Years and years ago I saw a cut of a TV pilot, and it was pretty good but it was five minutes too long. And I wondered what scenes they would cut, wondered which plotline they'd pull out or push back.
And then I saw the aired pilot. They had removed no "content," they had cut no scenes. What they'd done was, they just... Sucked air out. They extracted any half beat of silence, any lingering scene transition, any hesitation or pause.
The pilot went from "fun if overstuffed" to "incoherently, unpleasantly fast." Instead of doing the job of making TV, they treated it like flicking a time-saving switch in a podcast app.
I have no idea what happened, how THAT was the agreed upon outcome. I don't know if exec notes for "clarity" pushed back on efforts to cut scenes, I don't know if the showrunner lacked enough confidence to make tough calls and kill darlings, I wasn't privy to conversations. But it was a truly bizarre solution to an age-old problem.
That it has become more commonplace, that it wasn't a weird aberration, is alarming. It feels related to (if not directly connected to) whatever forces are causing TV/movie dialogue to sound more and more like "how people write on Twitter" and less and less like "how people talk with their mouths"
Hey in the first matrix movie they teach neo Kung fu with the programs right? But does that mean he knows Kung fu outside of the matrix or only inside?
My assumption would be that you'd get the text but not the associated connections/experience of it, so you could remember a line but doing so would be the first chance you had to really parse it so probably he'd get it downloaded and then sit there for a couple hours trying to really get war and peace ya know?
I've also never read war and peace so maybe he downloads it, thinks for a minute, and says it's bad and moves on
StraightziHere we may reign secure, and in my choice,To reign is worth ambition though in HellRegistered Userregular
Unless you run it similarly to how you do the kung fu training with Morpheus, where you spend actual time performing the actions of reading as well. I'm not sure if they can do any time dilation with that though, I don't remember if that's something they've shown. But learning martial arts is such a physical process it seems like they might do be doing that, right? Whose to say that downloading a book into your brain isn't spending several hours in a coffee shop on a rainy afternoon reading that book, just instantaneously?
My assumption would be that you'd get the text but not the associated connections/experience of it, so you could remember a line but doing so would be the first chance you had to really parse it so probably he'd get it downloaded and then sit there for a couple hours trying to really get war and peace ya know?
I've also never read war and peace so maybe he downloads it, thinks for a minute, and says it's bad and moves on
Training in kung fu includes not just book knowledge, but muscle/body control, hand-eye coordination, balance, tactical decision making, creativity in use, etc to not just practice kung fu but be good at it. If the purpose of the war and peace one is teaching, which is what all their training programs seem to be, you'd expect it to not just provide textual knowledge of the book, but include reviews and other literary analysis of it for a deeper understanding.
Unless you run it similarly to how you do the kung fu training with Morpheus, where you spend actual time performing the actions of reading as well. I'm not sure if they can do any time dilation with that though, I don't remember if that's something they've shown. But learning martial arts is such a physical process it seems like they might do be doing that, right? Whose to say that downloading a book into your brain isn't spending several hours in a coffee shop on a rainy afternoon reading that book, just instantaneously?
Matrix time seems to be 1:1 with real world time based on the time they spend in the chairs and that they can literally watch what happens in the Matrix in real time on their monitors. But they show Neo completes the kung fu training in about 2 seconds real time. Trinity's also shown completing helicopter training in about 2 seconds while already in the Matrix. That indicates the trainings are direct knowledge transfer without any simulated learning time required.
SiliconStew on
Just remember that half the people you meet are below average intelligence.
StraightziHere we may reign secure, and in my choice,To reign is worth ambition though in HellRegistered Userregular
Yeah that's what I'm saying, that time is clearly not real time. There are two different ways of doing things - there's knowledge upload, which is near instantaneous but seems to necessarily involve physical training and memory, and there's test environments, which run in real time. You could maybe infer the limitation that the knowledge upload can't be multiple people at the same time, it has to be just one person having those experiences. So you wouldn't be able to attend a class with other people where you talked about War & Peace, although presumably there could be subroutines designed for talking to you in it (much as there would be other combatants for a martial arts training).
