I wouldn't have anybody be dead, just have the entire caravan gone. The goblin tribe waits until around the next meal time, then eats, then says, "Screw those jerks" and bails.
Incidentally, the scout would have only made 3 death saves. If you fail three, you're dead. If you pass any of them, you're stable but unconscious until healed.
Just a minor point of order. If you didn't do it that way (AND if you're playing 4e, which is what I'm assuming), you may want to retcon that the scout didn't die....if the player actually wants to keep the character alive.
FishmanPut your goddamned hand in the goddamned Box of Pain.Registered Userregular
Put this really interesting quandry in front of the party tonight.
This comes with Backstory.
Okay, so about 5 levels ago, the party got entangled in a political stoush between a prince and a princess who were contesting to be the next-in-line to the throne. The party waltzed in, tried to pull a fistful-of-dollars, failed and when the whole thing came crashing down, princess double-crossed them to win. The Prince and the party both came out losers, but to maintain his staion the prince also sold them out and refused to assist as he covered his own ass.
Skip ahead a few level and they've been maintaining a wary relationship of provoked disinterest and dancing around the fact that both blame each other for events that transpired. They discover the Prince has a thing they want, and to get back in his good books, they agree to run a mission for him. Take object A to point B.
This is where it got interesting. On route to point B, they were met by Wizard cabal who has, on occasion, kidnapped, manipulated and imprisoned party for their own ends, although only to further their own goals - the party are incidental pawns, a tool to be used when the situation demands, then to be put aside until needed again (because only a fool destroys something before they have got full use out of it). To say it was an antagonistic relationship would be discourtious; however, in the past, when their interests have aligned (rarely) the party has come out ahead.
The Cabal offered a simple proposition Do not deliver Object A to point B. Instead, they take INSANELY POWERFUL MAGIC ITEM and go do something else. Anything else. Just don't deliver the item.
So, two competing factions, both of which the party doesn't have much reason to like. One is vaguely amoral, the other very amoral, but neither is entirely good or evil. Abigious goals they don't understand, causes and requests they don't know the implications of. They like one slightly more, but the other is more trustworthy, and the competing value of the party's word is balanced by a very powerful carrot.
The nuances and subtletys can't really be carried here, but I'm running a very shades-of-grey campaign where nothing is clear and everyone is out for their own goals and motivations and the discussion that went around and around the table about this one simple offer consumed half the session.
It was some of the most deep and searching quandries I've put in front of my players yet, and it was seriously, seriously fun.
In the end, they turned down the cabal and decided to continue with their efforts to ingratiate themselves with the Prince. But it was a very close thing, which means I judged it right.
That's unbelievably cool. Your new name is cool guy. Let's have sex.
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chiasaur11Never doubt a raccoon.Do you think it's trademarked?Registered Userregular
Generally, I'd say that's the right call.
If someone's offering you something you want for a "simple job"?
It ain't that simple. Details or no dice.
Of course, sometimes that someone is just keeping quiet because they're assholes who like having secrets, and then you're screwing everyone over. But hey, it hits the assholes too! Victory!
FishmanPut your goddamned hand in the goddamned Box of Pain.Registered Userregular
The next 4 levels are consumed with turning this delicate weaving of 8 different factions I've been slowly pulling together into a Godian knot of intrigue and compting interests. The two Factions and six others, all competing for one thing, all of which will be trying to use every shred of influence they have and the whole time the party will be put into positions to promote one at the expense of another until one by one the party manages to elevate one faction above the rest... gaining 7 mortal enemies in the process.
Some of which will be immediately and utterly killed off. After all, what's the point of becoming the power behind the throne if you can't use it to irrevocably eliminate your enemies?
Incidentally, the scout would have only made 3 death saves. If you fail three, you're dead. If you pass any of them, you're stable but unconscious until healed.
Just a minor point of order. If you didn't do it that way (AND if you're playing 4e, which is what I'm assuming), you may want to retcon that the scout didn't die....if the player actually wants to keep the character alive.
I'm not sure this is the case. It doesn't jive with the Player's Handbook or anything I've read before, and it seems like the vast majority of PCs would get knocked out and stabilize immediately with these rules. The Player's Handbook says that the player makes a roll every round until they rest, and if they fail three rolls during this period the character dies. A roll of 10-19 has no effect on the character.
Incidentally, the scout would have only made 3 death saves. If you fail three, you're dead. If you pass any of them, you're stable but unconscious until healed.
