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Dem Primary: Choose Your Fighter

BogartBogart Streetwise HerculesRegistered User, Moderator mod
Don't bring up 2016, don't be a dick, don't make personal attacks on other posters and don't just shit memes into the thread.

9 more months of this I swear an early grave is looking tempting right now.

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    PantsBPantsB Fake Thomas Jefferson Registered User regular
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    RedTideRedTide Registered User regular
    The two year grind of an American executive election cycle considered against the UKs call it at any time mystery system and their effects on Bogart's liver and overall homeostasis.

    In this paper...

    RedTide#1907 on Battle.net
    Come Overwatch with meeeee
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    AbsalonAbsalon Lands of Always WinterRegistered User regular
    edited October 2019
    Bogart wrote: »
    Don't bring up 2016, don't be a dick, don't make personal attacks on other posters and don't just shit memes.

    Feels quite biased of the mods to just outright ban Tulsi Gabbard from the thread.


    Warren continues making all the right enemies.

    Data journo at The Economist.

    Absalon on
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    RMS OceanicRMS Oceanic Registered User regular
    I feel like frustrating corporate executives is a net positive regardless of the primary results in this case.

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    AbsalonAbsalon Lands of Always WinterRegistered User regular

    Publisher of the Argo Journal, AP member.

    Not exactly "Let's draft Bob Iger"-territory.

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    RMS OceanicRMS Oceanic Registered User regular
    The subtext of the "none of these guys can win" sentiment is the corollary "and further the policies we are comfortable with".

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    XaquinXaquin Right behind you!Registered User regular
    Absalon wrote: »

    Publisher of the Argo Journal, AP member.

    Not exactly "Let's draft Bob Iger"-territory.

    ok but is that poll per state, or is it just noting that the massive populations of new york and california will be going for a democrat while all the usual red states will be for trump?

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    NobeardNobeard North Carolina: Failed StateRegistered User regular
    From the WaPo article
    national party leaders, nearly all expressed some level of unease with where the field stands and a deepening concern that, even as Trump suffers through one of the darkest phases of his presidency, the leading presidential contenders would struggle mightily in a one-on-one contest with him.

    I stopped reading there. The article is clearly bullshit. It dropped Hillary Clinton in there for no good reason, trying to distract from any substantive discussion. Generally, if what someone says would get them banned from this forum, I consider them safe to disregard.

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    Centipede DamascusCentipede Damascus Registered User regular
    These polls are making me impatient but also anxious for the actual primary voting to begin. The numbers are extremely volatile.

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    NobeardNobeard North Carolina: Failed StateRegistered User regular
    And again, performance against Trump directly, like in a debate, is meaningless. You can't win a debate against a moronic pathological liar, Trumpites consider his idiotic flailing a good thing, and they are biased against whoever his opponent is such that they won't listen. Don't engage Trump, talk to the voters, and dont dwell on how awful Trump is, that won't change anyones mind.

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    TarantioTarantio Registered User regular
    Xaquin wrote: »
    Absalon wrote: »

    Publisher of the Argo Journal, AP member.

    Not exactly "Let's draft Bob Iger"-territory.

    ok but is that poll per state, or is it just noting that the massive populations of new york and california will be going for a democrat while all the usual red states will be for trump?

    The numbers are national (how would you ever represent per-state polling as a percentage) but each of those leads would lead to easy victories if they held up.

    The bigger issue is that since the general is so far away, such polls aren't extremely predictive of the actual outcome.

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    MegaMan001MegaMan001 CRNA Rochester, MNRegistered User regular
    Pissing off corporate executives should be her fucking bumper sticker.

    That's the greatest endorsement of Warren I've read so far.

    I am in the business of saving lives.
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    RMS OceanicRMS Oceanic Registered User regular
    MegaMan001 wrote: »
    Pissing off corporate executives should be her fucking bumper sticker.

    That's the greatest endorsement of Warren I've read so far.

