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Star Trek: Give Us Sexy Dolphins Now!!

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    AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular
    One thing I don't like about Picard is the continuing trend of ships with depressing lighting. Turn the damn lights on!

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    Dark_SideDark_Side Registered User regular
    edited February 2020
    One thing I don't like about Picard is the continuing trend of ships with depressing lighting. Turn the damn lights on!

    I really don't care for the interior ship design at all. Even pure warships from the older series looked lived in and full of life. A Klingon warbird interior for instance looks way cooler and more interesting than most anything you see in the modern Trek shows. I think it's cause they just don't spend the time or money to build those sets anymore, and rely on cheap VFX work to flesh things out, which is why ship interiors all look like empty warehouses with some chairs and furniture tossed here and there.

    Dark_Side on
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    HozHoz Cool Cat Registered User regular
    edited February 2020
    Has anyone else been slightly underwhelmed with the acting from Isa Briones (Dahj/Soji)? So far it hasn't been anything major, but there's a CW-teen-show vibe I get whenever she shows up on the screen. It may have been stronger in the latest episode than in the others. Maybe it's just me?

    It's not just you. But it's a common thing, that affect of awkwardly conveyed sympathy. And I think it's usually the writing and production that's at fault by putting the actor in a position where they're conveying their emotions through dialogue in poorly set up circumstances. The style of this show only ranges from fast paced action to rushed sentimentality.

    Compare Stewart's performance in TNG and this show, the difference is stark. Especially this last episode, it's the least believable Picard performance I have ever seen from Stewart.
    Billions of people are about to die? Oh well, I'm going to just sit on this bench in self-pity.

    Hoz on
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    The WolfmanThe Wolfman Registered User regular
    Wait y'all are talking about Episode 3 and NO ONE mentions
    the return of Hugh?!?!?!
    Ok I am obviously not paying attention and am either slow or dumb. Who the heck was Hugh? That director boss guy?

    "The sausage of Green Earth explodes with flavor like the cannon of culinary delight."
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    PhillisherePhillishere Registered User regular
    Cambiata wrote: »
    Yeah that's the way I square it
    These people aren't starving, they have housing, food and water and can live basically where they want. But if
    your passion is, say, cybersecurity and you can no longer get TS clearance, then you maybe don't give a shit about anything anymore. You aren't dying, but you aren't happy either.

    As for Captain Rios, he may not have "money", but he has a spaceship that looks more luxurious than the most luxurious modern car you can buy in 2020. It seems like a self-owned spaceship is the sort of thing you would need money (latinum?) for, if you want the ship for "free" you join Starfleet.
    The Federation is a post-scarcity society in that everyone has access to their basic needs - food, housing, medical, education - and can meritocracy themselves into a good professional position based on ability and hard work. It's not a utopia where everyone can replicate themselves a sky castle and use it to dock their personal fleet of spaceships. If you want more than to live on Basic, you have to earn it.

    She's not complaining that she's starving. She's complaining that she is living on the margins of society, while Picard's exile involves a celebrated writing career and award-winning vineyards. Without the ability to do what she is trained for - intelligence work - she's stuck just living. Since we see she's hitching a ride on Picard's ship, we can probably also assume that regular Federation citizens don't get to travel space freely unless they have Starfleet backing.

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    CambiataCambiata Commander Shepard The likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered User regular
    Wait y'all are talking about Episode 3 and NO ONE mentions
    the return of Hugh?!?!?!
    Ok I am obviously not paying attention and am either slow or dumb. Who the heck was Hugh? That director boss guy?

    Yeah
    Soji's boss dude. I love that they just put him in there and didn't explain "Yo, Hugh is back." He doesn't even give his name as far as I remember. Way to trust your audience, ST:P!

    "If you divide the whole world into just enemies and friends, you'll end up destroying everything" --Nausicaa of the Valley of Wind
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    hlprmnkyhlprmnky Registered User regular
    Cambiata wrote: »
    Wait y'all are talking about Episode 3 and NO ONE mentions
    the return of Hugh?!?!?!
    Ok I am obviously not paying attention and am either slow or dumb. Who the heck was Hugh? That director boss guy?

