Sounds good. We should get extras just to be safe. A few will get lost/lost in the mail. Assuming it's only a few people whoever has them can just check for an ID that night. We need to make sure every one that paid gets in no matter what happens.
Cronus on
"Read twice, post once. It's almost like 'measure twice, cut once' only with reading." - MetaverseNomad
Sounds good. We should get extras just to be safe. A few will get lost/lost in the mail. Assuming it's only a few people whoever has them can just check for an ID that night. We need to make sure every one that paid gets in no matter what happens.
Agreed entirely.
Arco on
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Organizer of the Post-PAX Party. You should come!
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Sounds good. We should get extras just to be safe. A few will get lost/lost in the mail. Assuming it's only a few people whoever has them can just check for an ID that night. We need to make sure every one that paid gets in no matter what happens.
Still fails the "potential (and fully theoretical) douchebags can exploit it" test. I think the only way we could be sure is ID's checked at the door, wristband gets handed out when you've presented your ID. But that brings us back to we need someone watching the door.
Or maybe not. Just have someone at the door for the first hour or so, then have everyone keep an eye out for people with no wristbands and direct them to the ID checker at whatever activity they're currently occupied in. On the list, the get a wristband, not on the list, they get kicked. Still a pain, but less of a pain than having someone miss out on the whole event sitting at the door.
Or we could take shifts at the door. That's probably easier.
To be honest you could just have one person responsible for giving out the wristbands at first, and then new people without wristbands could be directed to this person. Nobody needs to watch the door if we're going by wristbands, just need to have somebody with the list handy and a bag of wristbands. :P
To be honest you could just have one person responsible for giving out the wristbands at first, and then new people without wristbands could be directed to this person. Nobody needs to watch the door if we're going by wristbands, just need to have somebody with the list handy and a bag of wristbands. :P
Here's my view on it: if we have no system in place, people will crash because there's nothing stopping them. But if we have a system in place, I don't think we'll have any problem. Even if the system is theoretically exploitable, nobody is going to expend the effort to do so. The system doesn't have to be air tight.
I also think that the douchebag factor at PAX is significantly lower than most places. I don't expect a deluge of crashers that we have to deal with.
I think the combination of the bracelets and the lack of douchebag factor will be plenty.
EDIT: I do think having someone at the party with a list and and extra wristbands for people who lose theirs is a good idea, as long as that person isn't required to watch the door or anything.
Arco on
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Its in the back room anyways, so they would have to know about the party to attempt to crash it anyways, and the majority of PAX Goers don't post on the forums anyways. So we really don't have to worry about assclowns.
Also, when shall we discuss what appetizers we are getting? I'm a picky eater, so I will definitely participate in said discussions.
Honestly the only one I care about is the Sushi. If it's halfway decent (which the taphouse's rep leads me to believe it will), I could eat that all night and be happy.
To be honest you could just have one person responsible for giving out the wristbands at first, and then new people without wristbands could be directed to this person. Nobody needs to watch the door if we're going by wristbands, just need to have somebody with the list handy and a bag of wristbands. :P
Just reminding everybody that one platter and one appetizer needs to be veggie friendly, and that the buffet is all-you-can-eat-for-all-night. Endless sushi, anyone?
Also, I do think the buffet will be a straight-up vote. The three platters and three appetizers that get the most mention will be served, provided that there's a vegetarian selection of each. So it's in everyone's best interest to vote.
My votes:
Fresh Fruit Platter
Hummus Platter with Pita, olives, and Roquefort Tomatoes
Assorted Sushi and Nigiri Platter
Carribean jerk chicken tenders
Grilled beef tenderloin with blue cheese and horseradish on baguette
Vegetable gyoza (pot stickers, according to wikipedia)
Arco on
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0
TimeCruiserMikePast Organizer of the West Coast Train TripSan Fernando ValleyRegistered Userregular
edited July 2009
if it was raised on a farm i'll eat it. if it was grown on a farm i might not
Just reminding everybody that one platter and one appetizer needs to be veggie friendly, and that the buffet is all-you-can-eat-for-all-night. Endless sushi, anyone?
Also, I do think the buffet will be a straight-up vote. The three platters and three appetizers that get the most mention will be served, provided that there's a vegetarian selection of each. So it's in everyone's best interest to vote.
