having to get down on his knees to wash is degrading. Not enough butter for his bread without asking for more. Cell searches making a mess of his documents.
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SarksusATTACK AND DETHRONE GODRegistered Userregular
The Prison
"Looking at the internal environment I seriously doubt there's a worse penal facility in Norway, than the Basement of Ila prison, and I view being there as an additional punishment."
The Cell
"The solitary cell that I am in is, as I said, stripped for furniture and has white walls that I'm not allowed to decorate. This worn cell from the 60s/70s is in the infamous cellblock that's nicknamed 'The Basement', where the only view you have is a prison wall that, with its nine meter height, blocks out everything except for the tops of a few trees."
Correspondence
In his letter of complaint Breivik claims that only letters from "new-testament Christians and other people who don't like me" has gotten through censorship since the 8th of August. A short time before the central administration of the Correctional Services issued a memorandum to ensure that Breivik would not be able to control a criminal network from his cell.
Lack of daylight
"As you know the windows have a dark foil applied to them, which reduses the available sunlight with around 60 percent. As a result of this I'm forced to take vitamin supplements to prevent Vitamin D deficiencies among other things."
Being unable to control the lighting
"That the light- and TV- switch is outside the cell means that I have to call the prison officers through the intercom system for this (...) On several occasions when I was going to bed I've been forced to wait for up to 40 minutes before they've come to hand over my toothbrush and turn off the light.
The pen is bad
Breivik claims that the rubber pen he was issued doesn't work for him. Using this pen he can only write around 10-15 words a minute. IT is also not very ergonomic, and according to the mass murderer it makes his hand hurt after using it for only a short while. "If it'd been theoretically possible to develop rheumatism, then I'm sure this rubber pen would have done the job."
Lack of common courtesy among the prisoners
Breivik has four times complained that another prisoner in the solitary block at Ila has provoked him by increasing the volume of his stereo system. Breivik also complains about being scolded by the prison officers, as well as screaming from fellow prisoners. "I want peace and quiet. I want to be left alone."
No thermos-bottle for his coffee
The terrorist is not allowed a thermo-bottle in his cell, according to the letter this means that he's forced to drink cold coffee 80 percent of the time.
Collection of cardboard plates and plastic utensils
He describes the way the prison officers collect his cardboard plates and plastic utensils is a form of "low-intensity psychological terror", because he feels it requires him to hurry to finish eating and drinking.
Moisturizer problem
He reacts to not being allowed to have a container of moisturizer in his room, but instead he's issued a plastic cup filled with cream. This means that much of the cream will be ruined during the day.
Gets too little butter
The terrorist complains that at times he only gets enough butter for 2-3 of the 4 slices of bread he eats. "This creates unnecessary irritation because you ... either have to eat dry slices of bread or be made to have a bad conscience about asking for more."
Bad TV
The mass murderer is upset that the TV has a very poor image and an echo to the sound, because it's locked up in a security closet made from steel and Plexiglas. Furthermore he's upset that his radio will only get channel P1 and channel P3.
Clothing
"Since it is often quite cool in my living cell I usually wear a thick jacket / sweater at any given time (...) There are regularly problems when I ask for one of these garments. For some reason they often bring me a Lacoste sweater of the sort I use for special occasions. Despite the fact that I've pointed out several times that I don't want one of those, since they are quite valuable and should be spared a high degree of wear (...) I have therefore on several occasions wound up spending 1-2 days freezing until I manage to 'nag' my way into getting a prison officer to go into the storage area and fetch one of the correct jacket-sweaters."
Handcuffs
"To be handcuffed is offensive and creates a mental strain. National guidelines for SHS requires me to be handcuffed before I'm moved to other rooms / the exercise area and/or before the prison officers open the cell door. During the last 14 months I've been subjected to handcuffing on average of five times a day – a total of more than 2000 occasions." The murderer who killed 77 and maimed many other for life says that he has six times has suffered "friction cuts where the steel edge on the inside of the handcuffs has ripped the skin on my wrists in a very painful way." This has led him to develop a fear of handcuffs.