    Yeah
    Soji's boss dude. I love that they just put him in there and didn't explain "Yo, Hugh is back." He doesn't even give his name as far as I remember. Way to trust your audience, ST:P!
    Soji says his name once, in passing, to Ramdha.
    Unrelated:
    I think they did and amazing job lampshading the Return of the Loaf, when Laris thumps the goon they're interrogating on the head and says "He won't answer because he's a stubborn Northerner, like you, Zhaban!" Just ...super good job, I liked it a lot, top marks.

    _
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    HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    Cambiata wrote: »
    Wait y'all are talking about Episode 3 and NO ONE mentions
    the return of Hugh?!?!?!
    Ok I am obviously not paying attention and am either slow or dumb. Who the heck was Hugh? That director boss guy?

    Yeah
    Soji's boss dude. I love that they just put him in there and didn't explain "Yo, Hugh is back." He doesn't even give his name as far as I remember. Way to trust your audience, ST:P!

    she calls him by his name once, it is extremely easy to miss

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    CambiataCambiata Commander Shepard The likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered User regular
    edited February 2020
    Yeah that was great and I love it, too! Pretty much the platonic ideal of how to communicate something like that.

    Cambiata on
    "If you divide the whole world into just enemies and friends, you'll end up destroying everything" --Nausicaa of the Valley of Wind
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    WinkyWinky rRegistered User regular
    Cambiata wrote: »
    Yeah that was great and I love it, too! Pretty much the platonic ideal of how to communicate something like that.

    I really hope it pays off later. That'll be particularly satisfying if you were someone who caught it early.

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    AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular
    Cambiata wrote: »
    Yeah that was great and I love it, too! Pretty much the platonic ideal of how to communicate something like that.

    Much better than what's-her-face saying "JL" twenty four hundred times. JL! JL! JL! Do you get it yet? JL as in Jean-Luc! JL!

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    DanHibikiDanHibiki Registered User regular
    hlprmnky wrote: »
    Cambiata wrote: »
    Wait y'all are talking about Episode 3 and NO ONE mentions
    the return of Hugh?!?!?!
    Ok I am obviously not paying attention and am either slow or dumb. Who the heck was Hugh? That director boss guy?

    Yeah
    Soji's boss dude. I love that they just put him in there and didn't explain "Yo, Hugh is back." He doesn't even give his name as far as I remember. Way to trust your audience, ST:P!
    Soji says his name once, in passing, to Ramdha.
    Unrelated:
    I think they did and amazing job lampshading the Return of the Loaf, when Laris thumps the goon they're interrogating on the head and says "He won't answer because he's a stubborn Northerner, like you, Zhaban!" Just ...super good job, I liked it a lot, top marks.
    which i guess makes it racist?

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    HardtargetHardtarget There Are Four Lights VancouverRegistered User regular
    Cambiata wrote: »
    Yeah that was great and I love it, too! Pretty much the platonic ideal of how to communicate something like that.

    Much better than what's-her-face saying "JL" twenty four hundred times. JL! JL! JL! Do you get it yet? JL as in Jean-Luc! JL!

    teh thing that really bugged me about that is
    she's supposed to have been his former XO on his last ship post enterprise, and like.. I just don't see him allowing a XO to do that

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    BizazedoBizazedo Registered User regular
    Much better than what's-her-face saying "JL" twenty four hundred times. JL! JL! JL! Do you get it yet? JL as in Jean-Luc! JL!
    She replaced Beverly.

    In every way.

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    DanHibikiDanHibiki Registered User regular
    Bizazedo wrote: »
    Much better than what's-her-face saying "JL" twenty four hundred times. JL! JL! JL! Do you get it yet? JL as in Jean-Luc! JL!
    She replaced Beverly.

    In every way.

    what, did he also have her husband killed?

