A shutdown in November would be catastrophic for the GOP. I think civil disobedience is possible. Maybe Trump's approval rating going below 30%. Possibly civil war in the GOP between the moneyed interest and the true believers. Likely a tipping point for a deep recession. That would kill the 2020 elections for the GOP across the board, possibly handing Dems the White House and Congress. It might trigger a political realignment on a scale not seen since, I don't know, at least 60s, maybe even pre-WW2.
So even odds Trump tries it, I figure.
Edit: can a shutdown happen in November? Can it only happen at certain times? I've had a very long day and I may have types up a bunch of nonsense.
Shutdowns can only happen when Congress needs to pass a new budget.
Which is basically every year now because the Freedom Caucus doesn't give a shit about who gets hurt during one and passing a multiyear budget would mean giving up their favorite political weapon
A shutdown in November would be catastrophic for the GOP. I think civil disobedience is possible. Maybe Trump's approval rating going below 30%. Possibly civil war in the GOP between the moneyed interest and the true believers. Likely a tipping point for a deep recession. That would kill the 2020 elections for the GOP across the board, possibly handing Dems the White House and Congress. It might trigger a political realignment on a scale not seen since, I don't know, at least 60s, maybe even pre-WW2.
So even odds Trump tries it, I figure.
Edit: can a shutdown happen in November? Can it only happen at certain times? I've had a very long day and I may have types up a bunch of nonsense.
Shutdowns can only happen when Congress needs to pass a new budget.
Which is basically every year now because the Freedom Caucus doesn't give a shit about who gets hurt during one and passing a multiyear budget would mean giving up their favorite political weapon
This isn't a Freedom Caucas thing it's a Congress is shit at doing their jobs thing.
iirc it's been over 20 years since Congress actually passed a budget on time with no continuing resolutions.
Washington Post is reporting, per two familiar with Vindman's testimony, that Eisenberg (WH NSC Legal Advisor) discussed moving the call summary to the SCI server in response to concerns about impropriety from NSC staffers.
Vindman told Eisenberg, the White House’s legal adviser on national security issues, that what the president did was wrong, said the people, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because of the ongoing investigation.
Scribbling notes on a yellow legal pad, Eisenberg proposed a step that other officials have said is at odds with long-standing White House protocol: moving a transcript of the call to a highly classified server and restricting access to it, according to two people familiar with Vindman’s account.
Eisenberg (a direct report of Pat Cipollone) and another WH lawyer, Mike Ellis, have been invited to appear before the committee Monday.
Mike Ellis, apparently, is yet another former Nunes aide, and one whose name you may recall (I did not) offered as the guy who allegedly leaked FISA stuff to Nunes to help substantiate Trump's claim of being wire-tapped waaay back in March 2017.
One of the seven House Democrats who had not made a public statement in support of launching an impeachment inquiry into President Donald Trump announced Wednesday he will back the House resolution formalizing the procedures of the investigation.
"While I disagreed with the initial decision to open the impeachment inquiry, it is clear that the investigation has confirmed information contained in the whistleblower complaint," Rep. Jared Golden of Maine said in a news release Wednesday. "For the good of our country and the public's understanding of the process, this investigation should no longer continue solely in a closed setting. Tomorrow, I'll vote to open up the House investigation to the American people."
Those still holding out are
Those Democrats -- Rep. Collin Peterson of Minnesota, Rep. Jeff Van Drew of New Jersey, Rep. Anthony Brindisi of New York, Rep. Kendra Horn of Oklahoma, Rep. Joe Cunningham of South Carolina and Rep. Ron Kind of Wisconsin -- all represent districts Trump won in 2016.
If any of these guys are your congress critters, call 'em up. At this point the lady who answers Brindisi's phone and me are on a first name basis cause I'm calling his office every single day wondering why the hell he hasn't supported the inquiry.
Jared Golden is voting for the process but he's still not on the impeachment train at all. He disagrees with there even being an inquiry and only backs this resolution in order to open public hearings because Republicans want them.
