If you purchased the power armor edition, and submit a ticket to bethesda before January 31st, they will send you a canvas bag once they get them made. I think that's good for them to make amends like that, but I'd love to have access to the number of tickets submitted vs the number of people who bought the collector's edition. Anyone who claims to feel anything other than a bit of annoyance over the nylon bag is a liar, IMO. Nobody gives a shit about the bag, and I think the majority of those "outraged" over it are just Reddit lemmings trying to fit in like sad little turds.
The bag switch was a bit of a dick move, and the PR response was just the worst, so it's good they're making amends. The helmet was the thing everyone wanted, and that turned out fine apparently.
I agree! False advertising rules! /s
Honestly, what is the thought process that leads to the conclusion "I should defend this multi-million dollar company for its false advertisement, and their stated intention of not doing anything about it." ?
If you purchased the power armor edition, and submit a ticket to bethesda before January 31st, they will send you a canvas bag once they get them made. I think that's good for them to make amends like that, but I'd love to have access to the number of tickets submitted vs the number of people who bought the collector's edition. Anyone who claims to feel anything other than a bit of annoyance over the nylon bag is a liar, IMO. Nobody gives a shit about the bag, and I think the majority of those "outraged" over it are just Reddit lemmings trying to fit in like sad little turds.
The bag switch was a bit of a dick move, and the PR response was just the worst, so it's good they're making amends. The helmet was the thing everyone wanted, and that turned out fine apparently.
I agree! False advertising rules! /s
Honestly, what is the thought process that leads to the conclusion "I should defend this multi-million dollar company for its false advertisement, and their stated intention of not doing anything about it." ?
You mean, in today's marketplace?
The whole thing was a mistake, and it is good that they are making it right. But, we also are fans of a medium that is suffering from the effects of having a reactionary, abusive fanbase that can and will destroy a company whose products we have loved for decades based on over-the-top, manipulative campaigns from Youtube and Internet commentators who know that rage and endless attacks are a way to build their audience. People are defending Bethesda (and Bioware) not because they agree with the companies' decisions all the time, but because they don't want these mistakes to be turned into the type of witch hunts that destroy careers, end companies, and make the world a poorer place in exchange for some Youtube celebrity getting more hits.
I’m oneshotting those ghouls with All Rise (Super Sledge) most of the time, with no melee perk cards yet.
The melee and gun durability perk cards should be up to rank 3 each, not 5 as it is right now.
I took some sneak perk cards and the one that counts running as sneaking... They dont seem to work right.
I thought the running sneaking meant that moving at normal speed while sneaking doesn't affect it adversely anymore, rather than having to walk(capslock on PC) in order to get maximum stealth.
Its more that maxed out sneak in F76 seems terrible even with -75% chance to be detected and the walk/run stealth perk, I cant even sneak up on ghouls, to be frank I’m not convinced that those perks does anything, maxed out stealth in F76 feels like base level stealth in F4.
Guess I’ll have to spend 8 levels to get rid of this mess.
It might be, but max stealth in Fallout 4 was honestly pretty ridiculous. Having super mutants just about bumping into you while you're out of cover and not seeing you was hilariously broken.
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FairchildRabbit used short words that were easy to understand, like "Hello Pooh, how about Lunch ?"Registered Userregular
If you purchased the power armor edition, and submit a ticket to bethesda before January 31st, they will send you a canvas bag once they get them made. I think that's good for them to make amends like that, but I'd love to have access to the number of tickets submitted vs the number of people who bought the collector's edition. Anyone who claims to feel anything other than a bit of annoyance over the nylon bag is a liar, IMO. Nobody gives a shit about the bag, and I think the majority of those "outraged" over it are just Reddit lemmings trying to fit in like sad little turds.
The bag switch was a bit of a dick move, and the PR response was just the worst, so it's good they're making amends. The helmet was the thing everyone wanted, and that turned out fine apparently.
I agree! False advertising rules! /s
Honestly, what is the thought process that leads to the conclusion "I should defend this multi-million dollar company for its false advertisement, and their stated intention of not doing anything about it." ?
You mean, in today's marketplace?
The whole thing was a mistake, and it is good that they are making it right. But, we also are fans of a medium that is suffering from the effects of having a reactionary, abusive fanbase that can and will destroy a company whose products we have loved for decades based on over-the-top, manipulative campaigns from Youtube and Internet commentators who know that rage and endless attacks are a way to build their audience. People are defending Bethesda (and Bioware) not because they agree with the companies' decisions all the time, but because they don't want these mistakes to be turned into the type of witch hunts that destroy careers, end companies, and make the world a poorer place in exchange for some Youtube celebrity getting more hits.
