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The Emergency Backup US [Election] 2024 thread: Part Two
I mean, yeah. Better regulation and overall social media reform instead of just straight up banning a single company was exactly what some of us kept saying we'd prefer the last time this came up and we were told, repeatedly, that we should be happy with the "incremental" step of just banning TikTok.
But regardless, while you could make an argument that the Democrats were using TikTok before the move to ban it took hold, you can't make that argument with Kamala, so hopefully this puts a significant damper on that and pushes her administration to aim for more effective legislation to protect us better from social media corporations in general.
If you were paying attention you would have realized that the people fine with banning TikTok were also in favor of better regulation as a long term solution too.
I don't really love you implying I wasn't paying attention to a conversation I spent many hours and dozens of pages carefully explaining my position in, just because you disagree with me. Try to be less condescending when you talk to people, please.
You first my guy, as if you’re post I was responding to wasn’t also condescending.
For the debates, I think Harris is in a good position either way.
If there’s no debate, then she can hammer Trump’s cowardice and keep him on the defensive. To say nothing of potentially enjoying completely uninterrupted airtime on the debate stage
If there is a debate, then it’s her time to shine. Her debate performance will be compared to Biden’s, not Trump’s.
Right now, a debate carries much greater risk for Trump. If Harris counters the gish gallop, that’ll be the narrative. If he comes off as old and tired, that’ll be the narrative. If he manages to pull his regular stunt—well, that’s a known a quantity and the narrative goes back to comparing Harris with the man she replaced.
As for Vance, I don’t think Trump has a way out of that narrative. If he sticks with Vance, the negative attention continues—and Vance is guaranteed to have further gaffes or more old quotes thrown into the spotlight. If he ditches Vance, it fosters a Pubs in Disarray narrative. Either way, it keeps Trump on the defensive.
I don’t know if we’ll get a Harris-Trump debate. That’ll depend on Trump’s mood and whether Harris keeps the momentum.
While Trump very well could dump Vance, I bet he doesn’t—if only to avoid admitting that he made a mistake.
+17
minor incidentyou can't swim whenyou've been dead a hundred yearsRegistered User, Transition Teamregular
In general classic forums aren't considered social media in the way people use it (Twitter, Facebook, TikTok) because they don't have the built in follower / network effects and don't have an algorithm that promotes / demotes content.
I don't say that to be obtuse, but to remind people they do utilize a form of social media and not to hate it just because they don't utilize the popular forms of it.
Social Media has ills, but it's also a great way to find community online and introduce people to new ideas.
If it wasn't for twitter we wouldn't have these JD Vance couch fucking jokes.
Honestly, it's a good point. "Social media" as we generally think of it (Facebook, Twitter, IG, and the also-rans) didn't always involve the algorithmic manipulation that most of us have issues with, but they were still social media. That just says that the meticulous grift of algorithmic content feed manipulation isn't necessarily a load bearing structure in the fundamentals of social media. We can always go back, with the right smart, targeted regulation from lawmakers who actually use and understand social media.
minor incident on
Ah, it stinks, it sucks, it's anthropologically unjust
I keep seeing people call tiktok chinese spyware but have never seen an adequate explanation for
a) why this is meaningfully worse than american social media companies handing info over to the us govt
or
b) what harm they think the ccp is going to do with the search history of, say, some guy in idaho
like, nobody's posting about how it sucks that kamala has to use twitter, and that's owned by a single exceptionally evil dude, and it's well documented what he does with it! and that's not even touching facebook's crimes, both literal and moral
it really just seems like a lot of folks finding a socially acceptable avenue to be racist about china!
A ) it's not
B ) having foreign governments be able to adjust algorithms to influence public opinion is bad, but that's true of all social media and why most of us don't like it, but foreign governments doing it is arguably worse
C ) some people probably are using it as a dog whistle, sure
Really calling Trump's bluff. But I also think debating him is a trap. Hilary thought debating him was a winning move but he is in his element where he can appear strong by talking utter bollocks as loudly as he can, ignoring etiquette and disparaging his opponent. We saw it in the ancient 2016 primaries, he just takes control and moderators let him.
She's better off sassing him from out of reach.
In 2016 Trump was a comparatively spry 70 and still regarded as a joke candidate.
In 2024 he's clearly exhausted, Possibly insane, has an absolutely horrific record in public office and had tooled his entire campaign around debating a man who was older then him and he'd been bitching about for 4 years.
