I’m not going to a pub any time vaguely soon, but I’m quite keen on interpreting this to mean my gaming club gets to restart soon-ish as it does mention social clubs and community centres. 2m and face masks and hand washing sounds a massive faff but do-able for a tabletop minis game or similar. We’ll have to see what the full guidance says.
It helps that it’s a half dozen people I know quite well. Not the great moronic mass that is the general public.
+1
Options
ElldrenIs a woman dammitceterum censeoRegistered Userregular
You'd have thought things that relate to health would be important. Much as I love going to the pub, is it really more important than keeping people's health?
I can't imagine a worse place for transmission to be honest.
yeah
it's not "what benefit does this provide?"
it's "what risk does this represent?"
which is why opening pubs is a bad move, what with the crowded spaces and the drinking and talking and shouting
You'd have thought things that relate to health would be important. Much as I love going to the pub, is it really more important than keeping people's health?
I can't imagine a worse place for transmission to be honest.
yeah
it's not "what benefit does this provide?"
it's "what risk does this represent?"
which is why opening pubs is a bad move, what with the crowded spaces and the drinking and talking and shouting
I assume that a lot of ministers, who presumably come out of fairly rural or wealthy contexts, will be thinking of quiet cointry pubs, or private clubs. My local would be fine for reopening. It had a huge outside area, for easy social distancing, and there were only ever a handful of people at a time inside anyway, petting the dog by the fire and having a slow couple of pints.
The pub five minutes up the road though, was the nearest one off campus, and so perpetually packed with students. In summer, it might (might!) be alright, they had a big outside too. Getting into September/October, it was invariably rammed inside though. That one is...not so good, to reopen.
And then you get all the city centre bars, which were always wall-to-wall anyway. Which was not a bad thing - people out having a good time was good. But, probably not so good in this context.
Partly it's going to be "We want to reopen to win at economy", partly "We want to reopen pubs because it's a bright spot in another worrying news cycle", but I'd suggest it's really also that there's a big difference in the image of what pubs are to the government versus the reality of the pubs people go to .
Sturgeon has said that schools can now plan for full reopening in Summer as cases have continued to fall. The SCons have now demanded to know why councils were having to plan for socially distanced reopening.
I don't have any energy left to even say anything amusing about this.
There was a particularly weird and vicious social media scrap about this kicked off by Mandy Rhodes in the Sunday Post and Jack McConnell, who is now a lobbyist for PwC
As the teaching profession at large was at pains to point out to both, you plan for limited/distanced reopening because that is the option that requires the most planning
It's no good preparing your curriculum, logistics, and material assuming in person teaching if you then have to bin all of it and create new material for distanced/blended learning with a couple of weeks notice
That's literally what happened in march and look how that went
You'd have thought things that relate to health would be important. Much as I love going to the pub, is it really more important than keeping people's health?
I can't imagine a worse place for transmission to be honest.
yeah
it's not "what benefit does this provide?"
it's "what risk does this represent?"
which is why opening pubs is a bad move, what with the crowded spaces and the drinking and talking and shouting
I assume that a lot of ministers, who presumably come out of fairly rural or wealthy contexts, will be thinking of quiet cointry pubs, or private clubs. My local would be fine for reopening. It had a huge outside area, for easy social distancing, and there were only ever a handful of people at a time inside anyway, petting the dog by the fire and having a slow couple of pints.
The pub five minutes up the road though, was the nearest one off campus, and so perpetually packed with students. In summer, it might (might!) be alright, they had a big outside too. Getting into September/October, it was invariably rammed inside though. That one is...not so good, to reopen.
And then you get all the city centre bars, which were always wall-to-wall anyway. Which was not a bad thing - people out having a good time was good. But, probably not so good in this context.
Partly it's going to be "We want to reopen to win at economy", partly "We want to reopen pubs because it's a bright spot in another worrying news cycle", but I'd suggest it's really also that there's a big difference in the image of what pubs are to the government versus the reality of the pubs people go to .
I don't think they know or care what most pubs are like, only that people really want to go to them again (regardless of how stupidly risky that is for most).