If I may make a suggestion Arco. Perhaps you should rank the two lists after the voting, then select the top two from each list. If there is a veggie option, select the third. If not move down the respective list until you hit the top voted veggie option.
This way people like myself and TNTrooper can have a list that has all delicious, delicious meat, but there will always be at least one appetizer and one platter that is veggie friendly.
Cronus on
"Read twice, post once. It's almost like 'measure twice, cut once' only with reading." - MetaverseNomad
Yeah. I figure I'm just going to take the two meat platters and one veggie platter with the most votes, and the two meat appetizers and one veggie appetizer with the most votes. I don't think I'm going to look at it in terms of a set selection of 3 or 6 items, just the individual items.
Arco on
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Organizer of the Post-PAX Party. You should come!
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Yeah. I figure I'm just going to take the two meat platters and one veggie platter with the most votes, and the two meat appetizers and the one veggie appetizer with the most votes. I don't think I'm going to look at it in terms of a set selection of 3 or 6 items, just the individual items.
That's more or less what I meant. The only difference is that mine lets there be multiple veggie options if they are voted high enough. Plus mine totally used more words, thus making it better!
Cronus on
"Read twice, post once. It's almost like 'measure twice, cut once' only with reading." - MetaverseNomad
Oh, absolutely. The one veggie platter/veggie appetizer thing is just a minimum. I just want veggie or health conscious people to have something to eat. If people vote up two veggie friendly options, that's of course okay.
And yes, your word girth vastly overpowered mine.
Arco on
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Organizer of the Post-PAX Party. You should come!
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Really the only two I care about are the Tequila Chicken Tenders, which sound awesome and have quite a few votes already, and the Cheese and Crackers. Because come on, who doesn't like cheese and crackers? Heathens. Thats who.
For my platter choices:
Assorted Cheese and Cracker Platter
Assorted Sushi Platter
Assorted Fruit Platter
For my appetiser choices:
Chicken (any kind, all sound good)
Mini Cheese Tarts
Crab Cakes
And Acro, I will be registering, but it may take a while. I need to pick up one of those pre-paid credit cards so I can pay for it. It shouldn't be too long now...
Pulled Pork on Mini Buns with etc. (If we do not have these I will seriously kill someone)
Tequila Chicken Tenders
Tequila Prawns
People, more votes for pulled pork. I will cut a bitch if I do not have these.
Pulled pork is always awesome. And always messy. It's the eat once. You can't go around playing games or walking while eating it. And if you can they made them wrong.
Also, how the hell did I miss Tequila Prawns. Well, I like my choices and my vote for Tequila Chicken. I also hope that more people vote for the Antipasto Platter. That's always a good thing to break up the meat eating times.
Cronus on
"Read twice, post once. It's almost like 'measure twice, cut once' only with reading." - MetaverseNomad
As per Cronus' suggestion I've edited the front page to reflect the bracelet idea, and to mention that the buffer is paying for the bracelets (hooray for foresight!).
Also, I'm keeping track of what platters/appetizers are being voted for. We still have two months until the dinner, so I don't want these votes to get lost in the Intertubes. I imagine the discussion will heat up again as we get closer.
The attendee list on the event page (http://pppd.eventbrite.com) isn't populating for some reason, even though it's turned on in my little admin panel and even though everyone's data is still there. I e-mailed eventbrite and hopefully it will get fixed soon.
We're up to 19 tickets sold, putting us just shy of 1/5 of the way there.
Arco on
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Organizer of the Post-PAX Party. You should come!
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May I say that Pinder... your new avatar and accompanying quotable quotes are epic. We've gotta find a theater around the area that's going to play the sequel when it comes out... it just HAS to happen!
As far as food goes, anything that's been mentioned thus far would be great. I'd love the calamari, but I think I'd probably be pretty hard-set to find anyone who'd want it too. That being the case, I'll eat anything that has no cilantro or lamb in it.
The DIMD on
<+ACC3SS> 4chan doesn't make me cringe as much as you do, The_DIMD.
So, there's this new thing called Twitter. It's pretty cool. You can update people on what you're doing in short little messages, and people can subscribe to you to get all your updates. Well, they call it "following." Same thing. Anyway, I figure it might be useful for the PPPD. Dunno if anybody uses it, but whatever.