Unless Harris has like... a gran mal seizure when he makes his opening statement he's completely fucked in a debate.
So this poll is probably dog shit. But the headline made me laugh.
Former President Donald Trump received the support of no Black voters in a new Michigan survey.
The WDIV/Detroit News poll found that the presidential race is a dead heat between Trump, the Republican nominee, and Vice President Kamala Harris, the presumptive Democratic nominee—with each receiving 41 percent of support.
Among the Black voters surveyed, 82.1 percent supported Harris, 11.5 percent backed independent candidate Robert F. Kennedy Jr., and none supported Trump.
Meta is the worst about this because on Instagram and Facebook, which I barely use anymore, you see more ads than anything posted by the people you follow. For as bad as Elon has tried to make twitter I still see at least a dozen posts from people I follow before I see an ad. Same with TikTok. Facebook in Myanmar was utilized to help facilitate a genocide and should be the social media that we put on trial first.
So this poll is probably dog shit. But the headline made me laugh.
Former President Donald Trump received the support of no Black voters in a new Michigan survey.
The WDIV/Detroit News poll found that the presidential race is a dead heat between Trump, the Republican nominee, and Vice President Kamala Harris, the presumptive Democratic nominee—with each receiving 41 percent of support.
Among the Black voters surveyed, 82.1 percent supported Harris, 11.5 percent backed independent candidate Robert F. Kennedy Jr., and none supported Trump.
If there were at least 1000 participants with good crosstabs this is fucking hilarious.
SW-4158-3990-6116
Let's play Mario Kart or something...
having foreign governments be able to adjust algorithms to influence public opinion is bad, but that's true of all social media and why most of us don't like it, but foreign governments doing it is arguably worse
I really want to single in on this. Why is it worse?
having foreign governments be able to adjust algorithms to influence public opinion is bad, but that's true of all social media and why most of us don't like it, but foreign governments doing it is arguably worse
I really want to single in on this. Why is it worse?
In general classic forums aren't considered social media in the way people use it (Twitter, Facebook, TikTok) because they don't have the built in follower / network effects and don't have an algorithm that promotes / demotes content.
I don't say that to be obtuse, but to remind people they do utilize a form of social media and not to hate it just because they don't utilize the popular forms of it.
Social Media has ills, but it's also a great way to find community online and introduce people to new ideas.
If it wasn't for twitter we wouldn't have these JD Vance couch fucking jokes.
Honestly, it's a good point. "Social media" as we generally think of it (Facebook, Twitter, IG, and the also-rans) didn't always involve the algorithmic manipulation that most of us have issues with, but they were still social media. That just says that the meticulous grift of algorithmic content feed manipulation isn't necessarily a load bearing structure in the fundamentals of social media. We can always go back, with the right, smart, targeted regulation from lawmakers who actually use and understand social media.
But in practice how is “make TikTiK not algorithmic bullshit” different from “ban TikTok”. I’m not even sure what it would be at that point, but in any case TikTok will call any attempt to do so the government trying to ban or kill it and that’s the story the media will run with.
I think the musket to AR-15 comparison was really good. Because like guns social media needs reform, but any attempts will be hyperbolically attacked. But worse than guns I think the attempts will also be very unpopular with voters, specially because they will get the news about it from the platforms threatened with regulation.
having foreign governments be able to adjust algorithms to influence public opinion is bad, but that's true of all social media and why most of us don't like it, but foreign governments doing it is arguably worse
I really want to single in on this. Why is it worse?
China has a way of disappearing journalists they disagree with, and were definitely using TikTok to track the locations of prominent journalists until that whistle was blown.
Russia using social media to run psyops on America is a big part, though not the only part, of why we got Trump.
We expect the government to defend the citizens from physical harm. I would be fine with the government doing similar for our data and privacy.
We need a stronger GDPR like mechanism here.
SW-4158-3990-6116
Let's play Mario Kart or something...
having foreign governments be able to adjust algorithms to influence public opinion is bad, but that's true of all social media and why most of us don't like it, but foreign governments doing it is arguably worse
I really want to single in on this. Why is it worse?
Why isn't it?
I do not believe that the chinese government is necessarily more evil than the united states government. why do you?
In general classic forums aren't considered social media in the way people use it (Twitter, Facebook, TikTok) because they don't have the built in follower / network effects and don't have an algorithm that promotes / demotes content.
