I think, if I have one criticism to level against Deltarune, it's that ACT has to some extent become "Fight" against a parallel HP. Whereas in Undertale you'd occasionally have ACTs that were flat-out wrong or needed to be executed in sequence, once your party members get their own ACTs, it's effectively impossible to use ACT without raising the enemy's Mercy level. It's become more mechanical and less story-driven, I guess is what I'm saying.
My favorite musical instrument is the air-raid siren.
I think, if I have one criticism to level against Deltarune, it's that ACT has to some extent become "Fight" against a parallel HP. Whereas in Undertale you'd occasionally have ACTs that were flat-out wrong or needed to be executed in sequence, once your party members get their own ACTs, it's effectively impossible to use ACT without raising the enemy's Mercy level. It's become more mechanical and less story-driven, I guess is what I'm saying.
I get that.
My hope is that further chapters expand the party ACT concept to more interesting options. Chapter 2 shook up a few of the mechanics seen in chapter 1 (including adding the party acts), so I hope they work on it as they go.
I do like having the party ACT, mind. Prior to getting it, there wasn't a lot you could do as Susie in a mercy run besides defend, unless you used a Kris/Susie ACT that turn.
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AbsalonLands of Always WinterRegistered Userregular
Ralsei is constantly on Kris' person all the time, or something, as an explanation for his ability to move from fountainworld to fountainworld without issue (and his strange ability to know in which unused classroom the fountain from Chapter 1 showed up). Could he be the knife?
I’ve heard someone suggest that maybe Kris and Asriel have a set of paired lockets, like [name] and Asriel did in Undertale. And maybe Kris’s locket becomes Ralsei.
I saw someone else speculate that Ralsei is a personification of the set of fake horns Kris wore when they were younger. The red ones Toriel got for them when they asked when their horns were growing in. And that'd be why Ralsei's horns are pink.
I wonder if Ralsei is the only Darkner resident that knows that Darkners are based on/emanate from objects in the Lightner world. None of the others seem to be aware of that or comment on it, except for the Queen who says she is a computer and apparently doesn't care?
Also the soundtrack is up on Spotify. Happy feet dumbass!!
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Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
Listening to Toby when he talks about the game (especially in the 6th anniversary livestream) it seems he makes a lot of choices based on gameplay first. If he can't make something work in a way that is actually interesting to play, he moves on from it. I think he did mention he hit a wall with regards to the Undertale ACT being more story based, and in addition, having more than one party member essentially meant it had to become more systematic like it is now.
The benefit to that though, is ACT is actually much more gameplay oriented with actual inputs involved in them. That likely was the goal as well, to make it more of a game and less a sort of choose your own adventure combat.
Listening to Toby when he talks about the game (especially in the 6th anniversary livestream) it seems he makes a lot of choices based on gameplay first. If he can't make something work in a way that is actually interesting to play, he moves on from it. I think he did mention he hit a wall with regards to the Undertale ACT being more story based, and in addition, having more than one party member essentially meant it had to become more systematic like it is now.
The benefit to that though, is ACT is actually much more gameplay oriented with actual inputs involved in them. That likely was the goal as well, to make it more of a game and less a sort of choose your own adventure combat.
Right, I actually like the movement towards ACTs with gameplay elements to them, and it seems like the natural progression of the ACT system once the novelty of it wears off
For instance, throwing characters, or changing the color shades of the swatches, or catching the mice, or doing the houses puzzle, etc
A detail I found interesting at the end of the game, and I can't remember if this was visible in chapter 1:
When you check out the headstones in the graveyard, mention "an [item] for [a profession]", and you learn that Gerson's grave contains the hammer he used early in his life.
It's an interesting funerary rite, that is, and one that makes sense. Monsters don't leave anything behind when they die; their bodies vanish into dust. So, to mark their life, and remember that they were here, their graves contain an item that represents what they did in life.
A detail I found interesting at the end of the game, and I can't remember if this was visible in chapter 1:
When you check out the headstones in the graveyard, mention "an [item] for [a profession]", and you learn that Gerson's grave contains the hammer he used early in his life.