I went to a pub in London once which had old-fashioned "privacy screens" at head-height
The informative plaque said that it was because it used to be frequented by influential Londoners and it allowed them to let their hair down without the bar staff knowing who was present and making an arse of themselves
Seems like a thing that we should bring back to protect staff, as this is like passive smoking in pubs all over again - individuals might not be at risk if they're just in there for an hour or so, but bar staff are going to be breathed on by everybody
Under a no deal Brexit my wife and her tens of thousands of UK colleagues will officially work for the Irish arm of her company.
Doesn't look like much will change in practice so it looks like it's being done to keep everything ticking along as now but it's just an example of the stupidity that's fast approaching us.
I think that's half of the problem, the guys steering us towards this iceberg as fast as possible are looking at things like that and how it wasn't much hassle to move their investment firm over to Ireland, thinking that a No Deal Brexit is just going to be a bit of paperwork and a lot less tax. Probably will be for them, too (other than the paperwork, that's for other people to do).
0
Options
BethrynUnhappiness is MandatoryRegistered Userregular
SnicketysnickThe Greatest Hype Man inWesterosRegistered Userregular
tbh that is just sensible, regardless of how likely it is, I still think the great unlocking is going a little be rapidly but I'm not going to go "Aha!" about what seems to be a sensible bit of preparation. I will go aha! about a second wave though, especially as there's unlikely to be anything like the level of conformity this time around thanks to Cummings.
You'd have thought things that relate to health would be important. Much as I love going to the pub, is it really more important than keeping people's health?
my gym in Dublin is reopening in July
their plans so far are
- Limited numbers and you have to book your time a day in advance. You can stay in the gym for 60 mins.
- No dressing rooms
- Temp checks on entrance
- Some machines won't be available to enforce social distancing
- Equipment is cleaned when people have used it and you're not allowed use machines for 30 mins after someone else has used it.
All of those things are enough for me to feel comfortable going in, and I don't see a reason why other gyms couldn't be doing that.
Social distancing would need to be a lot more than 2m though in a room with recirculating air, no masks and heavy breathing. You'd really be wanting small private rooms, or need to have an antibody titre check to grant X months of access.
Basically sounds like almost all lockdown restrictions are being lifted from the 4th of July. 1 metre plus for distancing, pubs, restaurants and cinemas reopening, members of two households at a time freely able to meet up.
On that note, saw some data saying that the infection risk is 10-30x higher at one meter than it is at two meters. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Basically sounds like almost all lockdown restrictions are being lifted from the 4th of July. 1 metre plus for distancing, pubs, restaurants and cinemas reopening, members of two households at a time freely able to meet up.
On that note, saw some data saying that the infection risk is 10-30x higher at one meter than it is at two meters. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I'm sure it's okay as long as everyone's wearing masks -
There's been no government push for masks beyond public transport, and official messaging has been to focus on easing off and getting things back up and blah blah blah. It's not surprising at all that people aren't wearing them.
There's been no government push for masks beyond public transport, and official messaging has been to focus on easing off and getting things back up and blah blah blah. It's not surprising at all that people aren't wearing them.
Johnson wants to be like Churchill - get masks sent out to every household, including Mickey Mouse ones for the kids
Although I bet gas masks weren't carried around as much as the propaganda / that 2-part Doctor Who would have us believe
We were originally advised against using them (we were told they did more harm than good in the hands (or on the faces) of untrained people), and now we're told the pandemic is basically over.
In unrelated news, there have been several flare-ups in certain isolated regions.
Whether any other country has got one is beside the point. Johnson promised ours would be incredible and ready by now. "Oh nobody else can do it either" isn't much of a defence when you promised it in the first place.
It's also the case that several countries have working contact tracing apps
Edit: to expand on this, this point specifically cuts to the heart of the problem with Johnson and his trading off British exceptionalism
He's constantly trading on the idea that Britain is bigger, better, more advanced, etc. than other countries (especially EU countries), and while there was arguably a time when that was true it certainly isn't now
However I don't think Johnson has ever adjusted his worldview to compensate
So you get weirdnesses like it simply not occurring to him that other countries could have done this when the UK hasn't
You'd have thought things that relate to health would be important. Much as I love going to the pub, is it really more important than keeping people's health?
my gym in Dublin is reopening in July
their plans so far are
- Limited numbers and you have to book your time a day in advance. You can stay in the gym for 60 mins.