I'm super happy that my choice in 2018 was to vote for this guy or an even shittier shit. /sigh/
In case you wanna watch a bunch of republicans flounder against the impeachment vote live. So far in watching, two republicans have taken time to speak against it, while two democrats have spoken out against other important issues.
Are these 7 a threat to the vote not getting through or do we need them aboard, just so that Dems look unified?
No threat. Just helps with unity.
So with Amash who we know is voting yes the count would be 228-204 for the motion to proceed. 218 is the magic number and the Dems have 234 members in the House.
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38thDoelets never be stupid againwait lets always be stupid foreverRegistered Userregular
One of the seven House Democrats who had not made a public statement in support of launching an impeachment inquiry into President Donald Trump announced Wednesday he will back the House resolution formalizing the procedures of the investigation. "While I disagreed with the initial decision to open the impeachment inquiry, it is clear that the investigation has confirmed information contained in the whistleblower complaint," Rep. Jared Golden of Maine said in a news release Wednesday. "For the good of our country and the public's understanding of the process, this investigation should no longer continue solely in a closed setting. Tomorrow, I'll vote to open up the House investigation to the American people."
Those still holding out are
Those Democrats -- Rep. Collin Peterson of Minnesota, Rep. Jeff Van Drew of New Jersey, Rep. Anthony Brindisi of New York, Rep. Kendra Horn of Oklahoma, Rep. Joe Cunningham of South Carolina and Rep. Ron Kind of Wisconsin -- all represent districts Trump won in 2016.
If any of these guys are your congress critters, call 'em up. At this point the lady who answers Brindisi's phone and me are on a first name basis cause I'm calling his office every single day wondering why the hell he hasn't supported the inquiry.
.............................so you don't think they should've started the investigation, but you're glad the investigation found information?
How the fuck you think you would've found out that information if the investigation wasn't started, you spineless whelp?
Likely got some real damning evidence in closed sessions, so ready to move on to open hearings now.
Given how republicans are now spouting out about how any information obtained in the pre-vote inquiries should be thrown out? Yeah, I'm guessing they found something super duper juicy on Trump.
It wasn't really a dig at her, but that just really sounded like the voice of a computer. If that was the goal - congratulations, goal achieved :biggrin:
Likely got some real damning evidence in closed sessions, so ready to move on to open hearings now.
Given how republicans are now spouting out about how any information obtained in the pre-vote inquiries should be thrown out? Yeah, I'm guessing they found something super duper juicy on Trump.
We’ve always had juicy stuff, but now there’s eyewitnesses willing to testify
+12
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KoopahTroopahThe koopas, the troopas.Philadelphia, PARegistered Userregular
edited October 2019
(R) Tom Cole just tried to extend the debate time by four hours to allow for all members of the house to debate and provide amendments over the resolution with unanimous consent.
(D) Jim McGovern representative said, no. Vote is still estimated to go at 10:45 EST.
(R) Tom Cole just tried to extend the debate time by four hours to allow for all members of the house to debate and provide amendments over the resolution with unanimous consent.
(D) Jim McGovern representative said, no. Vote is still estimated to go at 10:45 EST.
He went further and responded to Cole’s assertion that this inquiry is unfair to the minority by admitting prior inquiry rules with identical minority rights.
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BlackDragon480Bluster KerfuffleMaster of Windy ImportRegistered Userregular
(R) Tom Cole just tried to extend the debate time by four hours to allow for all members of the house to debate and provide amendments over the resolution with unanimous consent.
(D) Jim McGovern representative said, no. Vote is still estimated to go at 10:45 EST.
He went further and responded to Cole’s assertion that this inquiry is unfair to the minority by admitting prior inquiry rules with identical minority rights.
Not to mention, weren't the current House committee rules for closed door sessions and the rights/procedures for minority members of said committees enacted under Boehner in like 2015?
No matter where you go...there you are. ~ Buckaroo Banzai
Likely got some real damning evidence in closed sessions, so ready to move on to open hearings now.
