I'm pretty sure it was already posted, but Maggie Haberman at the NYT wrote a nice little article about yesterday in Trump Tower. Some choice quotes:
But he was criticized for ending his statement with a dig at the Clintons and for not apologizing to his wife, Melania, in his remarks. To him, the criticism was an affirmation that “nothing he can say or do” would reduce the hostility directed his way, according to one of the people with knowledge of how he feels.
Other advisers assured Mr. Trump that attacking Mrs. Clinton over her husband’s behavior with women, and over reports that she had defended his behavior, would help rally Republicans again.
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AbsalonLands of Always WinterRegistered Userregular
And did the Emails Wikileaks released contain any thing bad? I'm seeimg a lot of carefully cut quotes online to make what she said fit the authors intentions, so its hard to say.
Not anything we didn't already know i.e. behind closed doors she supports free trade, open borders and Wall Street self-regulation. But there's nothing in there equivalent to the "47%" slip-up of yesteryear.
Except none of that is true.
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HakkekageSpace Whore Academysumma cum laudeRegistered Userregular
So are we going to start seeing this impact the nowcast? Clinton's big surge after the first debate was within 2-3 days.
Of course we may also be at the point where Trump's remaining supporters don't give a shit, and Clinton is embedding her lead but not really increasing it.
That does not surprise me at all, and Mark Burnett is also a racist, though smarter about it. If you ever want to have a real hilarious time, watch for the way black contestants are cast and edited on Survivor. Juuuuuuust a few stereotypes.
Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
So Chuck Todd on Meet The Press impressed me. Pressing Giuliani on sexual assault vs words, then when he uses wikileaks to attack Hillary about private vs public persona turns it right back to Trump's private person on the Access Hollywood bus...
e: Also the incredulity in Todd's voice when Giuliani goes Full Breitbart.
Holy shit, a reporter actually being a reporter. It's about time we saw that on TV news. If only they'd do that more often.
So are we going to start seeing this impact the nowcast? Clinton's big surge after the first debate was within 2-3 days.
Of course we may also be at the point where Trump's remaining supporters don't give a shit, and Clinton is embedding her lead but not really increasing it.
People were poised to take polls after the debate and some of that was increases she was already about to get: this one should take at least four or five days to show up.
Parliament knew that they shouldn't call a referendum, that it was stupid economically, socially, and politically. But they did it for stunt points to solidify their base and party. Then it fucking passed, and now they're all frantically trying to figure out what the fuck to do, because despite calling the referendum, that's exactly what they *didn't* want to happen.
The American Media is alike to Britain's conservative party. The media knew that Trump was completely unpresidential, yet all through the primary cycle they gave him press time, free advertising, and never highlighted the numerous, on record things that showed how utterly irresponsible it would be to nominate him. The media never thought he would get nominated, but then, thanks to their portrayal....
Fuck, he's nominated. Alright, well, he'll never win the presidency, right? Wrong. The media has given him such a helping hand early in the election and all through the primaries that now they're scrambling to fix their Brexit. The news is 24/7 calling on his buffoonery, so much that even Fox news is doing it, because they done goofed and don't want Trump to be the American BrExit.
All in all: Fuck you, American Media. Stop playing poker with my future.
I disagree heartily that they never highlighted the awful things he's said and done
how did we know them so well? all of his awfulness was on TV CONSTANTLY
yet, he still had support. those people who are still supporting him now? they don't care what the media says. that is, not only do they generally not trust them but they also don't really care about awful things trump has said and done.
I know it's nice to blame the media and pretend they really have this much power because it makes the world seem orderly, makes the devil really obvious. unfortunately it's just not true.
VariableMouth CongressStroke Me Lady FameRegistered Userregular
I don't feel liek him saying the n word would really mean anything at this point unless the context is particularly awful. I doubt there's a single person that would be surprised by it and anyone paying attention already knows he's a racist. those that don't won't be convinced of it just because he used a slur.
You can be as racist as you want in American politics, but you have to frame it in a certain way.
Using the n-word is not one of those ways. That's the point where even other racists will start distancing themselves from you, in order to demonstrate that they themselves are Not Racist.
