Also, a reminder for anyone getting this on PC stateside: You can get it for around $36 on D2D's British page, no hassle. I don't regret the cash thus far.
Also, the Console versions are $45 this week at Kmart
More annoying than the save system is the fact that you can't escape, load a save, etc during conversations -- and they like to put fucking autosaves right AFTER conversations. Hope you didn't fuck it up.
Ok, after the hiccup at the start of the opening, it seems to be running fine.
First annoyance is that apparently I actually have to use my mouse to pick a conversation stance? Ugh.
I'm going Field Agent on Hard. I take it Recruit is the challenge mode? Is there a point to taking it other than making the game hard as hell and unlocking the silly Veteran mode afterwards?
You can use WASD to choose dialogue too
There's a few lines of new dialogue, and it's only about 2 levels worth of points difference.
Also, if you want to exploit to get lots of XP, go sabotage to get remote hacking, and use it on all the cameras and turrets, as it gives 25 xp for each, as opposed to only one thing of 25 for shutting them down from a computer
Wait you can remote hack deactivate them with tech? Hmm, that gives the idea of a stealthy non-spy playthrough some decent possibilities. Maybe I'll just go full-on tech, loading up on tech gadgets and stuff and throwing them around everywhere. Apart from radio mimic, I rarely used any of the stuff the last time around.
I just played through my first mission, bugging the control tower at the airfield. So far I found one bug, and that was that I restarted the mission because I found out that the guards can hear you running at 20 yards. However when I restarted I was standing and the initial guard was facing me. So as soon as the mission started I was in gun fire. I had to load the save from the safehouse and redo the intro conversation.
Also, what is the deal with checkpoints? I didn't see one through the entire mission. Granted it was only 20 minutes, but what if I needed to quit the game? I can't even start the mission from the beginning, I have to go earlier because of the above bug.
Despite that and finding out why the computer hacking game is so despised I've been really digging the game.
Oh, wait. I forgot that the menus are way to console centric. Maybe I'm getting used to that since I haven't been playing too many Valve games lately.
Cronus on
"Read twice, post once. It's almost like 'measure twice, cut once' only with reading." - MetaverseNomad
Yeah savescumming would pretty much destroy the game, it's all about accepting the consequences of the choices you make. As it is, the game is generous enough with the checkpoints so you never need to go through any large segments of the game.
Also, what is the deal with checkpoints? I didn't see one through the entire mission. Granted it was only 20 minutes, but what if I needed to quit the game? I can't even start the mission from the beginning, I have to go earlier because of the above bug.
Yeah savescumming would pretty much destroy the game, it's all about accepting the consequences of the choices you make. As it is, the game is generous enough with the checkpoints so you never need to go through any large segments of the game.
I...have been known to Ctrl-Alt-Del my way out of the game and restart if a major conversation is badly not going my way. It's the game's fault for (sometimes) saving checkpoints right at the start of the conversation, and for having nice short (and skippable) intro movies and load times!
And whilst it's true that the game is generous enough with checkpoints, if you're playing as a stealth character and picking up things, hacking, laying traps and just generally waiting for patrol routes, replaying a section taking any longer than a few minutes can be quite frustrating. On the other hand, these moments have been few in number and it's amazing how much more confident you become on the second attempt.
And whilst it's true that the game is generous enough with checkpoints, if you're playing as a stealth character and picking up things, hacking, laying traps and just generally waiting for patrol routes, replaying a section taking any longer than a few minutes can be quite frustrating. On the other hand, these moments have been few in number and it's amazing how much more confident you become on the second attempt.
Yeah when I was familiar with the stealth mechanics a bit more I was hitting Silent Running and tearing around knocking out 2-3 guards on a pass.
And I won't lie, despite my talk of savescumming, I have in fact re-played entire levels (but only once or twice! Honest!) because I couldn't handle the consequences of my actions. I have to admit, the game took one or two choices I made and made me actually think about them, and then feel a whole lot worse.
It made me realise something though, sometimes I was actually playing the game through choosing what I though ought to be the default "good guy" options. But the game doesn't really delineate like that. Each choice you can make has a rational reasoning behind it, far more so than in most RPG's where it's actually a choice of "be nice / be a jerk (but maybe get more money)".
