I like the idea of shotguns in this game more than I actually like them. I seem to get killed with them all the time, yet I've yet to kill more than two people with them in a match.
I seem to get killed by the SAIGA a lot, but whenever I use it, it takes like 5-6 rounds at about 5 meters to kill someone, and I just give up. Apparently I'm doing it wrong. Slugs haven't made it any more worthwhile for me.
I'm speaking as someone who has unlocked it and used it extensively, not just someone who's been killed by it. It's cheese. It needs the damage cut by about 40% and the accuracy reduced significantly. It shouldn't be the most damaging and most accurate LMG at once.
I'm speaking as someone who has unlocked it and used it extensively, not just someone who's been killed by it. It's cheese. It needs the damage cut by about 40% and the accuracy reduced significantly.
So you think the M60 should have it's power cut, it's accuracy cut, and just have medium power, medium accuracy, and slow rate of fire?
There'd be no point in using it. You sacrifice mobility and the ability to actually use covering fire for high power and relatively high accuracy. Without those two it's just a hunk of junk that slows you down and can't spit out that many bullets.
I'm speaking as someone who has unlocked it and used it extensively, not just someone who's been killed by it. It's cheese. It needs the damage cut by about 40% and the accuracy reduced significantly. It shouldn't be the most damaging and most accurate LMG at once.
So it should be worthless?
No, it should be the most damaging LMG per-shot by a small amount, not a factor of two. And it should have its accuracy reduced to something less than the MG36 and XM8 LMG.
EDIT: Let me dig up the chart. The release numbers came out, finally, and the M60 does like 39 damage per shot at short range, while no other LMG does much more than 20. It has less damage fall-off at long range, too.
EDIT 2: Can't find the source again and I forgot to bookmark it. GalagaGalaxian posted this in the last thread:
Really, personally I don't have any problems with any of the weapons as they are in the game right now. Sure I don't like getting killed before I have a chance to respond when my own attacks seem far more susceptible to retaliation, but I can live with that.
What actually bothers me is how most of the weapons just feel the same, or are functionally the same. There appears to be two kinds of every weapon and that's it. Pump shotguns, and auto shotties. Normal snipers and weak-ass stealthy snipers. Full auto AR's and Burst AR's. etc etc. The differences beyond that seem pretty much inconsequential. Regardless of perks, every normal sniper will always take two non-headshots to kill. Pump action shotguns are literally interchangeable. I am loving this game, just wondering how long I'll be able to love it for.
I unlocked the M60 last night after an epic game of 9000 points scored and something like 31 kills to 8 deaths.
The M60 is not overpowered. You can shut up about it. You can't see shit with it, it fires slow, and if you wanna put a scope on it you lose probably one of the best specializations in the game.
Your statement does not take into account that it's a laser. Of course you can't kill anything if you can't see anyone, as the iron sights suck. But a 4x on that bitch? Yummy.
Laser implies that it has a steady stream of bullets, which it doesn't. The M60 fires slow.
True about putting the 4X or even the red dot on it, but if you do that then you lose out of some serious healing ability.
Though, honestly, in my epic run last night I was medic with the Saiga and I was just raining down hell upon the plebes.
Oddly enough, I do much better with the M60 when I am using the iron sights.
Sheep you were on fire last night, I hope you friended nero, he's one of my favorite squad mate duders.
Did not. I'll try to keep that in mind next time I see him. He's free to add me as well.
I like how that one guy jumps into the squad, acts all shit tough, and doesn't score better than any of us.
"Yo, any of you douches have mics on tonight?"
"Don't fucking revive me if you don't know what you're doing Sheep"
Sheeeeeeep - 9000 points
Asshat - 1100 points
That must have been after I logged for the night, I was basically bullshitting with nero all night, I know I'm not that good due to my restless nature in conquest. I mean I just don't feel right if I'm not out there getting blown up.
Preacher on
I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.
Sheep you were on fire last night, I hope you friended nero, he's one of my favorite squad mate duders.
Did not. I'll try to keep that in mind next time I see him. He's free to add me as well.
I like how that one guy jumps into the squad, acts all shit tough, and doesn't score better than any of us.
"Yo, any of you douches have mics on tonight?"
"Don't fucking revive me if you don't know what you're doing Sheep"
Sheeeeeeep - 9000 points
Asshat - 1100 points
That must have been after I logged for the night, I was basically bullshitting with nero all night, I know I'm not that good due to my restless nature in conquest. I mean I just don't feel right if I'm not out there getting blown up.
Nah, you were there. It was me, you, another guy, and an open slot that that guy filled. I think it was after the squad got split for a bit.