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    AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular
    Bizazedo wrote: »
    Much better than what's-her-face saying "JL" twenty four hundred times. JL! JL! JL! Do you get it yet? JL as in Jean-Luc! JL!
    She replaced Beverly.

    In every way.

    At least when Beverly said Jean-Luc you could believe the familiarity. The JL thing came off forced.

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    Dark_SideDark_Side Registered User regular
    Bizazedo wrote: »
    Much better than what's-her-face saying "JL" twenty four hundred times. JL! JL! JL! Do you get it yet? JL as in Jean-Luc! JL!
    She replaced Beverly.

    In every way.

    At least when Beverly said Jean-Luc you could believe the familiarity. The JL thing came off forced.

    I think it would have been fine used sparingly, but instead it just got tossed around like a person at a party trying to prove they totally didn't forget your name, after already calling you the wrong one.

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    CambiataCambiata Commander Shepard The likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered User regular
    I will say that in my experience starched, strict military men do get softer as they get older, and allow breaches in their ideas of discipline that they never would have allowed as younger men.

    "If you divide the whole world into just enemies and friends, you'll end up destroying everything" --Nausicaa of the Valley of Wind
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    DonnictonDonnicton Registered User regular
    dumb memes

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tum7ucG5HvY

    (may be very minor spoilers by virtue of existing)

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    The WolfmanThe Wolfman Registered User regular
    Cambiata wrote: »
    I will say that in my experience starched, strict military men do get softer as they get older, and allow breaches in their ideas of discipline that they never would have allowed as younger men.

    Picard never was super strict to begin with. He always allowed a certain veneer of casualness over the standard professionalism that was expected. A veneer we see get stripped right off when a certain Captain Jelico takes over for a bit.

    That said, yeah that whole JL JL JL was a bit too much.

    "The sausage of Green Earth explodes with flavor like the cannon of culinary delight."
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    Commander ZoomCommander Zoom Registered User regular
    Cambiata wrote: »
    I will say that in my experience starched, strict military men do get softer as they get older, and allow breaches in their ideas of discipline that they never would have allowed as younger men.

    Picard never was super strict to begin with. He always allowed a certain veneer of casualness over the standard professionalism that was expected. A veneer we see get stripped right off when a certain Captain Jelico takes over for a bit.

    That said, yeah that whole JL JL JL was a bit too much.

    Hell, it seemed very awkward to me when someone posted just the one panel from the prequel comic. At the time, I didn't realize she was going to be a character in the show.

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    Metzger MeisterMetzger Meister It Gets Worse before it gets any better.Registered User regular
    As much as I like the episodes that like heavily feature him as a villain, Michael Eddington sure does get on my nerves in DS9. He just seems like such a weenie. They should have let O'Brien give him a whuppin.

    Maybe that's like a deliberate character choice though in which case, bravo.

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    TOGSolidTOGSolid Drunk sailor Seattle, WashingtonRegistered User regular
    edited February 2020
    So, three episodes in and

    Stuff I like!
    The slow pace is doing this show so many favors. Scenes have room to breath and gives the audience time to settle in with the characters which is a problem I had with Discovery. That show moved too fast for its own good. Whenever we're focused on Picard and his friends the whole show is like some warm comfy blanket. His Tal Shiar buddies were instantly endearing and when they got their action scene I'm really thankful that they were shown as hyper capable while Picard got thrown around until he got a gun.

    I like that we got what it means to be on basic assistance living fleshed out. You get a pre-fab, you get a replicator, you're comfortable but you're not eating filet mignon every day. It means artists can pursue their dreams even if they're crap. Farmers can still farm because there's gonna be a demand for real food/booze since replicator food isn't perfect. You'll go as far as you're driven to, or just idle along in life if you so choose.

    Stuff I don't like!
    Holy shit the villains are twirling their moustaches so hard that even Snidely Whiplash is like "yo....dial it back a hair." The Vulcan showing up in sunglasses, as pointed out earlier in the thread, makes me wonder if she's even really Vulcan and the Romulan gal and her brother having sexy villain tension is just gross and played out. Also it seems like anyone not in the "Picard Bubble" just feels out of place, in that, everyone surrounding Picard is just immediately likable while the villains and the android gal are either flat or in their personas.