    Their disapproval fills me with pride.

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    AngelHedgieAngelHedgie Registered User regular
    Harris is now using cooking as outreach:



    I do have to agree that bacon can be a spice.

    XBL: Nox Aeternum / PSN: NoxAeternum / NN:NoxAeternum / Steam: noxaeternum
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    Fleur de AlysFleur de Alys Biohacker Registered User regular
    Honestly the only "vs. Trump" polls I care about would be the half dozen purple states that are deciding the election (I hate our system so much).

    As for the Democratic candidate polls, Warren + Sanders are consistently equal to or above Biden, even in the most Biden-friendly polls (the CNN one last thread), and most of their supporters would likely switch to the other of the two instead of tossing to Biden. Also Warren had a lot more more #2's among the chaff candidates than Biden. So, as long as they don't do the worst possible thing and both stay in too long, one of them wins (at current trajectory).

    Also, taking the Senate is more important than getting the best Democratic primary candidate on the national ticket, but this isn't the thread for that.

    Triptycho: A card-and-dice tabletop indie RPG currently in development and playtesting
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    LadaiLadai Registered User regular
    edited October 2019
    Pretty small potatoes as far as these things go, I know, but the mayor of Philadelphia has endorsed Warren.


    Text:
    I am endorsing Elizabeth Warren for President because she is a tough and determined leader. She has what it takes to defeat Donald Trump and lead us in the post-Trump era. She will unite us and put power in the hands of working families - & get our nation back on the right track.

    Also, rando Philly guy with the most Philly response:

    Ladai on
    ely3ub6du1oe.jpg
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    MrMonroeMrMonroe passed out on the floor nowRegistered User regular
    Nobeard wrote: »
    And again, performance against Trump directly, like in a debate, is meaningless. You can't win a debate against a moronic pathological liar, Trumpites consider his idiotic flailing a good thing, and they are biased against whoever his opponent is such that they won't listen. Don't engage Trump, talk to the voters, and dont dwell on how awful Trump is, that won't change anyones mind.

    I wonder if the best debate strategy isn't to show up as belligerent as possible, interrupt him with insults, and see if you can't provoke him into unilaterally canceling the remaining debates.

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    RMS OceanicRMS Oceanic Registered User regular
    I think the best direct way to handle Trump is to highlight all his business failures.

    "When he passed away, Fred Trump had a property portfolio worth $1 Billion. His son Donald arranged its sale for $700 million. Is he that great a negotiator?"

    Attacking his morals won't work, and he probably likes the belligerency of an insult, the wrestling with a pig thing. What he cares about is his image of a successful businessman, so you puncture that if you want to get under his skin.

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    MegaMan001MegaMan001 CRNA Rochester, MNRegistered User regular
    edited October 2019
    MrMonroe wrote: »
    Nobeard wrote: »
    And again, performance against Trump directly, like in a debate, is meaningless. You can't win a debate against a moronic pathological liar, Trumpites consider his idiotic flailing a good thing, and they are biased against whoever his opponent is such that they won't listen. Don't engage Trump, talk to the voters, and dont dwell on how awful Trump is, that won't change anyones mind.

    I wonder if the best debate strategy isn't to show up as belligerent as possible, interrupt him with insults, and see if you can't provoke him into unilaterally canceling the remaining debates.

    I feel like the only way to "beat" Trump is to be aggressive and attack. We've never seen him stand up to anyone in person that wasn't carefully choreographed on his television appearances or with a crowd of supporters at his back.

    Get up there and work the failure of Trump Steaks, Trump Air, ask why you can't root for the NY Trump Football team, or why he doesn't have an Emmy.

    Oh an call him a coward, repeatedly, for any of the number of reasons he's a coward.

    MegaMan001 on
    I am in the business of saving lives.
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    ButtersButters A glass of some milks Registered User regular
    I think the best direct way to handle Trump is to highlight all his business failures.