Just a minor point of order. If you didn't do it that way (AND if you're playing 4e, which is what I'm assuming), you may want to retcon that the scout didn't die....if the player actually wants to keep the character alive.
I'm not sure this is the case. It doesn't jive with the Player's Handbook or anything I've read before, and it seems like the vast majority of PCs would get knocked out and stabilize immediately with these rules. The Player's Handbook says that the player makes a roll every round until they rest, and if they fail three rolls during this period the character dies. A roll of 10-19 has no effect on the character.
Hmm, RC has the same language as well. Interesting. I am checking with Q&A/FAQ boards to verify which interpretation is correct, because as it stands you're right and my group and I have been Doin' It Rong™ this whole time.
The trick is under the Heal skill. It lets you stabilize a dying PC, so they don't have to keep making DSTs. I'd been assuming that same benefit applied for passing a DST.
I got dropped to negative eleven hit points, and then the cleric got knocked unconscious (save ends). The DM was taking the party prisoner. The Psion pretty much refused to surrender, even after the warlock and thief did. I made my first save, but failed the next two, and after the psion had put up a fight for three rounds after I dropped, I decided to point out to her that if my character dies he's going to haunt her.
So we got taken prisoner. But it was fun, because the psion refused to surrender, so we got to watch her try to take on a whole bunch of enemies all by herself. Very amusing.
Also, superior crossbow for an artificer, is it worth it? Cause it seems crossbow caster works wiht it, and it is completely better then a normal crossbow. not sure if it is better then a repeating crossbow.
Superior Crossbow is pretty good. It's the only +3 ranged weapon in the game, iirc.
And I just thought it was really amusing that the death save rules were relevant so soon after we'd hashed them out here.
Truth be told it was sort of dumb. The elven lady had us captured so she could recruit us to rescue her husband, but for whatever reason couldn't approach us directly, so she had to have us captured.
I mean, out of character, it's whatever and it didn't really irk me that badly. In character it just played out kind of dumb. But hey, level 9, so who cares!
Well, it really, really depends. Crossbow caster just lets you use it as an implement, so you don't get the proficiency bonus on non-weapon attacks anyway. To that end, no, it's not worth it.
But if you're making weapon attacks and already have crossbow expertise and are trying to tease out every last little bonus you can get, than yeah, it's worth it.
i guess it matters on if there are enough good weapon powers i want to use. Might just stick with the repeating crossbow, upgrade later, i'm an artificer after all, magic weapons aren't' hard for me to come by.
So in Black Crusade tonight I tore a Thunderhawk Gunship out of the sky with a single psychic assault from my unbound psyker. It wasn't even a particularly good roll (only got three hits).
And not, like, the rules for a Thunderhawk my gm had made up and were kind of crappy. The actual Thunderhawk rules from the Deathwatch books.
If I push I can get a Psy Rating of 10. That's Alpha Level power. And I had, what, 6k XP?
All right sure they aren't much use for anything else, but forget chaos marines, you want to kill shit in that game, play an unbound psyker. I can kill tanks with my mind. I tear apart space marines.
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CymrilSon, we just crossed the street.Registered Userregular
i guess it matters on if there are enough good weapon powers i want to use. Might just stick with the repeating crossbow, upgrade later, i'm an artificer after all, magic weapons aren't' hard for me to come by.
I could be mistaken here, and I'll be assed if I'm going to look it up, but aren't most non-summon artificer powers weapon attacks, including most of their buffs?
e: Well, like half of those can we used with a wand, but still.
Cymril on
Shut up Francis. Something about Vietnam. Horseshit.
D3: Cymril#1411 || League of Legends/Steam/Xbox/Origin: Cymril
Decided to bail on LFR tonight. Just not feeling so hot. Which means I'm done gaming for the year, but it's all good. I gotta start planning for when I pick up DMing for our weekly game anyway. Time to plot!
i guess it matters on if there are enough good weapon powers i want to use. Might just stick with the repeating crossbow, upgrade later, i'm an artificer after all, magic weapons aren't' hard for me to come by.
I could be mistaken here, and I'll be assed if I'm going to look it up, but aren't most non-summon artificer powers weapon attacks, including most of their buffs?
e: Well, like half of those can we used with a wand, but still.
nah, they have a lot of implement attacks. you can make an all weapons all the time artificer, but it seems to lose some effect.