    This is a personal nitpick but the entire "Romulans don't use AI, our computers just do numerical computations" thing just seems massively absurd to me. Even in our era, machine learning is massively important to so much of our daily life that the idea that Romulan computers are purely just rapid-fire calculators seems incredibly silly. I suppose with enough computational power you can brute force anything, but yeah, that line is stuck in my tooth like popcorn kernel.

    TOGSolid on
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    GONG-00GONG-00 Registered User regular
    As much as I like the episodes that like heavily feature him as a villain, Michael Eddington sure does get on my nerves in DS9. He just seems like such a weenie. They should have let O'Brien give him a whuppin.

    Maybe that's like a deliberate character choice though in which case, bravo.

    I'm fairly certain it was deliberate considering the number of instances where the audience has to question his loyalty or if replaced by changeling.

    Black lives matter.
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    MsAnthropyMsAnthropy The Lady of Pain Breaks the Rhythm, Breaks the Rhythm, Breaks the Rhythm The City of FlowersRegistered User regular
    edited February 2020
    TOGSolid wrote: »
    So, three episodes in and

    Stuff I like!
    The slow pace is doing this show so many favors. Scenes have room to breath and gives the audience time to settle in with the characters which is a problem I had with Discovery. That show moved too fast for its own good. Whenever we're focused on Picard and his friends the whole show is like some warm comfy blanket. His Tal Shiar buddies were instantly endearing and when they got their action scene I'm really thankful that they were shown as hyper capable while Picard got thrown around until he got a gun.

    I like that we got what it means to be on basic assistance living fleshed out. You get a pre-fab, you get a replicator, you're comfortable but you're not eating filet mignon every day. It means artists can pursue their dreams even if they're crap. Farmers can still farm because there's gonna be a demand for real food/booze since replicator food isn't perfect. You'll go as far as you're driven to, or just idle along in life if you so choose.

    Stuff I don't like!
    Holy shit the villains are twirling their moustaches so hard that even Snidely Whiplash is like "yo....dial it back a hair." The Vulcan showing up in sunglasses, as pointed out earlier in the thread, makes me wonder if she's even really Vulcan and the Romulan gal and her brother having sexy villain tension is just gross and played out. Also it seems like anyone not in the "Picard Bubble" just feels out of place, in that, everyone surrounding Picard is just immediately likable while the villains and the android gal are either flat or in their personas.

    This is a personal nitpick but the entire "Romulans don't use AI, our computers just do numerical computations" thing just seems massively absurd to me. Even in our era, machine learning is massively important to so much of our daily life that the idea that Romulan computers are purely just rapid-fire calculators seems incredibly silly. I suppose with enough computational power you can brute force anything, but yeah, that line is stuck in my tooth like popcorn kernel.

    Not really spoiler-y, but re: Machine Learning / AI. As a practitioner in that field, I think the state of its capabilities is oversold and overblown. Fundamentally the models we implement are just calculations (generally just a ton of linear algebra) that are done on data that is input into the system in question. The various weighting’s / parameters / decision thresholds are estimated using historical data, under various mathematical / statistical assumptions, which gets sold as ‘learning’. Yes, if the model estimation algorithms are re-run the various weights / parameters / decision thresholds are updated, but in general they are not ‘learning’ without someone actively setting them up to do so on some kind of schedule. So such a species could still get the benefits of thins like current predictive analytics, just maybe a tad bit slower and requiring a bit more manual intervention. You might think of it like the difference between manually updating your PC’s OS or allowing it to auto update.

    MsAnthropy on
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    "The only real politics I knew was that if a guy liked Hitler, I’d beat the stuffing out of him and that would be it." -- Jack Kirby
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    Inquisitor77Inquisitor77 2 x Penny Arcade Fight Club Champion A fixed point in space and timeRegistered User regular
    edited February 2020
    There's also a major philosophical question as to what constitutes intelligence, sentience, consciousness, etc.

