not commander's post, thaw, but the rest of the band's (and people on the board's) reaction.
edit: hooray SH! If i didn't instantly lose things, I would buy the cd too. After re-buying Act 1 twice, I gave up on having physical copies.
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited September 2009
Langly, can you shoot me a link to the rest of the band's reaction?
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
not commander's post, thaw, but the rest of the band's (and people on the board's) reaction.
The other people on their board can suck it. I've had all I can stand of their "discussion".
I didn't see that anyone else from their band had reacted. Can't say I really dug around for their reactions. Really too bad if they didn't just leave it to Commander's post, and call it a day.
Saying that a physical CD is intrinsically better than a digital CD: Yeah sure, that's fine.
Saying that the customers who buy the physical CD are intrinsically different than those who buy the digital CD: Stop being a dick.
And that's the crux of the matter. Munkus wins again, I am the new protomen by default.
I really wish I could find someone from the band that said that, because I simply can't, and don't know what you're referring to.
If you're referring to the fans, then I don't know what you're mad at the Protomen about. They're fans. It's 2009. They're always a week too late for their Rabies Vaccination. Always.
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited September 2009
What you're saying would make a bit of sense, had we not made a conscious effort to warn people about the situation. If we had tried to sneak it by you, I could see your point. We provide it in digital form, because some people could give a shit about the story. Some people just like fancy music. On the other hand, some people just like fancy story. If you happen to be one of those people who enjoy both, you should get the product that contains both. The CD. As archaic as it may seem in the year 2009, Compact Disk is the medium that we chose as the complete package. Do you get pissed when a band offers deluxe editions or box sets that have all manner of extra info and liner notes? No. I should hope not.
I hate to bring this down to money, but if you bought digital, you paid roughly 5 dollars less than the people who bought the physical cd. You also got the music about a week and a half before everyone else (not saying that isn't partly our fault and I apologize to the Pre-Salers). If that is spitting on you, then I'm sorry, and I wish I could offer you a tissue.
All that being said, we have toyed with the idea of offering the booklet for sale. But in the end, realized that most of you wouldn't buy it, because it looks like the majority of you tend to think real things are soooo 90's.
I'm sorry if this comes off as snarky and a little annoyed, but this argument has run it's course.
-Commander
Munkus Beaver on
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited September 2009
I again don't fault them for not providing the damned notes themselves.
I do fault them for intending that the notes not be posted.
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
What you're saying would make a bit of sense, had we not made a conscious effort to warn people about the situation. If we had tried to sneak it by you, I could see your point. We provide it in digital form, because some people could give a shit about the story. Some people just like fancy music. On the other hand, some people just like fancy story. If you happen to be one of those people who enjoy both, you should get the product that contains both. The CD. As archaic as it may seem in the year 2009, Compact Disk is the medium that we chose as the complete package. Do you get pissed when a band offers deluxe editions or box sets that have all manner of extra info and liner notes? No. I should hope not.
I hate to bring this down to money, but if you bought digital, you paid roughly 5 dollars less than the people who bought the physical cd. You also got the music about a week and a half before everyone else (not saying that isn't partly our fault and I apologize to the Pre-Salers). If that is spitting on you, then I'm sorry, and I wish I could offer you a tissue.
All that being said, we have toyed with the idea of offering the booklet for sale. But in the end, realized that most of you wouldn't buy it, because it looks like the majority of you tend to think real things are soooo 90's.
I'm sorry if this comes off as snarky and a little annoyed, but this argument has run it's course.
-Commander
Yeah, read that. Didn't see where he said anyone who bought anything was a true fan, or a different kind of fan.
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
What you're saying would make a bit of sense, had we not made a conscious effort to warn people about the situation. If we had tried to sneak it by you, I could see your point. We provide it in digital form, because some people could give a shit about the story. Some people just like fancy music. On the other hand, some people just like fancy story. If you happen to be one of those people who enjoy both, you should get the product that contains both. The CD. As archaic as it may seem in the year 2009, Compact Disk is the medium that we chose as the complete package. Do you get pissed when a band offers deluxe editions or box sets that have all manner of extra info and liner notes? No. I should hope not.