Hey guys, My firend and I will be attending and possiably up to 3 more. I have a few suggestion first if a bouncer is only $12/ hour that would be only 48 cents more per person for 4 hours (and i would be willing to pay for 4 hours if i was able to get in without paying the 35-38, just a suggestion) plus you can also put down a kind of donation thing where to ensure that we have what we paid for someone can donate more. say for example I would be willing to pay for a whole half hour or even and hour to ensure that only payers get in. secondly just ask for ids at the door plain and simple and yes there might be someone with a fake id which can be easly fixed: give each person a security question that only they (and you) would know that answer to that way even if a fake id does show up then its not a problem. (only ask if multiples of the same person show up of course).(also you dont have to ask 100 different questions just ask about 10 and give them randomly to people). I also have a somewhat crude way to ensure that we get 100 hell even 150 easy... first come first serve. when we are at pax everyone here will be letting other peopl know right? they will tell others and eventually there will be lots at the door BEGGING to come in, so like pax add on a little extra(for our , or rather arcos, trouble,) and people will pay i guarentee it. let me know what you all think and please be nice i asked a simple question over on the dnd forums and everyone who answered was a dick. thanks for hearing my ideas.
Dragondevon on
"The times are duanting, its perilous to walk out your front door anymore. The enemy is everywhere, hidden in technology, smiling faces, and laziness. Though, we are not given the luxury to give up. We are the last bastion of hope for our species. We are HUMANS!!!!RAAAAAR"-Devon
"Dude, I think he's a zombie."
"No he's not, he's dead."
"But he's still walking around."
"Which makes him one of the walking dead."
"Exactly."
"So, he's dead."
"No, that makes him a zombie."
"You sound like WALL-E having sex with a Speak and Spell"
We're not going with the bouncer thing. It wouldn't be a bouncer, anyway. This isn't a club, it's a restaurant with a big party room. It would just be a guy at a table checking names. Either way, it's really not going to be a big deal. The bracelets will be plenty. Part of the reason the bracelets are a good idea is that nobody has to be "actively" working. I certainly don't want to spend the night checking IDs, issuing nametags or bracelets, or whatever. I want to have fun. So do all of you. So the bracelets are a good passive system that everybody can participate in. If you see someone without a bracelet, send them my way. I'll have extras and a list of registered guests on hand, and anybody who isn't registered will be asked to pay or leave, plain and simple. That's as hard as I'm willing to "work" during this party, and I don't expect anyone else to work any harder.
As far as IDs go, that isn't even our concern. I don't care if someone under 21 drinks alcohol; the Taphouse and the cops care. It's the bartender's job to check IDs, not mine or your's. It's their liquor license and it's their law. I'm just the guy who put this thing together. If someone gets busted using a fake ID, it's the cops, the kid, and the Taphouse that will be involved, not me. None of you are going to do it anyway, we're all cool adults.
As far as last minute attendees or a mad rush of PAXers at the door... that is something that remains to be dealt with. This is turning into just as much of a party as it is a dinner, but we still have a fixed capacity and a bill to pay, so I can't just "open the doors" and let people come in. I don't think the Taphouse would let that happen, either, but I don't know for sure. I'm choosing to deal with this possibility when it's closer to PAX.
Arco on
Like this, not like the gas station.
Organizer of the Post-PAX Party. You should come!
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lol very good points, they were just a few ideas. Im going to register hopefully the 10th when I get paid, Not to sure when my friend can pay, but we will defadently be there. I want to soak up as much of pax as I can (this will be my first year so i guess you can call me a pax virgin lol) so im going to do everything I can, and this dinner will be a great ending to a great weekend. thanx for organizing this. also I wanted to suggest a few games for the 360. of course most people will agree with these (i hope)
Resident evil 5
Gears of war 1 and or 2
obviously the guitar heros/ rockbands
i think i saw someone say l4d so yeah to that
i also think it would be fun for a fighting game like soul calibur or MK VS DC and have a little free for all kind of tournament (lol and if you wanted you could play loser takes/buys a shot)
I hope this small selection is one people like. Im not to big on sports games (i was never into sports) but I kinda like racing.
Dragondevon on
"The times are duanting, its perilous to walk out your front door anymore. The enemy is everywhere, hidden in technology, smiling faces, and laziness. Though, we are not given the luxury to give up. We are the last bastion of hope for our species. We are HUMANS!!!!RAAAAAR"-Devon
"Dude, I think he's a zombie."
"No he's not, he's dead."
"But he's still walking around."
"Which makes him one of the walking dead."