    As best we understand it, the brain largely consists of neurons firing in patterns. How something like the thought, "Free will is an illusion" can come from that is a massive unknown, let alone what principles are in play that would allow you to jump from human neurons to something like fiber-optic cables or quantum CPUs.

    At an even higher level of abstraction, you can't even prove that other human beings have thoughts. How would you go about proving that an alien is sentient or that a planet-wide collection of computer parts has consciousness?

    Inquisitor77 on
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    JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Moderator mod
    Cambiata wrote: »
    Yeah that was great and I love it, too! Pretty much the platonic ideal of how to communicate something like that.

    Much better than what's-her-face saying "JL" twenty four hundred times. JL! JL! JL! Do you get it yet? JL as in Jean-Luc! JL!

    Yeah, that was awkward as hell and I didn't care for it.

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    DonnictonDonnicton Registered User regular
    Who shot JL?

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    initiatefailureinitiatefailure Registered User regular
    an enthusiastic young XO developing an endearing way of addressing you that we so far have only seen used in confidence or after the removal of hierarchy in the relationship is like, not anything i could ever see as a problem, even if i was digging deep to put cons to a review

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    The WolfmanThe Wolfman Registered User regular
    Her entire beef with Picard seemed pretty dang ridiculous and manufactured. I'm not even sure I completely understand it. Ok, Picard threatens to quit Starfleet, and unfortunately they call his bluff. Then, because he's gone, she's fired for... reasons. I can buy that, and I can buy her getting emotional in the moment. But to hold a fucking grudge that long, to the point of grabbing a shotgun the second he steps on your property... I mean, on the one hand he is technically responsible for what happened to her, but on the other hand he's kinda not. Or at least, he didn't intentionally throw her under a bus and betray her, so to continue to act like he did is just ridiculous.

    "The sausage of Green Earth explodes with flavor like the cannon of culinary delight."
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    PhillisherePhillishere Registered User regular
    edited February 2020
    Her entire beef with Picard seemed pretty dang ridiculous and manufactured. I'm not even sure I completely understand it. Ok, Picard threatens to quit Starfleet, and unfortunately they call his bluff. Then, because he's gone, she's fired for... reasons. I can buy that, and I can buy her getting emotional in the moment. But to hold a fucking grudge that long, to the point of grabbing a shotgun the second he steps on your property... I mean, on the one hand he is technically responsible for what happened to her, but on the other hand he's kinda not. Or at least, he didn't intentionally throw her under a bus and betray her, so to continue to act like he did is just ridiculous.
    Her grudge is that Picard peaced out. He gave up, left, she got fired for being his supporter, and then she never heard from him again. She lost her security clearance because she was loyal to him and went into a downward spiral, and he never contacted her once. And when he did, it was because he wanted something and Starfleet had already turned him down.

    And from the guilty look on Picard's face, he knew he was doing it.

    Phillishere on
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    BlarghyBlarghy Registered User regular
    Her entire beef with Picard seemed pretty dang ridiculous and manufactured. I'm not even sure I completely understand it. Ok, Picard threatens to quit Starfleet, and unfortunately they call his bluff. Then, because he's gone, she's fired for... reasons. I can buy that, and I can buy her getting emotional in the moment. But to hold a fucking grudge that long, to the point of grabbing a shotgun the second he steps on your property... I mean, on the one hand he is technically responsible for what happened to her, but on the other hand he's kinda not. Or at least, he didn't intentionally throw her under a bus and betray her, so to continue to act like he did is just ridiculous.
    It is extreme, but from what is depicted she idolized him, thought he could do pretty much anything, and then when he was defeated and broken, -and- that defeat stripped everything away from her that she valued too, then emotions can and do swing from extremely positive to extremely negative quite strongly. That he didn't reach out to her either while she stewed in her own misery for years, that's the kind of thing that can breed massive resentment. That being said, you can see that she still logically understands Picard's situation and that while her emotions still are badly wounded, she is still trying to work with him, despite herself. It makes sense to me.