Strip searches
"The number of daily strip searches was reduced from January on, but even today it sometimes happens that I'm subjected to this twice a day. A strip search involves me being made to take off all my clothes, after which each garment is carefully examined." He describes in detail how such searches are conducted. "This is something I dread every day."
Feeling watched
"The two cameras and the peephole in the door leads to a constant feeling of tension and of being watched (...) On occasion I am subjected to one of the daily 30-40 door hatch checks at the precise moment that I'm using the toilet, something which leads to a particularly great psychological strain. At times this can be experienced as a mental shock, especially if the hatch is slammed a the same time."
Controls
"There is a hatch check every 30-60 minutes – 24 hours a day. AT night I occasionally wake up from having a flashlight shone into my face. It has also happened that they have woken me up if I've been sleeping without moving. It is known that they are not doing this for sadistic reasons, but to make sure that the prisoner hasn't committed suicide."
Cell searches
Require him to rearrange his documents as they are occasionally brought into disarray. Breivik is also upset that he has to make his bed again after these searches.
Being moved
In the letter Breivik expresses great frustration that he is apparently made to wait overlong to be moved to his training-cell, the study cell, or the outdoors area. He says that since 15 October he has stopped using the study cell. "The reason is that I feel the price I have to pay to use this offer is too high, as a daily struggle has to be fought to gain access to the cell for a full workday."
Denied art and a view
"The solitary cell in which I live is, as I said, stripped of furniture and with white walls that may not be decorated. One is therefore denied the inspiration and mental energy that art and a view can give you."
Disturbed by prison wide messages
Breivik asks to be exempt from receiving prison wide messages on the intercom, as "this is viewed as very irritating and at times an interruption."
Money
"The requirement for my daily 'work money' allowance being raised from $7.2 / £4.5 a day to $10.25 / £6.5 a day from 1 October onwards was that in addition to studying, I would also wash the three cells that I use. In Skien prison I was given a mop with handle. In Ila on the other hand the only thing I'm given is a cloth, despite for my verbal complaints about this. I am in other words forced to scrub all three cells on my knees, something I view as degrading.
oh the hu-manity
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TehSlothHit Or MissI Guess They Never Miss, HuhRegistered Userregular
Is that normal for a Norway prison or has the country succumbed to terror despite the PM's inspirational insistence otherwise?
Pretty normal, yeah.
You didn't actually believe our prisons were like holidays, right?
Not holidays, but less beholden to sadism and revenge than what we enjoy in the United States.
are you saying this is sadistic?
A lot of these measures are obviously rooted in sadism, yeah. They aren't pulling nails, I'm not suggesting he's being tortured, but some of these things are being done for the enjoyment of the prison staff and possibly the other criminals who are less immoral.
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21stCenturyCall me Pixel, or Pix for short![They/Them]Registered Userregular
@TehSpectre has also given birth to a beautiful baby girl dorf. Congrats, Spectre!
I think i'm getting better at managing dorfs, i don't feel like managing 44 dorfs is too much anymore. i haven't lost yet, but not losing seems pretty fun so far.
On one hand, I feel kinda bad providing the narcissist with attention.
On the other, his butter plight must be shared with the world.
The attention here is just hurting his image.
Not that he didn't come across as pathetic before but this
this takes the fucking cake.
He really should have gone in an asylum. He is clearly crazy and lacks understanding of what a prison is and why it's the consequence of his actions. Plus I still think putting him in prison reinforces his fantasy that he's a legitimate political prisoner and not an insane mass murderer.
Can someone explain to me why this Petraeus thing is so huge, and/or possibly overblown?
cia directors should ideally be people who can't be blackmailed. that's the proximate issue. if you have something to hide, don't be director of the cia.
besides that there seems to have been some dubious behavior
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SarksusATTACK AND DETHRONE GODRegistered Userregular
How bout we ask the people he has killed and their families about his "inhumane" treatment?
This is a common rebuttal but its always wrong, and born in emotion. It's not about empathy for the prisoner. It's about us avoiding the dark urges we feel. We should not promote sadism or revenge in ourselves. This shouldn't be controversial.
