and obsidian bought the rights to the forgotten realms from bioware. damn you obsidian!
Yeaaaaaah, no. Atari holds the rights. Bioware actually doesn't want to do another D&D game. One of the main reasons they don't want to do a Baldur's Gate 3.
Also sorry, but you hate Obsidian for this. Seriously.....
Nah, hater's gonna hate though I really don't get the hate. Unfinished/Unpolished aren't reasons for me (Since they are actually nonrelevant of the contents quality). Well, difficult reasons to understand since they also have parts that make up for it.
I mean if it was totally mediocre like Bioshock 2 or awfully bad like Sonic 2006+. But seriously.
KOTOR is (as good as it is) Star Wars Story #7123245. It reuses a lot of star wars clichees both in the charachter as in the narrative.
Kotor 2 on the other hand questions the force itself and presents itself as a story that tries to go deeper into the universe. Not to mention it easily brought us one of the best star wars charachters of all time (Kreia) It's cut devlopment time damaged that and the game on the whole severly though.
In the end as a whole KOTOR 2 falls short of KOTOR as a complete game. But that doesn't mean that everything about it was bad.
And in the case of NWN 2, well.
NWN2 OC > NWN OC
NWN2 MP < NWN MP
Here I would understand it more since the Multiplayer is NWNs main draw and it was buggy as hell at realease. So some hate is certainly justified but still NWN2 and especially its MOTB expansion (that is hailed by some to be the best storytechnical RPG since PST) have garnerd supporters.
I mean all these games are passable buggy games with some REALLY good elements (especially in terms of narrative).
And F:NV is regarded by many aside from the technical issues to be better than FO3.
So, please tell me. Did Obsidian rape your dog or something?
I mean I understand some of it since these things can trouble you waaaaaaaaaaay more if you are a certain typ of gamer (ESPECIALLY the technical issues. I fully get the hate on that one), but when I read comments that basically suggest that Obsidian is the Uwe Boll of gaming.
Both KoTORS are excellent. The first runs strongly on the heroic epic motif that has been Bioware's thing for most of their games, while the second has much superior writing in terms of nuance and character motivation.
Obsidian's track record aside, you can't blame anyone but LucasArts for the sorry state at release. The sequel had between a third to a half the time KoTOR had in development.
No. Everyone loves to blame this on LucasArts... Guess what, LA didn't wait until 5 days before Christmas and say "holy crap we should throw our plan out the window and release NOW!!!". Before the first line of code was written by Obsidian, they knew what the release date would be, and they agreed to it. If they couldn't make the game in time, they should not have represented that they could. Obsidian has record of doing this with other franchises, so to say that this is LucasArts' fault is inaccurate. This is like what, their 4th or 5th game where everyone has the same complaints. Basically the people at obsidian know how to create games, but have no clue how to run a business, they are not one and the same. They should be bought out by a studio that can actually competently run a company.
Both KoTORS are excellent. The first runs strongly on the heroic epic motif that has been Bioware's thing for most of their games, while the second has much superior writing in terms of nuance and character motivation.
Obsidian's track record aside, you can't blame anyone but LucasArts for the sorry state at release. The sequel had between a third to a half the time KoTOR had in development.
No. Everyone loves to blame this on LucasArts... Guess what, LA didn't wait until 5 days before Christmas and say "holy crap we should throw our plan out the window and release NOW!!!". Before the first line of code was written by Obsidian, they knew what the release date would be, and they agreed to it. If they couldn't make the game in time, they should not have represented that they could. Obsidian has record of doing this with other franchises, so to say that this is LucasArts' fault is inaccurate. This is like what, their 4th or 5th game where everyone has the same complaints. Basically the people at obsidian know how to create games, but have no clue how to run a business, they are not one and the same. They should be bought out by a studio that can actually competently run a company.
Nope,
You are right Obsidian is at fault too but you are oversymplifing it too. There was a lot going on between this time. Promises were made from both sides that weren't hold which lead to what it is.
Also nope "unfinished" wasn't really a complaint in the newer games (Except for Alpha Protocol but there was SEGA) as much as technical issues which is limited by Obsidians small technical staff, their inexperience with the engines they are using and that they work on rpgs. The possibly most complex gaming formula you can work with. Especially if you create reactive worlds. Edit: Naturally this is still no excuse.
I hope with the success of New Vegas they expand their technical department.
And yes, I like my Obsidian to stay private. They do too and they have reason to. Even from before Obsidian.