"Exactly."
"So, he's dead."
"No, that makes him a zombie."
"You sound like WALL-E having sex with a Speak and Spell"
Street Fighter IV. I know it's not everyone's cup of tea, but I'd love to get a chance to test my El Fuerte against some other people in a non-online setting.
All the other options said by Dragondevon sound good to me. I've also got Lego Star Wars and Pure here. Pure can be fun with 4 players. (pure is the SSX like ATV racing game if you didn't know)
So, there's this new thing called Twitter. It's pretty cool. You can update people on what you're doing in short little messages, and people can subscribe to you to get all your updates. Well, they call it "following." Same thing. Anyway, I figure it might be useful for the PPPD. Dunno if anybody uses it, but whatever.
I'm following, but I can't guarantee that I'll see anything as I never use Twitter. Having a twitter account might just be more work for you as we'll always want to keep this thread up to date. Now you'll just have to do it in two places.
Cronus on
"Read twice, post once. It's almost like 'measure twice, cut once' only with reading." - MetaverseNomad
structurally speaking I think it would be nice to have a layout of games and mabe some kind of time frame to reduce indescion and possibly arguments as to which games will be played during the event. Such as for example 7-8 fighting, 8-9 racing, 9-10 shooter etc etc. by the way is there an expected end (sadly) to the night like a time limit or something? i think the game schedual might be a good idea but as i said merly suggestions
oh and id be willing to try the atv one as i said i play racing they just arnt my first choice.
ps sorry for mispellings wasnt my best subject lol
Dragondevon on
"The times are duanting, its perilous to walk out your front door anymore. The enemy is everywhere, hidden in technology, smiling faces, and laziness. Though, we are not given the luxury to give up. We are the last bastion of hope for our species. We are HUMANS!!!!RAAAAAR"-Devon
"Dude, I think he's a zombie."
"No he's not, he's dead."
"But he's still walking around."
"Which makes him one of the walking dead."
"Exactly."
"So, he's dead."
"No, that makes him a zombie."
"You sound like WALL-E having sex with a Speak and Spell"
Posts
"Read twice, post once. It's almost like 'measure twice, cut once' only with reading." - MetaverseNomad
Agreed entirely.
Organizer of the Post-PAX Party. You should come!
Satellite Theater for life!
Still fails the "potential (and fully theoretical) douchebags can exploit it" test. I think the only way we could be sure is ID's checked at the door, wristband gets handed out when you've presented your ID. But that brings us back to we need someone watching the door.
Or maybe not. Just have someone at the door for the first hour or so, then have everyone keep an eye out for people with no wristbands and direct them to the ID checker at whatever activity they're currently occupied in. On the list, the get a wristband, not on the list, they get kicked. Still a pain, but less of a pain than having someone miss out on the whole event sitting at the door.
Or we could take shifts at the door. That's probably easier.
That's... exactly what I suggested.
I also think that the douchebag factor at PAX is significantly lower than most places. I don't expect a deluge of crashers that we have to deal with.
I think the combination of the bracelets and the lack of douchebag factor will be plenty.
EDIT: I do think having someone at the party with a list and and extra wristbands for people who lose theirs is a good idea, as long as that person isn't required to watch the door or anything.
Organizer of the Post-PAX Party. You should come!
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Also, when shall we discuss what appetizers we are getting? I'm a picky eater, so I will definitely participate in said discussions.
We can have 3 platters and 3 appetizers. There needs to be at least one platter and one appetizer that's vegetarian friendly.
Organizer of the Post-PAX Party. You should come!
Satellite Theater for life!
Hummus Platter with Pita, olives, and Roquefort Tomatoes
Assorted Sushi and Nigiri Platter
Soy ginger beef skewers
Tequila Chicken Tenders
Vegetable Gyoza
Honestly the only one I care about is the Sushi. If it's halfway decent (which the taphouse's rep leads me to believe it will), I could eat that all night and be happy.
Antipasto Platter
Assorted Cheeses & Crackers
Pulled pork on mini buns with bbq sauce and country slaw
Caribbean Jerk Chicken Tenders
Tequila Chicken Tenders
As long as there is plenty of meat from things that have legs I'm happy.
"Read twice, post once. It's almost like 'measure twice, cut once' only with reading." - MetaverseNomad
Antipasto Platter
Assorted Cheeses & Crackers
Pulled pork on mini buns with bbq sauce and country slaw
Beef sliders
Tequila Chicken Tenders
I am pretty much the same as Cronus as long there is something that is beef/pork/chicken then I am happy.
