Ya gotta admit my posts are at least interesting to read, on topic, accurate and well written.
...And do not have any inflamatory religious or political trailing pictures.
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mi-go hunterOnce again I'm back in the lab.Cleaning my knives, ready for stabs.Registered Userregular
edited February 2012
Still...don't you think calling people dickheads just because they don't agree with your point of view is going a wee bit too far? You know??? :?
I'd like to be put back on the signup list please!
"The only way to get rid of a temptation is to give into it." - Oscar Wilde
"We believe in the people and their 'wisdom' as if there was some special secret entrance to knowledge that barred to anyone who had ever learned anything." - Friedrich Nietzsche
For those new to our forums (this used to be stickied in all sub-forums and remains in effect; quote is copied from Debate and Discourse):
The Glorious Edict
All insults other than 'silly goose' are punishable by punishment most severe. Admins and mods are exempted, so we may be allowed to practice the modly art of self-restraint.
There is a moderate exception for in-character text in role-playing threads, but that doesn't apply to our CitOW games or any discussion threads. Keep it civil, please.
edit: I put this into the second post (above the player list), to help ensure everyone coming in gets a chance to see it.
So on the topic of CitOW, I got a chance to play Slaanesh the other night in a HR game. I went with the Keeper of Secrets upgrade because I had a few of those 1-cost get a victory point for each noble, hero and peasant cards. Without the power point upgrades the cost of your greater demon is an even bigger investment, I dong think I'd go that route instead. Tzeentch ended up winning off the Empire ruining, playing a Havoc to keep his figures there safe and drop even more corruption.
I won my only try at slaanesh on VP with the keeper upgrade but I did maybe get a little help of the king-maker variety* but if you wanna try for VP I don't really see much else to do than go for keeper and of course try and get a little corruption with defensive cards and daemon subtlety here and there.
*(and a noob Khorne, Khorne has won 3/5 and won everytime he had an experienced player behind the wheel)
Greater Daemon upgrade in Morrslieb can be a dangerous choice; not only is it expensive to summon, but both Tzeentch and Khorne have cards that can move it around to their benefit.
The upgrade for 2 DACs if you place 3 corruption looked good, but as Slaanesh only has 6 cultists and Khorne was breathing down my neck I didn't see it happening.
Both our RL games with the Rat have seen him sitting in the Badlands and Border Princes because that's where the Skaven ended up. We've realized that turtling isn't the way to go with him, and getting in on the action with your tons of dudes looks like it could be a lot of fun. Plus he gets a few tricks to move whole clumps after dominating/ruining. I'd been thinking I'd play Slaanesh or Tzeentch when I get into a forum game but the Rat has moved to the top of my list.
Greater Daemon upgrade in Morrslieb can be a dangerous choice; not only is it expensive to summon, but both Tzeentch and Khorne have cards that can move it around to their benefit.
That is true but what is the popular choice then? Always go for dial?
Well, for points securing Rise to Glory (nobles count toward your domination) can give you an edge toward domination. For the dial, seductress (move nobles to better regions) or daemonette (take control of enemy cultists) are both viable choices, as is Fall from Grace (though as stated that makes you a sitting duck for Khorne).
I'm still not sure what Slaneesh is supposed to do for a realistic shot at victory that doesn't depend on lucking out. Khorne gets that doozy bloodletter upgrade, Nurgle still has his cheap warriors, and Tzeentch has havoc with plentiful cultists. Slaneesh gets the crap warriors of Tzeentch, less cultists, no more Fields of Ecstacy, and no more (boring) 2 defense cultists to hide behind.
He also seems to have the weakest upgrades in the game next to Nurgle. Most of them are geared towards dial, and even with the shortest number of ticks to victory Slaneesh never wins by dial anyway. You're left with the double edged sword of the Keeper upgrade (at most +3 VP per turn) and Rise to Glory giving you the occasional extra domination point.
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AegisFear My DanceOvershot Toronto, Landed in OttawaRegistered Userregular
(The following ignores the existence of the Bloodletter upgrade to preserve some measure of assumed balance)
I wouldn't run Fall from Grace unless I double-ticked turn 1. It's not going to come into play often to give you extra dial ticks (since you're competing with Khorne, Rat, and Nurgle who in Morrisleb can manufacture DACs rather well).
