Anyone advocating for kicking Manchin, frustration understood, is advocating for McConnell to continue to be in charge of the senate past 2018 and 2020.
He already fucking is if Manchin is going to vote his agenda in for him.
No, he isn’t.
First, ACA repeal.
Second, what comes before the Senate is at least as important as how people vote on what does.
Manchin wasn’t the 50th vote on Kavanaugh.
No, he was the 51st, saving the VP the trouble of making this look like a highly-struggled-for attempt. Edit - And in case he was the 52nd vote, still, fuck Joe Manchin.
I mean Manchin's an ass but you can't practically get rid of him for six years unless he loses his seat in the next election. And if he loses his seat you're not likely to get another Democratic senator in west virginia for the foreseeable future. (and again it'd literally take six years to get a chance for another one in the future.)
Assuming Manchin wins and runs again in six years, the electorate isn't gonna care. He might get primaried out but it won't be specifically over this.
The person I'm actually disappointed in is Susan Collins. She seems like an actual person and it's disappointing to see her take the easy way out.
I'm not angry, particularly, at either of them. I'm just disappointed, and sad. Now McConnell, Kavanaugh, Grassley, Graham, Trump? Fucking pissssssed. But for most of them that's not exactly a new feeling.
Anyone advocating for kicking Manchin, frustration understood, is advocating for McConnell to continue to be in charge of the senate past 2018 and 2020.
He already fucking is if Manchin is going to vote his agenda in for him.
No, he isn’t.
First, ACA repeal.
Second, what comes before the Senate is at least as important as how people vote on what does.
Manchin wasn’t the 50th vote on Kavanaugh.
Yeah he wasn't needed to vote for him and did it anyway because he thinks a rapist anti abortionist is good for the scotus. Fuck Joe Manchin.
Or he's doing it because he thinks it's good for his re-election and he's more interested in the politics than anything and still Fuck Joe Manchin.
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HenroidMexican kicked from Immigration ThreadCentrism is Racism :3Registered Userregular
Fucking Doug Jones voted against kavanaugh. Manchin did not have an electoral choice. He had a moral one.
That shit is wild. When Jones declared himself voting against Kavanaugh I thought, "okay the stars aligned and the party is in unison." Fuck me I guess.
I mean Manchin's an ass but you can't practically get rid of him for six years unless he loses his seat in the next election. And if he loses his seat you're not likely to get another Democratic senator in west virginia for the foreseeable future. (and again it'd literally take six years to get a chance for another one in the future.)
Assuming Manchin wins and runs again in six years, the electorate isn't gonna care. He might get primaried out but it won't be specifically over this.
The person I'm actually disappointed in is Susan Collins. She seems like an actual person and it's disappointing to see her take the easy way out.
I'm not angry, particularly, at either of them. I'm just disappointed, and sad. Now McConnell, Kavanaugh, Grassley, Graham, Trump? Fucking pissssssed. But for most of them that's not exactly a new feeling.
I'm kinda the opposite now. I can't be pissed at monsters for being monsters. But for, as you put it, "an actual person" to fail to prevent them from doing monstrous things when that power is in their hands? Yeah, them I can be pissed at.
Move on from 2020 speculation. Manchin is not running for office right now.
We're also moving on from "the DNC should do XYZ with their money". If you want to comment on how money is being spent on CURRENT elections, go to the elections thread.
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No-QuarterNothing To FearBut Fear ItselfRegistered Userregular
Despite Kavanaugh's personal shittiness, his SCOTUS decisions wouldn't be any different than anyone else on that short list.
We'd still be freaking out about VRA, Roe, and marriage regardless of who it was.
Anyone advocating for kicking Manchin, frustration understood, is advocating for McConnell to continue to be in charge of the senate past 2018 and 2020.
He already fucking is if Manchin is going to vote his agenda in for him.
No, he isn’t.
First, ACA repeal.
Second, what comes before the Senate is at least as important as how people vote on what does.
Manchin wasn’t the 50th vote on Kavanaugh.
Yeah he wasn't needed to vote for him and did it anyway because he thinks a rapist anti abortionist is good for the scotus. Fuck Joe Manchin.
Or he's doing it because he thinks it's good for his re-election and he's more interested in the politics than anything and still Fuck Joe Manchin.
He's up 10 in his election. He legit thinks Kavanaugh is a good fit for SCOTUS. And his constituents will feel the fall out from his bad politicing like they already have with his trump support.
I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.
Fucking Doug Jones voted against kavanaugh. Manchin did not have an electoral choice. He had a moral one.
That shit is wild. When Jones declared himself voting against Kavanaugh I thought, "okay the stars aligned and the party is in unison." Fuck me I guess.
I thought Jones was way more likely to stand up for basic decency than Manchin or Heitkamp.
Good on her though, btw. Given how polling is going there and the Trumpiness of the state, that's a rough vote to make.