Sheep on
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Zen VulgarityWhat a lovely day for teaSecret British ThreadRegistered Userregular
...and again, as soon as someone posts the numbers, the M60 argument just gets dropped. That's what, like three times now?
What? You said that the M60 was twice as powerful as the other guns and then the info you posted said the opposite. At most, unmodified, the M60 does only does 10 more points of damage compared to other LMGs. If it does more you sacrifice your medics ability to be an efficient medic.
Sheep on
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Zen VulgarityWhat a lovely day for teaSecret British ThreadRegistered Userregular
edited March 2010
He could have said "twice as powerful" to be taken as hyperbole sheep
Nah, you were there. It was me, you, another guy, and an open slot that that guy filled. I think it was after the squad got split for a bit.
I must have completely spaced it, or maybe that was in game chat and I didn't hear it because I was in party? Still my favorite moment was when that idiot took up a position the next room over when were on position b, walking over and shanking him was glorious.
Preacher on
I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.
...and again, as soon as someone posts the numbers, the M60 argument just gets dropped. That's what, like three times now?
well, your numbers are a bit off, using the chart you posted.
a more realistic request is a 20% drop in damage, since the rate of fire is so much slower than the other LMGs.
any request to lower accuracy is just gonna piss people off, bringing back bad memories of how utterly shit LMGs were in Battlefield 2.
The fire rate is still extremely high for a weapon that damaging, even with the damage reduced by 20%.
The issue with accuracy is balance against other LMGs. Fire rate rarely amounts to much. If it did, the MG3 wouldn't be such a monumental pile of shit. The M60 shouldn't be the most accurate and the most damaging. A 20% cut in damage with the same accuracy still makes it superior to every other LMG in the game.
I had my Battlefield Moment of the Week(tm) last night on Isla Innocentes.
I was defending, and my team got pushed all the way back to the last point. I got to the Hind first and hopped in, waiting for a squadmate or teammate to join me and take the gunner seat. Unfortunately, none of my team had respawned back at base yet and most were retreating on foot from the previous area. As a result, the enemy Blackhawk was overhead and firing at me before I even took off.
So I took off before they could destroy me on the ground. I flew straight up in my wonderful, impotent flying machine, decided that I couldn't actually accomplish anything without a gunner, and just flew my Hind straight into their Blackhawk at ramming speed.
Now would be a great time to conclude the story with "And we both blew up", but sadly, I was the only one that died in the crash. Their Blackhawk became severely damaged but stayed aloft. Still, though. My squadmate saw it happen and said, "Did... did you just kamikazi right into their Blackhawk? I know you were the only one that died, but that was still cool."
Also, Engineers in the backseat of a Blackhawk ftw.
...and again, as soon as someone posts the numbers, the M60 argument just gets dropped. That's what, like three times now?
What? You said that the M60 was twice as powerful as the other guns and then the info you posted said the opposite. At most, unmodified, the M60 does only does 10 more points of damage compared to other LMGs. If it does more you sacrifice your medics ability to be an efficient medic.
I was winging it without the numbers in front of me.
It's more than twice as powerful, per-round, as the MG3, just shy of twice as powerful as the T-88, MG36, and SAW, and a little more than 50% more powerful than the PKM and XM8. That better?
Point is:
1) It's far more damaging than other LMGs
2) It's far more accurate than other LMGs
The only reason to use anything other the the M60 is personal taste (or having not unlocked it yet). It is utterly dominant over every other LMG in every range and every setting.
...and again, as soon as someone posts the numbers, the M60 argument just gets dropped. That's what, like three times now?
well, your numbers are a bit off, using the chart you posted.
a more realistic request is a 20% drop in damage, since the rate of fire is so much slower than the other LMGs.
any request to lower accuracy is just gonna piss people off, bringing back bad memories of how utterly shit LMGs were in Battlefield 2.
The fire rate is still extremely high for a weapon that damaging, even with the damage reduced by 20%.
The issue with accuracy is balance against other LMGs. Fire rate rarely amounts to much. If it did, the MG3 wouldn't be such a monumental pile of shit. The M60 shouldn't be the most accurate and the most damaging. A 20% cut in damage with the same accuracy still makes it superior to every other LMG in the game.
If you lower the accuracy on a gun with a lower fire rate people are just going to stop using it.
(I don't use it anyway, I use the SAW because it's more fun, and I don't have the slot to spare for a scope for the m60)
I can't decide if I love or hate the VSS
it's basically an engy SMG in a recon kit. I'm going to have to experiment with it more to find a suitable playstyle.