I hate to bring this down to money, but if you bought digital, you paid roughly 5 dollars less than the people who bought the physical cd. You also got the music about a week and a half before everyone else (not saying that isn't partly our fault and I apologize to the Pre-Salers). If that is spitting on you, then I'm sorry, and I wish I could offer you a tissue.
All that being said, we have toyed with the idea of offering the booklet for sale. But in the end, realized that most of you wouldn't buy it, because it looks like the majority of you tend to think real things are soooo 90's.
I'm sorry if this comes off as snarky and a little annoyed, but this argument has run it's course.
-Commander
Yeah, read that. Didn't see where he said anyone who bought anything was a true fan, or a different kind of fan.
Munkus Beaver on
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited September 2009
I also find it odd that they are lauding the CD as the one true way to experience the album when it's a rock opera.
Which means that the show is the way to experience the album.
And the album is mainly about convenience in hearing it.
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
I think I mis-read his original post. He referred to several people in the thread, and then said "our". I took that to mean that several of them were members of the band. I think that commander is the only band member speaking on this.
In any case, I wasn't mad about not having digital liner, just the mood that posting the notes online was wrong.
What you're saying would make a bit of sense, had we not made a conscious effort to warn people about the situation. If we had tried to sneak it by you, I could see your point. We provide it in digital form, because some people could give a shit about the story. Some people just like fancy music. On the other hand, some people just like fancy story. If you happen to be one of those people who enjoy both, you should get the product that contains both. The CD. As archaic as it may seem in the year 2009, Compact Disk is the medium that we chose as the complete package. Do you get pissed when a band offers deluxe editions or box sets that have all manner of extra info and liner notes? No. I should hope not.
I hate to bring this down to money, but if you bought digital, you paid roughly 5 dollars less than the people who bought the physical cd. You also got the music about a week and a half before everyone else (not saying that isn't partly our fault and I apologize to the Pre-Salers). If that is spitting on you, then I'm sorry, and I wish I could offer you a tissue.
All that being said, we have toyed with the idea of offering the booklet for sale. But in the end, realized that most of you wouldn't buy it, because it looks like the majority of you tend to think real things are soooo 90's.
I'm sorry if this comes off as snarky and a little annoyed, but this argument has run it's course.
-Commander
Yeah, read that. Didn't see where he said anyone who bought anything was a true fan, or a different kind of fan.
Yep, he said that if you enjoy both story and music, you should get the physical CD. I'm guessing it probably had something to do with the liner notes being included with the CD.
He didn't say that not buying the CD meant that you didn't care about the story. He said that the purpose of the digital distribution was so that they had a product for those that would merely want music.
He still didn't say anything about what it took to be a real fan, and you're still reaching.
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited September 2009
His original post on the matter said that their intention was that the liner notes shouldn't be posted online and that they should be passed around in person.
It's called inference of intention man.
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
You know what? I don't really care. They got my ten bucks, and I got some great music and a cool story to go along with it. If they're unhappy about it oh well.
I was seriously thinking about buying a physical copy when I went to the show on Friday but not anymore.
I think I mis-read his original post. He referred to several people in the thread, and then said "our". I took that to mean that several of them were members of the band. I think that commander is the only band member speaking on this.
In any case, I wasn't mad about not having digital liner, just the mood that posting the notes online was wrong.
See, and this was my reaction to that "mood":
"Oh, you don't really like the inevitable. Well....that sucks......
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited September 2009
Let me combine the ideas, for clarity.
"If you want the whole story you need the liner notes.
The liner notes shouldn't have been posted online. We didn't want them to be posted online.
If you wanted the whole story you should have bought the CD."
Therefore
"We didn't/don't want people who bought the CD online to get the whole story."