It's hardly a secret that Hollywood has a pretty massive issue with sexually exploiting women
Donald Trump's objectification of women fits right in.
Yeah. The whole "You'll never work in this town again!" dynamic allows a lot of horrific bullshit to continue unopposed. Absent major cultural change, I would support legislation that would allow someone to sue based on future lifetime career earning in that town, since that's the only way to even come close to evening out that dynamic.
You can be as racist as you want in American politics, but you have to frame it in a certain way.
Using the n-word is not one of those ways. That's the point where even other racists will start distancing themselves from you, in order to demonstrate that they themselves are Not Racist.
The trouble is that the GOP has cultivated an ignorant, racist base who no longer give a shit about the rules of decorum. The establishment types are caught in a trap where they either have to support a candidate who spouts this shit or risk losing the support of a base who actively wants leaders who go on TV and spout racist and sexist bullshit.
The only sliver of light in this is that it looks like GOP women are statistically slightly less likely to go along with this at the voting booth. That's because they know well enough that they live at the knife's edge of this trend - sexist leaders will ultimately fuck them and their daughters in the workplace and heighten their risk for sexual assault.
I'm pretty sure it was already posted, but Maggie Haberman at the NYT wrote a nice little article about yesterday in Trump Tower. Some choice quotes:
But he was criticized for ending his statement with a dig at the Clintons and for not apologizing to his wife, Melania, in his remarks. To him, the criticism was an affirmation that “nothing he can say or do” would reduce the hostility directed his way, according to one of the people with knowledge of how he feels.
Other advisers assured Mr. Trump that attacking Mrs. Clinton over her husband’s behavior with women, and over reports that she had defended his behavior, would help rally Republicans again.
I DIDN'T WANT TO SAY I'M SORRY, BUT YOU MADE ME, AND NOW LOOK THEY'RE STILL ANGRY AT ME, I HATE YOU
Donald Trump is seriously a 70 year old child
A trap is for fish: when you've got the fish, you can forget the trap. A snare is for rabbits: when you've got the rabbit, you can forget the snare. Words are for meaning: when you've got the meaning, you can forget the words.
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AbsalonLands of Always WinterRegistered Userregular
I mean, people are playing it off as "Oh man, 90% of his base will stick with him."
Losing 10% of your base is a big freaking deal. That's 4 points. He only led *Alaska* by three in a recent poll. Trump losing four points from where he was right before the tapes come out means we'll spend election night rooting for Texas to put her over 400 EVs.
I'm fairly certain dropping the N word is "even worse", not because anyone will be surprised by it, but instead because it's going to create an even more clear voting divide among the GOP base. That's the kind of thing that will get Republicans at each other's throats defending and arguing against it.
Edit: To clarify, on a personal, voter level. Not the reps. Joe and Jake arguing.
I don't feel liek him saying the n word would really mean anything at this point unless the context is particularly awful. I doubt there's a single person that would be surprised by it and anyone paying attention already knows he's a racist. those that don't won't be convinced of it just because he used a slur.
We said the same thing about his history of mysoginy but only an actual tape about it is what made an impact.
Just remember that half the people you meet are below average intelligence.
Yeah, Trump can't afford to lose even a single point in the popular vote. He was already likely to lose based on post-debate numbers last week. So nothing short of an incredibly successful debate will save him from the fallout of this I think even if "almost" all of his support remains.
There's zero chance that trump saying the N word doesn't tank him further.
There will be a lot of people defending it with "it's old, who cares" and "boys will be boys", but it'll ring hollow and he'll shed voters. The fact there are voters who would stick with him throughout it is unpleasant, but that doesn't mean every one of his voters is that way.
I'm fairly certain dropping the N word is "even worse", not because anyone will be surprised by it, but instead because it's going to create an even more clear voting divide among the GOP base. That's the kind of thing that will get Republicans at each other's throats defending and arguing against it.
Edit: To clarify, on a personal, voter level. Not the reps. Joe and Jake arguing.