Given how republicans are now spouting out about how any information obtained in the pre-vote inquiries should be thrown out? Yeah, I'm guessing they found something super duper juicy on Trump.
I don't think they're directly related. Like, yes they are, and yes they did; but there's no mechanism to "throw out" the depositions that the GOP could hope to engage. They're just saying things lawyers say on TV about completely different preceedings, and, given that there are actual lawyers among them, they cannot possibly think it will work.
(R) Tom Cole just tried to extend the debate time by four hours to allow for all members of the house to debate and provide amendments over the resolution with unanimous consent.
(D) Jim McGovern representative said, no. Vote is still estimated to go at 10:45 EST.
He went further and responded to Cole’s assertion that this inquiry is unfair to the minority by admitting prior inquiry rules with identical minority rights.
Weird, didn't know we let criminal's buddies serve on their juries.
not a doctor, not a lawyer, examples I use may not be fully researched so don't take out of context plz, don't @ me
I had to turn off Nunes, get away from my desk, only to come back and hear Jordan. Holy crap, the gaslighting...
It all reeks of desperation
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KoopahTroopahThe koopas, the troopas.Philadelphia, PARegistered Userregular
edited October 2019
Not impeachment related but Clyburn has a wonderful voice. Would love a podcast or eBook from that man.
Currently just going back and forth giving specific members of each side opportunity to give support or oppose the vote before the official vote around 10:45 ET.
KoopahTroopahThe koopas, the troopas.Philadelphia, PARegistered Userregular
Heh, (D) Jefferies just put pulled out an american flag on a print out for his one minute speech lol. That was pretty silly. Got some claps from the democratic representatives.
Washington Post is reporting, per two familiar with Vindman's testimony, that Eisenberg (WH NSC Legal Advisor) discussed moving the call summary to the SCI server in response to concerns about impropriety from NSC staffers.
Vindman told Eisenberg, the White House’s legal adviser on national security issues, that what the president did was wrong, said the people, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because of the ongoing investigation.
Scribbling notes on a yellow legal pad, Eisenberg proposed a step that other officials have said is at odds with long-standing White House protocol: moving a transcript of the call to a highly classified server and restricting access to it, according to two people familiar with Vindman’s account.
Eisenberg (a direct report of Pat Cipollone) and another WH lawyer, Mike Ellis, have been invited to appear before the committee Monday.
Mike Ellis, apparently, is yet another former Nunes aide, and one whose name you may recall (I did not) offered as the guy who allegedly leaked FISA stuff to Nunes to help substantiate Trump's claim of being wire-tapped waaay back in March 2017.
Ellis is also Eisenberg's deputy, but wouldn't it be nice if there was another reason they'd like to see him.
Nunes sure seems to have some well placed assets associates in the White House, doesn't he.
They really need to censure and remove Nunes from any committees. He's clearly been running his own shadow government. I really don't understand how he's not under some seriously bright lights right now.
One of the seven House Democrats who had not made a public statement in support of launching an impeachment inquiry into President Donald Trump announced Wednesday he will back the House resolution formalizing the procedures of the investigation.
"While I disagreed with the initial decision to open the impeachment inquiry, it is clear that the investigation has confirmed information contained in the whistleblower complaint," Rep. Jared Golden of Maine said in a news release Wednesday. "For the good of our country and the public's understanding of the process, this investigation should no longer continue solely in a closed setting. Tomorrow, I'll vote to open up the House investigation to the American people."
Those still holding out are
Those Democrats -- Rep. Collin Peterson of Minnesota, Rep. Jeff Van Drew of New Jersey, Rep. Anthony Brindisi of New York, Rep. Kendra Horn of Oklahoma, Rep. Joe Cunningham of South Carolina and Rep. Ron Kind of Wisconsin -- all represent districts Trump won in 2016.
If any of these guys are your congress critters, call 'em up. At this point the lady who answers Brindisi's phone and me are on a first name basis cause I'm calling his office every single day wondering why the hell he hasn't supported the inquiry.