...and again, as soon as someone posts the numbers, the M60 argument just gets dropped. That's what, like three times now?
well, your numbers are a bit off, using the chart you posted.
a more realistic request is a 20% drop in damage, since the rate of fire is so much slower than the other LMGs.
any request to lower accuracy is just gonna piss people off, bringing back bad memories of how utterly shit LMGs were in Battlefield 2.
The fire rate is still extremely high for a weapon that damaging, even with the damage reduced by 20%.
The issue with accuracy is balance against other LMGs. Fire rate rarely amounts to much. If it did, the MG3 wouldn't be such a monumental pile of shit. The M60 shouldn't be the most accurate and the most damaging. A 20% cut in damage with the same accuracy still makes it superior to every other LMG in the game.
If you lower the accuracy on a gun with a lower fire rate people are just going to stop using it.
(I don't use it anyway, I use the SAW because it's more fun, and I don't have the slot to spare for a scope for the m60)
Oranged for utter lies.
Again, the M60 is the single most accurate LMG. It's also the single most damaging LMG. It has the lowest fire rate, true, but still has the shortest TTK.
There's no reason that a gun that has the lowest fire rate, highest damage, and middle-of-the-pack accuracy would be unusable or undesirable. None at all.
s3rial one on
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Zen VulgarityWhat a lovely day for teaSecret British ThreadRegistered Userregular
I can't decide if I love or hate the VSS
it's basically an engy SMG in a recon kit. I'm going to have to experiment with it more to find a suitable playstyle.
Slap a red dot on it and head to the front lines
It's incredibly deadly short to mid-range and most people will never know where they got hit until they're dead
It's perfect for when you are also running C4 instead of the Mortar
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Zen VulgarityWhat a lovely day for teaSecret British ThreadRegistered Userregular
He could have said "twice as powerful" to be taken as hyperbole sheep
I mean you've considered that right
I considered that. I just wanted to point out that the stats didn't match his rhetoric and that the M60 has drawbacks.
I must have completely spaced it, or maybe that was in game chat and I didn't hear it because I was in party? Still my favorite moment was when that idiot took up a position the next room over when were on position b, walking over and shanking him was glorious.
Yeah, I think that was in game.
Did I do the shanking?
I think the most epic part was something like, "DUDE BEHIND YOU. WAIT WA... was that Sheep? Sheep? Fuck. Sheep got em. Holy shit Sheep's still killing them GO SHEEP!"
When I pretty much Rambo'd B on that snow level I felt like 10 feet tall.
Is the foghorn I hear at the end of conquest rounds someone really honking the horn? I can't tell if its there to tell me that the round is almost over.
Posts
I seem to get killed by the SAIGA a lot, but whenever I use it, it takes like 5-6 rounds at about 5 meters to kill someone, and I just give up. Apparently I'm doing it wrong. Slugs haven't made it any more worthwhile for me.
banned
Steam
So it should be worthless?
So you think the M60 should have it's power cut, it's accuracy cut, and just have medium power, medium accuracy, and slow rate of fire?
There'd be no point in using it. You sacrifice mobility and the ability to actually use covering fire for high power and relatively high accuracy. Without those two it's just a hunk of junk that slows you down and can't spit out that many bullets.
No, it should be the most damaging LMG per-shot by a small amount, not a factor of two. And it should have its accuracy reduced to something less than the MG36 and XM8 LMG.
EDIT: Let me dig up the chart. The release numbers came out, finally, and the M60 does like 39 damage per shot at short range, while no other LMG does much more than 20. It has less damage fall-off at long range, too.
EDIT 2: Can't find the source again and I forgot to bookmark it. GalagaGalaxian posted this in the last thread:
(spoilered for h-scroll)
LMGs:
Full chart:
Steam
pleasepaypreacher.net
Did not. I'll try to keep that in mind next time I see him. He's free to add me as well.
I like how that one guy jumps into the squad, acts all shit tough, and doesn't score better than any of us.
"Yo, any of you douches have mics on tonight?"
"Don't fucking revive me if you don't know what you're doing Sheep"
Sheeeeeeep - 9000 points
Asshat - 1100 points
Like sniping Talios off of a hopping Jetski
What actually bothers me is how most of the weapons just feel the same, or are functionally the same. There appears to be two kinds of every weapon and that's it. Pump shotguns, and auto shotties. Normal snipers and weak-ass stealthy snipers. Full auto AR's and Burst AR's. etc etc. The differences beyond that seem pretty much inconsequential. Regardless of perks, every normal sniper will always take two non-headshots to kill. Pump action shotguns are literally interchangeable. I am loving this game, just wondering how long I'll be able to love it for.
Oddly enough, I do much better with the M60 when I am using the iron sights.