I don't say that to be obtuse, but to remind people they do utilize a form of social media and not to hate it just because they don't utilize the popular forms of it.
Social Media has ills, but it's also a great way to find community online and introduce people to new ideas.
If it wasn't for twitter we wouldn't have these JD Vance couch fucking jokes.
Honestly, it's a good point. "Social media" as we generally think of it (Facebook, Twitter, IG, and the also-rans) didn't always involve the algorithmic manipulation that most of us have issues with, but they were still social media. That just says that the meticulous grift of algorithmic content feed manipulation isn't necessarily a load bearing structure in the fundamentals of social media. We can always go back, with the right, smart, targeted regulation from lawmakers who actually use and understand social media.
But in practice how is “make TikTiK not algorithmic bullshit” different from “ban TikTok”. I’m not even sure what it would be at that point, but in any case TikTok will call any attempt to do so the government trying to ban or kill it and that’s the story the media will run with.
I think the musket to AR-15 comparison was really good. Because like guns social media needs reform, but any attempts will be hyperbolically attacked. But worse than guns I think the attempts will also be very unpopular with voters, specially because they will get the news about it from the platforms threatened with regulation.
But yeah: they're dangerous, they're an iteration on a technologh that was way beyond the standards of the time, they're used as weapons of war by state actors and by nonstate actors through stochastic terrorism or by useful idiots, etc.
So this poll is probably dog shit. But the headline made me laugh.
Former President Donald Trump received the support of no Black voters in a new Michigan survey.
The WDIV/Detroit News poll found that the presidential race is a dead heat between Trump, the Republican nominee, and Vice President Kamala Harris, the presumptive Democratic nominee—with each receiving 41 percent of support.
Among the Black voters surveyed, 82.1 percent supported Harris, 11.5 percent backed independent candidate Robert F. Kennedy Jr., and none supported Trump.
If there were at least 1000 participants with good crosstabs this is fucking hilarious.
having foreign governments be able to adjust algorithms to influence public opinion is bad, but that's true of all social media and why most of us don't like it, but foreign governments doing it is arguably worse
I really want to single in on this. Why is it worse?
Why isn't it?
I do not believe that the chinese government is necessarily more evil than the united states government. why do you?
President Biden stepped down from re-election for the good of the nation. That puts the US ahead, at least for me.
Marty: The future, it's where you're going? Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
having foreign governments be able to adjust algorithms to influence public opinion is bad, but that's true of all social media and why most of us don't like it, but foreign governments doing it is arguably worse
I really want to single in on this. Why is it worse?
Why isn't it?
I do not believe that the chinese government is necessarily more evil than the united states government. why do you?
I'd ask the Uyghurs but apparently they are hard to get ahold of.
Regardless relitigating the whole TikTok discussion that previously got the Social Media thread locked seems like a bad idea for the Election thread since it's barely even tangentally related.
It says something about Harris as the new-car-smell nominee that we all have to litigate all the other threads instead of having something she did/said/didn’t do/didn’t say to very stupidly and pointlessly debate
having foreign governments be able to adjust algorithms to influence public opinion is bad, but that's true of all social media and why most of us don't like it, but foreign governments doing it is arguably worse
I really want to single in on this. Why is it worse?
China has a way of disappearing journalists they disagree with, and were definitely using TikTok to track the locations of prominent journalists until that whistle was blown.
Russia using social media to run psyops on America is a big part, though not the only part, of why we got Trump.
We expect the government to defend the citizens from physical harm. I would be fine with the government doing similar for our data and privacy.
We need a stronger GDPR like mechanism here.
do you think our government does not persecute dissidents or use propaganda?
again, the root question is why tiktok deserves so much ire beyond what its contemporaries receive, if not xenophobia?
having foreign governments be able to adjust algorithms to influence public opinion is bad, but that's true of all social media and why most of us don't like it, but foreign governments doing it is arguably worse
I really want to single in on this. Why is it worse?
Why isn't it?
I do not believe that the chinese government is necessarily more evil than the united states government. why do you?
For me it’s their relationship with Taiwan. I don’t think the US has anything similar, and it does push China into more evil.
having foreign governments be able to adjust algorithms to influence public opinion is bad, but that's true of all social media and why most of us don't like it, but foreign governments doing it is arguably worse
I really want to single in on this. Why is it worse?
Why isn't it?
I do not believe that the chinese government is necessarily more evil than the united states government. why do you?