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cj iwakuraThe Rhythm RegentBears The Name FreedomRegistered Userregular
Finally saw the trailer for Kinds of Kindness before Challengers, and it was amusingly edited with different scenes, but the same beat cues.
What's weird is it was before an R-rated film, so why would anyone care?
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KalTorakOne way or another, they all end up inthe Undercity.Registered Userregular
If it's possible to absorb and learn massive amounts of knowledge and information over a short period of time, why not have Neo in the sequels use dialogue and diplomacy in order to negotiate a peace with the AI's
I know it's because the movie has to happen, but I wonder if there was ever an attempt to that in one of the "Iterations" of the matrix. That seems like it would be an interesting idea.
The Youtuber should have been a 20 year old with neon hair. Glen Powell looks like a responsible daddy, how can she learn the power of being a fucking idiot from him?
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Zonugal(He/Him) The Holiday ArmadilloI'm Santa's representative for all the southern states. And Mexico!Registered Userregular
If it's possible to absorb and learn massive amounts of knowledge and information over a short period of time, why not have Neo in the sequels use dialogue and diplomacy in order to negotiate a peace with the AI's
I know it's because the movie has to happen, but I wonder if there was ever an attempt to that in one of the "Iterations" of the matrix. That seems like it would be an interesting idea.
I mean, that is ultimately what he does though.
Neo uses the crisis of Agent Smith becoming the Leviathan to propose a truce between humanity and the machines.
I don't know if previous versions of the One really succeed in any real attempt at diplomacy without that sort of leverage.
But we're also presumed to believe that every previous incarnation of the One chose to save Zion when offered the deal from the Architect, so, Neo is a real abnormality (a particularity nurtured by the manipulations of the Oracle).
[begins to be shoved into the world's deepest locker] No, no, you have to understand! It's a sci-fi retelling of Leonidas of Sparta!!
....Am I going to rewatch the matrix on my day off?
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Raijin QuickfootI'm your Huckleberry YOU'RE NO DAISYRegistered User, ClubPAregular
Well when he was woken up they had to put him through all of the rigamarole because his muscles had atrophied so clearly whatever you do in the Matrix has zero impact on your body outside the Matrix.
“Why do my eyes hurt?”
“You’ve never used them before.”
So he would know the moves mentally but I would almost think it would fuck him up physically.
In his brain he knows how to do a perfect backflip but his muscles have no idea. He would try to act on instinct and end up hurting himself over and over again.
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Raijin QuickfootI'm your Huckleberry YOU'RE NO DAISYRegistered User, ClubPAregular
I kind of want to see this scenario because it sounds hilarious.
I gathered that the standard regimen is you get the kung fu brain upload and then you have to do a lot of training inside the program to get the muscle memory and practical application down. Neo has literally that one session with Morpheus before they wind up going in and Morpheus gets captured. Neo is kind of treated like cargo on that run; he has the data but he hasn't put in the time to fight so he's not seen as a viable combatant
Neo doesn't just learn Kung Fu, he apparently spends literal HOURS absorbing tons of other fighting styles, and who knows what else. (Probably a lot of firearm programs).
He doesn't have the sparring match with Morpheus until afterwards.
Also wasn't the point of that sparring match not to test his kung fu skills, it was to demonstrate that the knowledge he learned was basically real-world knowledge and things work differently in the matrix, because it's all fake ("You think that's air your breathing?") and that the really cool shit happens when he applies that knowledge with the physics defying matrix crap to, well, you've seen the rest of the movie.