I do like the Rise to Glory paired with Keeper of Secrets upgrade, in that order, strategy. Yes your greater daemon is expensive but it's also not likely to die if you move it around well enough. Hell if you combine it with Pleasure Shield then it becomes unkillable unless Khorne has put every single warrior in your region and his dice roll bullshit. Congrats, you've just dominated a region for 8+ VP (20% of the way to victory, assuming you're doing this in the valuable regions) just with your card, your Keeper and any existing Noble Tokens in the region.
You also have to be strategic in your noble token placement. Rarely should you pile your Noble Tokens into the same region unless you are damned sure it's not going to ruin any time soon. I actually think if you go this strategy you want to not ruin regions for as long as physically possible in order to milk as much VP as you can from Domination, keeping in mind that you should still angle for 1st or 2nd as much as you can. Spreading out Noble Tokens 2 at a time in some regions with the aim to get your Keeper Upgrade and hop in to gain 8+ a turn is preferred to going for the huge domination score in a single region only to have it ruin and condemn all your Noble tokens to the region never to return. Realistically you're not going to get your 3rd upgrade in time to matter a whole lot due to the shorter games that Morrisleb brings as you've probably been single ticking, meaning you don't get your 3rd upgrade until round 6. If you do get it, though, it can help for the last second Noble pile-in.
I find this strategy having played it with Slaanesh for a few games now rather competitive, provided any of your opponents don't jump to a massive lead *Cough* Game 65 *Cough*. I haven't yet tried, but also think Rise to Glory + Seductress could work for a more ruination-centric strategy where you pile in with cultists and noble tokens, dominate, ruin, then move on. I also like the Daemonette upgrade but it's hard for it to fit in a domination-structured strategy (outside of your third upgrade). I think it has more viability in a dial-ticking strategy as the second upgrade after you pick up Fall from Grace (alternatively, if you do double-tick turn 1 you could pick up Daemonette to protect your cultists by stealing others and try for another double).
Hi everyone.
I would like to sign up, and want to play a game quickly.
No guarantees about how soon you'll get into a game, but you're on the list. Welcome, though! Feel free to drop by the general board game discussion thread (link in my signature) while you are waiting.
That's the thing with Slaneesh's upgrades though; they seemed too dependent on working in combination with each other. Any strategy that doesn't kick in until you get a 2nd upgrade is...shakey. Khorne and Tzeentch (sometimes even Nurgle) get apparent strengths that lead to realistic shots at victory. I just can't find any clear strengths that Slaneesh gets to leverage.
After game 66 is over I'll share why the Horned Rat always leaves me scratching my head.
KOS upgrade can work, but if you pull out into an early lead people will target it to screw with you, so I agree it is risky. That said, it is the upgrade that plays best with Chaos cards such as Debauchary etc.
I personally think Rise to Glory is only really useful when there are more Noble tokens out due to dial or OWC, the same applies to the Cultist upgrade.
Fall from Grace and the Deamonette upgrade work well together, and in fact I think the Daemonette upgrade is the most versatile of them all, it is good for securing extra corruption if you have all six cultists out, it is good for screwing people etc.
The Slaanesh upgrades are good, but they are more situational than other gods who always have a known upgrade to chose, with Slaan you need to pick based on OWC, your game position etc.
Also Slaanesh isn't under powered, she has some great cards, such as Festival and Corrupt and I think is one of the best gods (along with Tzeentch) for playing with the board, moving tokens and controling where people can and cannot go.
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AegisFear My DanceOvershot Toronto, Landed in OttawaRegistered Userregular
I personally think Rise to Glory is only really useful when there are more Noble tokens out due to dial or OWC, the same applies to the Cultist upgrade.
Well if you're picking up KOS, you need Rise to Glory to not have it easily countered by cards or sheer figures while giving the opponent free +3 VP. As for Noble tokens, you get your 1st upgrade at 2 ticks and you place down 2 nobles the very next tick. At that point you have 4 of 6 noble tokens on the board if the Old World doesn't play nice with you, so you're always going to have a fair number of nobles to have it affect. And you can always play Debauchery for more Nobles.
Corrupt from Within is also the best card in the game for absolutely screwing Tzeentch or the Rat over. Though in the Rat's case, most of what you do screws him over since you compete very well with him for domination.
As for Noble tokens, you get your 1st upgrade at 2 ticks and you place down 2 nobles the very next tick. At that point you have 4 of 6 noble tokens on the board if the Old World doesn't play nice with you, so you're always going to have a fair number of nobles to have it affect. And you can always play Debauchery for more Nobles.
I suppose so, though it depends on when you are ticking, if it is just once a round then your upgrade is really only effective for the last round of the game (in most games). I appreciate that you can use Debauchery for more Nobles but it's not a hugely cheap way of doing it, I think it is a good upgrade, just not one that you should take every game regardless as it is best in set situatations...