C2B on
0
Options
WhiteZinfandelYour insidesLet me show you themRegistered Userregular
edited December 2010
Man, if you're going to post some condescending know-it-all faux-essay, at least have the decency to check your spelling and syntax.
Man, if you're going to post some condescending know-it-all faux-essay, at least have the decency to check your spelling and syntax.
I'm sorry:(
Tried to fix it. But since I'm terrible at Englisch please specify.
Also no, I do not know it all. The only ones that do would be (Ex) employees of both companys.
C2B on
0
Options
WhiteZinfandelYour insidesLet me show you themRegistered Userregular
edited December 2010
Your command of English isn't really a problem, but you do come off preachy. Just chiiiillll. We know Obisidian does interesting dialog and story. Some of us think that doesn't make up for the horrible technical mess KotOR 2 was, though.
No. Everyone loves to blame this on LucasArts... Guess what, LA didn't wait until 5 days before Christmas and say "holy crap we should throw our plan out the window and release NOW!!!". Before the first line of code was written by Obsidian, they knew what the release date would be, and they agreed to it.
Eh? Wasn't it supposed to come out in February or March and then pushed ahead to early December halfway through development?
But your and Santa's point is correct, it's not wholly LucasArts's fault. Obsidian does have poor management and tarnished technical skills, as well as what I would consider amateurish design decisions in some aspects - I am no ardent defender of theirs - but an extra three months could have done wonders for the technical state of the game as well as the narrative conclusion.
They didn't take anything, Bioware wanted to go make their own IP, hence Jade Empire, Mass Effect (Star Wars), and Dragon Age (DnD), two of which are now franchises. ( JE2 ) It's not like they're likely to return to Forgotten Realms after kicking up DA.
i just wish Obsidian would leave Bio ware's games alone.:(
The two companys had a longlasting relationship even before Obsidian days. Thats why they got NWN and Kotor in the first place.
Feargus was largly involved from a buisness and a little dev point in Baldur's Gate 1+2 and Black Isle (Which I really think people forgot how buggy their games were already back then like Fallout 2 or Icewind Dale) was contracted for the first Badurs Gate 3 version. Avellone was even Lead Designer on it IIRC.
i just wish Obsidian would leave Bio ware's games alone.:(
I just wish BioWare would let Obsidian handle all their franchise sequels. Mass Effect 2 was pretty good but it was more Gears of War than Mass Effect, and Dragon Age 2 looks like it's going to try to take on Diablo III or something.
i just wish Obsidian would leave Bio ware's games alone.:(
I just wish BioWare would let Obsidian handle all their franchise sequels. Mass Effect 2 was pretty good but it was more Gears of War than Mass Effect, and Dragon Age 2 looks like it's going to try to take on Diablo III or something.
My one real disappointment with Alpha Protocol was that Obsidian opted for winnable Bioware romances.
An unfortunate concession to marketability. As Avellone has said in the past, he really doesn't care for it but apparently the vast majority of players do.
I think they're mildly creepy wish fulfillment and add nothing to roleplaying games.
Taris was way worse than that asteroid mining place, I'll give it that
Especially considering how fucking long you're on Taris before you even start your grand old quest!
This is way way late but I just have to say that the asteroid mining place in KOTOR 2 is probably my all time favourite opening level of a game ever. Ever.
Well, there's a freaking achievment to do all 4 of them in the same playthrough
Avellone actually prefers romance that ends in tragedy (someone dies or whatever) so in this case we might take "winnable" to mean "not heartrendingly horrific for both parties."
He doesn't prefer tragedy. He prefers unrequited, in one form or another. Torment is a good example of this. Any romance with the Nameless One is doomed by the nature of his quest.
It's a lot better story material than the winnable romances, that's for sure. One is genuine characterization and story telling, the other is 90% pandering.
He doesn't prefer tragedy. He prefers unrequited, in one form or another. Torment is a good example of this. Any romance with the Nameless One is doomed by the nature of his quest.
It's a lot better story material than the winnable romances, that's for sure. One is genuine characterization and story telling, the other is 90% pandering.
My favorite part of Alpha Protocol was how, if you kept rejecting a girl during the pre-sex conversation, they would keep trying to get you to choose sex.
It felt like acting in a play, and suddenly you start diverging from the script while your partner desperately tries to fix things while remaining in-character.
He doesn't prefer tragedy. He prefers unrequited, in one form or another. Torment is a good example of this. Any romance with the Nameless One is doomed by the nature of his quest.
It's a lot better story material than the winnable romances, that's for sure. One is genuine characterization and story telling, the other is 90% pandering.
That really has nothing to do with whether is is unrequited or not, that is moreso the writing in itself.