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    Dark_SideDark_Side Registered User regular
    edited February 2020
    Her entire beef with Picard seemed pretty dang ridiculous and manufactured. I'm not even sure I completely understand it. Ok, Picard threatens to quit Starfleet, and unfortunately they call his bluff. Then, because he's gone, she's fired for... reasons. I can buy that, and I can buy her getting emotional in the moment. But to hold a fucking grudge that long, to the point of grabbing a shotgun the second he steps on your property... I mean, on the one hand he is technically responsible for what happened to her, but on the other hand he's kinda not. Or at least, he didn't intentionally throw her under a bus and betray her, so to continue to act like he did is just ridiculous.
    Her grudge is that Picard peaced out. He gave up, left, she got fired for being his supporter, and then she never heard from him again. She lost her security clearance because she was loyal to him and went into a downward spiral solely, and he never contacted her once. And when he did, it was because he wanted something and Starfleet had already turned him down.

    And from the guilty look on Picard's face, he knew he was doing it.

    I think there's also more to the history of that relationship that they haven't quite explained yet.
    There seems to be a narrative theme developing in Picard of filling out the plot with flashbacks.

    Dark_Side on
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    CambiataCambiata Commander Shepard The likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered User regular
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Her entire beef with Picard seemed pretty dang ridiculous and manufactured. I'm not even sure I completely understand it. Ok, Picard threatens to quit Starfleet, and unfortunately they call his bluff. Then, because he's gone, she's fired for... reasons. I can buy that, and I can buy her getting emotional in the moment. But to hold a fucking grudge that long, to the point of grabbing a shotgun the second he steps on your property... I mean, on the one hand he is technically responsible for what happened to her, but on the other hand he's kinda not. Or at least, he didn't intentionally throw her under a bus and betray her, so to continue to act like he did is just ridiculous.
    It is extreme, but from what is depicted she idolized him, thought he could do pretty much anything, and then when he was defeated and broken, -and- that defeat stripped everything away from her that she valued too, then emotions can and do swing from extremely positive to extremely negative quite strongly. That he didn't reach out to her either while she stewed in her own misery for years, that's the kind of thing that can breed massive resentment. That being said, you can see that she still logically understands Picard's situation and that while her emotions still are badly wounded, she is still trying to work with him, despite herself. It makes sense to me.

    Not only that, but
    The Picard she thought she knew wouldn't have just settled for being fired. The Picard she idolized would have found a ship right then, damn Starfleet's rules and done what needed to be done. He let his heart be broken by Starfleet's betrayal, and in turn broke her heart.

    "If you divide the whole world into just enemies and friends, you'll end up destroying everything" --Nausicaa of the Valley of Wind
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    PhillisherePhillishere Registered User regular
    Cambiata wrote: »
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Her entire beef with Picard seemed pretty dang ridiculous and manufactured. I'm not even sure I completely understand it. Ok, Picard threatens to quit Starfleet, and unfortunately they call his bluff. Then, because he's gone, she's fired for... reasons. I can buy that, and I can buy her getting emotional in the moment. But to hold a fucking grudge that long, to the point of grabbing a shotgun the second he steps on your property... I mean, on the one hand he is technically responsible for what happened to her, but on the other hand he's kinda not. Or at least, he didn't intentionally throw her under a bus and betray her, so to continue to act like he did is just ridiculous.
    It is extreme, but from what is depicted she idolized him, thought he could do pretty much anything, and then when he was defeated and broken, -and- that defeat stripped everything away from her that she valued too, then emotions can and do swing from extremely positive to extremely negative quite strongly. That he didn't reach out to her either while she stewed in her own misery for years, that's the kind of thing that can breed massive resentment. That being said, you can see that she still logically understands Picard's situation and that while her emotions still are badly wounded, she is still trying to work with him, despite herself. It makes sense to me.

    Not only that, but
    The Picard she thought she knew wouldn't have just settled for being fired. The Picard she idolized would have found a ship right then, damn Starfleet's rules and done what needed to be done. He let his heart be broken by Starfleet's betrayal, and in turn broke her heart.
    It's definitely a case where Jim Kirk's response would have been far superior.