It's an interesting funerary rite, that is, and one that makes sense. Monsters don't leave anything behind when they die; their bodies vanish into dust. So, to mark their life, and remember that they were here, their graves contain an item that represents what they did in life.
Alright having beat the chapter and watched a vid of the 'Weird' route I have to speculate a little.
So it seems pretty clear that Kris and the Soul we control are two separate entities. My question is has the soul been around prior to us controlling it? (And by extension is the soul literally supposed to be the player, or merely an existing entity we happen to play as)
Some points.
Soulless Kris as we've seen them would be extremely noticeable. Suggesting prior to the game he has been ensouled.
Despite there being hints that Kris lacks empathy. They seem to have an emotional reaction to both the 'weird' route and the bonus boss fight independent to the Soul. And to certain other things like Hot Chocolate bringing back memories or the Door south of town.
Kris clearly acts differently with the player controlled soul compared to how the characters talk about him. So Ensouled but not by our Soul?
The Soul can seemingly influence/observe others but not directly control them as they can Kris.
I've seen speculation that Ralsie deliberately distracted the Soul's attention to communicate with Kris. This seems likely as when he mentions wondering about what Susie is doing and we cut to her, we apparently miss a conversation between Ralsei and Kris. Also the fact that he can apparently move between Dark Worlds is suspicious. The speculation that his item form is Kris's knife seems plausible. It does seem like he knows more then he's letting on.
My best guess is Kris somehow lost his Soul just prior to the game starting (Probably involving whatever is behind the Mystery Door). Which created an opening for the Soul to take control. However they've got sufficient Determination that they can still act independently without it. Possibly they created the initial Fountain in this state right before the game begins. This also seems to suggest Kris and Ralsei were aware of the Soul prior to this point. Otherwise they'd have no reason to distract it's attention.
So if the opening of Chapter 1 is taken into account that seems to be the point where the player Soul entered Kris. However Kris prepared for it (Setting up the birdcage). If the narrator of the opening was Gaster, it could be that Kris encountered him beyond the door, lost his soul. And Gastor/Kris/Ralsei have for some reason engineered the Soul's involvement.
Alright having beat the chapter and watched a vid of the 'Weird' route I have to speculate a little.
So it seems pretty clear that Kris and the Soul we control are two separate entities. My question is has the soul been around prior to us controlling it? (And by extension is the soul literally supposed to be the player, or merely an existing entity we happen to play as)
Some points.
Soulless Kris as we've seen them would be extremely noticeable. Suggesting prior to the game he has been ensouled.
Despite there being hints that Kris lacks empathy. They seem to have an emotional reaction to both the 'weird' route and the bonus boss fight independent to the Soul. And to certain other things like Hot Chocolate bringing back memories or the Door south of town.
Kris clearly acts differently with the player controlled soul compared to how the characters talk about him. So Ensouled but not by our Soul?
The Soul can seemingly influence/observe others but not directly control them as they can Kris.
I've seen speculation that Ralsie deliberately distracted the Soul's attention to communicate with Kris. This seems likely as when he mentions wondering about what Susie is doing and we cut to her, we apparently miss a conversation between Ralsei and Kris. Also the fact that he can apparently move between Dark Worlds is suspicious. The speculation that his item form is Kris's knife seems plausible. It does seem like he knows more then he's letting on.
My best guess is Kris somehow lost his Soul just prior to the game starting (Probably involving whatever is behind the Mystery Door). Which created an opening for the Soul to take control. However they've got sufficient Determination that they can still act independently without it. Possibly they created the initial Fountain in this state right before the game begins. This also seems to suggest Kris and Ralsei were aware of the Soul prior to this point. Otherwise they'd have no reason to distract it's attention.
So if the opening of Chapter 1 is taken into account that seems to be the point where the player Soul entered Kris. However Kris prepared for it (Setting up the birdcage). If the narrator of the opening was Gaster, it could be that Kris encountered him beyond the door, lost his soul. And Gastor/Kris/Ralsei have for some reason engineered the Soul's involvement.