Also guys, New Member To Monster Party: Centaur Monk.
Still open: Rogue, Ranger, Barbarian, Druid.
same rules as always. Has to be better then a normal player races at the class, can't just be a monster race that if they take levels take levels in that class.
Only exception is Bigger Fighter, who is a cloud giant i think?
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CymrilSon, we just crossed the street.Registered Userregular
Also guys, New Member To Monster Party: Centaur Monk.
Still open: Rogue, Ranger, Barbarian, Druid.
same rules as always. Has to be better then a normal player races at the class, can't just be a monster race that if they take levels take levels in that class.
Only exception is Bigger Fighter, who is a cloud giant i think?
What's this then?
Shut up Francis. Something about Vietnam. Horseshit.
D3: Cymril#1411 || League of Legends/Steam/Xbox/Origin: Cymril
Terry, The Bigger fighter. He is bigger then most fighters.
Also the joke with him is despite being literally a giant, he looks pretty much exactly the same. everyone looks wildly different, he just has a different hue and is taller.
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CymrilSon, we just crossed the street.Registered Userregular
C-Can I join?
No idea what to play, or what the rules are.
Shut up Francis. Something about Vietnam. Horseshit.
D3: Cymril#1411 || League of Legends/Steam/Xbox/Origin: Cymril
This is typically the beginning of the end. then next week is goign to be difficult and then the next and then soon, you're drunk in a bowling ally talking about cool ideas you had.
Or maybe it's just me.
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AntimatterDevo Was RightGates of SteelRegistered Userregular
Anyone who has run or been in a number of online games can tell ya they are a fragile creature. I'm sure we're all thick headed enough to make it stay alive though.
Gorilla Suit's game has survived a long ass time, I'm sure blank can do as well.
Posts
Incidentally, the scout would have only made 3 death saves. If you fail three, you're dead. If you pass any of them, you're stable but unconscious until healed.
Just a minor point of order. If you didn't do it that way (AND if you're playing 4e, which is what I'm assuming), you may want to retcon that the scout didn't die....if the player actually wants to keep the character alive.
This comes with Backstory.
Skip ahead a few level and they've been maintaining a wary relationship of provoked disinterest and dancing around the fact that both blame each other for events that transpired. They discover the Prince has a thing they want, and to get back in his good books, they agree to run a mission for him. Take object A to point B.
This is where it got interesting. On route to point B, they were met by Wizard cabal who has, on occasion, kidnapped, manipulated and imprisoned party for their own ends, although only to further their own goals - the party are incidental pawns, a tool to be used when the situation demands, then to be put aside until needed again (because only a fool destroys something before they have got full use out of it). To say it was an antagonistic relationship would be discourtious; however, in the past, when their interests have aligned (rarely) the party has come out ahead.
The Cabal offered a simple proposition Do not deliver Object A to point B. Instead, they take INSANELY POWERFUL MAGIC ITEM and go do something else. Anything else. Just don't deliver the item.
So, two competing factions, both of which the party doesn't have much reason to like. One is vaguely amoral, the other very amoral, but neither is entirely good or evil. Abigious goals they don't understand, causes and requests they don't know the implications of. They like one slightly more, but the other is more trustworthy, and the competing value of the party's word is balanced by a very powerful carrot.
The nuances and subtletys can't really be carried here, but I'm running a very shades-of-grey campaign where nothing is clear and everyone is out for their own goals and motivations and the discussion that went around and around the table about this one simple offer consumed half the session.
It was some of the most deep and searching quandries I've put in front of my players yet, and it was seriously, seriously fun.
If someone's offering you something you want for a "simple job"?
It ain't that simple. Details or no dice.
Of course, sometimes that someone is just keeping quiet because they're assholes who like having secrets, and then you're screwing everyone over. But hey, it hits the assholes too! Victory!
Why I fear the ocean.
It's so... noir.
I'm not sure this is the case. It doesn't jive with the Player's Handbook or anything I've read before, and it seems like the vast majority of PCs would get knocked out and stabilize immediately with these rules. The Player's Handbook says that the player makes a roll every round until they rest, and if they fail three rolls during this period the character dies. A roll of 10-19 has no effect on the character.
Hmm, RC has the same language as well. Interesting. I am checking with Q&A/FAQ boards to verify which interpretation is correct, because as it stands you're right and my group and I have been Doin' It Rong™ this whole time.
e: Confirmed. You are correct! My bad!
