That's fair reasoning, but you'd think a Zaibatsu would shell out a bit for a good clean professional hit once in a while.
Additionally, if you're playing a game called Hitman that is all about assassinating people I think you have a fair idea about what kind of game you're in for. And man, it's not like it's sex or something. Dissonance!
Except you'd figure hitmen would be called on dangerous criminals mostly, since these people would be the primary clients (basically, hitmen are called to eliminate the competition). Not some poor misguided dude who went through tough times.
Anyway, I probably would have uninstalled the game if the victims had all been like the one in the tutorial. It doesn't bring me any pleasure to do something I consider to be morally repugnant, even if it's only a game.
That guy really wasn't as innocent as you're making out.
He wasn't an out-and-out monster, but he was guilty of negligence and probably avoided jail-time due to tossing money at lawyers.
That said, you did get the sense that the accident genuinely haunted him, and caused his life to spiral further into despair coupled with shady dealings. He was broken to a point that you pitied him, but to 47 it's nothing more than a job.
Personally I would love it if almost every assignment had that level of moral grayness to it, rather than just eliminating the equivalent of James Bond villains.
That's fair reasoning, but you'd think a Zaibatsu would shell out a bit for a good clean professional hit once in a while.
Additionally, if you're playing a game called Hitman that is all about assassinating people I think you have a fair idea about what kind of game you're in for. And man, it's not like it's sex or something. Dissonance!
Well, we've already seen the United States government, the largest-budgeted entity on the planet Earth, hire 47 at least once.
Forget corporations, the State Department's where its at.
That guy really wasn't as innocent as you're making out.
Well we really know nothing about the accident. I'm presuming that he's innocent, since he wasn't charged with anything.
Well, he was charged. It is mentioned in the intro that "all charges were dropped" and some of the newspaper clippings mention it. I thought we were supposed to read between the lines that his gross negligence was responsible for the accident.
Even if he was innocent of that accident it doesn't really absolve him from his actions in harboring a drug lab on his property after the fact.
At the very most, I think the decision to kill him could be described as "morally ambiguous" not repugnant.
But I never lost any sleep over it. 47 is a hired killer and it's a game. This game never struck me as attempting to force the player to confront moral issues.
I can accept killing overall benign people, and certainly people who have otherwise followed the spirit of the law.
Look at Vinnie. In America, he's probably a morally upright citizen, cooperating with the FBI, furthering the reach of the law (in a good way), living a nice, legal, upper-class lifestyle in surburbia. Killing him is just another job. The fact that, in Cuba, he was probably criminal mafioso scum, responsible for untold amounts of theft, murder, and suffering just sweetens the deal.
That being said, I wouldn't mind one mission that puts you up against a seeming paragon of the community, someone who hasn't apparently done anything reprehensible, but does have the enemies to warrant the mission in the first place. As a twist. As Professor Snugglesworth said, moral grayness, when done right, could be very entertaining in this setting.
It actually turned out (thanks Steam forums!) that the game won't let you have AA and PostFilterLOD at the same time.
I'm not sure which would look better, but for now I stuck with AA, although going to the maximum (8) slows the game down a bit, so I've got it set on 4.
That's one issue solved, but I'm having another where I get no sound during the cutscene in the tutorial level where you talk to the gate guard.
Slowly trying to iron out these bugs along with the other games I got in the sale. Old games....
Then perhaps they should use another level to promote their game, that's representative of the game? Or just not make the first level so linear, which was something people disliked about Blood Money, so it's odd to see them repeat it.
Either way, aside from the linearity of the map which may or may not be true of the other levels, there was a lot that was good about this. The way the engine handled the amount of people at the end was very nice, and bodes well for future levels incorporating crowds. Also got a kick out of
The camera panning to the assault rifles near the end, making me roll me eyes and get ready for another action sequence, only to... have him eat a donut. That right there. That's Hitman.
That aint the original Hitman VA. I think. Also, Xray
But I guess its optional so all is not lost there. Hopefully its a tutorial level of a sort so the regular freeform, open maps are somewhat still in.
Does every game need to have Detective Mode now? How exactly are they justifying this?
Say what you will about Blood Money's first mission, it at least demonstrates the basic premise, the "ideal" of the game, namely to infiltrate an area, eliminate the target, and then egress. The more elegantly, quietly, and efficiently the better, though of course if you want to Rambo the whole thing you can do so.
This mission would give the impression that all of the new game is going to be playing Predator with large groups of mooks, Arkham Asylum/Deus Ex-style. I hope that isn't the case.
Gaslight on
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Halfhanda stalwart bastion of terrible ideasRegistered Userregular
edited October 2011
Yeah that x-ray mode is ridiculous. It even gives you the enemy paths, making it impossible to fuck up. I'll never use it.
Seems like there are lethal and non-lethal takedowns, though. He knocked one guy out before fiber wiring the other. If I'm forced to kill any cops I'll be upset. It was pretty disgusting and un-hitman like watching him execute them for no reason. Like the fazano guy he took hostage. Just knock him out instead of breaking his neck.