The way I put it to a friend of mine, I think the SOUL is legitimately Kris's, and we've somehow become attached to it (there's references to Kris and Catti doing research into the occult and something having happened in the dark space past the doors south of town). All of our influence over Kris is mediated through the SOUL. Kris has to remove their SOUL to act independently of us, and just so happens to be able to survive-- albeit temporarily-- without it for short periods. Kris's spasmodic gestures are a consequence of having removed some pretty hefty control structures from their body.
My favorite musical instrument is the air-raid siren.
Alright having beat the chapter and watched a vid of the 'Weird' route I have to speculate a little.
So it seems pretty clear that Kris and the Soul we control are two separate entities. My question is has the soul been around prior to us controlling it? (And by extension is the soul literally supposed to be the player, or merely an existing entity we happen to play as)
Some points.
Soulless Kris as we've seen them would be extremely noticeable. Suggesting prior to the game he has been ensouled.
Despite there being hints that Kris lacks empathy. They seem to have an emotional reaction to both the 'weird' route and the bonus boss fight independent to the Soul. And to certain other things like Hot Chocolate bringing back memories or the Door south of town.
Kris clearly acts differently with the player controlled soul compared to how the characters talk about him. So Ensouled but not by our Soul?
The Soul can seemingly influence/observe others but not directly control them as they can Kris.
I've seen speculation that Ralsie deliberately distracted the Soul's attention to communicate with Kris. This seems likely as when he mentions wondering about what Susie is doing and we cut to her, we apparently miss a conversation between Ralsei and Kris. Also the fact that he can apparently move between Dark Worlds is suspicious. The speculation that his item form is Kris's knife seems plausible. It does seem like he knows more then he's letting on.
My best guess is Kris somehow lost his Soul just prior to the game starting (Probably involving whatever is behind the Mystery Door). Which created an opening for the Soul to take control. However they've got sufficient Determination that they can still act independently without it. Possibly they created the initial Fountain in this state right before the game begins. This also seems to suggest Kris and Ralsei were aware of the Soul prior to this point. Otherwise they'd have no reason to distract it's attention.
So if the opening of Chapter 1 is taken into account that seems to be the point where the player Soul entered Kris. However Kris prepared for it (Setting up the birdcage). If the narrator of the opening was Gaster, it could be that Kris encountered him beyond the door, lost his soul. And Gastor/Kris/Ralsei have for some reason engineered the Soul's involvement.
The way I put it to a friend of mine, I think the SOUL is legitimately Kris's, and we've somehow become attached to it (there's references to Kris and Catti doing research into the occult and something having happened in the dark space past the doors south of town). All of our influence over Kris is mediated through the SOUL. Kris has to remove their SOUL to act independently of us, and just so happens to be able to survive-- albeit temporarily-- without it for short periods. Kris's spasmodic gestures are a consequence of having removed some pretty hefty control structures from their body.
Personally, I think it’s as simple as we’re in control of the SOUL because we’re playing the game. Kris’s soul belongs to Kris, but is also what the game gives us command of. Kris needn’t have done anything weird to their SOUL; the player has control of whatever character the game assigns to them.
I think Kris’s SOUL was as normal, and Kris in control of themself, right up until the day that Chapter 1 takes place on.
Another thing to note is how the game’s save file uses the name “Kris” until the first time we save over it. Another thing pointing to Kris being in control until we show up.
Enlong on
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AbsalonLands of Always WinterRegistered Userregular
edited September 2021
Undertale
River Person: "Tra la la. Did you ever hear the old song coming from the sea?"
Deltarune chapter 2
Onionsan mentions hearing a song at night, that they have heard before, coming from the sea.
River Person: "Tra la la. Did you ever hear the old song coming from the sea?"
Deltarune chapter 2
Onionsan mentions hearing a song at night, that they have heard before, coming from the sea.