I gathered that the standard regimen is you get the kung fu brain upload and then you have to do a lot of training inside the program to get the muscle memory and practical application down. Neo has literally that one session with Morpheus before they wind up going in and Morpheus gets captured. Neo is kind of treated like cargo on that run; he has the data but he hasn't put in the time to fight so he's not seen as a viable combatant
They upload the training, Neo wakes up and says "I know kung fu.", Morpheus responds "show me", and they immediately start fighting. Neo isn't winning at first, but he certainly isn't awkwardly flailing about like someone that's never done it in practice before. Additional "live" training may refine your technique, but doesn't seem necessary to have decent competency right from the start. It's safe to assume Neo didn't spend unseen hours/days/weeks in a training sim before they went rescuing Morpheus where Neo is flipping off the walls and kicking everyone's ass.
SiliconStew on
Just remember that half the people you meet are below average intelligence.
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Raijin QuickfootI'm your Huckleberry YOU'RE NO DAISYRegistered User, ClubPAregular
Yeah because in the matrix your physical body doesn’t matter. Outside the matrix though I think he would be screwed without a LOT of physical training. Like years worth
The Matrix has cake that makes you orgasm. Makes you think whether this "real world" is all it's cracked up to be huh
This is why i got banned from Krispy Kreme.
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
Yeah because in the matrix your physical body doesn’t matter. Outside the matrix though I think he would be screwed without a LOT of physical training. Like years worth
Morpheus even has a spiel about how Neo is limiting himself by following the rules. I'm paraphrasing, but
M: Why do you think I won?
N: You're faster....stronger.
M: Do you think that me being faster, me being stronger....has anything to do with my muscles? Do you think that's air you're breathing right now?
And then they spar again and Neo starts doing the glitchy shit where he's throwing multiple punches within the same frame.
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
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JedocIn the scupperswith the staggers and jagsRegistered Userregular
If it's possible to absorb and learn massive amounts of knowledge and information over a short period of time, why not have Neo in the sequels use dialogue and diplomacy in order to negotiate a peace with the AI's
I know it's because the movie has to happen, but I wonder if there was ever an attempt to that in one of the "Iterations" of the matrix. That seems like it would be an interesting idea.
Unfortunately, the only work of diplomacy that survived the war was a box set of VH1's The Pickup Artist. The One who tried putting on a furry hat and negging the robots was instantly dismembered and they had to reset the whole thing years ahead of schedule.
If it's possible to absorb and learn massive amounts of knowledge and information over a short period of time, why not have Neo in the sequels use dialogue and diplomacy in order to negotiate a peace with the AI's
I know it's because the movie has to happen, but I wonder if there was ever an attempt to that in one of the "Iterations" of the matrix. That seems like it would be an interesting idea.
Unfortunately, the only work of diplomacy that survived the war was a box set of VH1's The Pickup Artist. The One who tried putting on a furry hat and negging the robots was instantly dismembered and they had to reset the whole thing years ahead of schedule.
If we wanted to get real technical, you could probably program a muscle response to the brain artificially in order to get the muscle-brain coordination to work in the learning process for any physical activity. This would have to require us understand that signaling system precisely, and it would probably but slightly unique to each person.
Where this future tech would fail would be in the ligament flexibility and muscle strength and stamina that's gained through training and physical exercises.
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Olivawgood name, isn't it?the foot of mt fujiRegistered Userregular
Years and years ago I saw a cut of a TV pilot, and it was pretty good but it was five minutes too long. And I wondered what scenes they would cut, wondered which plotline they'd pull out or push back.
And then I saw the aired pilot. They had removed no "content," they had cut no scenes. What they'd done was, they just... Sucked air out. They extracted any half beat of silence, any lingering scene transition, any hesitation or pause.
The pilot went from "fun if overstuffed" to "incoherently, unpleasantly fast." Instead of doing the job of making TV, they treated it like flicking a time-saving switch in a podcast app.
I have no idea what happened, how THAT was the agreed upon outcome. I don't know if exec notes for "clarity" pushed back on efforts to cut scenes, I don't know if the showrunner lacked enough confidence to make tough calls and kill darlings, I wasn't privy to conversations. But it was a truly bizarre solution to an age-old problem.