There is absolutely a difference between the CCP and the United States, not that the United States is a perfect paragon of virtue.
Foreign government absolutely move to destabilize governments in place. Perhaps look back approximately 8 years to get proof of this within our own country. The US isn't going to do that shit to themselves, but has for sure done it to others in the past. That's neither here nor there in terms of "my government isn't currently attacking me directly like foreign governments probably are". Is there an argument that capitalists are? Sure. But Biden and his cabinet aren't putting policies in place to adjust the algorithm and the fact that you think that they're similar in this regard tells me more about you than I probably care to know.
having foreign governments be able to adjust algorithms to influence public opinion is bad, but that's true of all social media and why most of us don't like it, but foreign governments doing it is arguably worse
I really want to single in on this. Why is it worse?
Why isn't it?
I do not believe that the chinese government is necessarily more evil than the united states government. why do you?
For me it’s their relationship with Taiwan. I don’t think the US has anything similar, and it does push China into more evil.
having foreign governments be able to adjust algorithms to influence public opinion is bad, but that's true of all social media and why most of us don't like it, but foreign governments doing it is arguably worse
I really want to single in on this. Why is it worse?
China has a way of disappearing journalists they disagree with, and were definitely using TikTok to track the locations of prominent journalists until that whistle was blown.
Russia using social media to run psyops on America is a big part, though not the only part, of why we got Trump.
We expect the government to defend the citizens from physical harm. I would be fine with the government doing similar for our data and privacy.
We need a stronger GDPR like mechanism here.
do you think our government does not persecute dissidents or use propaganda?
again, the root question is why tiktok deserves so much ire beyond what its contemporaries receive, if not xenophobia?
having foreign governments be able to adjust algorithms to influence public opinion is bad, but that's true of all social media and why most of us don't like it, but foreign governments doing it is arguably worse
I really want to single in on this. Why is it worse?
China has a way of disappearing journalists they disagree with, and were definitely using TikTok to track the locations of prominent journalists until that whistle was blown.
Russia using social media to run psyops on America is a big part, though not the only part, of why we got Trump.
We expect the government to defend the citizens from physical harm. I would be fine with the government doing similar for our data and privacy.
We need a stronger GDPR like mechanism here.
do you think our government does not persecute dissidents or use propaganda?
again, the root question is why tiktok deserves so much ire beyond what its contemporaries receive, if not xenophobia?
Imo it get so much more ire because it’s more popular and because Facebook, Twitter, YouTube at some point were seen as pretty good. I think if any of those three, specially the first two, had became popular in the state they are now they would be just as hated.
having foreign governments be able to adjust algorithms to influence public opinion is bad, but that's true of all social media and why most of us don't like it, but foreign governments doing it is arguably worse
I really want to single in on this. Why is it worse?
Why isn't it?
I do not believe that the chinese government is necessarily more evil than the united states government. why do you?
I'd ask the Uyghurs but apparently they are hard to get ahold of.
if a campaign of racial violence perpetrated by the state means said state's social media companies must be banned, I again ask why the US is an exception
having foreign governments be able to adjust algorithms to influence public opinion is bad, but that's true of all social media and why most of us don't like it, but foreign governments doing it is arguably worse
I really want to single in on this. Why is it worse?
Why isn't it?
I do not believe that the chinese government is necessarily more evil than the united states government. why do you?
So, you don't actually know anything about the chinese government.
This is a bit less obvious then say... the treatment of the Uighurs, Tibet or Hong Kong but it's a great example of how incredibly petty and shitty china can be at the drop of a hat to someone who engages in "wrong think".
having foreign governments be able to adjust algorithms to influence public opinion is bad, but that's true of all social media and why most of us don't like it, but foreign governments doing it is arguably worse
I really want to single in on this. Why is it worse?
Why isn't it?
I do not believe that the chinese government is necessarily more evil than the united states government. why do you?
There is absolutely a difference between the CCP and the United States, not that the United States is a perfect paragon of virtue.
Foreign government absolutely move to destabilize governments in place. Perhaps look back approximately 8 years to get proof of this within our own country. The US isn't going to do that shit to themselves, but has for sure done it to others in the past. That's neither here nor there in terms of "my government isn't currently attacking me directly like foreign governments probably are". Is there an argument that capitalists are? Sure. But Biden and his cabinet aren't putting policies in place to adjust the algorithm and the fact that you think that they're similar in this regard tells me more about you than I probably care to know.