    "When he passed away, Fred Trump had a property portfolio worth $1 Billion. His son Donald arranged its sale for $700 million. Is he that great a negotiator?"

    Attacking his morals won't work, and he probably likes the belligerency of an insult, the wrestling with a pig thing. What he cares about is his image of a successful businessman, so you puncture that if you want to get under his skin.

    All of the perception of his business acumen came from his stupid TV show. I'm not sure how you change the minds of people foolish enough to actually believe The Apprentice is real.

    PSN: idontworkhere582 | CFN: idontworkhere | Steam: lordbutters | Amazon Wishlist
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    -Tal-Tal Registered User regular
    no dude you gotta be way meaner. tell him his father never loved him and he's laughing in hell at his failures

    PNk1Ml4.png
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    ElendilElendil Registered User regular
    I think the best direct way to handle Trump is to highlight all his business failures.

    "When he passed away, Fred Trump had a property portfolio worth $1 Billion. His son Donald arranged its sale for $700 million. Is he that great a negotiator?"

    Attacking his morals won't work, and he probably likes the belligerency of an insult, the wrestling with a pig thing. What he cares about is his image of a successful businessman, so you puncture that if you want to get under his skin.
    a: we definitely did this and it accomplished just as much as making fun of his small hands
    b: the corollary of that argument is that we want a good, successful businessman as president, which fuck no

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    ElendilElendil Registered User regular
    we should own trump by saying he's only got a few hundred million dollars

    imagine supporting a big loser like that

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    joshofalltradesjoshofalltrades Class Traitor Smoke-filled roomRegistered User regular
    edited October 2019
    You win voters over by making promises that appeal to them

    If you’re gonna hit Trump on anything it should be that he’s a criminal and hasn’t done anything to help them

    joshofalltrades on
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    PreacherPreacher Registered User regular
    You win voters over by making promises that appeal to them

    If you’re gonna hit Trump on anything it should be that he’s a criminal and hasn’t done anything to help them

    Yeah point out how much he's given away to corporate farms hurt by his tarriffs, but nothing to factory workers who have lost jobs due to them.

    I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.

    pleasepaypreacher.net
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    Shazkar ShadowstormShazkar Shadowstorm Registered User regular
    i do think it's a bummer that castro is likely out
    i would much rather hear his voice on the debate stage than a lot of the other lower tier candidates who are polling ahead of him
    he puts POC perspective out there that other people are not addressing in the same way at all

    poo
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    ForarForar #432 Toronto, Ontario, CanadaRegistered User regular
    i do think it's a bummer that castro is likely out
    i would much rather hear his voice on the debate stage than a lot of the other lower tier candidates who are polling ahead of him
    he puts POC perspective out there that other people are not addressing in the same way at all

    I can't say I've favoured him to win, but I have been generally happy with his presentation thus far.

    I get that there's a sentiment of 'oh god, get some young blood in higher spots!' contrasted with the three frontrunners, but given that he's only 45 years old, there's time for him to build his reputation and take on further roles of responsibility.

    First they came for the Muslims, and we said NOT TODAY, MOTHERFUCKER!
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    joshofalltradesjoshofalltrades Class Traitor Smoke-filled roomRegistered User regular
    I would be very happy with Castro as VP for any of the candidates

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    MegaMan001MegaMan001 CRNA Rochester, MNRegistered User regular
    I would be very happy with Castro as VP for any of the candidates

    Warren Castro would please me deeply.

    Actually, Warren and any non old white guy from a supposed swing state would still please me.

    I am in the business of saving lives.
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    joshofalltradesjoshofalltrades Class Traitor Smoke-filled roomRegistered User regular
    As much as he got shit for it Castro was very good at taking the hit and calling bullshit in the debates

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    RMS OceanicRMS Oceanic Registered User regular
    You win voters over by making promises that appeal to them

    If you’re gonna hit Trump on anything it should be that he’s a criminal and hasn’t done anything to help them

    I definitely agree, and a campaign that's about jobs and healthcare is probably the better tack. My reasoning was for when confronting Trump directly is unavoidable. My thesis is "he's doing bad things" will not resonate for a variety of reasons, so "he's failing at what he tries" is a better approach.