I do believe I missed the opportunity to meet Onionsan; a character told me how they did some stuff "yesterday", and a character I think is Onionsan showed up.
Speaking of that? Seam also said something about how I was missing a crystal that I could've got from Jevil (because I never encountered him in chapter 1). He then said something like: "Are you sure you never fought that clown? Well, if at some point, you remember doing that, at any time, you might find that missing crystal."
So like, could I finish my crystal collection if I were to make another save file, and fight Jevil there? I already hit the ending of chapter 2, so I don't think I have the opportunity to go back and talk to Seam in castle town to confirm it, though.
River Person: "Tra la la. Did you ever hear the old song coming from the sea?"
Deltarune chapter 2
Onionsan mentions hearing a song at night, that they have heard before, coming from the sea.
I do believe I missed the opportunity to meet Onionsan; a character told me how they did some stuff "yesterday", and a character I think is Onionsan showed up.
Speaking of that? Seam also said something about how I was missing a crystal that I could've got from Jevil (because I never encountered him in chapter 1). He then said something like: "Are you sure you never fought that clown? Well, if at some point, you remember doing that, at any time, you might find that missing crystal."
So like, could I finish my crystal collection if I were to make another save file, and fight Jevil there? I already hit the ending of chapter 2, so I don't think I have the opportunity to go back and talk to Seam in castle town to confirm it, though.
Yeah, if you beat Jevil in a different save file, you can pick up the dark crystal from the hole on the left side of town. I assume that will apply for all of the dark crystals, going forward. I don't know if there's any way to get around missing out on a few of the conversations in town though outside of just playing through again.
River Person: "Tra la la. Did you ever hear the old song coming from the sea?"
Deltarune chapter 2
Onionsan mentions hearing a song at night, that they have heard before, coming from the sea.
I do believe I missed the opportunity to meet Onionsan; a character told me how they did some stuff "yesterday", and a character I think is Onionsan showed up.
Speaking of that? Seam also said something about how I was missing a crystal that I could've got from Jevil (because I never encountered him in chapter 1). He then said something like: "Are you sure you never fought that clown? Well, if at some point, you remember doing that, at any time, you might find that missing crystal."
So like, could I finish my crystal collection if I were to make another save file, and fight Jevil there? I already hit the ending of chapter 2, so I don't think I have the opportunity to go back and talk to Seam in castle town to confirm it, though.
Yeah, if you beat Jevil in a different save file, you can pick up the dark crystal from the hole on the left side of town. I assume that will apply for all of the dark crystals, going forward. I don't know if there's any way to get around missing out on a few of the conversations in town though outside of just playing through again.
So, I went and checked, and it turns out I can load up my save files from Chapters 1 and 2. So I can totally go back and do the Jevil quest without playing through all of chapter 1 again. Missing NPC dialogue, yeah, I'm probably SOL there. Though I might see if that's something I can change, I dunno.
I've been thinking about Kris tearing out their soul. It kinda seems like they can do it at will, and they always put their soul back in after they've done whatever they were gonna do. We've been figuring they were unwillingly possessed by us or something, but I wonder if this setup is what they want?
From chapter 2 it seems like Deltarune is gonna be talking about escapism. I wonder if this might be a sort of escapism for Kris? A way to make friends and go on adventures with them, but without having to really confront the mortifying ordeal of being known, since they're in the passenger seat for most of it.
Would be a fitting motive for the player character, since that's kinda why we play these games too.
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NEO|PhyteThey follow the stars, bound together.Strands in a braid till the end.Registered Userregular
Lore/story speculation:
soulless Kris having a knife definitely draws parallels to Chara, perhaps somebody is planning to stab some of these world-razing Titans
It was that somehow, from within the derelict-horror, they had learned a way to see inside an ugly, broken thing... And take away its pain.
Warframe/Steam: NFyt
Spamton made quite the impression right away. When he suddenly whirled around and punched the dumpster, I was like "oh dear. I might actually be in some danger here." It was very sudden.