I like agreeing with people by redundancy. :P
Fresh Fruit Platter
Assorted Cheese and Crackers
Assorted Sushi platter(Not because I eat it, but others do)
Tequila Chicken Tenders
Beef Sliders
Mini Cheese Tarts
Antipasto Platter
Fresh Fruit Platter
Sausage and cheese stuffed mushrooms
Spinach and Artichoke Dip
Tequila Chicken Tenders
Also, I do think the buffet will be a straight-up vote. The three platters and three appetizers that get the most mention will be served, provided that there's a vegetarian selection of each. So it's in everyone's best interest to vote.
My votes:
Fresh Fruit Platter
Hummus Platter with Pita, olives, and Roquefort Tomatoes
Assorted Sushi and Nigiri Platter
Carribean jerk chicken tenders
Grilled beef tenderloin with blue cheese and horseradish on baguette
Vegetable gyoza (pot stickers, according to wikipedia)
Organizer of the Post-PAX Party. You should come!
Satellite Theater for life!
{Fondly remembers the PAXTrain}
Fresh Vegetable Platter
Assorted Sushi and Nigiri Platter
Mini Dungeness crab cakes
Caribbean Jerk Chicken Tenders
Mini cheese tarts
I used to grow fruits and vegetable as a kid. Can't anymore, the earth, near my house, is too bad.
If I may make a suggestion Arco. Perhaps you should rank the two lists after the voting, then select the top two from each list. If there is a veggie option, select the third. If not move down the respective list until you hit the top voted veggie option.
This way people like myself and TNTrooper can have a list that has all delicious, delicious meat, but there will always be at least one appetizer and one platter that is veggie friendly.
"Read twice, post once. It's almost like 'measure twice, cut once' only with reading." - MetaverseNomad
Organizer of the Post-PAX Party. You should come!
Satellite Theater for life!
That's more or less what I meant. The only difference is that mine lets there be multiple veggie options if they are voted high enough. Plus mine totally used more words, thus making it better!
"Read twice, post once. It's almost like 'measure twice, cut once' only with reading." - MetaverseNomad
And yes, your word girth vastly overpowered mine.
Organizer of the Post-PAX Party. You should come!
Satellite Theater for life!
Fresh Fruit Platter
Assorted Sushi and Nigiri Platter
(no preference for third platter)
Mini Dungeness crab cakes
Tequila Chicken Tenders
Vegetable kabobs
SPICY TUNA ROLL
spicy tuna, cucumbers, green onions and tobiko
CALIFORNIA
crab, avocado, mayo, cucumber and tobiko
CABO
ahi tuna, pico de gallo, jicama, sesame seeds and avocado
SEATTLE
tempura shrimp, tobiko, avocado, asparagus and sesame seeds
Assorted Cheese and Cracker Platter
Assorted Sushi Platter
Assorted Fruit Platter
For my appetiser choices:
Chicken (any kind, all sound good)
Mini Cheese Tarts
Crab Cakes
And Acro, I will be registering, but it may take a while. I need to pick up one of those pre-paid credit cards so I can pay for it. It shouldn't be too long now...
That sounds all well and good, but is only rolls. There would be nigiri as well. Mmm... Nigiri...
Assorted Cheese & Crackers
Assorted Sushi and Nigiri Platter
Antipasto Platter
Pulled Pork on Mini Buns with etc. (If we do not have these I will seriously kill someone)
Tequila Chicken Tenders
Tequila Prawns
People, more votes for pulled pork. I will cut a bitch if I do not have these.
Pulled pork is always awesome. And always messy. It's the eat once. You can't go around playing games or walking while eating it. And if you can they made them wrong.
Also, how the hell did I miss Tequila Prawns. Well, I like my choices and my vote for Tequila Chicken. I also hope that more people vote for the Antipasto Platter. That's always a good thing to break up the meat eating times.
"Read twice, post once. It's almost like 'measure twice, cut once' only with reading." - MetaverseNomad
Also, I'm keeping track of what platters/appetizers are being voted for. We still have two months until the dinner, so I don't want these votes to get lost in the Intertubes. I imagine the discussion will heat up again as we get closer.
