Ricks aversion to time travel is interesting and I hope it becomes a plot point. Like rick has ran into future rick who caused beths mom to die or something that has made him convinced he’ll never invent time travel
Or the rick kills baby rick ending or Rick is future morty or some connection that makes him think he can never do that
But all of that is dumb considering he did invent it for the snakes
I think Dan Harmon just hates Time Travel and considers it hack.
You can tell a story that's only about time travel or you can tell a shitty story that has time travel in it. Those are really the only ways to go. Time travel makes any story not explicity about the time travel pointless because you can always just time travel and fix any possible conflict. And the ability to fix conflicts, taken recursively, is the snake people story.
Ricks aversion to time travel is interesting and I hope it becomes a plot point. Like rick has ran into future rick who caused beths mom to die or something that has made him convinced he’ll never invent time travel
Or the rick kills baby rick ending or Rick is future morty or some connection that makes him think he can never do that
But all of that is dumb considering he did invent it for the snakes
I think Dan Harmon just hates Time Travel and considers it hack.
You can tell a story that's only about time travel or you can tell a shitty story that has time travel in it. Those are really the only ways to go. Time travel makes any story not explicity about the time travel pointless because you can always just time travel and fix any possible conflict. And the ability to fix conflicts, taken recursively, is the snake people story.
Well with Harmon's track record it's guaranteed to be a shitty story made for the sole purpose to shit on time travel as a plot device.
Ricks aversion to time travel is interesting and I hope it becomes a plot point. Like rick has ran into future rick who caused beths mom to die or something that has made him convinced he’ll never invent time travel
Or the rick kills baby rick ending or Rick is future morty or some connection that makes him think he can never do that
But all of that is dumb considering he did invent it for the snakes
I think Dan Harmon just hates Time Travel and considers it hack.
You can tell a story that's only about time travel or you can tell a shitty story that has time travel in it. Those are really the only ways to go. Time travel makes any story not explicity about the time travel pointless because you can always just time travel and fix any possible conflict. And the ability to fix conflicts, taken recursively, is the snake people story.
It's been suggested that authors (and other creators) should only be allowed one time travel story, so that if and when they decide to write one, they treat it with the gravitas and care it requires.
Time travel is a really fun device, it is something I've been obsessed with since I was a kid thanks to predestination paradoxes like The Terminator and Back to the Future, and the more fun use in Groundhog Day, but if you make it easily accessible it becomes a crutch very easily and a plot hole at worst, since you're always just asking why they don't use time travel to go fix things.
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Golden YakBurnished BovineThe sunny beaches of CanadaRegistered Userregular
I wouldn't mind less 'terrible asshole Rick' and more 'deranged mad scientist Rick.' We've probably come too far since then, but the Rick who thought preying mantis DNA would cancel out vole DNA because it was 'totally opposite' is a Rick who's hilarious without being shocking or horrible (the shock and horror came from Rick being a bad scientist, not a bad person). And you can still have that element of Rick being a monster with stuff like the time-stamp episode, where it comes not from Rick having a terrible past or being a bad father, but just him being this crazy old man who's fucking with you because you criticized his genius.
That's the Rick who killed human civilization on an earth and abandon his daughter and granddaughter without a second thought?
Yeeeaah, but he didn't do it because of cynical nihilism or crippling loneliness or being unable to connect with his family. He did it because he mixed the DNA from a bunch of stuff incluidng 'just a smidge of dinosaur', because he thought it would add up to normal human, and then bailed with the fantastic advice of 'don't think about it'. His weird science and how it fucks with life was the focus of the catastrophe, not just something to distract from his personal emotional baggage.
Time travel can be great; you either need to take it seriously or just Doctor Who/Legends of Tomorrow it and not think about it too much. If you try to take it seriously and don't stick the landing, though, that's when you get into trouble.
Orson Scott Card (yes, I know) wrote an incredible time travel novel called Pastwatch: the Redemption of Christopher Columbus (I know).
The Future People realized that, as soon as they tried to prevent western culture from evolving in a toxic way via time travel, their future would likely cease to exist, so they only had one shot at it. They did it anyway because the environment was fucked because America Fuck Yeah.
Actually a really satisfying time travel story with a good message. From fucking Orson Scott Card.