Also, the voice is awful. Bateson was leagues better.
Aside from those complaints, it's a pretty badass opening level. The ending was perfect.
If I'm forced to kill any cops I'll be upset. It was pretty disgusting and un-hitman like watching him execute them for no reason. Like the fazano guy he took hostage. Just knock him out instead of breaking his neck.
I had the same reaction, but I'm not going to criticize the game just because the person playing it in the video chooses to be sortof a douche. Assuming you do get a lethal/non-lethal choice and aren't forced into inflicting collateral casualties.
I'm pretty sure the Blood Money tutorial did force you to kill people other than your target (though they were thugs, not cops). I think that was pretty much the only mission since the first game that did though.
Well (Blood Money Ending Spoilers)...
...other than Blood Money's epilogue I guess since he wasn't contracted to kill all those people, but that's kind of a special case.
Though in this video I thought showing his face to a room full of cops while he held another cop hostage did seem a little amateur for Agent 47 (speaking of which, I wonder if Notoriety will be back?). Of course, the video was also a little too scripted to even be the tutorial level (some of the things he did basically required knowing all the enemy scripts in advance, which you wouldn't expect someone to do in a tutorial level) so I'm leaning towards the whole thing just being a level they modified to show off a bunch of gameplay elements.
47 canonically does not give much of a fuck about killing innocent people
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ShogunHair long; money long; me and broke wizards we don't get alongRegistered Userregular
When that video first started I thought the gameplay looked very similar to deus ex human revolution. When he jumped up and yanked that cop in to the hole I was convinced otherwise. I don't like the idea of the xray vision and I'm curious what premise its even based on. There hasn't been anything like that in a Hitman game and I'm not sure there should be. The series started off challenging for a reason.
Well the x Ray feature makes sense when you view the game as a consumer product. They want to sell it to as many people as possible and unfortunately that means making it much more accessible. Easier even. That said it is an optional feature and remember, the only way to play Hitman games is on the hardest difficulty.
My only concern right now is the way the maps are going to be broken down into segments. Could mean much more linearity.
It was pretty disgusting and un-hitman like watching him execute them for no reason. Like the fazano guy he took hostage. Just knock him out instead of breaking his neck.
If this was a level in Uncharted or some other action game, I'd probably be pretty impressed, but this doesn't look like Hitman. Hopefully it's just a shit level, but if this is how they're choosing to represent their game, it's a bit worrying.
Looks pretty fucking fantastic to me. I can definitely see how people would react negatively to some of the stuff in this video. Some of it doesn't look like Hitman. But it still looks great.
Yeah, good to see that just using a disguise isn't gated or "fueled". That part at least seems to be more or less untouched. But the addition of bluffing and using the environment to enhance your disguise (doughnuts!) is interesting.
Yeah that x-ray mode is ridiculous. It even gives you the enemy paths, making it impossible to fuck up. I'll never use it.
Seems like there are lethal and non-lethal takedowns, though. He knocked one guy out before fiber wiring the other. If I'm forced to kill any cops I'll be upset. It was pretty disgusting and un-hitman like watching him execute them for no reason. Like the fazano guy he took hostage. Just knock him out instead of breaking his neck.
Also, the voice is awful. Bateson was leagues better.
Aside from those complaints, it's a pretty badass opening level. The ending was perfect.
I am really pissed about the Bateson thing. The Jesper Kyd and the Diana thing pissed me off as well, but I could accept it. But this just really gets my goat.
At least the Max Payne developers were smart enough to get the same VA back. I was really excited about this game. And I will still buy it. I am a series addict.
All the killings are morally repugnant. You're not supposed to kill people.
b-but...this means boondock saints isn't a reliable source of opinions on ethical justice!
actually, in all honesty, if the game were entirely about killing people who were sympathetic characters, it would be a very different and much more mentally exhausting experience
It was pretty disgusting and un-hitman like watching him execute them for no reason. Like the fazano guy he took hostage. Just knock him out instead of breaking his neck.
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Just one other thing: do I want SLI enabled, or overwritten?
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Except you'd figure hitmen would be called on dangerous criminals mostly, since these people would be the primary clients (basically, hitmen are called to eliminate the competition). Not some poor misguided dude who went through tough times.
Anyway, I probably would have uninstalled the game if the victims had all been like the one in the tutorial. It doesn't bring me any pleasure to do something I consider to be morally repugnant, even if it's only a game.
He wasn't an out-and-out monster, but he was guilty of negligence and probably avoided jail-time due to tossing money at lawyers.
That said, you did get the sense that the accident genuinely haunted him, and caused his life to spiral further into despair coupled with shady dealings. He was broken to a point that you pitied him, but to 47 it's nothing more than a job.
Personally I would love it if almost every assignment had that level of moral grayness to it, rather than just eliminating the equivalent of James Bond villains.
Blog||Tumblr|Steam|Twitter|FFXIV|Twitch|YouTube|Podcast|PSN|XBL|DarkZero
Well we really know nothing about the accident. I'm presuming that he's innocent, since he wasn't charged with anything.