He literally calls "the majority of those outraged (over the bag)" "sad little turds", and says that "nobody gives a shit about the bag".
No, they shouldn't be insulted or witch hunted. But holding them accountable is not only reasonable but the right thing to do.
If you purchased the power armor edition, and submit a ticket to bethesda before January 31st, they will send you a canvas bag once they get them made. I think that's good for them to make amends like that, but I'd love to have access to the number of tickets submitted vs the number of people who bought the collector's edition. Anyone who claims to feel anything other than a bit of annoyance over the nylon bag is a liar, IMO. Nobody gives a shit about the bag, and I think the majority of those "outraged" over it are just Reddit lemmings trying to fit in like sad little turds.
The bag switch was a bit of a dick move, and the PR response was just the worst, so it's good they're making amends. The helmet was the thing everyone wanted, and that turned out fine apparently.
I agree! False advertising rules! /s
Honestly, what is the thought process that leads to the conclusion "I should defend this multi-million dollar company for its false advertisement, and their stated intention of not doing anything about it." ?
You mean, in today's marketplace?
The whole thing was a mistake, and it is good that they are making it right. But, we also are fans of a medium that is suffering from the effects of having a reactionary, abusive fanbase that can and will destroy a company whose products we have loved for decades based on over-the-top, manipulative campaigns from Youtube and Internet commentators who know that rage and endless attacks are a way to build their audience. People are defending Bethesda (and Bioware) not because they agree with the companies' decisions all the time, but because they don't want these mistakes to be turned into the type of witch hunts that destroy careers, end companies, and make the world a poorer place in exchange for some Youtube celebrity getting more hits.
He literally calls "the majority of those outraged (over the bag)" "sad little turds", and says that "nobody gives a shit about the bag".
No, they shouldn't be insulted or witch hunted. But holding them accountable is not only reasonable but the right thing to do.
It's a shitty PR response, and Bethesda needs to get its act together on multiple fronts before they do serious and irreparable harm to the company. No one here is denying that.
But I can also sympathize, because I know exactly who the company rep is raging about and why. Bethesda's the current target of the Internet Hate Squad, and it takes a calm head and well-considered corporate guidelines to operate as a PR person under those pressures. As someone who has worked in that industry, the gaming space really needs to stop hiring people from their communities and start investing in professionals who can learn the product and follow best practices like "Don't rage the fuck out under the company masthead, because it does not matter whether you are right or not."
If you purchased the power armor edition, and submit a ticket to bethesda before January 31st, they will send you a canvas bag once they get them made. I think that's good for them to make amends like that, but I'd love to have access to the number of tickets submitted vs the number of people who bought the collector's edition. Anyone who claims to feel anything other than a bit of annoyance over the nylon bag is a liar, IMO. Nobody gives a shit about the bag, and I think the majority of those "outraged" over it are just Reddit lemmings trying to fit in like sad little turds.
The bag switch was a bit of a dick move, and the PR response was just the worst, so it's good they're making amends. The helmet was the thing everyone wanted, and that turned out fine apparently.
I agree! False advertising rules! /s
Honestly, what is the thought process that leads to the conclusion "I should defend this multi-million dollar company for its false advertisement, and their stated intention of not doing anything about it." ?
Did you only read the part you bolded and ignore anything else I said? I'm not defending anyone, certainly not Bethesda. I agree they messed up, and I also stated their response was awful. Nobody in their right mind would be so "outraged" that the bag is nylon instead of canvas. It's all fucking bullshit to feed the hivemind "Fallout 76 is the worst game ever" meme.
Nobody saw the collector's edition and went "Oh hell yeah, a canvas bag!". No, everyone wanted that helmet. But then the game released, and it isnt the greatest thing ever so all the little sad reddit turds got together to circle-jerk and farm useless internet points.
Maybe I shouldn't use words like "nobody" and "everyone" since it's possible someone out there legitimately wanted that bag, and I'm glad they'll get the chance to get the item that was advertised.
Everyone has a price. Throw enough gold around and someone will risk disintegration.
I'm all for holding companies responsible, but I'm also for intense (in my case: maybe even obsessive) self-reflection and analysis. We are angry at Bethesda, but why are we actually angry? If someone doesn't hold the door for me, am I upset because now I have to perform some extra work that I didn't need to (opening a door), or am I upset because they saw me coming, looked me in the eye, and closed the door in my face, thus wordlessly telling me that I am not worth their time, that I am such a nothing to them that they don't need to acknowledge my basic humanity? Even if my hands are full and opening a door is awkward, I think that second thing is what I'm actually upset about!