The attendee list on the event page (http://pppd.eventbrite.com) isn't populating for some reason, even though it's turned on in my little admin panel and even though everyone's data is still there. I e-mailed eventbrite and hopefully it will get fixed soon.
We're up to 19 tickets sold, putting us just shy of 1/5 of the way there.
Organizer of the Post-PAX Party. You should come!
Satellite Theater for life!
As far as food goes, anything that's been mentioned thus far would be great. I'd love the calamari, but I think I'd probably be pretty hard-set to find anyone who'd want it too. That being the case, I'll eat anything that has no cilantro or lamb in it.
New Votes:
For my platter choices:
Assorted Cheese and Cracker Platter
Assorted Sushi Platter
Assorted Fruit Platter
For my appetiser choices:
Chicken (any kind, all sound good)
Mini Cheese Tarts
PULLED PORK!
https://twitter.com/pppd09
Organizer of the Post-PAX Party. You should come!
Satellite Theater for life!
"No he's not, he's dead."
"But he's still walking around."
"Which makes him one of the walking dead."
"Exactly."
"So, he's dead."
"No, that makes him a zombie."
"You sound like WALL-E having sex with a Speak and Spell"
We're not going with the bouncer thing. It wouldn't be a bouncer, anyway. This isn't a club, it's a restaurant with a big party room. It would just be a guy at a table checking names. Either way, it's really not going to be a big deal. The bracelets will be plenty. Part of the reason the bracelets are a good idea is that nobody has to be "actively" working. I certainly don't want to spend the night checking IDs, issuing nametags or bracelets, or whatever. I want to have fun. So do all of you. So the bracelets are a good passive system that everybody can participate in. If you see someone without a bracelet, send them my way. I'll have extras and a list of registered guests on hand, and anybody who isn't registered will be asked to pay or leave, plain and simple. That's as hard as I'm willing to "work" during this party, and I don't expect anyone else to work any harder.
As far as IDs go, that isn't even our concern. I don't care if someone under 21 drinks alcohol; the Taphouse and the cops care. It's the bartender's job to check IDs, not mine or your's. It's their liquor license and it's their law. I'm just the guy who put this thing together. If someone gets busted using a fake ID, it's the cops, the kid, and the Taphouse that will be involved, not me. None of you are going to do it anyway, we're all cool adults.
As far as last minute attendees or a mad rush of PAXers at the door... that is something that remains to be dealt with. This is turning into just as much of a party as it is a dinner, but we still have a fixed capacity and a bill to pay, so I can't just "open the doors" and let people come in. I don't think the Taphouse would let that happen, either, but I don't know for sure. I'm choosing to deal with this possibility when it's closer to PAX.
Organizer of the Post-PAX Party. You should come!
Satellite Theater for life!
Resident evil 5
Gears of war 1 and or 2
obviously the guitar heros/ rockbands
i think i saw someone say l4d so yeah to that
i also think it would be fun for a fighting game like soul calibur or MK VS DC and have a little free for all kind of tournament (lol and if you wanted you could play loser takes/buys a shot)
I hope this small selection is one people like. Im not to big on sports games (i was never into sports) but I kinda like racing.
"No he's not, he's dead."
"But he's still walking around."
"Which makes him one of the walking dead."
"Exactly."
"So, he's dead."
"No, that makes him a zombie."
"You sound like WALL-E having sex with a Speak and Spell"
Nobody has mentioned games yet, so I'm sure that's a discussion worth sparking.
Organizer of the Post-PAX Party. You should come!
Satellite Theater for life!
All the other options said by Dragondevon sound good to me. I've also got Lego Star Wars and Pure here. Pure can be fun with 4 players. (pure is the SSX like ATV racing game if you didn't know)
Organizer of the Post-PAX Party. You should come!
Satellite Theater for life!
I'm following, but I can't guarantee that I'll see anything as I never use Twitter. Having a twitter account might just be more work for you as we'll always want to keep this thread up to date. Now you'll just have to do it in two places.
"Read twice, post once. It's almost like 'measure twice, cut once' only with reading." - MetaverseNomad
oh and id be willing to try the atv one as i said i play racing they just arnt my first choice.
ps sorry for mispellings wasnt my best subject lol
"No he's not, he's dead."
"But he's still walking around."
"Which makes him one of the walking dead."
"Exactly."
"So, he's dead."
"No, that makes him a zombie."
"You sound like WALL-E having sex with a Speak and Spell"