Well, we've already seen the United States government, the largest-budgeted entity on the planet Earth, hire 47 at least once.
Forget corporations, the State Department's where its at.
Well, he was charged. It is mentioned in the intro that "all charges were dropped" and some of the newspaper clippings mention it. I thought we were supposed to read between the lines that his gross negligence was responsible for the accident.
Even if he was innocent of that accident it doesn't really absolve him from his actions in harboring a drug lab on his property after the fact.
At the very most, I think the decision to kill him could be described as "morally ambiguous" not repugnant.
But I never lost any sleep over it. 47 is a hired killer and it's a game. This game never struck me as attempting to force the player to confront moral issues.
Look at Vinnie. In America, he's probably a morally upright citizen, cooperating with the FBI, furthering the reach of the law (in a good way), living a nice, legal, upper-class lifestyle in surburbia. Killing him is just another job. The fact that, in Cuba, he was probably criminal mafioso scum, responsible for untold amounts of theft, murder, and suffering just sweetens the deal.
That being said, I wouldn't mind one mission that puts you up against a seeming paragon of the community, someone who hasn't apparently done anything reprehensible, but does have the enemies to warrant the mission in the first place. As a twist. As Professor Snugglesworth said, moral grayness, when done right, could be very entertaining in this setting.
But now there's a new problem: maxing everything results in a mostly black screen.
http://cloud.steampowered.com/ugc/558661528646067832/A28DC1E3783ED2C8FA82CC0C9634AEC4C3A3CA51/
Sure, that might be cool as a Sin City type deal, but I can't see shit, captain. Help?
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I'm not sure which would look better, but for now I stuck with AA, although going to the maximum (8) slows the game down a bit, so I've got it set on 4.
That's one issue solved, but I'm having another where I get no sound during the cutscene in the tutorial level where you talk to the gate guard.
Slowly trying to iron out these bugs along with the other games I got in the sale. Old games....
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That aside, a full playthrough of the first mission:
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Either way, aside from the linearity of the map which may or may not be true of the other levels, there was a lot that was good about this. The way the engine handled the amount of people at the end was very nice, and bodes well for future levels incorporating crowds. Also got a kick out of
X-ray vision is still dumb though.
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But I guess its optional so all is not lost there. Hopefully its a tutorial level of a sort so the regular freeform, open maps are somewhat still in.
Old PA forum lookalike style for the new forums | My ko-fi donation thing.
Does every game need to have Detective Mode now? How exactly are they justifying this?
Say what you will about Blood Money's first mission, it at least demonstrates the basic premise, the "ideal" of the game, namely to infiltrate an area, eliminate the target, and then egress. The more elegantly, quietly, and efficiently the better, though of course if you want to Rambo the whole thing you can do so.
This mission would give the impression that all of the new game is going to be playing Predator with large groups of mooks, Arkham Asylum/Deus Ex-style. I hope that isn't the case.
Seems like there are lethal and non-lethal takedowns, though. He knocked one guy out before fiber wiring the other. If I'm forced to kill any cops I'll be upset. It was pretty disgusting and un-hitman like watching him execute them for no reason. Like the fazano guy he took hostage. Just knock him out instead of breaking his neck.
Also, the voice is awful. Bateson was leagues better.
Aside from those complaints, it's a pretty badass opening level. The ending was perfect.
As for X-Ray, I'll be treating that the same as runner's vision in Mirror's Edge: a non-canon handicap for people who aren't me.
edit: I know that Conviction comparisons are clichéd but damn
I had the same reaction, but I'm not going to criticize the game just because the person playing it in the video chooses to be sortof a douche. Assuming you do get a lethal/non-lethal choice and aren't forced into inflicting collateral casualties.
Well (Blood Money Ending Spoilers)...
Though in this video I thought showing his face to a room full of cops while he held another cop hostage did seem a little amateur for Agent 47 (speaking of which, I wonder if Notoriety will be back?). Of course, the video was also a little too scripted to even be the tutorial level (some of the things he did basically required knowing all the enemy scripts in advance, which you wouldn't expect someone to do in a tutorial level) so I'm leaning towards the whole thing just being a level they modified to show off a bunch of gameplay elements.
Shogun Streams Vidya
My only concern right now is the way the maps are going to be broken down into segments. Could mean much more linearity.
To be fair these are Chicago cops...
But god damn I am tired of the Inception "boom".
Ok now that they're talking about "fuelling your disguise powers" I officially wash my hands of this game.
Edit: alright I spoke too soon. Apparently you can use instinct to bluff more effectively in disguise.
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I am really pissed about the Bateson thing. The Jesper Kyd and the Diana thing pissed me off as well, but I could accept it. But this just really gets my goat.
At least the Max Payne developers were smart enough to get the same VA back. I was really excited about this game. And I will still buy it. I am a series addict.
But I will buy it second-hand at gamestop.
http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=34183192&postcount=1
b-but...this means boondock saints isn't a reliable source of opinions on ethical justice!
actually, in all honesty, if the game were entirely about killing people who were sympathetic characters, it would be a very different and much more mentally exhausting experience
I don't buy it. They were way too nice.