Looking back on the game, it's clear that sometimes there's no "good" outcome that you can achieve. That's not the same as saying "you're forced to be the badguy", because it's not, and if the game forced you along those lines then giving the player the choice wouldn't have an impact anyway. It's more along the lines of "which of these two values / goals do I consider more important?", the choices are more about asking you to decide your reasons for doing things, rather than being good or evil.
There's few games that make me think like that, and whatever choice you choose is usually just as much the right choice as it is the wrong one, because pretty much every decision has a legitimate reason behind it.
EDIT: Also, how do I skip the intro movies? Is there a command or do you mean just deleting the intro files and having it load straight up?
Going to take a break for some sleep. I made a big deal about going in with plans on being run and gun, but I ended up going pure stealth and never touching a gun. 1 button melee takedowns? Melee abilities allowing me to beat people up, ammo free, and not have it count as killing? So far so good.
So yeah, the ending. A little bit preachy and heavy handed. These are your choices, that you did. But I liked it, but then again, I liked Dantooine too, and would have been fine if they cut to black after it.
I especially liked being able to turn Marburg and Parker, just wish that you had a chance to do the same to Yancy. Or even gotten some comment on the 3 dossier slots they wasted on that one op of his.
I didn't even get that for an ending so the preachiness must be relegated to whichever one you got.
So yeah, the ending. A little bit preachy and heavy handed. These are your choices, that you did. But I liked it, but then again, I liked Dantooine too, and would have been fine if they cut to black after it.
I especially liked being able to turn Marburg and Parker, just wish that you had a chance to do the same to Yancy. Or even gotten some comment on the 3 dossier slots they wasted on that one op of his.
I didn't even get that for an ending so the preachiness must be relegated to whichever one you got.
You could turn Marburg? Damn, I missed out on that. Something to aim for on my Veteran playthrough.
So yeah, the ending. A little bit preachy and heavy handed. These are your choices, that you did. But I liked it, but then again, I liked Dantooine too, and would have been fine if they cut to black after it.
I especially liked being able to turn Marburg and Parker, just wish that you had a chance to do the same to Yancy. Or even gotten some comment on the 3 dossier slots they wasted on that one op of his.
I didn't even get that for an ending so the preachiness must be relegated to whichever one you got.
You could turn Marburg? Damn, I missed out on that. Something to aim for on my Veteran playthrough.
I never even came close, i figured I never could and I'm not sure how its doable, I think I had a pretty decent relationship rating with him.
So yeah, the ending. A little bit preachy and heavy handed. These are your choices, that you did. But I liked it, but then again, I liked Dantooine too, and would have been fine if they cut to black after it.
I especially liked being able to turn Marburg and Parker, just wish that you had a chance to do the same to Yancy. Or even gotten some comment on the 3 dossier slots they wasted on that one op of his.
I didn't even get that for an ending so the preachiness must be relegated to whichever one you got.
You could turn Marburg? Damn, I missed out on that. Something to aim for on my Veteran playthrough.
I never even came close, i figured I never could and I'm not sure how its doable, I think I had a pretty decent relationship rating with him.
Just be professional throughout all the conversations with him. Especially the meeting in Rome at the coffee shop.
Being professional with him is cruise control for +10.
So yeah, the ending. A little bit preachy and heavy handed. These are your choices, that you did. But I liked it, but then again, I liked Dantooine too, and would have been fine if they cut to black after it.
I especially liked being able to turn Marburg and Parker, just wish that you had a chance to do the same to Yancy. Or even gotten some comment on the 3 dossier slots they wasted on that one op of his.
I didn't even get that for an ending so the preachiness must be relegated to whichever one you got.
You could turn Marburg? Damn, I missed out on that. Something to aim for on my Veteran playthrough.
I never even came close, i figured I never could and I'm not sure how its doable, I think I had a pretty decent relationship rating with him.
I was just happy that one of my playthroughs I pissed him off so much he ...
Stayed in the museum to fight me and I killed him right there
So yeah, the ending. A little bit preachy and heavy handed. These are your choices, that you did. But I liked it, but then again, I liked Dantooine too, and would have been fine if they cut to black after it.
I especially liked being able to turn Marburg and Parker, just wish that you had a chance to do the same to Yancy. Or even gotten some comment on the 3 dossier slots they wasted on that one op of his.