I haven't purchased the Collector's Edition of Fallout 76 (haven't purchased any version of it, in fact), so my feelings here are super-hypothetical, and should be taken with a fistful of salt, but: I've looked at the image of the Collector's Edition thing many times because I'm a sucker for excessive, overproduces, unreasonably-expensive Collector's Editions with all sorts of unnecessary tchotchkes, and yet I didn't even register that there was a bag in the package until Canvasgate started. I obviously can't speak for everyone's motivations, but I think it's pretty safe to say that the Power Armor helmet was the big-ticket item in the Collector's Edition, and that most of the people buying it were buying it primarily for that. For these people, all the other stuff was incidental.
I agree with Skull2185, in that I think most people posting angrily about Canvasgate aren't actually upset that they didn't get the right kind of bag, because (I think) they never really cared about the bag. I think that what they are actually upset about - what I am annoyed about, even, despite not having a Collector's Edition - is the curt customer service response, the "Yeah, we gave you the wrong thing and we're not gonna fix it". In fact, I'm most upset by the "We don't plan to do anything about it" phrase, and not the "we gave you a cheaper product" part of it. As an entitled American living in a capitalist 2018, I am not accustomed to being treated like this.
I disagree with Skull2185, in that I'm not going to call names all the people making angry posts/screamy YouTube videos/scathing Tweets, nor do I think they are liars as such. That being said, I am going to take their posts with a dramatic eye-roll. Some of the folks are truly upset, I believe that, but I also think that they are not voicing what they are genuinely upset about. Some of the folks I don't think are genuinely upset at all; I think that they are gripped by a righteous fervor, or by a desire to belong to a group, and that's their main motivation. I'm not gonna bash them for it, because I'd be lying if I said I haven't been in those shoes. It's just human nature. But, precisely because I've felt those feelings and experienced those experiences, I feel safe saying that sometimes people voice a greater degree of displeasure than they actually feel. Sometimes, they don't even realize that they're doing it.
But then the game released, and it isnt the greatest thing ever so all the little sad reddit turds got together to circle-jerk and farm useless internet points.
Regardless of the validity of your arguments, statements like this serve only to anger the people you are trying (?) to convince, and inflame rather than inform. This rhetoric and hyperbole is actively detrimental to your cause.
Maybe I shouldn't use words like "nobody" and "everyone" since it's possible someone out there legitimately wanted that bag, and I'm glad they'll get the chance to get the item that was advertised.
Maybe you also shouldn’t use words like “little sad reddit turds” and “circle-jerk” if you want people to take you seriously.
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AxenMy avatar is Excalibur.Yes, the sword.Registered Userregular
What they did was literally illegal and the only reason they've decided to go ahead with giving people actual canvas bags is because they are totally open to pretty cut and dry lawsuits.
I think appeasing the fans is just a happy coincidence here.
A Capellan's favorite sheath for any blade is your back.
What they did was literally illegal and the only reason they've decided to go ahead with giving people actual canvas bags is because they are totally open to pretty cut and dry lawsuits.
I think appeasing the fans is just a happy coincidence here.
Yeah, I don't really care about the corporations' feelings here.
People deserve to get the bags they were promised/advertised and I don't care how nice/polite they were about asking for it once somebody tries to pull one over on you to save a buck.
Somewhere in Maryland, a purchasing department manager is looking for a new job this week...
nah, just reassigned to head of QA
Don’t make me rant about this again.
QA is hard.
In better news, it looks like the refund/return madness with my copy of ‘76 has ended, and I now somehow have two copies of the game *and* most of my money. Going to call that a win.
Somewhere in Maryland, a purchasing department manager is looking for a new job this week...
nah, just reassigned to head of QA
Don’t make me rant about this again.
QA is hard.
In better news, it looks like the refund/return madness with my copy of ‘76 has ended, and I now somehow have two copies of the game *and* most of my money. Going to call that a win.
Four day weekend coming, going to get back on it.
And while I've worked for several companies where QA was nominally in charge of deciding to release, in practice that is never the case.
Somewhere in Maryland, a purchasing department manager is looking for a new job this week...
nah, just reassigned to head of QA
Don’t make me rant about this again.
QA is hard.
In better news, it looks like the refund/return madness with my copy of ‘76 has ended, and I now somehow have two copies of the game *and* most of my money. Going to call that a win.
Four day weekend coming, going to get back on it.
And while I've worked for several companies where QA was nominally in charge of deciding to release, in practice that is never the case.