I wouldn't expect Rick & Morty to put that much effort into it, but if they can Legends of Tomorrow it, I'm down. Regular time travel can't be that much different from snake time travel, and they knocked that one out of the park.
Ricks aversion to time travel is interesting and I hope it becomes a plot point. Like rick has ran into future rick who caused beths mom to die or something that has made him convinced he’ll never invent time travel
Or the rick kills baby rick ending or Rick is future morty or some connection that makes him think he can never do that
But all of that is dumb considering he did invent it for the snakes
I think Dan Harmon just hates Time Travel and considers it hack.
You can tell a story that's only about time travel or you can tell a shitty story that has time travel in it. Those are really the only ways to go. Time travel makes any story not explicity about the time travel pointless because you can always just time travel and fix any possible conflict. And the ability to fix conflicts, taken recursively, is the snake people story.
Well with Harmon's track record it's guaranteed to be a shitty story made for the sole purpose to shit on time travel as a plot device.
The snake episode was Harmon shitting on time travel as a plot device.
And yes, Harmon hates time travel stories. Not necessarily time travel itself, but he's obsessive about details and has said before that time travel always creates a lot of unexplained loose ends.
I always found Harmon’s disdain for time travel weird. It’s a plot device, that’s it. Time travel in a story is functionally no different than magic or deities or any other impossible thing. It’s how you tell it that matters.
Battlenet ID: MildC#11186 - If I'm in the game, send me an invite at anytime and I'll play.
I always found Harmon’s disdain for time travel weird. It’s a plot device, that’s it. Time travel in a story is functionally no different than magic or deities or any other impossible thing. It’s how you tell it that matters.
It is just one of the hardest to get right. At least if you care about things like "consistency" or "urgency" or "making sense".
In the last episode one of the memories we see is young beth hugging her mom (who's back is towards us) and you see a video camera on the counter... It's a reverse of the scene from "Simple rick" weirdly enough. Same room and camera
I always found Harmon’s disdain for time travel weird. It’s a plot device, that’s it. Time travel in a story is functionally no different than magic or deities or any other impossible thing. It’s how you tell it that matters.
It is just one of the hardest to get right. At least if you care about things like "consistency" or "urgency" or "making sense".
But hard doesn’t make it bad. Lots of story elements are hard to pull off in a satisfactory way, like villain protagonists or deus ex machinas as examples.
A lot of my favorite media has time travel in one form or another; Back to the Future, the MCU, Bill and Ted, Edge of Tomorrow, Chrono Trigger, Command and Conquer, Ocarina of Time, Majora’s Mask, Terminator 1 and 2, Deadpool 2, Prince of Persia (the game), Army of Darkness, Futurama, etc
I think the Terminator franchise past Judgement Day is probably the best example of why time travel stories can suck. I honestly don’t even think it’s time travel as a concept, but nostalgic based money grabs that force stories to push beyond their conclusions, that makes a lot of these shit stories. Every genre can suffer that though, and plot holes, inconsistency, and sense of urgency in the plot is universal in bad story telling and not limited to time travel stories.
Like, I don’t have any numbers or whatever, but I bet if we could ratio what is popularly considered good time travel stories to bad ones, it’d probably be more or less equal to good and bad stories in any other genre.
Harmon can have his own opinion on it as a plot device, but that doesn’t mean I can’t think he’s being a bit silly for having such a raging hard-on for hating it. Maybe he’s just mad that Marty didn’t bang his mom when he had the chance or something.
Battlenet ID: MildC#11186 - If I'm in the game, send me an invite at anytime and I'll play.
I think the Terminator franchise past Judgement Day is probably the best example of why time travel stories can suck. I honestly don’t even think it’s time travel as a concept, but nostalgic based money grabs that force stories to push beyond their conclusions, that makes a lot of these shit stories. Every genre can suffer that though, and plot holes, inconsistency, and sense of urgency in the plot is universal in bad story telling and not limited to time travel stories.
I recently had it pointed out to me that the Terminator's that don't suck follow the "Time Travel is pointless" rules. Nothing changed because of any of the time travel in the first two movies. This results in a paradox where folks take actions that lead to their own creation and such like.
I'd find it funny if Rick hates time travel because he did it once, it just resulted in the exact same scenario because it follows those rules so he decided to never bother with it again.
