

    Quick chant feels like all or nothing. You need to be able to max quick chant, and get your chant of choice to level 4 or 9 with decent levels in attack skills, as well as ready access to at least amritas for it to work. Elemancers might be able to get away with it with their mana reduction stuff, but omnimancers can't handle the tp strain around level 40.

    And my MVP on hippogryph was my hawk rover, she dealt massive damage with overexertion from my pugilist. I guess I did have pugilist+warlock dealing elemental damage as well though, but the rover was the mvp.
    If you have a celestrian, use chain blast. Hippogryph has no bind resistances as far as I know, and they stuck around forever for me. After the binds dropped it used wing shield, which breaks after you do 500 damage, which should be doable with upgraded weapons and some rank 9 skills.

  • HenroidHenroid Radio Demon Internet HellRegistered User regular
    The "Mastery" passives confuse me. For my Botanist and Warlock, a single point boosts their output substantially. But for my Masurao, I'm not noticing any damage increase.

    Centrism is just the cowardly way to be a bigot w/o being explicit about it.
    American politics isn't 4D chess, it's just if you give a shit about other people or not.
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