QA may be hard, but not realizing your stats are fucked when you log in and random quests are reset to a new one every time you log on isn't hard, it's someone being incompetent. Either QA or the people in charge of the live game.
The beta period was ostensibly also for catching things that may have been missed in internal QA, or taking balance feedback and the like. While I didn't partake in the beta, a few co-workers did and they've told me that things which were brought up by players during beta were either not heard or willfully ignored by Bethesda.
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Golden YakBurnished BovineThe sunny beaches of CanadaRegistered Userregular
edited December 2018
Hey, found this fun article about the creatures of F76. Thought people might like to read it. Whatever faults the game may have, it seems like it has a cool setting and some really nice creature design.
Hey, found this fun article about the creatures of F76. Thought people might like to read it. Whatever faults the game may have, it seems like it has a cool setting and some really nice creature design.
If you're suddenly over budget after having your base vanish check your stored items amount. I ended up with dozens of extra purifiers and generators for some reason I had to scrap.
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MortiousThe Nightmare BeginsMove to New ZealandRegistered Userregular
QA may be hard, but not realizing your stats are fucked when you log in and random quests are reset to a new one every time you log on isn't hard, it's someone being incompetent. Either QA or the people in charge of the live game.
I mean, the assumption here is that QA didn't find the bugs, and unless you have access to their defect tracking system I don't see how you could say that with any certainty.
Why did Bethesda decide to nerf workshops? I already thought they were pretty worthless late game and now they just slowly generate ore. Who wants ore?
It also looks like they stealth nerfed a bunch of things (melee damage, plans dropping from events, server hopping, and character's over 50). I don't like these nerfs, they can balance the game as they see fit but they could at least put them in the patch notes.
Edit: I don't know if the stealth nerfs are actually nerfs or are bugs. They added the workshop nerf to the patch notes so it is real.
Why did Bethesda decide to nerf workshops? I already thought they were pretty worthless late game and now they just slowly generate ore. Who wants ore?
It also looks like they stealth nerfed a bunch of things (melee damage, plans dropping from events, server hopping, and character's over 50). I don't like these nerfs, they can balance the game as they see fit but they could at least put them in the patch notes.
Melee damage changed? I didn't notice anything different with my melee character, and my damage numbers on my weapons were the same.
Yeah the only stealth nerfs that seem persistent that I have noticed is that fusion cores are draining quicker. The other ones might be bugs and not nerfs the melee one seemed to fix itself after I fixed the weight glitch thing by taking off all my armor and relogging.
Edit: I take back what I said about stealth nerfs. I think the patch notes might be accurate but there are just new bugs that seem like nerfs. Its letting me complete the BoS Forbidden Knowledge quest get the rewards and then if I relog it puts the technical data back in my inventory and I can turn it in again. So right now if I wanted I can farm infinite xp and caps. That is silly so I'm not going to keep doing it but pretty funny.
Why did Bethesda decide to nerf workshops? I already thought they were pretty worthless late game and now they just slowly generate ore. Who wants ore?
It also looks like they stealth nerfed a bunch of things (melee damage, plans dropping from events, server hopping, and character's over 50). I don't like these nerfs, they can balance the game as they see fit but they could at least put them in the patch notes.
Melee damage changed? I didn't notice anything different with my melee character, and my damage numbers on my weapons were the same.
Yeah, my axe is still grognaking things in half, and I did an even today and got a plan for a fusion generator.
I'm not saying they found it or not, because that doesn't matter. They fucked up is the problem.
I'm looking at my own bug tracker right now, and on a project of less systemic complexity, and with a QA team which I would imagine is far, far smaller than Bethesda's, we've got somewhere in the region of 200 open defects. These are things people know about and care about, but due to business priorities, resourcing and what have you, haven't been got around to yet.
If i had to hazard a guess, the Fallout 76 tracker will be large, prioritised daily (or more) and have as many people as they can working on it, given the PR impacts. And their defect count will, I suspect, be an order of magnitude higher than mine.
I guess I'd suggest a) it is unlikely that the QA involved were incompetent.
b) it is more than likely that all the issues everyone (including me!) are annoyed about are in their JIRA-equivalent somewhere
c) those issues are probably just not as much of a priority as all the other bugs we haven't seen, or all the other day to day dev tasks getting done, or any of the new features we're all wanting.
And d) that doesn't mean that the business/project team screwed up either. They get paid to make the calls on the priorities, and while we may be sitting at the far end of the process, looking at what they chose to leave in given the time and resource available, and wondering why, I guarantee you nobody wants to ship sub-par product.