Sadly, I don't think you'll find as many conservatives as you think that would care too much privately about direct racism. There's just too much racism ingrained in the party hidden by "law and order" and "bootstraps" rhetoric. Racism runs deep even in the suit and tie faction.
That's why this is so damaging. Trump spitting racial slurs get tut-tutted. Trump directly saying he likes to sexual assault women gets the "My wife/daughter/sister may have to deal with this shit" reaction.
SteevLWhat can I do for you?Registered Userregular
I'm definitely seeing a lot of downplaying of Trump's thing in my FB feed today. It's either "these comments were from 11 years ago!" or "But the Clintons did this!"
I actually am a little on edge about the debate tonight, if only because things are so unpredictable now.
For those who can't see embedded tweets, it's a reply to someone who said the "if you've ever quoted rap lyrics..." thing:
"Uh, wickey wild wild
Wicky wicky wild
Wickey wild, wicky wicky wild wild wild west"
I'm fairly certain dropping the N word is "even worse", not because anyone will be surprised by it, but instead because it's going to create an even more clear voting divide among the GOP base. That's the kind of thing that will get Republicans at each other's throats defending and arguing against it.
Edit: To clarify, on a personal, voter level. Not the reps. Joe and Jake arguing.
Sadly, I don't think you'll find as many conservatives as you think that would care too much privately about direct racism. There's just too much racism ingrained in the party hidden by "law and order" and "bootstraps" rhetoric. Racism runs deep even in the suit and tie faction.
That's why this is so damaging. Trump spitting racial slurs get tut-tutted. Trump directly saying he likes to sexual assault women gets the "My wife/daughter/sister may have to deal with this shit" reaction.
Trump has not, if I recall, been taped saying any racial slurs. He has said a lot of racist and bigoted things, yes, but that's "acceptable" to a lot of people while direct slurs aren't. "I'm not bigoted, but there are some bad ones" is a pretty standard refrain; "I'm not bigoted, but fuck the *slurs*" is not.
There's zero chance that trump saying the N word doesn't tank him further.
There will be a lot of people defending it with "it's old, who cares" and "boys will be boys", but it'll ring hollow and he'll shed voters. The fact there are voters who would stick with him throughout it is unpleasant, but that doesn't mean every one of his voters is that way.
Yes, there are people that will argue till blue in the face that the only thing valid to call racism is the N word.
Actually having documented usage of that would shred the last line of defence.
So Chuck Todd on Meet The Press impressed me. Pressing Giuliani on sexual assault vs words, then when he uses wikileaks to attack Hillary about private vs public persona turns it right back to Trump's private person on the Access Hollywood bus...
e: Also the incredulity in Todd's voice when Giuliani goes Full Breitbart.
Holy shit, a reporter actually being a reporter. It's about time we saw that on TV news. If only they'd do that more often.
I'm starting to wonder if Trump is holding some of Guliani's family members hostage.
"We need someone who will say the words 'Radical Islamic Terrorism' so we can finally defeat them."
Wow, I had no idea that the President of the United States merely speaking those words aloud would cast the magic spell that would cleanse ISIS & Co. from the Earth!
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wait. it gets better:
But Trump using the n-word could drive up right-wing enthusiasm, so maybe the tapes shouldn't be released.
I wouldn't bet $5 million in the hole on this unless I had the most ironclad contract ever written by mankind.
Except none of that is true.
" He says what I'm thinking !"
NNID: Hakkekage
That basket of deplorables...it wasn't nice to say, but it wasn't wrong.
Of course we may also be at the point where Trump's remaining supporters don't give a shit, and Clinton is embedding her lead but not really increasing it.
An actual defense of the trump tapes.... *vomits in mouth as brain dies a little more*
What an absolutely reprehensible piece of human garbage. That clip makes me physically ill.
People were poised to take polls after the debate and some of that was increases she was already about to get: this one should take at least four or five days to show up.
Pre-defined penalty for breaking an nda. To be fair, those things protect not shitheel people as well.
I disagree heartily that they never highlighted the awful things he's said and done
how did we know them so well? all of his awfulness was on TV CONSTANTLY
yet, he still had support. those people who are still supporting him now? they don't care what the media says. that is, not only do they generally not trust them but they also don't really care about awful things trump has said and done.