That it has become more commonplace, that it wasn't a weird aberration, is alarming. It feels related to (if not directly connected to) whatever forces are causing TV/movie dialogue to sound more and more like "how people write on Twitter" and less and less like "how people talk with their mouths"
This was exactly how I felt watching Oppenheimer, like there was never any fucking time for anyone to breathe outside of like, two key scenes. Just dialogue running up against dialogue, cuts from one shot to another that are just a beat too fast, no room to let anything settle or have any real impact or atmosphere
man watching ghost busters frozen empire, why is all dialogue so fast in movies now. It feels like every character is in a rush to get in as many lines as they can per minute. Theres no room for lines to sit or hit right, just a blitz of line after line, each one trying to outdo the last and stand out, its a cacophony.
I just watched 1 and 2 and they have such slow and casual dialogue delivery, like this lazy coolness that feels like everyone is just talking for each other, to actual listen and respond and let things build up and hit right.
So depressing
Also they added this new sidekick kid character and then sidelined the brother for him who was filling the exact same role, the brother character basically disappears from the films middle entirely. So weird
The end of the movie has 12 fucking characters involved in the final set piece sequence. In several sequences all 12 characters are in the same room. And that’s not including two ghost characters. Maybe if you find your ostensible comedy action romp has more characters in its finale than the fucking fellowship of the ring, you might have gone wrong somewhere
Yeah, it's definitely an overstuffed movie that probably would have been better as a netflix series or something. The movies tries to simulatenously be a family adventure movie with the Spenglars, a nostalgic play for fans of the originals, and also an attempt to push the franchise into new terroritories and any of those ideas could have worked fine for a film, but when you cram them all into the same movie nothing gets time to breath, stuff shows up and then doesn't get paid off, and basically nothing good in the movie is given the room to become great.
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And then I saw the aired pilot. They had removed no "content," they had cut no scenes. What they'd done was, they just... Sucked air out. They extracted any half beat of silence, any lingering scene transition, any hesitation or pause.
The pilot went from "fun if overstuffed" to "incoherently, unpleasantly fast." Instead of doing the job of making TV, they treated it like flicking a time-saving switch in a podcast app.
I have no idea what happened, how THAT was the agreed upon outcome. I don't know if exec notes for "clarity" pushed back on efforts to cut scenes, I don't know if the showrunner lacked enough confidence to make tough calls and kill darlings, I wasn't privy to conversations. But it was a truly bizarre solution to an age-old problem.
That it has become more commonplace, that it wasn't a weird aberration, is alarming. It feels related to (if not directly connected to) whatever forces are causing TV/movie dialogue to sound more and more like "how people write on Twitter" and less and less like "how people talk with their mouths"
Second question: would you be able to read a book like that? Like dozer runs a command prompt and BAM you've read war and peace?
Presumably that's what he's done with the helicopter piloting program, a mix of the manual reading and the practical experience of learning to fly it.
I've also never read war and peace so maybe he downloads it, thinks for a minute, and says it's bad and moves on
Training in kung fu includes not just book knowledge, but muscle/body control, hand-eye coordination, balance, tactical decision making, creativity in use, etc to not just practice kung fu but be good at it. If the purpose of the war and peace one is teaching, which is what all their training programs seem to be, you'd expect it to not just provide textual knowledge of the book, but include reviews and other literary analysis of it for a deeper understanding.
Matrix time seems to be 1:1 with real world time based on the time they spend in the chairs and that they can literally watch what happens in the Matrix in real time on their monitors. But they show Neo completes the kung fu training in about 2 seconds real time. Trinity's also shown completing helicopter training in about 2 seconds while already in the Matrix. That indicates the trainings are direct knowledge transfer without any simulated learning time required.
Twisters | Official Trailer 2
What's weird is it was before an R-rated film, so why would anyone care?