Now this isn't to say that I'm thrilled with the state of things on '76. But looking at the state of the game and suggesting it's because QA screwed the pooch, or that whoever's running their team could be equivalent to whoever masterminded canvasgate, or that the project team in charge of the game made the wrong priority calls...doesn't feel right to me. We don't know what calls the folks on the firing line are having to make, or live with.
Full disclosure: I haven't had many issues with the game either, so my anger/frustration level isn't that high. But if you're annoyed, I'd suggest looking upstream, at the C-level, where the decision to release the game at <time x> to meet revenues for <quarter-y> will have come from. Everyone else will have been firefighting since release day, and I suspect deserve sympathy far more than "You done fucked up"
cptruggedI think it has something to do with free will.Registered Userregular
So had a real taste of how lame PvP is in this game last night.
So a level 150+ fella comes to take over my workshop. By the time I got there It had already gotten all the way down so that I couldn't repair all. And I fast traveled as soon as I saw the message. Anways, I'm level 45 and he kills me. Doesn't even put on his power armor. I decide to at least give a go and come back in. This time I get the drop on him with a crit sledge and he goes down. I figured the 170 caps was enough so I decide to just leave and give up the workshop.
Fast travel to my camp. The guy decides to follow me. He shows up and starts shooting me. I figure nah, I'll fight around a workshop to try and defend, but not doing this mess. With the damage reduction, he can't actually hurt me so I just ignore him. He then proceeds to destroy everything in my base. Racking up a 450+ caps wanted amount. I decide to just follow the guy around. Eventually some high level guys show up to take those caps and I get my hit in and get caps and call it even. The comedy is that camp destruction didn't mean anything. I moved my camp and all my base was completely restored with no repair costs. So in the end that guys 450 cap loss was for nothing.
Then I had a situation where someone just continuously died over and over just to destroy all the infrastructure created at a workstation. Eventually killing them netted 0 caps cause they just didn't care.
It really made me realize that the only downside to being a tool and griefing is the caps. And if you don't really care about them, you can really mess with people for no real downside.
QA may be hard, but not realizing your stats are fucked when you log in and random quests are reset to a new one every time you log on isn't hard, it's someone being incompetent. Either QA or the people in charge of the live game.
I mean, the assumption here is that QA didn't find the bugs, and unless you have access to their defect tracking system I don't see how you could say that with any certainty.
I'm not saying they found it or not, because that doesn't matter. They fucked up is the problem.
Sorry, I'm not sure I follow this. If the QA found the bugs, then they did their job and did not fuck up. If QA did not find the bugs, then they didn't do their job, and so fucked up. So, it sounds like whether or not they found the bugs does matter. Unless the "they" in the first sentence and the "they" in the second sentence refers to different groups of people?
I finally gave up and uninstalled this last night. What finally broke me is that i need to get to the golf course and do two quests - grab an item, and read some holotapes.
Since getting the quests, a video came out on youtube showing how to farm xp at the golf course, at any level
So for the last week, ive been logging in several times a day, to find the clubhouse full of mobs 30 or 40 levels higher than me, as high level characters just camp there, logging in an out over and over.
So I'm giving up - unless they come out with an offline mode, which i assume is against their vision...
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cptruggedI think it has something to do with free will.Registered Userregular
Oh is that why there was a constant crowd around Whitesprings? I thought it was folks just building their camps all in the same place.
I finally gave up and uninstalled this last night. What finally broke me is that i need to get to the golf course and do two quests - grab an item, and read some holotapes.
Since getting the quests, a video came out on youtube showing how to farm xp at the golf course, at any level
So for the last week, ive been logging in several times a day, to find the clubhouse full of mobs 30 or 40 levels higher than me, as high level characters just camp there, logging in an out over and over.
So I'm giving up - unless they come out with an offline mode, which i assume is against their vision...
I had some luck stealthing through the madness, but the respawn system makes that very difficult. It is way too common to enter an empty room, hear a sound, and suddenly be getting mobbed by insta-spawn high level mobs.
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cptruggedI think it has something to do with free will.Registered Userregular
Yeah, I have an alt that uses auto weapons. Still very low level (13) but the damage increase was nice. I ran her up to the Toxic Valley last night to do the quest there that rewards the legendary 10mm smg, and had quite a bit of fun burning through piles of ammo.
I still have to resort to something harder hitting fairly often, but I'm hoping to be able to do that less as she gets better perks.
I'm not saying they found it or not, because that doesn't matter. They fucked up is the problem.
I'm looking at my own bug tracker right now, and on a project of less systemic complexity, and with a QA team which I would imagine is far, far smaller than Bethesda's, we've got somewhere in the region of 200 open defects. These are things people know about and care about, but due to business priorities, resourcing and what have you, haven't been got around to yet.