The US just ran a disinformation campaign about vaccines using social media in the Philippines
AtomikaLive fast and get fucked or whateverRegistered Userregular
Immediately playing the “you’re a racist if you don’t want China spying on foreign nationals” card is pretty disingenuous and reprehensible, choom, so maybe try something else
Trump pulling out of the debates is fertile ground for trolling. Dems just need to frame it as Trump running scared from a woman of color and he’ll blow his top.
The angrier he gets, the more deranged he acts, the more we harp on his cognitive decline. He pretty much walked right into this.
I think the superpacs and dark money should hammer him as a coward. I think Kamala saying something about understanding that his schedule may be filling up and he may not have the bandwidth to handle all of his “appointments.”
Which stands in contrast to the TikTok ban law that Biden signed, I think the Dems are going to have to find a way to retract or not enforce that law since the numbers shows that voters under 35 will just not tolerate it and will go to vote against any party that does it. No US party can afford to ban TikTok at this time.
It doesn't stand in contrast to it. Biden was on TikTok as well. You go where people are.
TikTok rules and it’s where the people the dems need to activate are and get motivation and instructions from so it’s good the Harris campaign is using it
Immediately playing the “you’re a racist if you don’t want China spying on foreign nationals” card is pretty disingenuous and reprehensible, choom, so maybe try something else
There is no proof they do it and the question stands as to why that's worse than the other companies doing it.
having foreign governments be able to adjust algorithms to influence public opinion is bad, but that's true of all social media and why most of us don't like it, but foreign governments doing it is arguably worse
I really want to single in on this. Why is it worse?
Why isn't it?
I do not believe that the chinese government is necessarily more evil than the united states government. why do you?
For me it’s their relationship with Taiwan. I don’t think the US has anything similar, and it does push China into more evil.
Cuba
Currently? I don’t think the US is attempting to annex Cuba, are they? I don’t necessarily think China is going to invade Taiwan any time soon, and I hope they never do. But they openly plan for Taiwan to become part of them. The US has a really stupid embargo with Cuba, but are Cubans worried that the US will invade or take over their country?
having foreign governments be able to adjust algorithms to influence public opinion is bad, but that's true of all social media and why most of us don't like it, but foreign governments doing it is arguably worse
I really want to single in on this. Why is it worse?
Why isn't it?
I do not believe that the chinese government is necessarily more evil than the united states government. why do you?
There is absolutely a difference between the CCP and the United States, not that the United States is a perfect paragon of virtue.
Foreign government absolutely move to destabilize governments in place. Perhaps look back approximately 8 years to get proof of this within our own country. The US isn't going to do that shit to themselves, but has for sure done it to others in the past. That's neither here nor there in terms of "my government isn't currently attacking me directly like foreign governments probably are". Is there an argument that capitalists are? Sure. But Biden and his cabinet aren't putting policies in place to adjust the algorithm and the fact that you think that they're similar in this regard tells me more about you than I probably care to know.
The just ran a disinformation campaign about vaccines using social media in the Philippines
Which was done specifically by the Trump Administration, and was shut down pretty much immediately after Biden took office - and illustrates yet another reason he shouldn't be given power again.
I keep seeing people call tiktok chinese spyware but have never seen an adequate explanation for
a) why this is meaningfully worse than american social media companies handing info over to the us govt
or
b) what harm they think the ccp is going to do with the search history of, say, some guy in idaho
like, nobody's posting about how it sucks that kamala has to use twitter, and that's owned by a single exceptionally evil dude, and it's well documented what he does with it! and that's not even touching facebook's crimes, both literal and moral
it really just seems like a lot of folks finding a socially acceptable avenue to be racist about china!
The degree of ‘bad’ which a social media site has in the modern era is a product of…
How dominant is algorithmic control of content?
How likely is the owner to oppose the interests of the public?
How capable is the owner of using algorithmic control
TikTok is entirely algorithmic content, it is a stream of consciousness feed
The Chinese government has a strong interest in damaging Democratic societies, it is critical to them maintaining control
TikTok has shown an immediate pivot to issues in support of Chinese government activities in the past, and serves up a regular diet of harmful content designed to promote misery and sadness
All algorithmically backed social media is designed to create misery, but TikTok is so obviously the worst that there’s no question it should be banned, as should all similar imitators.
The Chinese government is actively engaging in one of histories largest genocides against the Uigers, and concluding a genocide against the Tibetans. The concern isn’t the guys search history, the concern is that the Chinese government uses TikTok to control the narrative between young people overseas.