Spamton made quite the impression right away. When he suddenly whirled around and punched the dumpster, I was like "oh dear. I might actually be in some danger here." It was very sudden.
If you haven't already, if you go back to the Trash Zone after beating Spamton NEO, there's some text available that sheds some light on what specifically he's ranting about there.
My favorite musical instrument is the air-raid siren.
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Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
Apparently if you get Noelle to drink Susie tea (via inventory editing or whatever) it heals her for 400 HP and she thinks "Wonder if they sell this in gallons?"
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ApogeeLancks In Every Game EverRegistered Userregular
Apparently if you get Noelle to drink Susie tea (via inventory editing or whatever) it heals her for 400 HP and she thinks "Wonder if they sell this in gallons?"
She's a thirsty gal!
Is there any info on what happens between Susie and Noelle in Noelle's room in the Weird run? Seems like there are a lot of gaps...
Apparently if you get Noelle to drink Susie tea (via inventory editing or whatever) it heals her for 400 HP and she thinks "Wonder if they sell this in gallons?"
She's a thirsty gal!
Is there any info on what happens between Susie and Noelle in Noelle's room in the Weird run? Seems like there are a lot of gaps...
I've heard that a full Weird run has Noelle basically disappear between the Berdly fight and the final fight. So it's possible that there just isn't a Noelle's room scene.
Apparently if you get Noelle to drink Susie tea (via inventory editing or whatever) it heals her for 400 HP and she thinks "Wonder if they sell this in gallons?"
She's a thirsty gal!
Is there any info on what happens between Susie and Noelle in Noelle's room in the Weird run? Seems like there are a lot of gaps...
I've heard that a full Weird run has Noelle basically disappear between the Berdly fight and the final fight. So it's possible that there just isn't a Noelle's room scene.
Susie does go to Noelle's room in the weird run, but you don't get to see it.
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Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
No there is. The game goes on as normal after that. Noelle specifically says "I am going home now" but goes to her room in the castle.
Susie goes in to talk to her and Ralsei attempts to encourage you to "wonder what they are doing" to shift the view into the room. Which never happens, and Ralsei gets uncomfortable about this. Susie comes out unwilling to talk about what happened in the room but it seems implied in other scenes they still had a moment. Susie at least confirms she told Noelle "it is all just a dream" which seems to imply it would convince her the whole Snowgrave thing didn't happen. Likely that results in a coping mechanism for Noelle as she seems to act as if it didn't happen in the post Dark World ending scenes. She even comments about Susie's Tail which only happened in their scene in the room.
Most assume it went on as normal in there, but I feel like SOME aspect of what Kris and her did had to show. However, it seems like everything about Snowgrave is intentionally hidden from Susie and Ralsei though that whole not shifting the players view into the room thing bothering Ralsei implies he has some idea something went on.
The most interesting aspect of this is you can finish the game proper from that route, implying it can be used to move into Chapter 3. Which means it would have implications on how Chapter 3 goes.
Susie goes in to talk to her and Ralsei attempts to encourage you to "wonder what they are doing" to shift the view into the room. Which never happens, and Ralsei gets uncomfortable about this.
This to me is actually one of the most interesting parts of Side B. In both chapter 1 and in the normal route of chapter 2, you get a brief line from Ralsei as soon as you jump back to him and Kris, implying that he was chatting with Kris during the time that we (the player) weren't watching. I'm convinced that the reason Ralsei is so put off by this situation in Side B isn't because we apparently don't care about what Susie is doing, but rather because he was hoping to create a chance to discuss the situation with Kris.
AshtonDragon on
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Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
my random thought on the whole situation is that Ralsei was created by Kris when he created these Dark Worlds. It would be why he can just travel freely between them, and also why he just shows up in the Library computer room dark world without any intervention needed.
On that note, it would make sense he is disturbed by the "heart" not shifting into the room. The heart being the player. He likely knows the distinction between the two. I am not sure if it was with intent to have some secret convo, which would have to be with heartless Kris.