I didn't even get that for an ending so the preachiness must be relegated to whichever one you got.
You could turn Marburg? Damn, I missed out on that. Something to aim for on my Veteran playthrough.
I never even came close, i figured I never could and I'm not sure how its doable, I think I had a pretty decent relationship rating with him.
I was just happy that one of my playthroughs I pissed him off so much he ...
Stayed in the museum to fight me and I killed him right there
Thanks for confirming that for me, wasn't sure if the game did that as advertised. Good to know it did.
So yeah, the ending. A little bit preachy and heavy handed. These are your choices, that you did. But I liked it, but then again, I liked Dantooine too, and would have been fine if they cut to black after it.
I especially liked being able to turn Marburg and Parker, just wish that you had a chance to do the same to Yancy. Or even gotten some comment on the 3 dossier slots they wasted on that one op of his.
I didn't even get that for an ending so the preachiness must be relegated to whichever one you got.
You could turn Marburg? Damn, I missed out on that. Something to aim for on my Veteran playthrough.
I never even came close, i figured I never could and I'm not sure how its doable, I think I had a pretty decent relationship rating with him.
I was just happy that one of my playthroughs I pissed him off so much he ...
Stayed in the museum to fight me and I killed him right there
Thanks for confirming that for me, wasn't sure if the game did that as advertised. Good to know it did.
So yeah, the ending. A little bit preachy and heavy handed. These are your choices, that you did. But I liked it, but then again, I liked Dantooine too, and would have been fine if they cut to black after it.
I especially liked being able to turn Marburg and Parker, just wish that you had a chance to do the same to Yancy. Or even gotten some comment on the 3 dossier slots they wasted on that one op of his.
I didn't even get that for an ending so the preachiness must be relegated to whichever one you got.
You could turn Marburg? Damn, I missed out on that. Something to aim for on my Veteran playthrough.
I never even came close, i figured I never could and I'm not sure how its doable, I think I had a pretty decent relationship rating with him.
I managed it by completing his dossier.
I'm not sure how much he liked me... a little in the positive, I think. But the dossier was the important thing in my case.
So yeah, the ending. A little bit preachy and heavy handed. These are your choices, that you did. But I liked it, but then again, I liked Dantooine too, and would have been fine if they cut to black after it.
I especially liked being able to turn Marburg and Parker, just wish that you had a chance to do the same to Yancy. Or even gotten some comment on the 3 dossier slots they wasted on that one op of his.
I didn't even get that for an ending so the preachiness must be relegated to whichever one you got.
You could turn Marburg? Damn, I missed out on that. Something to aim for on my Veteran playthrough.
I never even came close, i figured I never could and I'm not sure how its doable, I think I had a pretty decent relationship rating with him.
I managed it by completing his dossier.
I'm not sure how much he liked me... a little in the positive, I think. But the dossier was the important thing in my case.
Oh that's right I remember. It all hinges on the Dossier speech option because that's what Mike uses to do it.
So yeah, the ending. A little bit preachy and heavy handed. These are your choices, that you did. But I liked it, but then again, I liked Dantooine too, and would have been fine if they cut to black after it.
I especially liked being able to turn Marburg and Parker, just wish that you had a chance to do the same to Yancy. Or even gotten some comment on the 3 dossier slots they wasted on that one op of his.
I didn't even get that for an ending so the preachiness must be relegated to whichever one you got.
You could turn Marburg? Damn, I missed out on that. Something to aim for on my Veteran playthrough.
I never even came close, i figured I never could and I'm not sure how its doable, I think I had a pretty decent relationship rating with him.
I was just happy that one of my playthroughs I pissed him off so much he ...
Stayed in the museum to fight me and I killed him right there
Thanks for confirming that for me, wasn't sure if the game did that as advertised. Good to know it did.
So yeah, this game is just awesome, confirmed.
Haha, I didn't know you could work things that way, that's pretty cool.
Although I'm not sure how that would've affected my ending, since in mine Marburg stopped blindly following Halbech and make up his own mind about this stuff
EDIT: @ DarkWarrior: That was actually the mission I was thinking about, although I replayed it with the opposite choices to you.
Really, I can't blame her for leaving, what she said made complete sense. It's like Marburg said, in some ways you did something so much worse to her by saving her instead of everyone else. And she can't stay with Thorton if it might come down to that choice again.