I recognize Cuba as an independent foreign nation and do not find anything offensive about their flag or cultural identity.
Marty: The future, it's where you're going? Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
0
amateurhourOne day I'll be professionalhourThe woods somewhere in TennesseeRegistered Userregular
having foreign governments be able to adjust algorithms to influence public opinion is bad, but that's true of all social media and why most of us don't like it, but foreign governments doing it is arguably worse
I really want to single in on this. Why is it worse?
Why isn't it?
I do not believe that the chinese government is necessarily more evil than the united states government. why do you?
I'd ask the Uyghurs but apparently they are hard to get ahold of.
if a campaign of racial violence perpetrated by the state means said state's social media companies must be banned, I again ask why the US is an exception
No clue, but if you ask 10 people 9.5 of them are gonna be kinda leery of another Country fucking with our politics through social media, even if our Country does the same thing.
I don't know how to explain it more clearly than that, unfortunately.
Posts
You first my guy, as if you’re post I was responding to wasn’t also condescending.
If there’s no debate, then she can hammer Trump’s cowardice and keep him on the defensive. To say nothing of potentially enjoying completely uninterrupted airtime on the debate stage
If there is a debate, then it’s her time to shine. Her debate performance will be compared to Biden’s, not Trump’s.
Right now, a debate carries much greater risk for Trump. If Harris counters the gish gallop, that’ll be the narrative. If he comes off as old and tired, that’ll be the narrative. If he manages to pull his regular stunt—well, that’s a known a quantity and the narrative goes back to comparing Harris with the man she replaced.
As for Vance, I don’t think Trump has a way out of that narrative. If he sticks with Vance, the negative attention continues—and Vance is guaranteed to have further gaffes or more old quotes thrown into the spotlight. If he ditches Vance, it fosters a Pubs in Disarray narrative. Either way, it keeps Trump on the defensive.
I don’t know if we’ll get a Harris-Trump debate. That’ll depend on Trump’s mood and whether Harris keeps the momentum.
While Trump very well could dump Vance, I bet he doesn’t—if only to avoid admitting that he made a mistake.
Honestly, it's a good point. "Social media" as we generally think of it (Facebook, Twitter, IG, and the also-rans) didn't always involve the algorithmic manipulation that most of us have issues with, but they were still social media. That just says that the meticulous grift of algorithmic content feed manipulation isn't necessarily a load bearing structure in the fundamentals of social media. We can always go back, with the right smart, targeted regulation from lawmakers who actually use and understand social media.
A ) it's not
B ) having foreign governments be able to adjust algorithms to influence public opinion is bad, but that's true of all social media and why most of us don't like it, but foreign governments doing it is arguably worse
C ) some people probably are using it as a dog whistle, sure
In 2016 Trump was a comparatively spry 70 and still regarded as a joke candidate.
In 2024 he's clearly exhausted, Possibly insane, has an absolutely horrific record in public office and had tooled his entire campaign around debating a man who was older then him and he'd been bitching about for 4 years.
Unless Harris has like... a gran mal seizure when he makes his opening statement he's completely fucked in a debate.
So this poll is probably dog shit. But the headline made me laugh.
https://systemicjustice.org/article/facebook-and-genocide-how-facebook-contributed-to-genocide-in-myanmar-and-why-it-will-not-be-held-accountable/
{Twitter, Everybody's doing it. }{Writing and Story Blog}
If there were at least 1000 participants with good crosstabs this is fucking hilarious.
Let's play Mario Kart or something...
I really want to single in on this. Why is it worse?
Why isn't it?
But in practice how is “make TikTiK not algorithmic bullshit” different from “ban TikTok”. I’m not even sure what it would be at that point, but in any case TikTok will call any attempt to do so the government trying to ban or kill it and that’s the story the media will run with.
I think the musket to AR-15 comparison was really good. Because like guns social media needs reform, but any attempts will be hyperbolically attacked. But worse than guns I think the attempts will also be very unpopular with voters, specially because they will get the news about it from the platforms threatened with regulation.
Maybe we can either get it unlocked or start a new one.
China has a way of disappearing journalists they disagree with, and were definitely using TikTok to track the locations of prominent journalists until that whistle was blown.
Russia using social media to run psyops on America is a big part, though not the only part, of why we got Trump.