I think the Terminator franchise past Judgement Day is probably the best example of why time travel stories can suck. I honestly don’t even think it’s time travel as a concept, but nostalgic based money grabs that force stories to push beyond their conclusions, that makes a lot of these shit stories. Every genre can suffer that though, and plot holes, inconsistency, and sense of urgency in the plot is universal in bad story telling and not limited to time travel stories.
I recently had it pointed out to me that the Terminator's that don't suck follow the "Time Travel is pointless" rules. Nothing changed because of any of the time travel in the first two movies. This results in a paradox where folks take actions that lead to their own creation and such like.
I'd find it funny if Rick hates time travel because he did it once, it just resulted in the exact same scenario because it follows those rules so he decided to never bother with it again.
Terminator 2 is expressly about changing the future.
I think the Terminator franchise past Judgement Day is probably the best example of why time travel stories can suck. I honestly don’t even think it’s time travel as a concept, but nostalgic based money grabs that force stories to push beyond their conclusions, that makes a lot of these shit stories. Every genre can suffer that though, and plot holes, inconsistency, and sense of urgency in the plot is universal in bad story telling and not limited to time travel stories.
I recently had it pointed out to me that the Terminator's that don't suck follow the "Time Travel is pointless" rules. Nothing changed because of any of the time travel in the first two movies. This results in a paradox where folks take actions that lead to their own creation and such like.
I'd find it funny if Rick hates time travel because he did it once, it just resulted in the exact same scenario because it follows those rules so he decided to never bother with it again.
Terminator 2 is expressly about changing the future.
There’s a deleted scene in Terminator 2 that has an older Sarah Conner living to Judgement Day and absolutely nothing happens and if I recall correctly, she states in a voice over that it worked. Movie franchise over.
It’s greed based serial escalation that brought about more movies, but that’s a problem with movie studios cynically recycling popular franchises in shameless money grabs, not the plot of T2.
Just look at every Jurassic Park since the first one; all just varying degrees of bad to mediocre, but that doesn’t mean dinosaur stories suddenly suck and Jurassic Park 1 is retroactively bad by association.
Battlenet ID: MildC#11186 - If I'm in the game, send me an invite at anytime and I'll play.
I think the Terminator franchise past Judgement Day is probably the best example of why time travel stories can suck. I honestly don’t even think it’s time travel as a concept, but nostalgic based money grabs that force stories to push beyond their conclusions, that makes a lot of these shit stories. Every genre can suffer that though, and plot holes, inconsistency, and sense of urgency in the plot is universal in bad story telling and not limited to time travel stories.
I recently had it pointed out to me that the Terminator's that don't suck follow the "Time Travel is pointless" rules. Nothing changed because of any of the time travel in the first two movies. This results in a paradox where folks take actions that lead to their own creation and such like.
I'd find it funny if Rick hates time travel because he did it once, it just resulted in the exact same scenario because it follows those rules so he decided to never bother with it again.
Terminator 2 is expressly about changing the future.
There’s a deleted scene in Terminator 2 that has an older Sarah Conner living to Judgement Day and absolutely nothing happens and if I recall correctly, she states in a voice over that it worked. Movie franchise over.
It’s greed based serial escalation that brought about more movies, but that’s a problem with movie studios cynically recycling popular franchises in shameless money grabs, not the plot of T2.
Just look at every Jurassic Park since the first one; all just varying degrees of bad to mediocre, but that doesn’t mean dinosaur stories suddenly suck and Jurassic Park 1 is retroactively bad by association.
1. Audiences hated that original ending
2. The original ending doesn't even make any sense. Skynet was the result of humanity's own flaws, and the Connors didn't do anything to fix humanity. If anything, all those explosions and deaths would have driven humanity to accelerate things faster.
Also if humans have the resources to send a robot back why doesn't Skynet send a dozen? Or send T-1000 back to events of the first movie? Or any of the million other escalations we saw with the snakes?
Also if humans have the resources to send a robot back why doesn't Skynet send a dozen? Or send T-1000 back to events of the first movie? Or any of the million other escalations we saw with the snakes?
My guess:
Because Skynet was dealing with diverging time lines,
Snakenet was dealing with converging time lines.
Each time Skynet sent a terminator back, a new timeline was created.
But for Snakenet, all the timeline altering shenanigans converged into a single point in space and time, destroying all further timelines by dragging all potential futures into the same place. Something something snake eating it's tale and/or ouroboros ala Rick.