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited September 2009
I've got this burning like my wikia is filled with nothing but liner notes
Munkus Beaver on
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UnbrokenEvaHIGH ON THE WIREBUT I WON'T TRIP ITRegistered Userregular
Also, I pre-ordered the physical CD as soon as it went up, and since it told me it was on backorder (which it wasn't, but it told me it was so that could have been up to a month before I got it) I also blew my load and bought it from iTunes on release day
I've payed twice for the album and as such I am the SUPERfan and may post notes when and where I see fit
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
That said, I can say for sure that Panther and Murphy are rad dudes (Commander didn't seem to want to talk to anyone after the show, maybe he is just not as nice) and I am still trying to get them to come to Columbia some time
His original post on the matter said that their intention was that the liner notes shouldn't be posted online and that they should be passed around in person.
It's called inference of intention man.
Yes, because his assessment of his audience is poor. That much is blatantly obvious to anyone that had spent so much as a second reading what he had to say. They thought that the only people that would want to buy the digital copy, since they had been talking about it forever, would be people that didn't care to have the liner notes.
Which, again, goes to their lack of good business sense. It's the year 2009, and we all know that simply wouldn't be, nor was, the case. They actually thought that their liner notes, being packaged with the CD only, and with nobody buying the digital copy that wanted the liner notes (Yes, horribly horribly incorrect), could actually be an anti-piracy device. And as such, didn't want them posted online.
Well, it's nice to want. And it's nice to think that you know the buying trends of your fans. But they obviously didn't.
Now, they obviously don't get any points whatsoever for continuing to think that they actually had a good plan, and defend it when it has already failed. But again, they're musicians, not businessmen, and they don't know their ass from a hole in the ground when it comes to money and product.
He DOES get points for trying to make his horribly incorrect point while trying his damnest not to piss anyone off. Which, apparently, he did anyways, since you're willing to stretch his intentions to fan polarization.
"If you want the whole story you need the liner notes.
The liner notes shouldn't have been posted online. We didn't want them to be posted online.
If you wanted the whole story you should have bought the CD."
Therefore
"We didn't/don't want people who bought the CD online to get the whole story."
This is the same impression I am getting.
And that is bullshit.
I'm going to take this opportunity to thank GG again for posting the notes.
Cause I made a vow a couple years ago that I wouldn't buy another disc, I still paid for both Protomen albums, but I appreciate them more having read the notes. I don't think it's fair that apparently the band posted said only people who bought the physical CD deserve the notes.
Frankly, when I read the notes, my rating of Act 2 when up from 90% to 110%
I don't see why people who didn't wait for a disc in the mail are forced to enjoy the album less.
Kind of unfair.
But my views on selling your music are kind of out of left field anyway.
"If you want the whole story you need the liner notes.
The liner notes shouldn't have been posted online. We didn't want them to be posted online.
If you wanted the whole story you should have bought the CD."
Therefore
"We didn't/don't want people who bought the CD online to get the whole story."
Yes, I 100% understand where you're coming from.
I'm saying that you're stretching it, and that this is not what he means at all. He said, quite plainly, that they did not expect that people who would buy the digital album, would actually be wanting lyrics with them, since they told everyone ahead of time that it wouldn't have them.
They didn't want a digital copy of their lyrics, because they thought it could be used as an anti-piracy measure.
Their plan is FAIL x100, but they're not telling you you're a poor fan.
Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited September 2009
I'm not stretching anything. That was pure logical inference right there.
Purest that money can buy, son.
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Posts
edit: hooray SH! If i didn't instantly lose things, I would buy the cd too. After re-buying Act 1 twice, I gave up on having physical copies.
The other people on their board can suck it. I've had all I can stand of their "discussion".
I didn't see that anyone else from their band had reacted. Can't say I really dug around for their reactions. Really too bad if they didn't just leave it to Commander's post, and call it a day.
I really wish I could find someone from the band that said that, because I simply can't, and don't know what you're referring to.
If you're referring to the fans, then I don't know what you're mad at the Protomen about. They're fans. It's 2009. They're always a week too late for their Rabies Vaccination. Always.