Is that normal for a Norway prison or has the country succumbed to terror despite the PM's inspirational insistence otherwise?
Pretty normal, yeah.
You didn't actually believe our prisons were like holidays, right?
Not holidays, but less beholden to sadism and revenge than what we enjoy in the United States.
are you saying this is sadistic?
A lot of these measures are obviously rooted in sadism, yeah. They aren't pulling nails, I'm not suggesting he's being tortured, but some of these things are being done for the enjoyment of the prison staff and possibly the other criminals who are less immoral.
They should just film him and make a reality show of it, but don't tell him about it because then he'd probably act up. Just clip it down to an hour a week or so of him just grumbling and sulking so everybody can watch it and be like, enjoy your dry bread jerkface.
Gotta tread the line between catharsis and sadism.
How bout we ask the people he has killed and their families about his "inhumane" treatment?
This is a common rebuttal but its always wrong, and born in emotion. It's not about empathy for the prisoner. It's about us avoiding the dark urges we feel. We should not promote sadism or revenge in ourselves. This shouldn't be controversial.
exactly none of the complaints seem self-evidently necessarily borne of casual sadism
adherence to evaluable procedure is an objective good in itself when it comes to bureaucracies, like a prison, which inherently have problems with transparency. If this procedure is inconvenient, tough.
Can someone explain to me why this Petraeus thing is so huge, and/or possibly overblown?
cia directors should ideally be people who can't be blackmailed. that's the proximate issue. if you have something to hide, don't be director of the cia.
besides that there seems to have been some dubious behavior
Oh I see, because the person who he had an affair with COULD have had/gained access to sensitive information, it's a potentially big deal.
saint2e on
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CindersWhose sails were black when it was windyRegistered Userregular
Can someone explain to me why this Petraeus thing is so huge, and/or possibly overblown?
cia directors should ideally be people who can't be blackmailed. that's the proximate issue. if you have something to hide, don't be director of the cia.
besides that there seems to have been some dubious behavior
On the other hand, closeted crossdressers are more than welcome to head the FBI.
Can someone explain to me why this Petraeus thing is so huge, and/or possibly overblown?
cia directors should ideally be people who can't be blackmailed. that's the proximate issue. if you have something to hide, don't be director of the cia.
besides that there seems to have been some dubious behavior
Oh I see, because the person who he had an affair with COULD have had/gained access to sensitive information, it's a potentially big deal.
Can someone explain to me why this Petraeus thing is so huge, and/or possibly overblown?
cia directors should ideally be people who can't be blackmailed. that's the proximate issue. if you have something to hide, don't be director of the cia.
besides that there seems to have been some dubious behavior
Oh I see, because the person who he had an affair with COULD have had/gained access to sensitive information, it's a potentially big deal.
Didn't she actually reveal some potentially sensitive information during a speech at a university?
Can someone explain to me why this Petraeus thing is so huge, and/or possibly overblown?
cia directors should ideally be people who can't be blackmailed. that's the proximate issue. if you have something to hide, don't be director of the cia.
besides that there seems to have been some dubious behavior
Oh I see, because the person who he had an affair with COULD have had/gained access to sensitive information, it's a potentially big deal.
there is some suggestion that she in fact did. but note that a third party could have tried to blackmail him over it, never mind the woman involved
Can someone explain to me why this Petraeus thing is so huge, and/or possibly overblown?
cia directors should ideally be people who can't be blackmailed. that's the proximate issue. if you have something to hide, don't be director of the cia.
besides that there seems to have been some dubious behavior
Oh I see, because the person who he had an affair with COULD have had/gained access to sensitive information, it's a potentially big deal.
Or anyone else who found out about the affair could have used it against him.
Can someone explain to me why this Petraeus thing is so huge, and/or possibly overblown?
cia directors should ideally be people who can't be blackmailed. that's the proximate issue. if you have something to hide, don't be director of the cia.
besides that there seems to have been some dubious behavior
Oh I see, because the person who he had an affair with COULD have had/gained access to sensitive information, it's a potentially big deal.