But that makes for a better game, where instead of there being a single universally accepted path that is best (always choose the bloodsworn upgrade for extra attack, seductress for extra defense) players have to actually read the board, their hands, and the opponents to decide which upgrade will be most useful in a given game. This is a good problem to have.
My problem is even with extreme planning it never seems like Slaneesh's options can realistically compete with Khorne and Tzeentch's much more straightforward paths. Much more work for weaker results.
But that makes for a better game, where instead of there being a single universally accepted path that is best (always choose the bloodsworn upgrade for extra attack, seductress for extra defense) players have to actually read the board, their hands, and the opponents to decide which upgrade will be most useful in a given game. This is a good problem to have.
I agree 100%.
I want to play Slaanesh in a game...
He does have a dilemma when it comes to choosing upgrades. I just think it's unfortunate that this doesn't translate to stronger play. He's in the same boat as Nurgle where he has 4-5 upgrades that are OKAY as opposed to the rest who have one or two really great upgrades (in a game where you only get one or two upgrades, that's all you need). Okay, more like Nurgle gets 1-2 OKAY upgrades with crappy ones while Horned Rat gets 4 pretty decent and one crappy one.
Lately I've been wishing that expansion games lasted longer. I've never seen one go over 5 turns, sometimes ending at 4. Maybe they should have raised the victory points threshold to compensate for the faster point gain. Longer games would make dial victories more realistic and let you play around with more upgrades for longer.
I'd also be interested in seeing a house rule game where everyone gets to pick one upgrade at the start. Often shunned upgrades like Slaneesh and Khorne's cultist upgrade would actually become useful. Clan Rat upgrade would go from noob trap to insanely useful. Tzeentch would actually have pause to pick something before Mystical Disregard.
MrBody on
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AegisFear My DanceOvershot Toronto, Landed in OttawaRegistered Userregular
edited February 2012
Eh, Nurgle has 4 alright upgrades. If we ignore the Populous region creating one, which is only useful for a dial strategy and...Nurgle isn't going to be winning on Dial, he's got: an upgrade that lets his cultists place more corruption; an upgrade which lets his plaguebearers drop corruption when killed; an upgrade which lets his dominations place corruption; and an upgrade which causes all his kills in a region with the GUO place corruption.
The only iffy one there is Plaguebearers and that's only when there's a bunch of figures for people to avoid placing hits on your warriors and maybe domination if you're forced into tough competition with Slaanesh or the Rat. I want to see the GUO upgrade appear more often as it has the most potential for Nurgle to wrack up a ton of corruption.
On the other hand, we do have to compare Nurgle's current upgrades with the fact he no longer has Provender of Ruin which was a free +12 VP.
I want to see the GUO upgrade appear more often as it has the most potential for Nurgle to wrack up a ton of corruption.
I think you are onto something here, dropping an upgraded GUO in a region that is highly contested could easily guarantee you the most corruption and earn you 1st place. Likely only to be useful towards end game, but this is also likely to be when Nurgle gets his upgrade.
I agree the Plague Bearer one is iffy, I think that the Leper one is very good and prefer it to IC. But I think like Slaanesh you pick based on the current game, rather than just thinking X is always the best one.
Also, how do you do that 'thing' where you change a link into a single word containing the link...
Cerberus on
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AegisFear My DanceOvershot Toronto, Landed in OttawaRegistered Userregular
edited February 2012
You'd need to have warrior support in the region where your GUO is put to maximize your battle dice, though Nurgle's warriors getting on the board isn't too much of a problem.
Also:
[url=http://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/148931/chaos-chaos-in-the-old-world-discussion-and-signups-the-horned-rat#Item_560]This is a Test[/url]
I do wish the upgrade allowed for all kills to lay corruption for you, it's not like it can be used in more than 1 region, though could be pretty broken in some situations. Still getting warriors down is easy so still a good upgrade.
I'm kinda new to the boards here; I'm seeing notifications when I'm on the board of new posts but I'd prefer if I could get email alerts. Is there a way to set things up like that here?
So I will try my hand at this hosting business, invitations have been sent to Nought, 38thDoe, caliber and BoardGamer. I can't seem to message @Gordon858 so Gordon if you see this come join the game.
I would like to sign up for a game of CiTOW. Never played the game over the net before and I'm a noob since I only have a few games under my belt, but I already love the game!