That was probably THE major decision I wanted to take back. And I only realised later that the reason I took it wasn't so much that I thought it was the best decision, I just thought the game would judge that the best "good guy" decision. Which is a stupid way to think, but it's like it's a reaction that's been drilled into me by countless RPG's before.
Left mouse button all the way until you get to the main menu.
Tried that before, didn't seem to do anything. Maybe I should try again.
I just hammer 'Start' or 'A' on the controller - can't remember which as my instinctive impatience/button-mashing instincts take over when I grasp a pad.
Also, when did did Sega start putting 'Saaay-gaaa' back into their published games?
So yeah, the ending. A little bit preachy and heavy handed. These are your choices, that you did. But I liked it, but then again, I liked Dantooine too, and would have been fine if they cut to black after it.
I especially liked being able to turn Marburg and Parker, just wish that you had a chance to do the same to Yancy. Or even gotten some comment on the 3 dossier slots they wasted on that one op of his.
I didn't even get that for an ending so the preachiness must be relegated to whichever one you got.
You could turn Marburg? Damn, I missed out on that. Something to aim for on my Veteran playthrough.
I never even came close, i figured I never could and I'm not sure how its doable, I think I had a pretty decent relationship rating with him.
I was just happy that one of my playthroughs I pissed him off so much he ...
Stayed in the museum to fight me and I killed him right there
Thanks for confirming that for me, wasn't sure if the game did that as advertised. Good to know it did.
So yeah, this game is just awesome, confirmed.
Haha, I didn't know you could work things that way, that's pretty cool.
Although I'm not sure how that would've affected my ending, since in mine Marburg stopped blindly following Halbech and make up his own mind about this stuff
EDIT: @ DarkWarrior: That was actually the mission I was thinking about, although I replayed it with the opposite choices to you.
Really, I can't blame her for leaving, what she said made complete sense. It's like Marburg said, in some ways you did something so much worse to her by saving her instead of everyone else. And she can't stay with Thorton if it might come down to that choice again.
That was probably THE major decision I wanted to take back. And I only realised later that the reason I took it wasn't so much that I thought it was the best decision, I just thought the game would judge that the best "good guy" decision. Which is a stupid way to think, but it's like it's a reaction that's been drilled into me by countless RPG's before.
I didn't even get that
I just remember Marburg saying how sad he was I wouldnt join Halbech then I think he disappeared in Alpha Protocol facility.
ANd yeah her reasoning is sound. I was mostly angry because, as I said earler in the topic, I did my research and Marburg had ordered her not to be harmed at all under any circumstances so IO figured he had a personal interest in her and so I went after the bomb thinking shed wind up safe anyway. Which she did, until Marburg shot her. Then I go to replay it and she can get shot in the head instead. Just somewhat counter to the intelligence I'd gathered there.
The game with the magic "Simultaneously headshot everybody in the room button?" Seeing that in the previews killed any interest I had in the game. I really hope AP doesn't have anything like that.
It also has a turn invisible button. No, I'm not joking.
Left mouse button all the way until you get to the main menu.
Tried that before, didn't seem to do anything. Maybe I should try again.
I just hammer 'Start' or 'A' on the controller - can't remember which as my instinctive impatience/button-mashing instincts take over when I grasp a pad.
Also, when did did Sega start putting 'Saaay-gaaa' back into their published games?
Don't know, but I much prefer it to the Gruff McSerious "Sega" they had a little while ago.
I just remember Marburg saying how sad he was I wouldnt join Halbech then I think he disappeared in Alpha Protocol facility.
ANd yeah her reasoning is sound. I was mostly angry because, as I said earler in the topic, I did my research and Marburg had ordered her not to be harmed at all under any circumstances so IO figured he had a personal interest in her and so I went after the bomb thinking shed wind up safe anyway. Which she did, until Marburg shot her. Then I go to replay it and she can get shot in the head instead. Just somewhat counter to the intelligence I'd gathered there.
Re: Marburg:
Basically you need to focus on his dossier and point out in practical terms that he was messed around before because he blindly followed orders, and that if he's following Halbech then he's heading in that same direction this time around as well.
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Amikron DevaliaI didn't ask for this title.Registered Userregular
Left mouse button all the way until you get to the main menu.