I know it's nice to blame the media and pretend they really have this much power because it makes the world seem orderly, makes the devil really obvious. unfortunately it's just not true.
Using the n-word is not one of those ways. That's the point where even other racists will start distancing themselves from you, in order to demonstrate that they themselves are Not Racist.
Yeah. The whole "You'll never work in this town again!" dynamic allows a lot of horrific bullshit to continue unopposed. Absent major cultural change, I would support legislation that would allow someone to sue based on future lifetime career earning in that town, since that's the only way to even come close to evening out that dynamic.
The trouble is that the GOP has cultivated an ignorant, racist base who no longer give a shit about the rules of decorum. The establishment types are caught in a trap where they either have to support a candidate who spouts this shit or risk losing the support of a base who actively wants leaders who go on TV and spout racist and sexist bullshit.
The only sliver of light in this is that it looks like GOP women are statistically slightly less likely to go along with this at the voting booth. That's because they know well enough that they live at the knife's edge of this trend - sexist leaders will ultimately fuck them and their daughters in the workplace and heighten their risk for sexual assault.
I DIDN'T WANT TO SAY I'M SORRY, BUT YOU MADE ME, AND NOW LOOK THEY'RE STILL ANGRY AT ME, I HATE YOU
Donald Trump is seriously a 70 year old child
Hmmmmmm.
Losing 10% of your base is a big freaking deal. That's 4 points. He only led *Alaska* by three in a recent poll. Trump losing four points from where he was right before the tapes come out means we'll spend election night rooting for Texas to put her over 400 EVs.
Edit: To clarify, on a personal, voter level. Not the reps. Joe and Jake arguing.
We said the same thing about his history of mysoginy but only an actual tape about it is what made an impact.
A. As it happens, I have never quoted rap lyrics.
B. Quoting something without sharing the intent is not the same as saying it yourself.
that would be catastrophic for the R undercard
*rubs hands together with glee*
There will be a lot of people defending it with "it's old, who cares" and "boys will be boys", but it'll ring hollow and he'll shed voters. The fact there are voters who would stick with him throughout it is unpleasant, but that doesn't mean every one of his voters is that way.
That's bad for him. He was in the 80s and his hope for getting it close was to get it into the 90s. He's losing ground.
Sadly, I don't think you'll find as many conservatives as you think that would care too much privately about direct racism. There's just too much racism ingrained in the party hidden by "law and order" and "bootstraps" rhetoric. Racism runs deep even in the suit and tie faction.
That's why this is so damaging. Trump spitting racial slurs get tut-tutted. Trump directly saying he likes to sexual assault women gets the "My wife/daughter/sister may have to deal with this shit" reaction.
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I actually am a little on edge about the debate tonight, if only because things are so unpredictable now.
People have been having fun with that on twitter:
For those who can't see embedded tweets, it's a reply to someone who said the "if you've ever quoted rap lyrics..." thing:
"Uh, wickey wild wild
Wicky wicky wild
Wickey wild, wicky wicky wild wild wild west"
My Backloggery
Is this good or bad
Steam: adamjnet
Trump has not, if I recall, been taped saying any racial slurs. He has said a lot of racist and bigoted things, yes, but that's "acceptable" to a lot of people while direct slurs aren't. "I'm not bigoted, but there are some bad ones" is a pretty standard refrain; "I'm not bigoted, but fuck the *slurs*" is not.
Bad.... FOR OBAMA!
Yes, there are people that will argue till blue in the face that the only thing valid to call racism is the N word.
Actually having documented usage of that would shred the last line of defence.
I made a game, it has penguins in it. It's pay what you like on Gumroad.
Currently Ebaying Nothing at all but I might do in the future.
"We need someone who will say the words 'Radical Islamic Terrorism' so we can finally defeat them."
Wow, I had no idea that the President of the United States merely speaking those words aloud would cast the magic spell that would cleanse ISIS & Co. from the Earth!
Rock Band DLC | GW:OttW - arrcd | WLD - Thortar
It would translate to him losing 2-3 points in the overall national polling.