- No dressing rooms
- Temp checks on entrance
- Some machines won't be available to enforce social distancing
- Equipment is cleaned when people have used it and you're not allowed use machines for 30 mins after someone else has used it.
All of those things are enough for me to feel comfortable going in, and I don't see a reason why other gyms couldn't be doing that.
As a reference point my gym in WA is doing literally none of that and is still open.
I assure you that 60% of the US is not wearing masks out in public. At least not in my neck of the woods. Maybe 30%, maybe.
Polling date for the 60% was 1st of June, which was just before the real big push here to reopen and F the concequences. At the start of this month I was definitely seeing about half or so people with masks.
have not seen any sensical justifications for the exact sum - its vastly over uk thresholds at which point things would be looked at or announced - and doesnt seem to map to anything eu-related either
Half expecting it to come back to some broken spreadsheet used for calculating estimated values for a public contract. But at some point someone has replaced a look up value with the actual number from the first instance.
Or just as likely there's a review that they just use as a basis for awarding grants, and they're just using the same one over and over again.
But this really is something Conspiracy Thread weird.
10th of August is the date that word of the declaration of American Independence reached the UK, the date Louis XVI of France was captured during the French revolution, Charlie Dimmock's birthday and the date that the Magellan probe reached Venus...
have not seen any sensical justifications for the exact sum - its vastly over uk thresholds at which point things would be looked at or announced - and doesnt seem to map to anything eu-related either
More conspiratorial, what if you layer on a few of those thresholds - so it's the minimum you'd need to award to then have the maximum possible dividend/bonuses given out over a period of X years that won't hit these thresholds for personal financial reporting? Alternatively it's 12 x 9 million, or 24 x 4.5 million (which is the limit at which you'd have to publish a Gov works contract on the EU ledgers)
Tastyfish on
+2
Options
surrealitychecklonely, but not unloveddreaming of faulty keys and latchesRegistered Userregular
its more weird due to the nature of the companies ... many of which have seemingly no reason to be chosen for those contracts at all, especially not as sole tender which is usually only acceptable when a company has unique qualities for serving a particuliar purpose
Posts
It helps that it’s a half dozen people I know quite well. Not the great moronic mass that is the general public.
yeah
it's not "what benefit does this provide?"
it's "what risk does this represent?"
which is why opening pubs is a bad move, what with the crowded spaces and the drinking and talking and shouting
I assume that a lot of ministers, who presumably come out of fairly rural or wealthy contexts, will be thinking of quiet cointry pubs, or private clubs. My local would be fine for reopening. It had a huge outside area, for easy social distancing, and there were only ever a handful of people at a time inside anyway, petting the dog by the fire and having a slow couple of pints.
The pub five minutes up the road though, was the nearest one off campus, and so perpetually packed with students. In summer, it might (might!) be alright, they had a big outside too. Getting into September/October, it was invariably rammed inside though. That one is...not so good, to reopen.
And then you get all the city centre bars, which were always wall-to-wall anyway. Which was not a bad thing - people out having a good time was good. But, probably not so good in this context.
Partly it's going to be "We want to reopen to win at economy", partly "We want to reopen pubs because it's a bright spot in another worrying news cycle", but I'd suggest it's really also that there's a big difference in the image of what pubs are to the government versus the reality of the pubs people go to .
Goodreads
SF&F Reviews blog
There was a particularly weird and vicious social media scrap about this kicked off by Mandy Rhodes in the Sunday Post and Jack McConnell, who is now a lobbyist for PwC
As the teaching profession at large was at pains to point out to both, you plan for limited/distanced reopening because that is the option that requires the most planning
It's no good preparing your curriculum, logistics, and material assuming in person teaching if you then have to bin all of it and create new material for distanced/blended learning with a couple of weeks notice
That's literally what happened in march and look how that went
I don't think they know or care what most pubs are like, only that people really want to go to them again (regardless of how stupidly risky that is for most).