Van Drew is a from a district that includes AC and had previously voted in a Republican for the last 24 years. Guy is never gonna go for impeachment.
Like, this is a district that includes Atlantic City as one of it's major population centers, a place that by all rights should hate Trump with the fire of a 1000 suns and it still went Trump +5. I dunno if it's gerrymandered to hell and back or what but I would not be surprised to see it flip back flip back red in 2020.
iguanacus on
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KoopahTroopahThe koopas, the troopas.Philadelphia, PARegistered Userregular
Pelosi's speech started pretty weak but got really good as it went on. Even with that ridiculous flag print out next to her. Lots of historical precedent and patriotism involved with ensuring a clear and precise procedure moving forward.
One of the seven House Democrats who had not made a public statement in support of launching an impeachment inquiry into President Donald Trump announced Wednesday he will back the House resolution formalizing the procedures of the investigation.
"While I disagreed with the initial decision to open the impeachment inquiry, it is clear that the investigation has confirmed information contained in the whistleblower complaint," Rep. Jared Golden of Maine said in a news release Wednesday. "For the good of our country and the public's understanding of the process, this investigation should no longer continue solely in a closed setting. Tomorrow, I'll vote to open up the House investigation to the American people."
Those still holding out are
Those Democrats -- Rep. Collin Peterson of Minnesota, Rep. Jeff Van Drew of New Jersey, Rep. Anthony Brindisi of New York, Rep. Kendra Horn of Oklahoma, Rep. Joe Cunningham of South Carolina and Rep. Ron Kind of Wisconsin -- all represent districts Trump won in 2016.
If any of these guys are your congress critters, call 'em up. At this point the lady who answers Brindisi's phone and me are on a first name basis cause I'm calling his office every single day wondering why the hell he hasn't supported the inquiry.
I was about to call Joe Cunningham, but he just announced that he's voting in favor. So cross him off the list of holdouts.
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KoopahTroopahThe koopas, the troopas.Philadelphia, PARegistered Userregular
Another print out for (D) Norma Torres, a picture of Donald Trump with the quote "Do us a favor, though" over his mouth, during her speech in favor.
KoopahTroopahThe koopas, the troopas.Philadelphia, PARegistered Userregular
edited October 2019
Wow, (R) Steve Scalise holding up a print out of "37 days of Soviet-Style Impeachment Proceedings" with the sickle/hammer symbol over St. Basil's Cathedral...
Wow, (R) Steve Scalise holding up a print out of "37 days of Soviet-Style Impeachment Proceedings" with the sickle/hammer symbol over St. Basil's Cathedral...
Incredible.
Soviets were definitely known as sticklers for procedure and not just disappearing someone in the dead of night.
I need to move to DC and open up shop selling stupid props for Congressmen
+70
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KoopahTroopahThe koopas, the troopas.Philadelphia, PARegistered Userregular
edited October 2019
It seems that republicans are reserving their time, probably in order to get the last word before the vote with someone like Gaetz or someone else. Democrats are running through speakers for 30 seconds, probably 5 or 6 in a row already while Republicans are reserving.
Democrats are done. (R) Tom Cole trying to amend the resolution again to allow for redactions of transcripts of hearings and reports.
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Which is basically every year now because the Freedom Caucus doesn't give a shit about who gets hurt during one and passing a multiyear budget would mean giving up their favorite political weapon
This isn't a Freedom Caucas thing it's a Congress is shit at doing their jobs thing.
iirc it's been over 20 years since Congress actually passed a budget on time with no continuing resolutions.
Eisenberg (a direct report of Pat Cipollone) and another WH lawyer, Mike Ellis, have been invited to appear before the committee Monday.
Mike Ellis, apparently, is yet another former Nunes aide, and one whose name you may recall (I did not) offered as the guy who allegedly leaked FISA stuff to Nunes to help substantiate Trump's claim of being wire-tapped waaay back in March 2017.
https://www.vox.com/world/2017/3/30/15126072/devin-nunes-source-white-house
Ellis is also Eisenberg's deputy, but wouldn't it be nice if there was another reason they'd like to see him.