I'm kinda new to the boards here; I'm seeing notifications when I'm on the board of new posts but I'd prefer if I could get email alerts. Is there a way to set things up like that here?
If you click on your name to view your profile, then the edit profile button, then the notifications submenu, there is a choice to be emailed when you get a private message. That should work to let you know when you are invited to a game; once in, you'd need to check more regularly to see when your turn is up (or ask the host/other players to PM you on your turn).
Got the message. Thx for the inv and please sign me right back up if thats okay (I really love this game). The list is looking frightening at the moment. Good thing i was a noob till now :-)
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...And do not have any inflamatory religious or political trailing pictures.
Yup, that's me on Steam.
If you are interested in playing, discussing, or hosting Arkham Horror, click here!
"We believe in the people and their 'wisdom' as if there was some special secret entrance to knowledge that barred to anyone who had ever learned anything." - Friedrich Nietzsche
There is a moderate exception for in-character text in role-playing threads, but that doesn't apply to our CitOW games or any discussion threads. Keep it civil, please.
edit: I put this into the second post (above the player list), to help ensure everyone coming in gets a chance to see it.
*(and a noob Khorne, Khorne has won 3/5 and won everytime he had an experienced player behind the wheel)
Both our RL games with the Rat have seen him sitting in the Badlands and Border Princes because that's where the Skaven ended up. We've realized that turtling isn't the way to go with him, and getting in on the action with your tons of dudes looks like it could be a lot of fun. Plus he gets a few tricks to move whole clumps after dominating/ruining. I'd been thinking I'd play Slaanesh or Tzeentch when I get into a forum game but the Rat has moved to the top of my list.
That is true but what is the popular choice then? Always go for dial?
He also seems to have the weakest upgrades in the game next to Nurgle. Most of them are geared towards dial, and even with the shortest number of ticks to victory Slaneesh never wins by dial anyway. You're left with the double edged sword of the Keeper upgrade (at most +3 VP per turn) and Rise to Glory giving you the occasional extra domination point.
I wouldn't run Fall from Grace unless I double-ticked turn 1. It's not going to come into play often to give you extra dial ticks (since you're competing with Khorne, Rat, and Nurgle who in Morrisleb can manufacture DACs rather well).
I do like the Rise to Glory paired with Keeper of Secrets upgrade, in that order, strategy. Yes your greater daemon is expensive but it's also not likely to die if you move it around well enough. Hell if you combine it with Pleasure Shield then it becomes unkillable unless Khorne has put every single warrior in your region and his dice roll bullshit. Congrats, you've just dominated a region for 8+ VP (20% of the way to victory, assuming you're doing this in the valuable regions) just with your card, your Keeper and any existing Noble Tokens in the region.
You also have to be strategic in your noble token placement. Rarely should you pile your Noble Tokens into the same region unless you are damned sure it's not going to ruin any time soon. I actually think if you go this strategy you want to not ruin regions for as long as physically possible in order to milk as much VP as you can from Domination, keeping in mind that you should still angle for 1st or 2nd as much as you can. Spreading out Noble Tokens 2 at a time in some regions with the aim to get your Keeper Upgrade and hop in to gain 8+ a turn is preferred to going for the huge domination score in a single region only to have it ruin and condemn all your Noble tokens to the region never to return. Realistically you're not going to get your 3rd upgrade in time to matter a whole lot due to the shorter games that Morrisleb brings as you've probably been single ticking, meaning you don't get your 3rd upgrade until round 6. If you do get it, though, it can help for the last second Noble pile-in.
I find this strategy having played it with Slaanesh for a few games now rather competitive, provided any of your opponents don't jump to a massive lead *Cough* Game 65 *Cough*. I haven't yet tried, but also think Rise to Glory + Seductress could work for a more ruination-centric strategy where you pile in with cultists and noble tokens, dominate, ruin, then move on. I also like the Daemonette upgrade but it's hard for it to fit in a domination-structured strategy (outside of your third upgrade). I think it has more viability in a dial-ticking strategy as the second upgrade after you pick up Fall from Grace (alternatively, if you do double-tick turn 1 you could pick up Daemonette to protect your cultists by stealing others and try for another double).
Currently DMing: None
Characters
[5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
I would like to sign up, and want to play a game quickly.
No guarantees about how soon you'll get into a game, but you're on the list. Welcome, though! Feel free to drop by the general board game discussion thread (link in my signature) while you are waiting.
After game 66 is over I'll share why the Horned Rat always leaves me scratching my head.