Didn't she actually reveal some potentially sensitive information during a speech at a university?
There's a conspiracy theory going around that the CIA annex on the embassy was actually a secret CIA prison, and she made comments about the real reason militants attacked the embassy was to try and free people from that prison.
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SarksusATTACK AND DETHRONE GODRegistered Userregular
How bout we ask the people he has killed and their families about his "inhumane" treatment?
This is a common rebuttal but its always wrong, and born in emotion. It's not about empathy for the prisoner. It's about us avoiding the dark urges we feel. We should not promote sadism or revenge in ourselves. This shouldn't be controversial.
exactly none of the complaints seem self-evidently necessarily borne of casual sadism
adherence to evaluable procedure is an objective good in itself when it comes to bureaucracies, like a prison, which inherently have problems with transparency. If this procedure is inconvenient, tough.
I don't think hiding behind procedure frees us from the consequences of falling prey to our self-destructive desires.
@spool32 did you vote for succession from the US in that Texas thing I'm hearing about?
hahahahah no.
I want Texas to take over America, not secede from it.
We'll show you lot how to run a legislature. You start by only letting them meet once every two years, and pay them like $8000 total.
Restricting democracy to the rich seems like a good idea.
All our representatives are hardworking average Americans with not-politics jobs that are totally legit and have nothing to do with lobbying efforts or crony capitalism.
How bout we ask the people he has killed and their families about his "inhumane" treatment?
This is a common rebuttal but its always wrong, and born in emotion. It's not about empathy for the prisoner. It's about us avoiding the dark urges we feel. We should not promote sadism or revenge in ourselves. This shouldn't be controversial.
exactly none of the complaints seem self-evidently necessarily borne of casual sadism
adherence to evaluable procedure is an objective good in itself when it comes to bureaucracies, like a prison, which inherently have problems with transparency. If this procedure is inconvenient, tough.
I don't think hiding behind procedure frees us from the consequences of falling prey to our self-destructive desires.
I think falling prey to self-destructive desires is only human, and prison procedure has to recognize it employs humans and has to restrict the tendency via procedural rigor, not invoke Hope and Goodness in Human Nature
Can someone explain to me why this Petraeus thing is so huge, and/or possibly overblown?
cia directors should ideally be people who can't be blackmailed. that's the proximate issue. if you have something to hide, don't be director of the cia.
besides that there seems to have been some dubious behavior
Oh I see, because the person who he had an affair with COULD have had/gained access to sensitive information, it's a potentially big deal.
Right. Background checks do a lot of looking into that kind of thing. When I was going for my clearance, if they found evidence that I was closeted, they'd deny my clearance (or at least confront me about it so I can tell them "No, just because Pal Joey is my favorite movie doesn't mean I'm gay"). What if a blackmailer found evidence I was gay and then told me he'd reveal it if I didn't give him info? An affair has the same issue. There are lots of similar checks, if your credit score is fucked you don't get a clearance (because it makes it easier for a bad guy to buy you).
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Tiger BurningDig if you will, the pictureRegistered User, SolidSaints Tuberegular
How bout we ask the people he has killed and their families about his "inhumane" treatment?
This is a common rebuttal but its always wrong, and born in emotion. It's not about empathy for the prisoner. It's about us avoiding the dark urges we feel. We should not promote sadism or revenge in ourselves. This shouldn't be controversial.
exactly none of the complaints seem self-evidently necessarily borne of casual sadism
adherence to evaluable procedure is an objective good in itself when it comes to bureaucracies, like a prison, which inherently have problems with transparency. If this procedure is inconvenient, tough.
I don't think hiding behind procedure frees us from the consequences of falling prey to our self-destructive desires.
I don't think the desire to punish transgressors of societal norms is self-destructive. I think it's probably pretty central to having societies at all.
Ain't no particular sign I'm more compatible with
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Tiger BurningDig if you will, the pictureRegistered User, SolidSaints Tuberegular
How about having such pisspoor medical care people go to mexico for medication
This is dumb and I have ground it into the dirt once before. When you live in a border town, "going to Mexico" is the same as "going down the street a couple of blocks".