The trick is under the Heal skill. It lets you stabilize a dying PC, so they don't have to keep making DSTs. I'd been assuming that same benefit applied for passing a DST.
That's....*grins evilly*
As well, failed death throws count until the encounter ends.
so if you go down, fail two, but then roll a 20 you're back up, but if you go down and fail again, dead.
My characters with a penchant for getting knocked down and then rolling a twenty may have been significantly more short lived.
I got dropped to negative eleven hit points, and then the cleric got knocked unconscious (save ends). The DM was taking the party prisoner. The Psion pretty much refused to surrender, even after the warlock and thief did. I made my first save, but failed the next two, and after the psion had put up a fight for three rounds after I dropped, I decided to point out to her that if my character dies he's going to haunt her.
So we got taken prisoner. But it was fun, because the psion refused to surrender, so we got to watch her try to take on a whole bunch of enemies all by herself. Very amusing.
This is what To the Death means guys! come on!
And I just thought it was really amusing that the death save rules were relevant so soon after we'd hashed them out here.
Truth be told it was sort of dumb. The elven lady had us captured so she could recruit us to rescue her husband, but for whatever reason couldn't approach us directly, so she had to have us captured.
I mean, out of character, it's whatever and it didn't really irk me that badly. In character it just played out kind of dumb. But hey, level 9, so who cares!
And yeah, we had a similar thing happen. we're not killing the guy ho did that to hire us, so keep an eye out for inconsistencies.
But if you're making weapon attacks and already have crossbow expertise and are trying to tease out every last little bonus you can get, than yeah, it's worth it.
is anyone interested in talking some DM Stuff
To the death?
No. Too easy. You just roll up a new character.
To the Pain.
Why I fear the ocean.
And not, like, the rules for a Thunderhawk my gm had made up and were kind of crappy. The actual Thunderhawk rules from the Deathwatch books.
If I push I can get a Psy Rating of 10. That's Alpha Level power. And I had, what, 6k XP?
All right sure they aren't much use for anything else, but forget chaos marines, you want to kill shit in that game, play an unbound psyker. I can kill tanks with my mind. I tear apart space marines.
I could be mistaken here, and I'll be assed if I'm going to look it up, but aren't most non-summon artificer powers weapon attacks, including most of their buffs?
e: Well, like half of those can we used with a wand, but still.
D3: Cymril#1411 || League of Legends/Steam/Xbox/Origin: Cymril
nah, they have a lot of implement attacks. you can make an all weapons all the time artificer, but it seems to lose some effect.
Also guys, New Member To Monster Party: Centaur Monk.
Still open: Rogue, Ranger, Barbarian, Druid.
same rules as always. Has to be better then a normal player races at the class, can't just be a monster race that if they take levels take levels in that class.
Only exception is Bigger Fighter, who is a cloud giant i think?
What's this then?
D3: Cymril#1411 || League of Legends/Steam/Xbox/Origin: Cymril
Where the heck have you been?
So monster party, is a once normal adventuring party until the wizard went insane, now the party is:
Nymph Paladin, Bigger fighter (cloud giant?), Medusa Sorcerer, Troll Wizard, Angel Cleric, and introducing Centaur Monk.
dude can run either 50 mph or 100. i am not sure if double move was a thing in 3.x.
Also the joke with him is despite being literally a giant, he looks pretty much exactly the same. everyone looks wildly different, he just has a different hue and is taller.
No idea what to play, or what the rules are.
D3: Cymril#1411 || League of Legends/Steam/Xbox/Origin: Cymril
to get it to work it requires like a level 14 3.5 DnD game, and no one wants to do that.
ever.
So it's just idea slinging.
But then it is the book of vile darkness. it makes some sense.
This is typically the beginning of the end. then next week is goign to be difficult and then the next and then soon, you're drunk in a bowling ally talking about cool ideas you had.
Or maybe it's just me.
also it's called teasing.
Anyone who has run or been in a number of online games can tell ya they are a fragile creature. I'm sure we're all thick headed enough to make it stay alive though.
Gorilla Suit's game has survived a long ass time, I'm sure blank can do as well.
When my games die I usually have another one started within the month, probably with the exact same players as the last game, plus or minus a few.
Or someone gets busy, can't show up, and the game dies.
Happens in real life games as well, but less frequently as most people can at least reason it as going out and doing something.