I for one don't believe that something is better simply because it ends on a sour note.
He doesn't prefer tragedy. He prefers unrequited, in one form or another. Torment is a good example of this. Any romance with the Nameless One is doomed by the nature of his quest.
It's a lot better story material than the winnable romances, that's for sure. One is genuine characterization and story telling, the other is 90% pandering.
That really has nothing to do with whether is is unrequited or not, that is moreso the writing in itself.
I for one don't believe that something is better simply because it ends on a sour note.
No. But it's a far more workable method than trying to cultivate something as difficult as romance in a game where, nine times out of ten, the main character is a sort of tabula rasa which fundamentally makes romantic interaction somewhat absurd to watch.
The unrequited bypasses this issue with video games as a medium. The other method is to not give you the option of roleplaying and make the protagonist a character with a personality and actions outside of your control.
It made sense to be able to have sex with all the women in Alpha Protocol though since it was a spy rpg. You needed to be able to go full James Bond on the game and bed everything that moved.
Mass Effect by Obsidian - story only, okay, but it's not like their recent characters or level design are better, and gameplay would certainly be worse.
Mass Effect by Obsidian - story only, okay, but it's not like their recent characters or level design are better, and gameplay would certainly be worse.
Nope, I wouldn't want that. Bioware got the Sci-Fi Popcorn Action Movie down. Maybe a spin-off that just uses the universe.
I don't mean the ending, I mean the glitches. Having a party member I adore disappear at random and never return, plus longer and longer load times does not suggest a finished game. I love FallOut: NV to pieces, but it's not done.
I don't mean the ending, I mean the glitches. Having a party member I adore disappear at random and never return, plus longer and longer load times does not suggest a finished game. I love FallOut: NV to pieces, but it's not done.
Games are never finished, they're just released. Obsidian just happens to be much better at the "release" part than the "finish" part.
I don't know, a lot of problems which have been issues that has plagued both oblivion and FO3 are suddenly huge freaking deals when it happens in Obsidian's games, but didn't receive a tenth the ire when it was Bethesda who did it.
Posts
Yeaaaaaah, no. Atari holds the rights. Bioware actually doesn't want to do another D&D game. One of the main reasons they don't want to do a Baldur's Gate 3.
Also sorry, but you hate Obsidian for this. Seriously.....
Nah, hater's gonna hate though I really don't get the hate. Unfinished/Unpolished aren't reasons for me (Since they are actually nonrelevant of the contents quality). Well, difficult reasons to understand since they also have parts that make up for it.
I mean if it was totally mediocre like Bioshock 2 or awfully bad like Sonic 2006+. But seriously.
KOTOR is (as good as it is) Star Wars Story #7123245. It reuses a lot of star wars clichees both in the charachter as in the narrative.
Kotor 2 on the other hand questions the force itself and presents itself as a story that tries to go deeper into the universe. Not to mention it easily brought us one of the best star wars charachters of all time (Kreia) It's cut devlopment time damaged that and the game on the whole severly though.
In the end as a whole KOTOR 2 falls short of KOTOR as a complete game. But that doesn't mean that everything about it was bad.
And in the case of NWN 2, well.
NWN2 OC > NWN OC
NWN2 MP < NWN MP
Here I would understand it more since the Multiplayer is NWNs main draw and it was buggy as hell at realease. So some hate is certainly justified but still NWN2 and especially its MOTB expansion (that is hailed by some to be the best storytechnical RPG since PST) have garnerd supporters.
I mean all these games are passable buggy games with some REALLY good elements (especially in terms of narrative).
And F:NV is regarded by many aside from the technical issues to be better than FO3.
So, please tell me. Did Obsidian rape your dog or something?
I mean I understand some of it since these things can trouble you waaaaaaaaaaay more if you are a certain typ of gamer (ESPECIALLY the technical issues. I fully get the hate on that one), but when I read comments that basically suggest that Obsidian is the Uwe Boll of gaming.
I just don't get it....
Battlenet ID: MildC#11186 - If I'm in the game, send me an invite at anytime and I'll play.
No. Everyone loves to blame this on LucasArts... Guess what, LA didn't wait until 5 days before Christmas and say "holy crap we should throw our plan out the window and release NOW!!!". Before the first line of code was written by Obsidian, they knew what the release date would be, and they agreed to it. If they couldn't make the game in time, they should not have represented that they could. Obsidian has record of doing this with other franchises, so to say that this is LucasArts' fault is inaccurate. This is like what, their 4th or 5th game where everyone has the same complaints. Basically the people at obsidian know how to create games, but have no clue how to run a business, they are not one and the same. They should be bought out by a studio that can actually competently run a company.