Tried that before, didn't seem to do anything. Maybe I should try again.
I just hammer 'Start' or 'A' on the controller - can't remember which as my instinctive impatience/button-mashing instincts take over when I grasp a pad.
Also, when did did Sega start putting 'Saaay-gaaa' back into their published games?
The game with the magic "Simultaneously headshot everybody in the room button?" Seeing that in the previews killed any interest I had in the game. I really hope AP doesn't have anything like that.
It also has a turn invisible button. No, I'm not joking.
Along with a 'running at full speed along a metal walkway in heavy battle armour makes no sound whatsoever' button, 'your Uzis have infinite ammo' button, and permanently-on awareness of every living person within 200m's location, alertness status and facing, without line of sight. These are all optional, but let's be clear that we are not talking about a gritty espionage simulator here. As the last 20-30 pages have shown, whether you enjoy it or not is very much down to the individual.
I just remember Marburg saying how sad he was I wouldnt join Halbech then I think he disappeared in Alpha Protocol facility.
ANd yeah her reasoning is sound. I was mostly angry because, as I said earler in the topic, I did my research and Marburg had ordered her not to be harmed at all under any circumstances so IO figured he had a personal interest in her and so I went after the bomb thinking shed wind up safe anyway. Which she did, until Marburg shot her. Then I go to replay it and she can get shot in the head instead. Just somewhat counter to the intelligence I'd gathered there.
Re: Marburg:
Basically you need to focus on his dossier and point out in practical terms that he was messed around before because he blindly followed orders, and that if he's following Halbech then he's heading in that same direction this time around as well.
Ah well see I didn't complete his dossier. Not sure how you do some, a lot i got from hacking computers but I tended to explore every inch of a level to check for computers, I must have missed a discussion somewhere, probably with Sie.
The game with the magic "Simultaneously headshot everybody in the room button?" Seeing that in the previews killed any interest I had in the game. I really hope AP doesn't have anything like that.
It also has a turn invisible button. No, I'm not joking.
Along with a 'running at full speed along a metal walkway in heavy battle armour makes no sound whatsoever' button, 'your Uzis have infinite ammo' button, and permanently-on awareness of every living person within 200m's location, alertness status and facing, without line of sight. These are all optional, but let's be clear that we are not talking about a gritty espionage simulator here. As the last 20-30 pages have shown, whether you enjoy it or not is very much down to the individual.
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Also, the Console versions are $45 this week at Kmart
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Wait you can remote hack deactivate them with tech? Hmm, that gives the idea of a stealthy non-spy playthrough some decent possibilities. Maybe I'll just go full-on tech, loading up on tech gadgets and stuff and throwing them around everywhere. Apart from radio mimic, I rarely used any of the stuff the last time around.
Also, what is the deal with checkpoints? I didn't see one through the entire mission. Granted it was only 20 minutes, but what if I needed to quit the game? I can't even start the mission from the beginning, I have to go earlier because of the above bug.
Despite that and finding out why the computer hacking game is so despised I've been really digging the game.
Oh, wait. I forgot that the menus are way to console centric. Maybe I'm getting used to that since I haven't been playing too many Valve games lately.
"Read twice, post once. It's almost like 'measure twice, cut once' only with reading." - MetaverseNomad
This times like, a bajillion.
Yeah savescumming would pretty much destroy the game, it's all about accepting the consequences of the choices you make. As it is, the game is generous enough with the checkpoints so you never need to go through any large segments of the game.
I got one after the first gate.
I...have been known to Ctrl-Alt-Del my way out of the game and restart if a major conversation is badly not going my way. It's the game's fault for (sometimes) saving checkpoints right at the start of the conversation, and for having nice short (and skippable) intro movies and load times!
And whilst it's true that the game is generous enough with checkpoints, if you're playing as a stealth character and picking up things, hacking, laying traps and just generally waiting for patrol routes, replaying a section taking any longer than a few minutes can be quite frustrating. On the other hand, these moments have been few in number and it's amazing how much more confident you become on the second attempt.
Yeah when I was familiar with the stealth mechanics a bit more I was hitting Silent Running and tearing around knocking out 2-3 guards on a pass.
And I won't lie, despite my talk of savescumming, I have in fact re-played entire levels (but only once or twice! Honest!) because I couldn't handle the consequences of my actions. I have to admit, the game took one or two choices I made and made me actually think about them, and then feel a whole lot worse.