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
Fucking Doug Jones voted against kavanaugh. Manchin did not have an electoral choice. He had a moral one.
That shit is wild. When Jones declared himself voting against Kavanaugh I thought, "okay the stars aligned and the party is in unison." Fuck me I guess.
Doug Jones ain't planning on winning another election. He's letting it rip.
Manchin plans on winning another election. This are pretty simple political games that he has been playing for decades. Manchin is going to flip from the party 1 nano second after the vote is secured against the democrats every time because he is from west virginia.
West Virginia, home of a +19 R PVI. Massachusetts it ain't.
Guys no you see Manchin just keeps voting with the GOP on major issues cause he secretly is waiting for the moment he can trumphantly push a Democratic senator into leadership, not because he’s basically a slightly liberal republican who repeatedly goes to bat for the GOP
Move on from 2020 speculation. Manchin is not running for office right now.
We're also moving on from "the DNC should do XYZ with their money". If you want to comment on how money is being spent on CURRENT elections, go to the elections thread.
Can we at least continue to specifically discuss the fallout of his vote for Kavanaugh as the news reports it, as well as sign all our posts "fuck Joe Manchin"?
Guys no you see Manchin just keeps voting with the GOP on major issues cause he secretly is waiting for the moment he can trumphantly push a Democratic senator into leadership, not because he’s basically a slightly liberal republican who repeatedly goes to bat for the GOP
Manchin isn’t even that. He’s just an artifact of the fact that the GOP absorbtion of the Southern Democrats is taking longer in West Virginia.
Move on from 2020 speculation. Manchin is not running for office right now.
We're also moving on from "the DNC should do XYZ with their money". If you want to comment on how money is being spent on CURRENT elections, go to the elections thread.
Can we at least continue to specifically discuss the fallout of his vote for Kavanaugh as the news reports it, as well as sign all our posts "fuck Joe Manchin"?
Guys no you see Manchin just keeps voting with the GOP on major issues cause he secretly is waiting for the moment he can trumphantly push a Democratic senator into leadership, not because he’s basically a slightly liberal republican who repeatedly goes to bat for the GOP
So there's that. At least this whole thing is over.
Even with the captions I'm having trouble understanding his answers with all the chanting. Not that those people are wrong to chant at him. He said something about not seeing this as a 50/50 vote situation he was stepping into, or something, and I'm just too mad at him to figure he's giving any sort of reasonable response.
I really hope we don't have to be subjected to some insultingly smug speech with zero self-awareness from Kavanaugh.
I don't think I could handle it.
Trump/huckabee sanders I'm sure has one qued up ready to go. He'll probably fire another shot off at ford as well because when you've already denigrated a sexual assault victim why not kick her again, it makes his numbers go up.
I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.
valhalla13013 Dark Shield Perceives the GodsRegistered Userregular
And again I say, what does it matter if Manchin is a Democrat? Yeah, someone here or in another thread said he votes with Dems 70% of the time, but if on every single important vote, he votes with Republicans, then him being a Democrat is a farce.
A lifetime Supreme Court position guides politics and events for decades. There is no way we'll get enough seats in the Senate to impeach Kavanaugh, much less Trump, so he is here to stay.
This feels right, which is truly an indictment of the american right atm.
"Republicans saved supreme court nominee by framing his sexual assault as ammo in a culture war" did manage to make me slightly more depressed than I was, which I didn't think was going to be possible really.
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minor incidentexpert in a dying fieldnjRegistered Userregular
Doug Jones is free to be left because Doug Jones knows he has no chance of ever being re-elected.
Incumbency is pretty powerful. I think he's mostly just a guy who believes in fairness and decency.
He also probably recognizes that he actually owes a lot to the party for getting him elected in the first place.
You win against some rapists, you lose against some rapists.
I guess.
I don't know. This is god damn absurd.
Ah, it stinks, it sucks, it's anthropologically unjust
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AstaerethIn the belly of the beastRegistered Userregular
Manchin’s vote on this depresses Democrats and voters everywhere in every state
We can either continue to pay that “both sides are the same, at least one Dem voted for the rapist” cost that makes everyone everywhere feel like politics doesn’t matter and voting is useless
Or we could primary his ass and have a chance at winning that seat with a Democrat who votes a little more often with us
At this point why not? I’ve defended keeping Manchin but this vote is beyond the fucking pale, for him and every other yes
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minor incidentexpert in a dying fieldnjRegistered Userregular
It's definitely indefensible, as far as I'm concerned.
Ah, it stinks, it sucks, it's anthropologically unjust
The party with more members gets the majority which gives you power like what McConnell is using to destroy this country. As well as stuff like who gets chairs and stuff on committees
It’s useful to have him even if he isn’t useful in votes
This feels right, which is truly an indictment of the american right atm.
"Republicans saved supreme court nominee by framing his sexual assault as ammo in a culture war" did manage to make me slightly more depressed than I was, which I didn't think was going to be possible really.