If i had to hazard a guess, the Fallout 76 tracker will be large, prioritised daily (or more) and have as many people as they can working on it, given the PR impacts. And their defect count will, I suspect, be an order of magnitude higher than mine.
I guess I'd suggest a) it is unlikely that the QA involved were incompetent.
b) it is more than likely that all the issues everyone (including me!) are annoyed about are in their JIRA-equivalent somewhere
c) those issues are probably just not as much of a priority as all the other bugs we haven't seen, or all the other day to day dev tasks getting done, or any of the new features we're all wanting.
And d) that doesn't mean that the business/project team screwed up either. They get paid to make the calls on the priorities, and while we may be sitting at the far end of the process, looking at what they chose to leave in given the time and resource available, and wondering why, I guarantee you nobody wants to ship sub-par product.
Now this isn't to say that I'm thrilled with the state of things on '76. But looking at the state of the game and suggesting it's because QA screwed the pooch, or that whoever's running their team could be equivalent to whoever masterminded canvasgate, or that the project team in charge of the game made the wrong priority calls...doesn't feel right to me. We don't know what calls the folks on the firing line are having to make, or live with.
Full disclosure: I haven't had many issues with the game either, so my anger/frustration level isn't that high. But if you're annoyed, I'd suggest looking upstream, at the C-level, where the decision to release the game at <time x> to meet revenues for <quarter-y> will have come from. Everyone else will have been firefighting since release day, and I suspect deserve sympathy far more than "You done fucked up"
It's still an industry recognized thing that Bethesda has the most trouble with bugs. Part of that is that they don't hire segmented teams like other shops, where they'll have a production manager, a content person, etc. Bethesda expects all their staff to be content creators in addition to their other duties. As a result, there's less management between groups to see whether teams are stepping on each other's toes, or to prioritize addressing the bug backlog. It's partially why they're so unique with all the crazy infinite content they have; everyone is always making something cool. There is a clear downside which always shows in their games as well though: they can be somewhat disjointed, the core story isn't always tied to other stuff in a way that suggests an overarching line, and they really struggle with technical debt.
This isn't just a C-level issue. It's a known eccentricity specific to Bethesda.
Posts
I agree! False advertising rules! /s
Honestly, what is the thought process that leads to the conclusion "I should defend this multi-million dollar company for its false advertisement, and their stated intention of not doing anything about it." ?
Steam ID: 76561198021298113
Origin ID: SR71C_Blackbird
You mean, in today's marketplace?
The whole thing was a mistake, and it is good that they are making it right. But, we also are fans of a medium that is suffering from the effects of having a reactionary, abusive fanbase that can and will destroy a company whose products we have loved for decades based on over-the-top, manipulative campaigns from Youtube and Internet commentators who know that rage and endless attacks are a way to build their audience. People are defending Bethesda (and Bioware) not because they agree with the companies' decisions all the time, but because they don't want these mistakes to be turned into the type of witch hunts that destroy careers, end companies, and make the world a poorer place in exchange for some Youtube celebrity getting more hits.
It might be, but max stealth in Fallout 4 was honestly pretty ridiculous. Having super mutants just about bumping into you while you're out of cover and not seeing you was hilariously broken.
He literally calls "the majority of those outraged (over the bag)" "sad little turds", and says that "nobody gives a shit about the bag".
No, they shouldn't be insulted or witch hunted. But holding them accountable is not only reasonable but the right thing to do.
Steam ID: 76561198021298113
Origin ID: SR71C_Blackbird
It's a shitty PR response, and Bethesda needs to get its act together on multiple fronts before they do serious and irreparable harm to the company. No one here is denying that.
But I can also sympathize, because I know exactly who the company rep is raging about and why. Bethesda's the current target of the Internet Hate Squad, and it takes a calm head and well-considered corporate guidelines to operate as a PR person under those pressures. As someone who has worked in that industry, the gaming space really needs to stop hiring people from their communities and start investing in professionals who can learn the product and follow best practices like "Don't rage the fuck out under the company masthead, because it does not matter whether you are right or not."
Did you only read the part you bolded and ignore anything else I said? I'm not defending anyone, certainly not Bethesda. I agree they messed up, and I also stated their response was awful. Nobody in their right mind would be so "outraged" that the bag is nylon instead of canvas. It's all fucking bullshit to feed the hivemind "Fallout 76 is the worst game ever" meme.
Nobody saw the collector's edition and went "Oh hell yeah, a canvas bag!". No, everyone wanted that helmet. But then the game released, and it isnt the greatest thing ever so all the little sad reddit turds got together to circle-jerk and farm useless internet points.