All because Rick wanted to make a point about how stupid time travel is, so he intentionally made it as stupid as possible.
I think the Terminator franchise past Judgement Day is probably the best example of why time travel stories can suck. I honestly don’t even think it’s time travel as a concept, but nostalgic based money grabs that force stories to push beyond their conclusions, that makes a lot of these shit stories. Every genre can suffer that though, and plot holes, inconsistency, and sense of urgency in the plot is universal in bad story telling and not limited to time travel stories.
I recently had it pointed out to me that the Terminator's that don't suck follow the "Time Travel is pointless" rules. Nothing changed because of any of the time travel in the first two movies. This results in a paradox where folks take actions that lead to their own creation and such like.
I'd find it funny if Rick hates time travel because he did it once, it just resulted in the exact same scenario because it follows those rules so he decided to never bother with it again.
Terminator 2 is expressly about changing the future.
There’s a deleted scene in Terminator 2 that has an older Sarah Conner living to Judgement Day and absolutely nothing happens and if I recall correctly, she states in a voice over that it worked. Movie franchise over.
It’s greed based serial escalation that brought about more movies, but that’s a problem with movie studios cynically recycling popular franchises in shameless money grabs, not the plot of T2.
Just look at every Jurassic Park since the first one; all just varying degrees of bad to mediocre, but that doesn’t mean dinosaur stories suddenly suck and Jurassic Park 1 is retroactively bad by association.
1. Audiences hated that original ending
2. The original ending doesn't even make any sense. Skynet was the result of humanity's own flaws, and the Connors didn't do anything to fix humanity. If anything, all those explosions and deaths would have driven humanity to accelerate things faster.
Skynet was the result of a parodx (deleted ending for Terminator 1 confirms this was on Cameron's mind before Terminator 2) by destroying all terminator tech and research derived from it, they prevented something like Skynet from being built until humanity develops that technology naturally. Humanity may still destroy itself, or make something to destroy itself, but it's no longer certain.
Also if humans have the resources to send a robot back why doesn't Skynet send a dozen? Or send T-1000 back to events of the first movie? Or any of the million other escalations we saw with the snakes?
IIRC, humanity took down Skynet right as it got time travel working, so it only had time to send back the first one (and later retconned the second one). It's been awhile, but I think Reese mentions it in the first movie.
That was the bit about the snake episode I thought was hilarious. The second time travel was invented, hundreds of snakes started appearing. Because that's exactly what should logically happen. You send someone to change the future, they send someone to stop you, you send someone to stop them from stopping you, they send someone...
"The sausage of Green Earth explodes with flavor like the cannon of culinary delight."
But it still had two! They could have sent it to the same point they sent T-800!
It's the equivalent of anime sending one villain at a time to fight the hero.
Skynet was sending terminators to fight against people who had no conception of what a terminator was. The issue wasn't one of firepower, but of tracking. You really don't need more than one terminator to track someone down, but targeting different time periods gives more opportunities for success.
I always found Harmon’s disdain for time travel weird. It’s a plot device, that’s it. Time travel in a story is functionally no different than magic or deities or any other impossible thing. It’s how you tell it that matters.
It is just one of the hardest to get right. At least if you care about things like "consistency" or "urgency" or "making sense".
But hard doesn’t make it bad. Lots of story elements are hard to pull off in a satisfactory way, like villain protagonists or deus ex machinas as examples.
A lot of my favorite media has time travel in one form or another; Back to the Future, the MCU, Bill and Ted, Edge of Tomorrow, Chrono Trigger, Command and Conquer, Ocarina of Time, Majora’s Mask, Terminator 1 and 2, Deadpool 2, Prince of Persia (the game), Army of Darkness, Futurama, etc
I think the Terminator franchise past Judgement Day is probably the best example of why time travel stories can suck. I honestly don’t even think it’s time travel as a concept, but nostalgic based money grabs that force stories to push beyond their conclusions, that makes a lot of these shit stories. Every genre can suffer that though, and plot holes, inconsistency, and sense of urgency in the plot is universal in bad story telling and not limited to time travel stories.
Like, I don’t have any numbers or whatever, but I bet if we could ratio what is popularly considered good time travel stories to bad ones, it’d probably be more or less equal to good and bad stories in any other genre.