There is something that slightly counters this though. In the fight with Susie vs Lancer in that castle, the red heart flies from offscreen into the dodging area. During the stream with Toby, he specifically pointed out in response to conversations online about this being a bug that it was not, it was 100% intentional. This would confuse a lot of theories as it implies the heart did NOT leave Kris during Susie's onscreen time in Chapter 1. Only when it was relevant to combat.
my random thought on the whole situation is that Ralsei was created by Kris when he created these Dark Worlds. It would be why he can just travel freely between them, and also why he just shows up in the Library computer room dark world without any intervention needed.
On that note, it would make sense he is disturbed by the "heart" not shifting into the room. The heart being the player. He likely knows the distinction between the two. I am not sure if it was with intent to have some secret convo, which would have to be with heartless Kris.
There is something that slightly counters this though. In the fight with Susie vs Lancer in that castle, the red heart flies from offscreen into the dodging area. During the stream with Toby, he specifically pointed out in response to conversations online about this being a bug that it was not, it was 100% intentional. This would confuse a lot of theories as it implies the heart did NOT leave Kris during Susie's onscreen time in Chapter 1. Only when it was relevant to combat.
Perhaps, though it's not clear what the exact relationship between us as the player and the heart is: as in, maybe we literally are the heart itself, or maybe it's just the one physical thing that we have direct control over and existed prior to our gaining control over it. So maybe we don't always have to be in the same place as the heart; it's just the only thing we can move.
I mean, it's also like a metatextual object that we use to operate menus and stuff, so maybe it doesn't necessarily follow consistent rules and is just a storytelling device.
I feel it is a form of art. Much like tragedies in film and theater, I can appreciate how and why they're made. Doesn't mean that I ever want to watch Million Dollar Baby ever again. Holy fuck.
DisruptedCapitalist on
"Simple, real stupidity beats artificial intelligence every time." -Mustrum Ridcully in Terry Pratchett's Hogfather p. 142 (HarperPrism 1996)
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Kai_SanCommonly known as Klineshrike!Registered Userregular
i do like how toby fox seems to have the mindset of "can i make alternative game routes that are so uncomfortable that people just won't do them?"
I mean, his holloween hack of earthbound seems to still be tops in regards to that. It was likely teenage angst toby but still, the potential was always there.
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Andy JoeWe claim the land for the highlord!The AdirondacksRegistered Userregular
Posts
I get that.
My hope is that further chapters expand the party ACT concept to more interesting options. Chapter 2 shook up a few of the mechanics seen in chapter 1 (including adding the party acts), so I hope they work on it as they go.
I do like having the party ACT, mind. Prior to getting it, there wasn't a lot you could do as Susie in a mercy run besides defend, unless you used a Kris/Susie ACT that turn.
Also the soundtrack is up on Spotify. Happy feet dumbass!!
The benefit to that though, is ACT is actually much more gameplay oriented with actual inputs involved in them. That likely was the goal as well, to make it more of a game and less a sort of choose your own adventure combat.
Right, I actually like the movement towards ACTs with gameplay elements to them, and it seems like the natural progression of the ACT system once the novelty of it wears off
It's an interesting funerary rite, that is, and one that makes sense. Monsters don't leave anything behind when they die; their bodies vanish into dust. So, to mark their life, and remember that they were here, their graves contain an item that represents what they did in life.
That was there in chapter 1 as well.
Some points.
Soulless Kris as we've seen them would be extremely noticeable. Suggesting prior to the game he has been ensouled.
Despite there being hints that Kris lacks empathy. They seem to have an emotional reaction to both the 'weird' route and the bonus boss fight independent to the Soul. And to certain other things like Hot Chocolate bringing back memories or the Door south of town.
Kris clearly acts differently with the player controlled soul compared to how the characters talk about him. So Ensouled but not by our Soul?
The Soul can seemingly influence/observe others but not directly control them as they can Kris.