Maybe I shouldn't use words like "nobody" and "everyone" since it's possible someone out there legitimately wanted that bag, and I'm glad they'll get the chance to get the item that was advertised.
I haven't purchased the Collector's Edition of Fallout 76 (haven't purchased any version of it, in fact), so my feelings here are super-hypothetical, and should be taken with a fistful of salt, but: I've looked at the image of the Collector's Edition thing many times because I'm a sucker for excessive, overproduces, unreasonably-expensive Collector's Editions with all sorts of unnecessary tchotchkes, and yet I didn't even register that there was a bag in the package until Canvasgate started. I obviously can't speak for everyone's motivations, but I think it's pretty safe to say that the Power Armor helmet was the big-ticket item in the Collector's Edition, and that most of the people buying it were buying it primarily for that. For these people, all the other stuff was incidental.
I agree with Skull2185, in that I think most people posting angrily about Canvasgate aren't actually upset that they didn't get the right kind of bag, because (I think) they never really cared about the bag. I think that what they are actually upset about - what I am annoyed about, even, despite not having a Collector's Edition - is the curt customer service response, the "Yeah, we gave you the wrong thing and we're not gonna fix it". In fact, I'm most upset by the "We don't plan to do anything about it" phrase, and not the "we gave you a cheaper product" part of it. As an entitled American living in a capitalist 2018, I am not accustomed to being treated like this.
I disagree with Skull2185, in that I'm not going to call names all the people making angry posts/screamy YouTube videos/scathing Tweets, nor do I think they are liars as such. That being said, I am going to take their posts with a dramatic eye-roll. Some of the folks are truly upset, I believe that, but I also think that they are not voicing what they are genuinely upset about. Some of the folks I don't think are genuinely upset at all; I think that they are gripped by a righteous fervor, or by a desire to belong to a group, and that's their main motivation. I'm not gonna bash them for it, because I'd be lying if I said I haven't been in those shoes. It's just human nature. But, precisely because I've felt those feelings and experienced those experiences, I feel safe saying that sometimes people voice a greater degree of displeasure than they actually feel. Sometimes, they don't even realize that they're doing it.
Regardless of the validity of your arguments, statements like this serve only to anger the people you are trying (?) to convince, and inflame rather than inform. This rhetoric and hyperbole is actively detrimental to your cause.
Maybe you also shouldn’t use words like “little sad reddit turds” and “circle-jerk” if you want people to take you seriously.
I think appeasing the fans is just a happy coincidence here.
People deserve to get the bags they were promised/advertised and I don't care how nice/polite they were about asking for it once somebody tries to pull one over on you to save a buck.
nah, just reassigned to head of QA
Edit: Seems it's a bug with bonus stats in general: If you log out with a bonus it's broken upon reentry. Have to unequip all bonuses, exit, reequip.
Don’t make me rant about this again.
QA is hard.
In better news, it looks like the refund/return madness with my copy of ‘76 has ended, and I now somehow have two copies of the game *and* most of my money. Going to call that a win.
Four day weekend coming, going to get back on it.
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And while I've worked for several companies where QA was nominally in charge of deciding to release, in practice that is never the case.
It’s not a very important country most of the time
http://steamcommunity.com/id/mortious
Yeah, it's usually FISI.
http://www.bogleech.com/halloween/hall18-fallout76.html
People give it shit and call it just reusing their assets from 4 to make a new game but the enemy designs and variety are so much better in 76.
I mean, the assumption here is that QA didn't find the bugs, and unless you have access to their defect tracking system I don't see how you could say that with any certainty.
It’s not a very important country most of the time
http://steamcommunity.com/id/mortious
It also looks like they stealth nerfed a bunch of things (melee damage, plans dropping from events, server hopping, and character's over 50). I don't like these nerfs, they can balance the game as they see fit but they could at least put them in the patch notes.
Edit: I don't know if the stealth nerfs are actually nerfs or are bugs. They added the workshop nerf to the patch notes so it is real.
Melee damage changed? I didn't notice anything different with my melee character, and my damage numbers on my weapons were the same.
Edit: I take back what I said about stealth nerfs. I think the patch notes might be accurate but there are just new bugs that seem like nerfs. Its letting me complete the BoS Forbidden Knowledge quest get the rewards and then if I relog it puts the technical data back in my inventory and I can turn it in again. So right now if I wanted I can farm infinite xp and caps. That is silly so I'm not going to keep doing it but pretty funny.