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    ArcTangentArcTangent Registered User regular
    edited October 2019
    Edit:

    Wrong thread. Sorry.

    ArcTangent on
    ztrEPtD.gif
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    MrMisterMrMister Jesus dying on the cross in pain? Morally better than us. One has to go "all in".Registered User regular
    When Marco Rubio took his turn on stage to try to make a joke about Trump’s small penis—under the theory that he was thin skinned and would melt down—it was the most debased, depressing moment of 2016 outside of the part where Trump went on to win, so not super eager to double down on that

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    TryCatcherTryCatcher Registered User regular
    edited October 2019
    MrMister wrote: »
    When Marco Rubio took his turn on stage to try to make a joke about Trump’s small penis—under the theory that he was thin skinned and would melt down—it was the most debased, depressing moment of 2016 outside of the part where Trump went on to win, so not super eager to double down on that
    Can't out mud wrestle Trump, the man is all too happy and comfortable to play on a territory where a complete lack of shame is an advantage.

    TryCatcher on
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    zepherinzepherin Russian warship, go fuck yourself Registered User regular
    As much as he got shit for it Castro was very good at taking the hit and calling bullshit in the debates
    Castro is someone who can take the roll of fire brand and is a fighter. For someone who has a tempered personality like Warren, who wants to mitigate sexism and avoid coming across as a "ball-buster." She can be the moderate "adult" voice while Castro can be the one to take the shots and do the punching and dirty work. Castro would be good to engage in the mud slinging. Also bringing more hispanic voters to the polls is never a bad thing. I like a Warren Castro Ticket.

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    TryCatcherTryCatcher Registered User regular
    Joe Biden on impeachment:

    Also Joe Biden on impeachment, less than 24 hours later:


    "Well, Trump did it on purpouse". Come on man.

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    Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    CBS reporter with Yang highlighting exactly why a candidate saying "I support medicare for all" isnt good enough

    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
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    enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    Biden's only sort of bad poll today was from South Carolina. Lost 13 points net there to Warren. Still leads by 17 though.

    The Wisconsin gold standard poll (Marquette) has Biden up 7 on Warren in that state. He's up 3 points since the last poll, she's up 7. In the general, Biden +6, Sanders +2, Warren +1 on Trump. Warren's the only one to go up since last time.

    Does feel like there's a little rally around Biden because Trump did illegal shit to attack him effect going on here. But I don't like Biden so I'm biased in explaining why he's had a bounce back this week.

    Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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    Fleur de AlysFleur de Alys Biohacker Registered User regular
    Tbh I don't see the big deal if a candidate supports M4A but also is fine with allowing health insurance to technically exist. They'd shrink fast, most probably going under, the rest becoming coverage for niche things that M4A is either weak on or doesn't cover for whatever reason. Maybe a few expensive plans for private hospitals, which sucks for making another tier of health care, but the UK system suggests that wouldn't be the end of the world.

    Triptycho: A card-and-dice tabletop indie RPG currently in development and playtesting
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    ToxTox I kill threads he/himRegistered User regular
    The Sauce wrote: »
    Tbh I don't see the big deal if a candidate supports M4A but also is fine with allowing health insurance to technically exist. They'd shrink fast, most probably going under, the rest becoming coverage for niche things that M4A is either weak on or doesn't cover for whatever reason. Maybe a few expensive plans for private hospitals, which sucks for making another tier of health care, but the UK system suggests that wouldn't be the end of the world.

    My take is basically "yes Medicare for all. Don't we have companies that offer Medicare supplemental insurance?"

    Obviously over time those will go away, and that's fine and good, but to say you can't have both seems at least a little silly.

    Twitter! | Dilige, et quod vis fac
This discussion has been closed.