FUCK YOU
*is promptly yeeted hundreds of feet in the air*
I know it's because the movie has to happen, but I wonder if there was ever an attempt to that in one of the "Iterations" of the matrix. That seems like it would be an interesting idea.
I mean, that is ultimately what he does though.
Neo uses the crisis of Agent Smith becoming the Leviathan to propose a truce between humanity and the machines.
I don't know if previous versions of the One really succeed in any real attempt at diplomacy without that sort of leverage.
But we're also presumed to believe that every previous incarnation of the One chose to save Zion when offered the deal from the Architect, so, Neo is a real abnormality (a particularity nurtured by the manipulations of the Oracle).
[begins to be shoved into the world's deepest locker] No, no, you have to understand! It's a sci-fi retelling of Leonidas of Sparta!!
“Why do my eyes hurt?”
“You’ve never used them before.”
So he would know the moves mentally but I would almost think it would fuck him up physically.
In his brain he knows how to do a perfect backflip but his muscles have no idea. He would try to act on instinct and end up hurting himself over and over again.
He doesn't have the sparring match with Morpheus until afterwards.
Also wasn't the point of that sparring match not to test his kung fu skills, it was to demonstrate that the knowledge he learned was basically real-world knowledge and things work differently in the matrix, because it's all fake ("You think that's air your breathing?") and that the really cool shit happens when he applies that knowledge with the physics defying matrix crap to, well, you've seen the rest of the movie.
They upload the training, Neo wakes up and says "I know kung fu.", Morpheus responds "show me", and they immediately start fighting. Neo isn't winning at first, but he certainly isn't awkwardly flailing about like someone that's never done it in practice before. Additional "live" training may refine your technique, but doesn't seem necessary to have decent competency right from the start. It's safe to assume Neo didn't spend unseen hours/days/weeks in a training sim before they went rescuing Morpheus where Neo is flipping off the walls and kicking everyone's ass.
Neo is an anagram for Crash Override.
This is why i got banned from Krispy Kreme.
Morpheus even has a spiel about how Neo is limiting himself by following the rules. I'm paraphrasing, but
M: Why do you think I won?
N: You're faster....stronger.
M: Do you think that me being faster, me being stronger....has anything to do with my muscles? Do you think that's air you're breathing right now?
And then they spar again and Neo starts doing the glitchy shit where he's throwing multiple punches within the same frame.
Unfortunately, the only work of diplomacy that survived the war was a box set of VH1's The Pickup Artist. The One who tried putting on a furry hat and negging the robots was instantly dismembered and they had to reset the whole thing years ahead of schedule.
What about the second renaissance?
If we wanted to get real technical, you could probably program a muscle response to the brain artificially in order to get the muscle-brain coordination to work in the learning process for any physical activity. This would have to require us understand that signaling system precisely, and it would probably but slightly unique to each person.
Where this future tech would fail would be in the ligament flexibility and muscle strength and stamina that's gained through training and physical exercises.
This was exactly how I felt watching Oppenheimer, like there was never any fucking time for anyone to breathe outside of like, two key scenes. Just dialogue running up against dialogue, cuts from one shot to another that are just a beat too fast, no room to let anything settle or have any real impact or atmosphere
PSN ID : DetectiveOlivaw | TWITTER | STEAM ID | NEVER FORGET
Yeah, it's definitely an overstuffed movie that probably would have been better as a netflix series or something. The movies tries to simulatenously be a family adventure movie with the Spenglars, a nostalgic play for fans of the originals, and also an attempt to push the franchise into new terroritories and any of those ideas could have worked fine for a film, but when you cram them all into the same movie nothing gets time to breath, stuff shows up and then doesn't get paid off, and basically nothing good in the movie is given the room to become great.
{Twitter, Everybody's doing it. }{Writing and Story Blog}
Steam
lmao
You know who is really good at playing an asshole? Jack Nicholson
He's absolutely amazing as a guy who can ruin the mood of any meeting in a quick 5 seconds.