Yeah, my axe is still grognaking things in half, and I did an even today and got a plan for a fusion generator.
I'm looking at my own bug tracker right now, and on a project of less systemic complexity, and with a QA team which I would imagine is far, far smaller than Bethesda's, we've got somewhere in the region of 200 open defects. These are things people know about and care about, but due to business priorities, resourcing and what have you, haven't been got around to yet.
If i had to hazard a guess, the Fallout 76 tracker will be large, prioritised daily (or more) and have as many people as they can working on it, given the PR impacts. And their defect count will, I suspect, be an order of magnitude higher than mine.
I guess I'd suggest a) it is unlikely that the QA involved were incompetent.
b) it is more than likely that all the issues everyone (including me!) are annoyed about are in their JIRA-equivalent somewhere
c) those issues are probably just not as much of a priority as all the other bugs we haven't seen, or all the other day to day dev tasks getting done, or any of the new features we're all wanting.
And d) that doesn't mean that the business/project team screwed up either. They get paid to make the calls on the priorities, and while we may be sitting at the far end of the process, looking at what they chose to leave in given the time and resource available, and wondering why, I guarantee you nobody wants to ship sub-par product.
Now this isn't to say that I'm thrilled with the state of things on '76. But looking at the state of the game and suggesting it's because QA screwed the pooch, or that whoever's running their team could be equivalent to whoever masterminded canvasgate, or that the project team in charge of the game made the wrong priority calls...doesn't feel right to me. We don't know what calls the folks on the firing line are having to make, or live with.
Full disclosure: I haven't had many issues with the game either, so my anger/frustration level isn't that high. But if you're annoyed, I'd suggest looking upstream, at the C-level, where the decision to release the game at <time x> to meet revenues for <quarter-y> will have come from. Everyone else will have been firefighting since release day, and I suspect deserve sympathy far more than "You done fucked up"
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So a level 150+ fella comes to take over my workshop. By the time I got there It had already gotten all the way down so that I couldn't repair all. And I fast traveled as soon as I saw the message. Anways, I'm level 45 and he kills me. Doesn't even put on his power armor. I decide to at least give a go and come back in. This time I get the drop on him with a crit sledge and he goes down. I figured the 170 caps was enough so I decide to just leave and give up the workshop.
Fast travel to my camp. The guy decides to follow me. He shows up and starts shooting me. I figure nah, I'll fight around a workshop to try and defend, but not doing this mess. With the damage reduction, he can't actually hurt me so I just ignore him. He then proceeds to destroy everything in my base. Racking up a 450+ caps wanted amount. I decide to just follow the guy around. Eventually some high level guys show up to take those caps and I get my hit in and get caps and call it even. The comedy is that camp destruction didn't mean anything. I moved my camp and all my base was completely restored with no repair costs. So in the end that guys 450 cap loss was for nothing.
Then I had a situation where someone just continuously died over and over just to destroy all the infrastructure created at a workstation. Eventually killing them netted 0 caps cause they just didn't care.
It really made me realize that the only downside to being a tool and griefing is the caps. And if you don't really care about them, you can really mess with people for no real downside.
Since getting the quests, a video came out on youtube showing how to farm xp at the golf course, at any level
So for the last week, ive been logging in several times a day, to find the clubhouse full of mobs 30 or 40 levels higher than me, as high level characters just camp there, logging in an out over and over.
So I'm giving up - unless they come out with an offline mode, which i assume is against their vision...
I had some luck stealthing through the madness, but the respawn system makes that very difficult. It is way too common to enter an empty room, hear a sound, and suddenly be getting mobbed by insta-spawn high level mobs.
Yeah, I have an alt that uses auto weapons. Still very low level (13) but the damage increase was nice. I ran her up to the Toxic Valley last night to do the quest there that rewards the legendary 10mm smg, and had quite a bit of fun burning through piles of ammo.
I still have to resort to something harder hitting fairly often, but I'm hoping to be able to do that less as she gets better perks.
It's still an industry recognized thing that Bethesda has the most trouble with bugs. Part of that is that they don't hire segmented teams like other shops, where they'll have a production manager, a content person, etc. Bethesda expects all their staff to be content creators in addition to their other duties. As a result, there's less management between groups to see whether teams are stepping on each other's toes, or to prioritize addressing the bug backlog. It's partially why they're so unique with all the crazy infinite content they have; everyone is always making something cool. There is a clear downside which always shows in their games as well though: they can be somewhat disjointed, the core story isn't always tied to other stuff in a way that suggests an overarching line, and they really struggle with technical debt.
This isn't just a C-level issue. It's a known eccentricity specific to Bethesda.