Harmon can have his own opinion on it as a plot device, but that doesn’t mean I can’t think he’s being a bit silly for having such a raging hard-on for hating it. Maybe he’s just mad that Marty didn’t bang his mom when he had the chance or something.
But it still had two! They could have sent it to the same point they sent T-800!
It's the equivalent of anime sending one villain at a time to fight the hero.
Skynet was sending terminators to fight against people who had no conception of what a terminator was. The issue wasn't one of firepower, but of tracking. You really don't need more than one terminator to track someone down, but targeting different time periods gives more opportunities for success.
The problem was very clearly an issue of firepower and not tracking. Never mind that having dealt with the first terminator gave her plenty conception of what to do when the second showed up.
I love those movies but the time travel literally does not make sense.
Also if humans have the resources to send a robot back why doesn't Skynet send a dozen? Or send T-1000 back to events of the first movie? Or any of the million other escalations we saw with the snakes?
IIRC, humanity took down Skynet right as it got time travel working, so it only had time to send back the first one (and later retconned the second one). It's been awhile, but I think Reese mentions it in the first movie.
Yup. Skynet was losing the war at that point which is why they decided to do something as risky as fucking with time and probably didn't realize it would create a new timeline.
The second timeline's Skynet was enhanced because the computer and cybernetics tech got a couple decades worth of jump start from the arm and chip left behind by the 101 in T1, so it was able to maintain it's original timeline (sending the 101 back to try and fail to kill Sarah) and proceed with further time fuckery by dropping the T-1000 further along John's timeline to take another swing. But it was still losing the war, as shown by the human resistance taking the time travel facility immediately after to drop Reese and the 800 back in time to protect the timeline.
But it still had two! They could have sent it to the same point they sent T-800!
It's the equivalent of anime sending one villain at a time to fight the hero.
Skynet was sending terminators to fight against people who had no conception of what a terminator was. The issue wasn't one of firepower, but of tracking. You really don't need more than one terminator to track someone down, but targeting different time periods gives more opportunities for success.
The problem was very clearly an issue of firepower and not tracking.
Skynet sent those Terminators to kill unsuspecting humans, not to fight against a battle harded future soldier and a reprogrammed t-800, which is what wound up happening.
Never mind that having dealt with the first terminator gave her plenty conception of what to do when the second showed up.
Except the second one was completely unlike the first one, which is probably why it was sent to later date. Also, the more likely scenerio was that the t-800 was unable to find Sarah Conner (or mistook her for someone else) rather than a random waitress being able to stop or destroy a future cyborg she had no idea was coming.
I love those movies but the time travel literally does not make sense.
I'd be more upset about why the fuck only living tissue, machines covered in living tissue, or machines covered in an alloy mimicking living tissue, can be sent through time. It's such a bullshit cop-out the movie itself has to lampshade it!
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Ninja Snarl PMy helmet is my burden.Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered Userregular
Eh, people can live in electromagnetic fields that would cook electronics handily. Crazy time-travelling super-science that says you can send back flesh things and not metal ones is hardly inconsistent or outrageous. As for the T-1000 going back, they probably just wrapped it in the same default meat bag they used to let it go hunt people, not had it mimic flesh (which, according to the T-800, it couldn't do).
And finally, not sending back weapons is a dead easy solve: sending back laser machine guns would've been incredibly non-sneaky, which would've run completely counter to the Terminator mission. If the first Terminator had rolled up to the police station and unloaded with plasma weapons, there's no way anyone would've shrugged that off as some guy wearing body armor and high on drugs. Same situation for the T-1000 in T2, and the T-800 couldn't take future weapons either because they couldn't risk the tech being turned into Skynet.
Firepower-wise, the Terminators had zero issues with termination with contemporary weapons; they were basically unstoppable and had no issues just using regular guns to wipe out everyone. The only struggle they had was reaching the targets quickly enough, which is why the issue for them was tracking and had nothing to do with firepower.
If you are interested in well-written time travel stories where the rules do make sense and are very consistent (albeit quite complex), you should definitely check out Steins;Gate. It's a visual novel available on Steam, but there is also an anime adaptation which is very well regarded. For me, it's basically the gold standard of time travel fiction.