We expect the government to defend the citizens from physical harm. I would be fine with the government doing similar for our data and privacy.
We need a stronger GDPR like mechanism here.
Let's play Mario Kart or something...
I do not believe that the chinese government is necessarily more evil than the united states government. why do you?
But yeah: they're dangerous, they're an iteration on a technologh that was way beyond the standards of the time, they're used as weapons of war by state actors and by nonstate actors through stochastic terrorism or by useful idiots, etc.
600 participants. I don't know the crosstabs.
Still funny.
President Biden stepped down from re-election for the good of the nation. That puts the US ahead, at least for me.
Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
I'd ask the Uyghurs but apparently they are hard to get ahold of.
Regardless relitigating the whole TikTok discussion that previously got the Social Media thread locked seems like a bad idea for the Election thread since it's barely even tangentally related.
do you think our government does not persecute dissidents or use propaganda?
again, the root question is why tiktok deserves so much ire beyond what its contemporaries receive, if not xenophobia?
At the very least get it locked for fighting over something related to the election not going through the whole uh huh nuh uh TikTok argument again?
There's too much going on day to day and I'd prefer being able to discuss it here.
For me it’s their relationship with Taiwan. I don’t think the US has anything similar, and it does push China into more evil.
There is absolutely a difference between the CCP and the United States, not that the United States is a perfect paragon of virtue.
Foreign government absolutely move to destabilize governments in place. Perhaps look back approximately 8 years to get proof of this within our own country. The US isn't going to do that shit to themselves, but has for sure done it to others in the past. That's neither here nor there in terms of "my government isn't currently attacking me directly like foreign governments probably are". Is there an argument that capitalists are? Sure. But Biden and his cabinet aren't putting policies in place to adjust the algorithm and the fact that you think that they're similar in this regard tells me more about you than I probably care to know.
Cuba
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Imo it get so much more ire because it’s more popular and because Facebook, Twitter, YouTube at some point were seen as pretty good. I think if any of those three, specially the first two, had became popular in the state they are now they would be just as hated.
if a campaign of racial violence perpetrated by the state means said state's social media companies must be banned, I again ask why the US is an exception
So, you don't actually know anything about the chinese government.
Here, let me give you an example of them being shitty:
This is a bit less obvious then say... the treatment of the Uighurs, Tibet or Hong Kong but it's a great example of how incredibly petty and shitty china can be at the drop of a hat to someone who engages in "wrong think".
The US just ran a disinformation campaign about vaccines using social media in the Philippines
https://www.reuters.com/investigates/special-report/usa-covid-propaganda/
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It doesn't stand in contrast to it. Biden was on TikTok as well. You go where people are.
Trump joined TikTok too. TikTok loved Trump.
There is no proof they do it and the question stands as to why that's worse than the other companies doing it.
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Currently? I don’t think the US is attempting to annex Cuba, are they? I don’t necessarily think China is going to invade Taiwan any time soon, and I hope they never do. But they openly plan for Taiwan to become part of them. The US has a really stupid embargo with Cuba, but are Cubans worried that the US will invade or take over their country?
Which was done specifically by the Trump Administration, and was shut down pretty much immediately after Biden took office - and illustrates yet another reason he shouldn't be given power again.
The degree of ‘bad’ which a social media site has in the modern era is a product of…
How dominant is algorithmic control of content?
How likely is the owner to oppose the interests of the public?
How capable is the owner of using algorithmic control
TikTok is entirely algorithmic content, it is a stream of consciousness feed
The Chinese government has a strong interest in damaging Democratic societies, it is critical to them maintaining control
TikTok has shown an immediate pivot to issues in support of Chinese government activities in the past, and serves up a regular diet of harmful content designed to promote misery and sadness
All algorithmically backed social media is designed to create misery, but TikTok is so obviously the worst that there’s no question it should be banned, as should all similar imitators.
The Chinese government is actively engaging in one of histories largest genocides against the Uigers, and concluding a genocide against the Tibetans. The concern isn’t the guys search history, the concern is that the Chinese government uses TikTok to control the narrative between young people overseas.
Doc: That's right, twenty five years into the future. I've always dreamed on seeing the future, looking beyond my years, seeing the progress of mankind. I'll also be able to see who wins the next twenty-five world series.
No clue, but if you ask 10 people 9.5 of them are gonna be kinda leery of another Country fucking with our politics through social media, even if our Country does the same thing.
I don't know how to explain it more clearly than that, unfortunately.