Blog||Tumblr|Steam|Twitter|FFXIV|Twitch|YouTube|Podcast|PSN|XBL|DarkZero
Nope,
You are right Obsidian is at fault too but you are oversymplifing it too. There was a lot going on between this time. Promises were made from both sides that weren't hold which lead to what it is.
Also nope "unfinished" wasn't really a complaint in the newer games (Except for Alpha Protocol but there was SEGA) as much as technical issues which is limited by Obsidians small technical staff, their inexperience with the engines they are using and that they work on rpgs. The possibly most complex gaming formula you can work with. Especially if you create reactive worlds. Edit: Naturally this is still no excuse.
I hope with the success of New Vegas they expand their technical department.
And yes, I like my Obsidian to stay private. They do too and they have reason to. Even from before Obsidian.
Tried to fix it. But since I'm terrible at Englisch please specify.
Also no, I do not know it all. The only ones that do would be (Ex) employees of both companys.
Eh? Wasn't it supposed to come out in February or March and then pushed ahead to early December halfway through development?
But your and Santa's point is correct, it's not wholly LucasArts's fault. Obsidian does have poor management and tarnished technical skills, as well as what I would consider amateurish design decisions in some aspects - I am no ardent defender of theirs - but an extra three months could have done wonders for the technical state of the game as well as the narrative conclusion.
The two companys had a longlasting relationship even before Obsidian days. Thats why they got NWN and Kotor in the first place.
Feargus was largly involved from a buisness and a little dev point in Baldur's Gate 1+2 and Black Isle (Which I really think people forgot how buggy their games were already back then like Fallout 2 or Icewind Dale) was contracted for the first Badurs Gate 3 version. Avellone was even Lead Designer on it IIRC.
So this is/was a buddy releationship.
Ah, and here is why Bioware won't do D&D anymore
http://www.videogamer.com/news/bioware_on_not_making_baldur_s_gate_3_we_ve_no_regrets.html
I just wish BioWare would let Obsidian handle all their franchise sequels. Mass Effect 2 was pretty good but it was more Gears of War than Mass Effect, and Dragon Age 2 looks like it's going to try to take on Diablo III or something.
White FC: 0819 3350 1787
They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
An unfortunate concession to marketability. As Avellone has said in the past, he really doesn't care for it but apparently the vast majority of players do.
I think they're mildly creepy wish fulfillment and add nothing to roleplaying games.
White FC: 0819 3350 1787
Well, there's a freaking achievment to do all 4 of them in the same playthrough
They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
I admire their authenticity.
Crazy chick, Mina, asshole reporter chick, and girl you know for all of five minutes in Rome?
This is way way late but I just have to say that the asteroid mining place in KOTOR 2 is probably my all time favourite opening level of a game ever. Ever.
Basically every female in the game besides Sis. So every female in the game with dialogue.
They tried to bury us. They didn't know that we were seeds. 2018 Midterms. Get your shit together.
Avellone actually prefers romance that ends in tragedy (someone dies or whatever) so in this case we might take "winnable" to mean "not heartrendingly horrific for both parties."
It's a lot better story material than the winnable romances, that's for sure. One is genuine characterization and story telling, the other is 90% pandering.
White FC: 0819 3350 1787
Turns out we're both right: he likes love that is unrequited or doomed.
It felt like acting in a play, and suddenly you start diverging from the script while your partner desperately tries to fix things while remaining in-character.
Twitter
That really has nothing to do with whether is is unrequited or not, that is moreso the writing in itself.
I for one don't believe that something is better simply because it ends on a sour note.
No. But it's a far more workable method than trying to cultivate something as difficult as romance in a game where, nine times out of ten, the main character is a sort of tabula rasa which fundamentally makes romantic interaction somewhat absurd to watch.
The unrequited bypasses this issue with video games as a medium. The other method is to not give you the option of roleplaying and make the protagonist a character with a personality and actions outside of your control.
White FC: 0819 3350 1787
Nope, I wouldn't want that. Bioware got the Sci-Fi Popcorn Action Movie down. Maybe a spin-off that just uses the universe.
Shitty Tumblr:lighthouse1138.tumblr.com
Shitty Tumblr:lighthouse1138.tumblr.com
New Vegas shows how to end a game without it being shit like F3
Games are never finished, they're just released. Obsidian just happens to be much better at the "release" part than the "finish" part.
Or UE3's texture loading problem.