Posts
having to get down on his knees to wash is degrading. Not enough butter for his bread without asking for more. Cell searches making a mess of his documents.
Not holidays, but less beholden to sadism and revenge than what we enjoy in the United States.
are you saying this is sadistic?
meatball sandwich
No, he's saying it's not sadistic
This is acceptable.
Then I realize I'm listening to music on it. New coat, new pocket.
oh the hu-manity
Damnit, now I really want a meatball sandwich and the cafe downstairs only does meatballs on wednesday!
twitch.tv/tehsloth
A lot of these measures are obviously rooted in sadism, yeah. They aren't pulling nails, I'm not suggesting he's being tortured, but some of these things are being done for the enjoyment of the prison staff and possibly the other criminals who are less immoral.
I think i'm getting better at managing dorfs, i don't feel like managing 44 dorfs is too much anymore. i haven't lost yet, but not losing seems pretty fun so far.
Check out my site, the Bismuth Heart | My Twitter
cia directors should ideally be people who can't be blackmailed. that's the proximate issue. if you have something to hide, don't be director of the cia.
besides that there seems to have been some dubious behavior
This is a common rebuttal but its always wrong, and born in emotion. It's not about empathy for the prisoner. It's about us avoiding the dark urges we feel. We should not promote sadism or revenge in ourselves. This shouldn't be controversial.
It's $10.25 a day
They should just film him and make a reality show of it, but don't tell him about it because then he'd probably act up. Just clip it down to an hour a week or so of him just grumbling and sulking so everybody can watch it and be like, enjoy your dry bread jerkface.
Gotta tread the line between catharsis and sadism.
twitch.tv/tehsloth
exactly none of the complaints seem self-evidently necessarily borne of casual sadism
adherence to evaluable procedure is an objective good in itself when it comes to bureaucracies, like a prison, which inherently have problems with transparency. If this procedure is inconvenient, tough.
Oh I see, because the person who he had an affair with COULD have had/gained access to sensitive information, it's a potentially big deal.
I doubt cleaning three cells is going to take over an hour.
On the other hand, closeted crossdressers are more than welcome to head the FBI.
That and Afghanistan is apparently one big orgy.
Didn't she actually reveal some potentially sensitive information during a speech at a university?
https://twitter.com/Hooraydiation
hahahahah no.
I want Texas to take over America, not secede from it.
We'll show you lot how to run a legislature. You start by only letting them meet once every two years, and pay them like $8000 total.
there is some suggestion that she in fact did. but note that a third party could have tried to blackmail him over it, never mind the woman involved
i have done this while physically holding my phone
Or anyone else who found out about the affair could have used it against him.
twitch.tv/tehsloth
Restricting democracy to the rich seems like a good idea.
There's a conspiracy theory going around that the CIA annex on the embassy was actually a secret CIA prison, and she made comments about the real reason militants attacked the embassy was to try and free people from that prison.
I don't think hiding behind procedure frees us from the consequences of falling prey to our self-destructive desires.
All our representatives are hardworking average Americans with not-politics jobs that are totally legit and have nothing to do with lobbying efforts or crony capitalism.
I think falling prey to self-destructive desires is only human, and prison procedure has to recognize it employs humans and has to restrict the tendency via procedural rigor, not invoke Hope and Goodness in Human Nature
Right. Background checks do a lot of looking into that kind of thing. When I was going for my clearance, if they found evidence that I was closeted, they'd deny my clearance (or at least confront me about it so I can tell them "No, just because Pal Joey is my favorite movie doesn't mean I'm gay"). What if a blackmailer found evidence I was gay and then told me he'd reveal it if I didn't give him info? An affair has the same issue. There are lots of similar checks, if your credit score is fucked you don't get a clearance (because it makes it easier for a bad guy to buy you).
I don't think the desire to punish transgressors of societal norms is self-destructive. I think it's probably pretty central to having societies at all.
?Como se dice "colonoscopy"?
This is dumb and I have ground it into the dirt once before. When you live in a border town, "going to Mexico" is the same as "going down the street a couple of blocks".