It made me realise something though, sometimes I was actually playing the game through choosing what I though ought to be the default "good guy" options. But the game doesn't really delineate like that. Each choice you can make has a rational reasoning behind it, far more so than in most RPG's where it's actually a choice of "be nice / be a jerk (but maybe get more money)".
Looking back on the game, it's clear that sometimes there's no "good" outcome that you can achieve. That's not the same as saying "you're forced to be the badguy", because it's not, and if the game forced you along those lines then giving the player the choice wouldn't have an impact anyway. It's more along the lines of "which of these two values / goals do I consider more important?", the choices are more about asking you to decide your reasons for doing things, rather than being good or evil.
There's few games that make me think like that, and whatever choice you choose is usually just as much the right choice as it is the wrong one, because pretty much every decision has a legitimate reason behind it.
EDIT: Also, how do I skip the intro movies? Is there a command or do you mean just deleting the intro files and having it load straight up?
Tried that before, didn't seem to do anything. Maybe I should try again.
I didn't even get that for an ending so the preachiness must be relegated to whichever one you got.
I never even came close, i figured I never could and I'm not sure how its doable, I think I had a pretty decent relationship rating with him.
Just be professional throughout all the conversations with him. Especially the meeting in Rome at the coffee shop.
Being professional with him is cruise control for +10.
I was just happy that one of my playthroughs I pissed him off so much he ...
Thanks for confirming that for me, wasn't sure if the game did that as advertised. Good to know it did.
So yeah, this game is just awesome, confirmed.
I'm not sure how much he liked me... a little in the positive, I think. But the dossier was the important thing in my case.
Oh that's right I remember. It all hinges on the Dossier speech option because that's what Mike uses to do it.
Still, I had +10 with him anyway.
Haha, I didn't know you could work things that way, that's pretty cool.
EDIT: @ DarkWarrior: That was actually the mission I was thinking about, although I replayed it with the opposite choices to you.
That was probably THE major decision I wanted to take back. And I only realised later that the reason I took it wasn't so much that I thought it was the best decision, I just thought the game would judge that the best "good guy" decision. Which is a stupid way to think, but it's like it's a reaction that's been drilled into me by countless RPG's before.
I just hammer 'Start' or 'A' on the controller - can't remember which as my instinctive impatience/button-mashing instincts take over when I grasp a pad.
Also, when did did Sega start putting 'Saaay-gaaa' back into their published games?
I didn't even get that
ANd yeah her reasoning is sound. I was mostly angry because, as I said earler in the topic, I did my research and Marburg had ordered her not to be harmed at all under any circumstances so IO figured he had a personal interest in her and so I went after the bomb thinking shed wind up safe anyway. Which she did, until Marburg shot her. Then I go to replay it and she can get shot in the head instead. Just somewhat counter to the intelligence I'd gathered there.
It also has a turn invisible button. No, I'm not joking.
Don't know, but I much prefer it to the Gruff McSerious "Sega" they had a little while ago.
Re: Marburg:
I just hit space bar on the pc, or start.
Along with a 'running at full speed along a metal walkway in heavy battle armour makes no sound whatsoever' button, 'your Uzis have infinite ammo' button, and permanently-on awareness of every living person within 200m's location, alertness status and facing, without line of sight. These are all optional, but let's be clear that we are not talking about a gritty espionage simulator here. As the last 20-30 pages have shown, whether you enjoy it or not is very much down to the individual.
Ah well see I didn't complete his dossier. Not sure how you do some, a lot i got from hacking computers but I tended to explore every inch of a level to check for computers, I must have missed a discussion somewhere, probably with Sie.
I think they were talking about Conviction...
Oh, well nevermind then.
it's an espionage movie simulator
unrealistic shit is part of the formula
"oh you can turn invisible? no gadget or anything just... just when you want to? I can see that coming in handy"
Well yeah, but it's not like anyone ever brings up health regen either.
"So the last time you were shot, how long did it take you to heal up?"
"About 30 seconds."
o_O
"Would've been less but they kept firing."
Pah, Jack Bauer is faster. 8-)
And please we do not forget that that guy has the power to bend space and time.
I want this in the Sequel.
"sequel"