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Golden YakBurnished BovineThe sunny beaches of CanadaRegistered Userregular
I got this magic cross bow in the modern day, then I went back in time and got the old version out of the same box 400 years ago, because fuck paradox, I got crossbows!
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
The point of Terminator was that you can’t change the future.
The point of T2 was that you can change the future.
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
The point of Terminator 3 was that have you ever had a dream that you, um, you had, your, you- you could, you’ll do, you- you wants, you, you could do so, you- you’ll do, you could- you, you want, you want them to do you so much you could do anything?
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You can tell a story that's only about time travel or you can tell a shitty story that has time travel in it. Those are really the only ways to go. Time travel makes any story not explicity about the time travel pointless because you can always just time travel and fix any possible conflict. And the ability to fix conflicts, taken recursively, is the snake people story.
Well with Harmon's track record it's guaranteed to be a shitty story made for the sole purpose to shit on time travel as a plot device.
It's been suggested that authors (and other creators) should only be allowed one time travel story, so that if and when they decide to write one, they treat it with the gravitas and care it requires.
Yeeeaah, but he didn't do it because of cynical nihilism or crippling loneliness or being unable to connect with his family. He did it because he mixed the DNA from a bunch of stuff incluidng 'just a smidge of dinosaur', because he thought it would add up to normal human, and then bailed with the fantastic advice of 'don't think about it'. His weird science and how it fucks with life was the focus of the catastrophe, not just something to distract from his personal emotional baggage.
Orson Scott Card (yes, I know) wrote an incredible time travel novel called Pastwatch: the Redemption of Christopher Columbus (I know).
I wouldn't expect Rick & Morty to put that much effort into it, but if they can Legends of Tomorrow it, I'm down. Regular time travel can't be that much different from snake time travel, and they knocked that one out of the park.
The snake episode was Harmon shitting on time travel as a plot device.
And yes, Harmon hates time travel stories. Not necessarily time travel itself, but he's obsessive about details and has said before that time travel always creates a lot of unexplained loose ends.
Battlenet ID: MildC#11186 - If I'm in the game, send me an invite at anytime and I'll play.
It is just one of the hardest to get right. At least if you care about things like "consistency" or "urgency" or "making sense".
But hard doesn’t make it bad. Lots of story elements are hard to pull off in a satisfactory way, like villain protagonists or deus ex machinas as examples.
A lot of my favorite media has time travel in one form or another; Back to the Future, the MCU, Bill and Ted, Edge of Tomorrow, Chrono Trigger, Command and Conquer, Ocarina of Time, Majora’s Mask, Terminator 1 and 2, Deadpool 2, Prince of Persia (the game), Army of Darkness, Futurama, etc
I think the Terminator franchise past Judgement Day is probably the best example of why time travel stories can suck. I honestly don’t even think it’s time travel as a concept, but nostalgic based money grabs that force stories to push beyond their conclusions, that makes a lot of these shit stories. Every genre can suffer that though, and plot holes, inconsistency, and sense of urgency in the plot is universal in bad story telling and not limited to time travel stories.
Like, I don’t have any numbers or whatever, but I bet if we could ratio what is popularly considered good time travel stories to bad ones, it’d probably be more or less equal to good and bad stories in any other genre.
Harmon can have his own opinion on it as a plot device, but that doesn’t mean I can’t think he’s being a bit silly for having such a raging hard-on for hating it. Maybe he’s just mad that Marty didn’t bang his mom when he had the chance or something.
Battlenet ID: MildC#11186 - If I'm in the game, send me an invite at anytime and I'll play.
I recently had it pointed out to me that the Terminator's that don't suck follow the "Time Travel is pointless" rules. Nothing changed because of any of the time travel in the first two movies. This results in a paradox where folks take actions that lead to their own creation and such like.
I'd find it funny if Rick hates time travel because he did it once, it just resulted in the exact same scenario because it follows those rules so he decided to never bother with it again.
Terminator 2 is expressly about changing the future.
There’s a deleted scene in Terminator 2 that has an older Sarah Conner living to Judgement Day and absolutely nothing happens and if I recall correctly, she states in a voice over that it worked. Movie franchise over.
It’s greed based serial escalation that brought about more movies, but that’s a problem with movie studios cynically recycling popular franchises in shameless money grabs, not the plot of T2.