That must have been after I logged for the night, I was basically bullshitting with nero all night, I know I'm not that good due to my restless nature in conquest. I mean I just don't feel right if I'm not out there getting blown up.
pleasepaypreacher.net
You could use the m14; it's pretty rad. Oh, and you could do handguns only if you wanted to be a true hero.
http://denkirson.xanga.com/722757523/bad-company-2/
For the initial info. based on beta.
http://denkirson.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=general2&action=display&thread=1165
For a few charts that look like the one posted earlier in this thread, and may or may not be accurate.
Nah, you were there. It was me, you, another guy, and an open slot that that guy filled. I think it was after the squad got split for a bit.
well, your numbers are a bit off, using the chart you posted.
a more realistic request is a 20% drop in damage, since the rate of fire is so much slower than the other LMGs.
any request to lower accuracy is just gonna piss people off, bringing back bad memories of how utterly shit LMGs were in Battlefield 2.
edit: ^^^^^MG3 is really freakin' fun especially in house to house fighting
sorry, I was unclear
I want the stats site that is creating the sigs, I don't want the stats in the sig, I want to know my other stats
What? You said that the M60 was twice as powerful as the other guns and then the info you posted said the opposite. At most, unmodified, the M60 does only does 10 more points of damage compared to other LMGs. If it does more you sacrifice your medics ability to be an efficient medic.
I mean you've considered that right
I must have completely spaced it, or maybe that was in game chat and I didn't hear it because I was in party? Still my favorite moment was when that idiot took up a position the next room over when were on position b, walking over and shanking him was glorious.
pleasepaypreacher.net
The fire rate is still extremely high for a weapon that damaging, even with the damage reduced by 20%.
The issue with accuracy is balance against other LMGs. Fire rate rarely amounts to much. If it did, the MG3 wouldn't be such a monumental pile of shit. The M60 shouldn't be the most accurate and the most damaging. A 20% cut in damage with the same accuracy still makes it superior to every other LMG in the game.
I was defending, and my team got pushed all the way back to the last point. I got to the Hind first and hopped in, waiting for a squadmate or teammate to join me and take the gunner seat. Unfortunately, none of my team had respawned back at base yet and most were retreating on foot from the previous area. As a result, the enemy Blackhawk was overhead and firing at me before I even took off.
So I took off before they could destroy me on the ground. I flew straight up in my wonderful, impotent flying machine, decided that I couldn't actually accomplish anything without a gunner, and just flew my Hind straight into their Blackhawk at ramming speed.
Now would be a great time to conclude the story with "And we both blew up", but sadly, I was the only one that died in the crash. Their Blackhawk became severely damaged but stayed aloft. Still, though. My squadmate saw it happen and said, "Did... did you just kamikazi right into their Blackhawk? I know you were the only one that died, but that was still cool."
Also, Engineers in the backseat of a Blackhawk ftw.
It's for raining a pile of lead on a whole squad
Ah, not sure on that.
Slap an ACOG on them and get near the front lines and they're fine
I was winging it without the numbers in front of me.
It's more than twice as powerful, per-round, as the MG3, just shy of twice as powerful as the T-88, MG36, and SAW, and a little more than 50% more powerful than the PKM and XM8. That better?
Point is:
1) It's far more damaging than other LMGs
2) It's far more accurate than other LMGs
The only reason to use anything other the the M60 is personal taste (or having not unlocked it yet). It is utterly dominant over every other LMG in every range and every setting.
If you lower the accuracy on a gun with a lower fire rate people are just going to stop using it.
(I don't use it anyway, I use the SAW because it's more fun, and I don't have the slot to spare for a scope for the m60)
it's basically an engy SMG in a recon kit. I'm going to have to experiment with it more to find a suitable playstyle.
Oranged for utter lies.
Again, the M60 is the single most accurate LMG. It's also the single most damaging LMG. It has the lowest fire rate, true, but still has the shortest TTK.
There's no reason that a gun that has the lowest fire rate, highest damage, and middle-of-the-pack accuracy would be unusable or undesirable. None at all.
Slap a red dot on it and head to the front lines
It's incredibly deadly short to mid-range and most people will never know where they got hit until they're dead
It's perfect for when you are also running C4 instead of the Mortar
I considered that. I just wanted to point out that the stats didn't match his rhetoric and that the M60 has drawbacks.
Yeah, I think that was in game.
Did I do the shanking?
I think the most epic part was something like, "DUDE BEHIND YOU. WAIT WA... was that Sheep? Sheep? Fuck. Sheep got em. Holy shit Sheep's still killing them GO SHEEP!"
When I pretty much Rambo'd B on that snow level I felt like 10 feet tall.
same for medic?
also I have this preorder key, where do I input dis