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    CambiataCambiata Commander Shepard The likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered User regular
    Cambiata wrote: »
    Blarghy wrote: »
    Her entire beef with Picard seemed pretty dang ridiculous and manufactured. I'm not even sure I completely understand it. Ok, Picard threatens to quit Starfleet, and unfortunately they call his bluff. Then, because he's gone, she's fired for... reasons. I can buy that, and I can buy her getting emotional in the moment. But to hold a fucking grudge that long, to the point of grabbing a shotgun the second he steps on your property... I mean, on the one hand he is technically responsible for what happened to her, but on the other hand he's kinda not. Or at least, he didn't intentionally throw her under a bus and betray her, so to continue to act like he did is just ridiculous.
    It is extreme, but from what is depicted she idolized him, thought he could do pretty much anything, and then when he was defeated and broken, -and- that defeat stripped everything away from her that she valued too, then emotions can and do swing from extremely positive to extremely negative quite strongly. That he didn't reach out to her either while she stewed in her own misery for years, that's the kind of thing that can breed massive resentment. That being said, you can see that she still logically understands Picard's situation and that while her emotions still are badly wounded, she is still trying to work with him, despite herself. It makes sense to me.

    Not only that, but
    The Picard she thought she knew wouldn't have just settled for being fired. The Picard she idolized would have found a ship right then, damn Starfleet's rules and done what needed to be done. He let his heart be broken by Starfleet's betrayal, and in turn broke her heart.
    It's definitely a case where Jim Kirk's response would have been far superior.

    To be fair,
    Kirk had his "I am an old useless man now, boo hoo" moment, too, but it took place during The Motion Picture (and I guess during whatever preceded that film).

    It wasn't until after he got his mojo back that he started stealing starships.


    On that note, I sure am glad we have Star Trek exploring the nature of growing old, again. Some of the best Trek comes from that premise.

    "If you divide the whole world into just enemies and friends, you'll end up destroying everything" --Nausicaa of the Valley of Wind
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    AeolusdallasAeolusdallas Registered User regular
    honovere wrote: »
    Commodore Oh
    are her sunglasses totally telling that she's romulan and not vulkan? My trek knowledge is limited, but Vulkan ist a bright desert planet while Romulus is all gloomy, right?
    Because otherwise that would be a weird looking costume choice.
    Vulcan is a bright desert. Romulus was a paradise.

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    Sanguinius666264Sanguinius666264 Registered User regular
    I thought it was pretty obvious that the XO's reaction was seeing her idol, the great JL, pretty well give up and shoot his shot - she says as much, going 'ok so Starfleet said no, so now is the time you go do something off the cuff and great, isn't it? and Picard more or less shurgs at her and says 'nah, I did as much as I could, I'm out'. I can totally get that she's then feeling pretty betrayed. His actions lost her her entire career, she's out in the desert spiralling downwards and smoking space-weed in the Star Trek equivalent to a trailer park.

    She went from being a pretty highly respected officer to more or less being down and out and saw pretty clearly that Picard's great moral stand off only led to him going back to his chateau and enjoying a luxurious retirement, where he was free to fling barbs at Starfleet. He also never contacted her again, so maybe she also realised that a relationship that she thought was strong and deep to her wasn't for him, nearly as much.

    All of that, plus a decade and a half of stewing on it, could well have anyone reaching for the shotgun when they come back asking for your help.

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    AbsoluteZeroAbsoluteZero The new film by Quentin Koopantino Registered User regular
    To be fair if Picard had gone and stolen a starship right then I'm pretty sure she would still be fired if not worse.

    cs6f034fsffl.jpg
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    JacobkoshJacobkosh Gamble a stamp. I can show you how to be a real man!Moderator mod
    One thing about Raffi is
    we so far only have the implication that she was fired for being Picard's aide. I feel like it's entirely possible that she went into that meeting with the CNC and blew her stack and got herself fired.

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