I've seen speculation that Ralsie deliberately distracted the Soul's attention to communicate with Kris. This seems likely as when he mentions wondering about what Susie is doing and we cut to her, we apparently miss a conversation between Ralsei and Kris. Also the fact that he can apparently move between Dark Worlds is suspicious. The speculation that his item form is Kris's knife seems plausible. It does seem like he knows more then he's letting on.
My best guess is Kris somehow lost his Soul just prior to the game starting (Probably involving whatever is behind the Mystery Door). Which created an opening for the Soul to take control. However they've got sufficient Determination that they can still act independently without it. Possibly they created the initial Fountain in this state right before the game begins. This also seems to suggest Kris and Ralsei were aware of the Soul prior to this point. Otherwise they'd have no reason to distract it's attention.
So if the opening of Chapter 1 is taken into account that seems to be the point where the player Soul entered Kris. However Kris prepared for it (Setting up the birdcage). If the narrator of the opening was Gaster, it could be that Kris encountered him beyond the door, lost his soul. And Gastor/Kris/Ralsei have for some reason engineered the Soul's involvement.
I think Kris’s SOUL was as normal, and Kris in control of themself, right up until the day that Chapter 1 takes place on.
Another thing to note is how the game’s save file uses the name “Kris” until the first time we save over it. Another thing pointing to Kris being in control until we show up.
Speaking of that? Seam also said something about how I was missing a crystal that I could've got from Jevil (because I never encountered him in chapter 1). He then said something like: "Are you sure you never fought that clown? Well, if at some point, you remember doing that, at any time, you might find that missing crystal."
So like, could I finish my crystal collection if I were to make another save file, and fight Jevil there? I already hit the ending of chapter 2, so I don't think I have the opportunity to go back and talk to Seam in castle town to confirm it, though.
From chapter 2 it seems like Deltarune is gonna be talking about escapism. I wonder if this might be a sort of escapism for Kris? A way to make friends and go on adventures with them, but without having to really confront the mortifying ordeal of being known, since they're in the passenger seat for most of it.
Would be a fitting motive for the player character, since that's kinda why we play these games too.
Warframe/Steam: NFyt
She's a thirsty gal!
Susie goes in to talk to her and Ralsei attempts to encourage you to "wonder what they are doing" to shift the view into the room. Which never happens, and Ralsei gets uncomfortable about this. Susie comes out unwilling to talk about what happened in the room but it seems implied in other scenes they still had a moment. Susie at least confirms she told Noelle "it is all just a dream" which seems to imply it would convince her the whole Snowgrave thing didn't happen. Likely that results in a coping mechanism for Noelle as she seems to act as if it didn't happen in the post Dark World ending scenes. She even comments about Susie's Tail which only happened in their scene in the room.
Most assume it went on as normal in there, but I feel like SOME aspect of what Kris and her did had to show. However, it seems like everything about Snowgrave is intentionally hidden from Susie and Ralsei though that whole not shifting the players view into the room thing bothering Ralsei implies he has some idea something went on.
The most interesting aspect of this is you can finish the game proper from that route, implying it can be used to move into Chapter 3. Which means it would have implications on how Chapter 3 goes.
On that note, it would make sense he is disturbed by the "heart" not shifting into the room. The heart being the player. He likely knows the distinction between the two. I am not sure if it was with intent to have some secret convo, which would have to be with heartless Kris.
There is something that slightly counters this though. In the fight with Susie vs Lancer in that castle, the red heart flies from offscreen into the dodging area. During the stream with Toby, he specifically pointed out in response to conversations online about this being a bug that it was not, it was 100% intentional. This would confuse a lot of theories as it implies the heart did NOT leave Kris during Susie's onscreen time in Chapter 1. Only when it was relevant to combat.
I mean, it's also like a metatextual object that we use to operate menus and stuff, so maybe it doesn't necessarily follow consistent rules and is just a storytelling device.
I mean, his holloween hack of earthbound seems to still be tops in regards to that. It was likely teenage angst toby but still, the potential was always there.
Not just emotionally uncomfortable, but fairly tedious as well.