The informative plaque said that it was because it used to be frequented by influential Londoners and it allowed them to let their hair down without the bar staff knowing who was present and making an arse of themselves
Seems like a thing that we should bring back to protect staff, as this is like passive smoking in pubs all over again - individuals might not be at risk if they're just in there for an hour or so, but bar staff are going to be breathed on by everybody
Doesn't look like much will change in practice so it looks like it's being done to keep everything ticking along as now but it's just an example of the stupidity that's fast approaching us.
Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.
D3 Steam #TeamTangent STO
my gym in Dublin is reopening in July
their plans so far are
- Limited numbers and you have to book your time a day in advance. You can stay in the gym for 60 mins.
- No dressing rooms
- Temp checks on entrance
- Some machines won't be available to enforce social distancing
- Equipment is cleaned when people have used it and you're not allowed use machines for 30 mins after someone else has used it.
All of those things are enough for me to feel comfortable going in, and I don't see a reason why other gyms couldn't be doing that.
Sounds like some good safety measures were put in place - let us know how it's going?
Now you made me want to move to Dublin : )
My gym isn't doing anything yet... I guess I can always go run around in a pub...
Someone who did something wrong wouldn't lie about it.
I thought the Conservatives were supposed to be good at business?
On that note, saw some data saying that the infection risk is 10-30x higher at one meter than it is at two meters. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Choose Your Own Chat 1 Choose Your Own Chat 2 Choose Your Own Chat 3
I'm sure it's okay as long as everyone's wearing masks -
Oh. Oh no.
Choose Your Own Chat 1 Choose Your Own Chat 2 Choose Your Own Chat 3
Unless you're Boris Johnson, Matt Hancock or Dominic Cummings.
Johnson wants to be like Churchill - get masks sent out to every household, including Mickey Mouse ones for the kids
Although I bet gas masks weren't carried around as much as the propaganda / that 2-part Doctor Who would have us believe
We were originally advised against using them (we were told they did more harm than good in the hands (or on the faces) of untrained people), and now we're told the pandemic is basically over.
In unrelated news, there have been several flare-ups in certain isolated regions.
Hell I don't wear them all the time and I know I should be doing so. Need to get my setup right so they don't fog my glasses, is the thing
I think people have taken that as the indelible truth, which happens to align nicely with not having to wear a mask which is annoying and itchy
But do they say they do...
Main line of attack on Starmer is that he was a lawyer?? (Thatcher was also a lawyer).
Not as punchy as calling Corbyn a Marxist etc etc
Boris: Name one country with a working contact tracing app
Starmer: Germany....
Boris:.....
Choose Your Own Chat 1 Choose Your Own Chat 2 Choose Your Own Chat 3
Edit: to expand on this, this point specifically cuts to the heart of the problem with Johnson and his trading off British exceptionalism
He's constantly trading on the idea that Britain is bigger, better, more advanced, etc. than other countries (especially EU countries), and while there was arguably a time when that was true it certainly isn't now
However I don't think Johnson has ever adjusted his worldview to compensate
So you get weirdnesses like it simply not occurring to him that other countries could have done this when the UK hasn't
As a reference point my gym in WA is doing literally none of that and is still open.
I mean just looking at the timing it’s clearly not cash for favours
It’s favours for cash
Polling date for the 60% was 1st of June, which was just before the real big push here to reopen and F the concequences. At the start of this month I was definitely seeing about half or so people with masks.
these two are from a qc
but theres been a surprisingly large number at that amount.
further example here:
https://www.crowdjustice.com/case/108million/
have not seen any sensical justifications for the exact sum - its vastly over uk thresholds at which point things would be looked at or announced - and doesnt seem to map to anything eu-related either
Or just as likely there's a review that they just use as a basis for awarding grants, and they're just using the same one over and over again.
But this really is something Conspiracy Thread weird.
10th of August is the date that word of the declaration of American Independence reached the UK, the date Louis XVI of France was captured during the French revolution, Charlie Dimmock's birthday and the date that the Magellan probe reached Venus...
More conspiratorial, what if you layer on a few of those thresholds - so it's the minimum you'd need to award to then have the maximum possible dividend/bonuses given out over a period of X years that won't hit these thresholds for personal financial reporting? Alternatively it's 12 x 9 million, or 24 x 4.5 million (which is the limit at which you'd have to publish a Gov works contract on the EU ledgers)