Nunes sure seems to have some well placed assets associates in the White House, doesn't he.
Even if they try to end up with the defense of "we only did it so it wouldn't embarrass the President, there's nothing wrong with the call."
Well, classifying something just to keep someone from being embarrassed is STILL illegal.
Those still holding out are
If any of these guys are your congress critters, call 'em up. At this point the lady who answers Brindisi's phone and me are on a first name basis cause I'm calling his office every single day wondering why the hell he hasn't supported the inquiry.
I'm super happy that my choice in 2018 was to vote for this guy or an even shittier shit. /sigh/
In case you wanna watch a bunch of republicans flounder against the impeachment vote live. So far in watching, two republicans have taken time to speak against it, while two democrats have spoken out against other important issues.
Oh, the vote is happening now.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
No threat. Just helps with unity.
So with Amash who we know is voting yes the count would be 228-204 for the motion to proceed. 218 is the magic number and the Dems have 234 members in the House.
Special rules for the public hearings, and something about authorizing transfer of other committee materials to Judiciary.
EDIT: Susan Coles was the clerk that read the Impeachment inquiry rules.
She is supposed to read what is being voted on as impassively as possible. That’s the job.
She's actually really good at it, I would be stuttering and mispronouncing stuff all over the place. That was so much legal speech, like wow.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
.............................so you don't think they should've started the investigation, but you're glad the investigation found information?
How the fuck you think you would've found out that information if the investigation wasn't started, you spineless whelp?
PSN/Steam/NNID: SyphonBlue | BNet: SyphonBlue#1126
Given how republicans are now spouting out about how any information obtained in the pre-vote inquiries should be thrown out? Yeah, I'm guessing they found something super duper juicy on Trump.
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We’ve always had juicy stuff, but now there’s eyewitnesses willing to testify
(D) Jim McGovern representative said, no. Vote is still estimated to go at 10:45 EST.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
He went further and responded to Cole’s assertion that this inquiry is unfair to the minority by admitting prior inquiry rules with identical minority rights.
Not to mention, weren't the current House committee rules for closed door sessions and the rights/procedures for minority members of said committees enacted under Boehner in like 2015?
~ Buckaroo Banzai
I don't think they're directly related. Like, yes they are, and yes they did; but there's no mechanism to "throw out" the depositions that the GOP could hope to engage. They're just saying things lawyers say on TV about completely different preceedings, and, given that there are actual lawyers among them, they cannot possibly think it will work.
They're just whining.
Weird, didn't know we let criminal's buddies serve on their juries.
It all reeks of desperation
Currently just going back and forth giving specific members of each side opportunity to give support or oppose the vote before the official vote around 10:45 ET.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
They really need to censure and remove Nunes from any committees. He's clearly been running his own shadow government. I really don't understand how he's not under some seriously bright lights right now.
Van Drew is a from a district that includes AC and had previously voted in a Republican for the last 24 years. Guy is never gonna go for impeachment.
Like, this is a district that includes Atlantic City as one of it's major population centers, a place that by all rights should hate Trump with the fire of a 1000 suns and it still went Trump +5. I dunno if it's gerrymandered to hell and back or what but I would not be surprised to see it flip back flip back red in 2020.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
Seriously, either grow a spine and do the right thing or stfu
I was about to call Joe Cunningham, but he just announced that he's voting in favor. So cross him off the list of holdouts.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
Incredible.
Twitch: KoopahTroopah - Steam: Koopah
Yeah, same for me. I want to strangle every Republican talking and knock some sense into them. Scalise is talking now and ARGH...
Soviets were definitely known as sticklers for procedure and not just disappearing someone in the dead of night.
Democrats are done. (R) Tom Cole trying to amend the resolution again to allow for redactions of transcripts of hearings and reports.
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