I do fault them for intending that the notes not be posted.
Yeah, read that. Didn't see where he said anyone who bought anything was a true fan, or a different kind of fan.
Which means that the show is the way to experience the album.
And the album is mainly about convenience in hearing it.
In any case, I wasn't mad about not having digital liner, just the mood that posting the notes online was wrong.
Yep, he said that if you enjoy both story and music, you should get the physical CD. I'm guessing it probably had something to do with the liner notes being included with the CD.
He didn't say that not buying the CD meant that you didn't care about the story. He said that the purpose of the digital distribution was so that they had a product for those that would merely want music.
He still didn't say anything about what it took to be a real fan, and you're still reaching.
It's called inference of intention man.
I was seriously thinking about buying a physical copy when I went to the show on Friday but not anymore.
http://www.audioentropy.com/
See, and this was my reaction to that "mood":
"Oh, you don't really like the inevitable. Well....that sucks......
......How about them Rams?"
aaaaaaaaand I moved on.
"If you want the whole story you need the liner notes.
The liner notes shouldn't have been posted online. We didn't want them to be posted online.
If you wanted the whole story you should have bought the CD."
Therefore
"We didn't/don't want people who bought the CD online to get the whole story."
You sent a young man to his death at Dr. Munkus.
I am in control.
I keep you safe.
typed the text
that they're whining about
http://www.audioentropy.com/
You monster.
DUMduhduhduhduhDUMduhduhduhduh
I've payed twice for the album and as such I am the SUPERfan and may post notes when and where I see fit
and with a click there's gonna be the biggest argument ever wrote
http://www.audioentropy.com/
It's the only way that they'll ever learn.
Yes, because his assessment of his audience is poor. That much is blatantly obvious to anyone that had spent so much as a second reading what he had to say. They thought that the only people that would want to buy the digital copy, since they had been talking about it forever, would be people that didn't care to have the liner notes.
Which, again, goes to their lack of good business sense. It's the year 2009, and we all know that simply wouldn't be, nor was, the case. They actually thought that their liner notes, being packaged with the CD only, and with nobody buying the digital copy that wanted the liner notes (Yes, horribly horribly incorrect), could actually be an anti-piracy device. And as such, didn't want them posted online.
Well, it's nice to want. And it's nice to think that you know the buying trends of your fans. But they obviously didn't.
Now, they obviously don't get any points whatsoever for continuing to think that they actually had a good plan, and defend it when it has already failed. But again, they're musicians, not businessmen, and they don't know their ass from a hole in the ground when it comes to money and product.
He DOES get points for trying to make his horribly incorrect point while trying his damnest not to piss anyone off. Which, apparently, he did anyways, since you're willing to stretch his intentions to fan polarization.
that is all
This is the same impression I am getting.
And that is bullshit.
I'm going to take this opportunity to thank GG again for posting the notes.
Cause I made a vow a couple years ago that I wouldn't buy another disc, I still paid for both Protomen albums, but I appreciate them more having read the notes. I don't think it's fair that apparently the band posted said only people who bought the physical CD deserve the notes.
Frankly, when I read the notes, my rating of Act 2 when up from 90% to 110%
I don't see why people who didn't wait for a disc in the mail are forced to enjoy the album less.
Kind of unfair.
But my views on selling your music are kind of out of left field anyway.
Dear satan I wish for this or maybe some of this....oh and I'm a medium or a large.
Yes, I 100% understand where you're coming from.
I'm saying that you're stretching it, and that this is not what he means at all. He said, quite plainly, that they did not expect that people who would buy the digital album, would actually be wanting lyrics with them, since they told everyone ahead of time that it wouldn't have them.
They didn't want a digital copy of their lyrics, because they thought it could be used as an anti-piracy measure.
Their plan is FAIL x100, but they're not telling you you're a poor fan.
Purest that money can buy, son.
They should have done that.
whatever, it's good musak
Can anyone break this dolor?!
because I parsed that as door