Just look at every Jurassic Park since the first one; all just varying degrees of bad to mediocre, but that doesn’t mean dinosaur stories suddenly suck and Jurassic Park 1 is retroactively bad by association.
Battlenet ID: MildC#11186 - If I'm in the game, send me an invite at anytime and I'll play.
1. Audiences hated that original ending
2. The original ending doesn't even make any sense. Skynet was the result of humanity's own flaws, and the Connors didn't do anything to fix humanity. If anything, all those explosions and deaths would have driven humanity to accelerate things faster.
Because Skynet was dealing with diverging time lines,
Snakenet was dealing with converging time lines.
Each time Skynet sent a terminator back, a new timeline was created.
But for Snakenet, all the timeline altering shenanigans converged into a single point in space and time, destroying all further timelines by dragging all potential futures into the same place. Something something snake eating it's tale and/or ouroboros ala Rick.
All because Rick wanted to make a point about how stupid time travel is, so he intentionally made it as stupid as possible.
Skynet was the result of a parodx (deleted ending for Terminator 1 confirms this was on Cameron's mind before Terminator 2) by destroying all terminator tech and research derived from it, they prevented something like Skynet from being built until humanity develops that technology naturally. Humanity may still destroy itself, or make something to destroy itself, but it's no longer certain.
IIRC, humanity took down Skynet right as it got time travel working, so it only had time to send back the first one (and later retconned the second one). It's been awhile, but I think Reese mentions it in the first movie.
It's the equivalent of anime sending one villain at a time to fight the hero.
Origin: Galedrid - Nintendo: Galedrid/3222-6858-1045
Blizzard: Galedrid#1367 - FFXIV: Galedrid Kingshand
Like the world is blown to shit but the rest of the world is sending war material/soldiers to the US in order to contain the machines.
Come Overwatch with meeeee
Skynet was sending terminators to fight against people who had no conception of what a terminator was. The issue wasn't one of firepower, but of tracking. You really don't need more than one terminator to track someone down, but targeting different time periods gives more opportunities for success.
"90% of everything is crap."
The problem was very clearly an issue of firepower and not tracking. Never mind that having dealt with the first terminator gave her plenty conception of what to do when the second showed up.
I love those movies but the time travel literally does not make sense.
Yup. Skynet was losing the war at that point which is why they decided to do something as risky as fucking with time and probably didn't realize it would create a new timeline.
The second timeline's Skynet was enhanced because the computer and cybernetics tech got a couple decades worth of jump start from the arm and chip left behind by the 101 in T1, so it was able to maintain it's original timeline (sending the 101 back to try and fail to kill Sarah) and proceed with further time fuckery by dropping the T-1000 further along John's timeline to take another swing. But it was still losing the war, as shown by the human resistance taking the time travel facility immediately after to drop Reese and the 800 back in time to protect the timeline.
Skynet sent those Terminators to kill unsuspecting humans, not to fight against a battle harded future soldier and a reprogrammed t-800, which is what wound up happening.
Except the second one was completely unlike the first one, which is probably why it was sent to later date. Also, the more likely scenerio was that the t-800 was unable to find Sarah Conner (or mistook her for someone else) rather than a random waitress being able to stop or destroy a future cyborg she had no idea was coming.
I'd be more upset about why the fuck only living tissue, machines covered in living tissue, or machines covered in an alloy mimicking living tissue, can be sent through time. It's such a bullshit cop-out the movie itself has to lampshade it!
And finally, not sending back weapons is a dead easy solve: sending back laser machine guns would've been incredibly non-sneaky, which would've run completely counter to the Terminator mission. If the first Terminator had rolled up to the police station and unloaded with plasma weapons, there's no way anyone would've shrugged that off as some guy wearing body armor and high on drugs. Same situation for the T-1000 in T2, and the T-800 couldn't take future weapons either because they couldn't risk the tech being turned into Skynet.
Firepower-wise, the Terminators had zero issues with termination with contemporary weapons; they were basically unstoppable and had no issues just using regular guns to wipe out everyone. The only struggle they had was reaching the targets quickly enough, which is why the issue for them was tracking and had nothing to do with firepower.
Best time travel in town.
I got this magic cross bow in the modern day, then I went back in time and got the old version out of the same box 400 years ago, because fuck paradox, I got crossbows!
The point of T2 was that you can change the future.