I personally think Rise to Glory is only really useful when there are more Noble tokens out due to dial or OWC, the same applies to the Cultist upgrade.
Fall from Grace and the Deamonette upgrade work well together, and in fact I think the Daemonette upgrade is the most versatile of them all, it is good for securing extra corruption if you have all six cultists out, it is good for screwing people etc.
The Slaanesh upgrades are good, but they are more situational than other gods who always have a known upgrade to chose, with Slaan you need to pick based on OWC, your game position etc.
Also Slaanesh isn't under powered, she has some great cards, such as Festival and Corrupt and I think is one of the best gods (along with Tzeentch) for playing with the board, moving tokens and controling where people can and cannot go.
Well if you're picking up KOS, you need Rise to Glory to not have it easily countered by cards or sheer figures while giving the opponent free +3 VP. As for Noble tokens, you get your 1st upgrade at 2 ticks and you place down 2 nobles the very next tick. At that point you have 4 of 6 noble tokens on the board if the Old World doesn't play nice with you, so you're always going to have a fair number of nobles to have it affect. And you can always play Debauchery for more Nobles.
Corrupt from Within is also the best card in the game for absolutely screwing Tzeentch or the Rat over. Though in the Rat's case, most of what you do screws him over since you compete very well with him for domination.
Currently DMing: None
Characters
[5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
I suppose so, though it depends on when you are ticking, if it is just once a round then your upgrade is really only effective for the last round of the game (in most games). I appreciate that you can use Debauchery for more Nobles but it's not a hugely cheap way of doing it, I think it is a good upgrade, just not one that you should take every game regardless as it is best in set situatations...
I agree 100%.
I want to play Slaanesh in a game...
Lately I've been wishing that expansion games lasted longer. I've never seen one go over 5 turns, sometimes ending at 4. Maybe they should have raised the victory points threshold to compensate for the faster point gain. Longer games would make dial victories more realistic and let you play around with more upgrades for longer.
I'd also be interested in seeing a house rule game where everyone gets to pick one upgrade at the start. Often shunned upgrades like Slaneesh and Khorne's cultist upgrade would actually become useful. Clan Rat upgrade would go from noob trap to insanely useful. Tzeentch would actually have pause to pick something before Mystical Disregard.
The only iffy one there is Plaguebearers and that's only when there's a bunch of figures for people to avoid placing hits on your warriors and maybe domination if you're forced into tough competition with Slaanesh or the Rat. I want to see the GUO upgrade appear more often as it has the most potential for Nurgle to wrack up a ton of corruption.
On the other hand, we do have to compare Nurgle's current upgrades with the fact he no longer has Provender of Ruin which was a free +12 VP.
Currently DMing: None
Characters
[5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
I'd be very interested to see how a 65 point victory threshold game played out.
I think you are onto something here, dropping an upgraded GUO in a region that is highly contested could easily guarantee you the most corruption and earn you 1st place. Likely only to be useful towards end game, but this is also likely to be when Nurgle gets his upgrade.
I agree the Plague Bearer one is iffy, I think that the Leper one is very good and prefer it to IC. But I think like Slaanesh you pick based on the current game, rather than just thinking X is always the best one.
I'm also loving the Khorne cultist upgrade, and think Pesky has used it really well in Game 64
http://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/154531/chaos-citow-game-64-revenge-of-the-peasants/p8
Also, how do you do that 'thing' where you change a link into a single word containing the link...
Also:
Like so
Currently DMing: None
Characters
[5e] Dural Melairkyn - AC 18 | HP 40 | Melee +5/1d8+3 | Spell +4/DC 12
Thanks for the other info...
Wins: NBN; Jenny Barnes; Emperor of Mankind; Werewolf (posthumous), Gregor; Colonel Mustard; USSR
Losses: Silas Marsh Bob Jenkins; Slaanesh, Tzeentch, Nurgle; House Harkonnen; Stark; Beravor; Scientist, Dispatcher; Universities of Jol-Nar, Winnu
http://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/156038/chaos-citow-game-68-and-tonights-host-is
Was listed in the OP wrong.
The Black Hole of Cygnus X-1
I would like to sign up for a game of CiTOW. Never played the game over the net before and I'm a noob since I only have a few games under my belt, but I already love the game!
Look forward to hearing back from you
If you click on your name to view your profile, then the edit profile button, then the notifications submenu, there is a choice to be emailed when you get a private message. That should work to let you know when you are invited to a game; once in, you'd need to check more regularly to see when your turn is up (or ask the host/other players to PM you on your turn).