Yeah I'd believe this
'This isn't about SCOTUS, this is about being able to tell women they aren't people' is something I would definitely believe from the American right.
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minor incidentexpert in a dying fieldnjRegistered Userregular
The party with more members gets the majority which gives you power like what McConnell is using to destroy this country. As well as stuff like who gets chairs and stuff on committees
It’s useful to have him even if he isn’t useful in votes
Useful in some sense, sure. But it feels like a Faustian bargain at times like this.
Ah, it stinks, it sucks, it's anthropologically unjust
Posts
Assuming Manchin wins and runs again in six years, the electorate isn't gonna care. He might get primaried out but it won't be specifically over this.
The person I'm actually disappointed in is Susan Collins. She seems like an actual person and it's disappointing to see her take the easy way out.
I'm not angry, particularly, at either of them. I'm just disappointed, and sad. Now McConnell, Kavanaugh, Grassley, Graham, Trump? Fucking pissssssed. But for most of them that's not exactly a new feeling.
Or he's doing it because he thinks it's good for his re-election and he's more interested in the politics than anything and still Fuck Joe Manchin.
That he was one of the votes for him matters more than where his landed in the sequence of votes.
I'm kinda the opposite now. I can't be pissed at monsters for being monsters. But for, as you put it, "an actual person" to fail to prevent them from doing monstrous things when that power is in their hands? Yeah, them I can be pissed at.
We're also moving on from "the DNC should do XYZ with their money". If you want to comment on how money is being spent on CURRENT elections, go to the elections thread.
We'd still be freaking out about VRA, Roe, and marriage regardless of who it was.
He's up 10 in his election. He legit thinks Kavanaugh is a good fit for SCOTUS. And his constituents will feel the fall out from his bad politicing like they already have with his trump support.
pleasepaypreacher.net
I thought Jones was way more likely to stand up for basic decency than Manchin or Heitkamp.
Good on her though, btw. Given how polling is going there and the Trumpiness of the state, that's a rough vote to make.
Doug Jones ain't planning on winning another election. He's letting it rip.
Manchin plans on winning another election. This are pretty simple political games that he has been playing for decades. Manchin is going to flip from the party 1 nano second after the vote is secured against the democrats every time because he is from west virginia.
West Virginia, home of a +19 R PVI. Massachusetts it ain't.
So there's that. At least this whole thing is over.
At least over half the senate wouldn't be all-in on a rapist who lied to their faces.
"What goes around comes around."
Well, now we know for sure the Republican Party is the Evil Party. That’s nice, I suppose.
Fuck Joe Manchin.
Manchin isn’t even that. He’s just an artifact of the fact that the GOP absorbtion of the Southern Democrats is taking longer in West Virginia.
You could literally put it in your sig.
I mean
I’m pretty sure we’ve known they were the evil party ever since the Dixiecrats left the Dems over the Civil Rights Act and the GOP said “Come on in!”
It’s both.
Incumbency is pretty powerful. I think he's mostly just a guy who believes in fairness and decency.
I'm not a fan of term limits because if you turn over people too fast, you'll run out of people who want the job and care about it passionately.
That said, putting getting re-elected above the betterment of your constituents is a sign it is time for you to go.
The trick is getting any of them at all to realize it.
He also probably recognizes that he actually owes a lot to the party for getting him elected in the first place.
I don't think I could handle it.
They delight in it.
Have you never heard one of them sneer about “virtue signaling”? They believe no-one is honestly good, only faking it to impress people.
Trump/huckabee sanders I'm sure has one qued up ready to go. He'll probably fire another shot off at ford as well because when you've already denigrated a sexual assault victim why not kick her again, it makes his numbers go up.
pleasepaypreacher.net
A lifetime Supreme Court position guides politics and events for decades. There is no way we'll get enough seats in the Senate to impeach Kavanaugh, much less Trump, so he is here to stay.
This feels right, which is truly an indictment of the american right atm.
"Republicans saved supreme court nominee by framing his sexual assault as ammo in a culture war" did manage to make me slightly more depressed than I was, which I didn't think was going to be possible really.
You win against some rapists, you lose against some rapists.
I guess.
I don't know. This is god damn absurd.
We can either continue to pay that “both sides are the same, at least one Dem voted for the rapist” cost that makes everyone everywhere feel like politics doesn’t matter and voting is useless
Or we could primary his ass and have a chance at winning that seat with a Democrat who votes a little more often with us
At this point why not? I’ve defended keeping Manchin but this vote is beyond the fucking pale, for him and every other yes
It’s useful to have him even if he isn’t useful in votes
Yeah I'd believe this
'This isn't about SCOTUS, this is about being able to tell women they aren't people' is something I would definitely believe from the American right.
Useful in some sense, sure. But it feels like a Faustian bargain at times like this.