Geeze, this just gets worse and worse. Then again, the way things keep going, maybe they'll retcon it within the year, like they seem to keep doing. Every time they get a good or neat idea, off it goes before it even touches the ground.
I actually have liked a number of the changes Spider-man's had over the past few years. Aunt May knowing the truth, the new powers, working as a teacher, even the Iron Spider costume.
This... this isn't even change. It's more like unchange. If I want classic Spidey, I have my choices. I can read Ultimate Spider-man, I can read Marvel Adventures Spider-man, hell, I can even get The Essential Spider-man. Not to mention the multimedia spin-offs like the movies, cartoons, etc.
I get PLENTY of classic Spider-man. Why refute change in the one that needs it most? I like progression, seeing how things unfold and play out and change over time. This is just rewinding and hitting the damn pause button.
The unmasking thing, ok, so they blew that and wanted to put the genie back in the bottle, but they already more or less did that with the Scarlet Spiders. This is just overkill.
As cliche' as it is, I want this to all be a dream. Because a good cliche'd dream is better than a sucky reality.
...such as "reality" applies here.
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I'm guessing that's the whole point. The Spider-Man movies were a big success. Therefore the best way to make the comics a big success is to make them more like the movies. Revert everything back to the start, then you can follow the movie storyline and reap the big bucks. It stands to reason that the people who saw the movies are bigger than the fanbase you're going to alienate by shitting all over their favoured medium, therefore movie audience - comic fans = cash.
Of course, there's the matter of just how much of the movie audience is going to bother picking up the comic books. For example, my wife and my mother both enjoyed the movies, but damn if you'll find them rushing out on Wednesday to see what happens to Parker next.
Not to say no one does, but I don't think the equation is as simple as the one provided.
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Oh, I know it's not. But I'm just saying that's how the comic book execs are seeing it; an untapped market. Everyone wants comic books, they just don't know it yet, etc.
What's perhaps most amazing to me is that Joe Q approved the organic shooters and the reconciliation of Peter and MJ after they had already split. I don't really understand the point of either of those moves at this point.
Kyle
He approved them getting back together because a seperated or divorced Peter is not what he wanted, if that was all then we wouldnt be jumping through these ridiculous hoops in this storyline to get to the new status quo.
I'm guessing that's the whole point. The Spider-Man movies were a big success. Therefore the best way to make the comics a big success is to make them more like the movies. Revert everything back to the start, then you can follow the movie storyline and reap the big bucks. It stands to reason that the people who saw the movies are bigger than the fanbase you're going to alienate by shitting all over their favoured medium, therefore movie audience - comic fans = cash.
No, this is not what this is about at all. Quesada has been on record for years that he hates the fact that Spider-Man is married and thinks it's one of the biggest mistakes Marvel ever made and that if he could find a way to undo it he would. This has nothing to do with movie tie-ins.
Considering Joe Q saved Marvel from bankruptcy and has done far more good than harm in his time as EiC, I'd say chances of that are pretty much nonexistant.
I don't mind getting rid of the marriage so much. I mean I know everything in comics eventually returns to a status quo. I mean Jason Todd, and Buckey are back arn't they?
What irks me is that the Unmasking is going to be undone. Like I understand that it was gunna happen eventually, but it just seems like it happened way too soon. Sorta cheapened one of the big plot points and events of Civil War.
Considering Joe Q saved Marvel from bankruptcy and has done far more good than harm in his time as EiC, I'd say chances of that are pretty much nonexistant.
Perhaps i haven't spent enough time around comic books, but i'm confused by an industry where the powers that be will let you fuck around with the product and anger the consumers just because it gets you hard.
Considering Joe Q saved Marvel from bankruptcy and has done far more good than harm in his time as EiC, I'd say chances of that are pretty much nonexistant.
No he didn't
He's the EiC of comics, that's it. That in no way saved MARVEL at all.
Considering Joe Q saved Marvel from bankruptcy and has done far more good than harm in his time as EiC, I'd say chances of that are pretty much nonexistant.
No he didn't
He's the EiC of comics, that's it. That in no way saved MARVEL at all.
Ok you're right, I guess the fact that they went from declaring bankrupty to being in the best financial position since before the 90s crash all while he's been in charge is mere coincidence.
Nerd Rage or not, this is some fucking bullshit. It's basically turned all of JMS's run into fan fiction. I just hope there's some What If?s or "Pre-OMD" storylines that can still be made.
You know, I think I'm actually more pissed off about undoing the unmasking than anything else. OMD cheapens the hell out of a great subplot of the Civil War in one fell swoop.
The way people are acting in this thread its like he's just some petulant dick doing this because he knows it will piss people off.
From his point of view, the marriage handicaps him creativley, so he wants to get rid of it. And the guy is in charge so it's his call to make.
I mean when was the last time Spider-Man comics were really great? Now thats it's over and being retconned people sure seem to be all about JMS' run but while it was going on I remember so much fucking bitching about how lame the "Spider-Totem" shit was or what a terrible crossover "The Other" was, etc etc.
Quesada has a pretty good track record, in my eyes at least. The mutant overpopulation was another one of his pet issues that he wanted to "fix." Plenty of people bitched about Decimation but look at the X-books right now, they are the best they have been in 20 years.
Does One More Day suck? hell yes it does, it's a terrible story. But it's a means to an end. I don't agree with how it was done but it's done now. So now Quesada has to show me it was worth it. The Brand New Day team is exciting (to me) and so I'm ready to give it a shot.
Norman Osborn's resurection was almost as terrible if not just as terrible as One More Day, but nobody fucking it remembers it now they just know that Norman is alive and being an awesome villian in good stories.
most of us are just annoyed that every single thing he did, both good and bad, seems to be getting retconned
and just because he has the power to do so doesn't mean he should do it. hitler had the "authority" to do what he did, but does that mean he should have done it? hell no. while this isn't anywhere near as extreme as that situation, when it comes down to it it's a move that seems like it was destined to alienate and piss off readers, so why do it in the first place?
hitler had the "authority" to do what he did, but does that mean he should have done it? hell no. while this isn't anywhere near as extreme as that situation...
Really, the Spider-Man marriage not as serious as WWII? Are you sure?
hitler had the "authority" to do what he did, but does that mean he should have done it? hell no. while this isn't anywhere near as extreme as that situation...
Really, the Spider-Man marriage not as serious as WWII? Are you sure?
We should compare the two some more, just to be certain!
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augustwhere you come from is goneRegistered Userregular
when it comes down to it it's a move that seems like it was destined to alienate and piss off readers, so why do it in the first place?
I'm going to do you a huge favor and go ahead and ignore your analogy and answer this question instead.
Because that's his job.
He has to decide if its worth it for the long term creative health of the character. He clearly thinks it is, I'm not convinced but we don't know what they are doing with it yet. If no editor/writer was willing to take chances like that then we would have nothing but pretty fucking boring stories.
People were furious at first when Bucky came back. Now, not so much.
Granted the Winter Soldier story was 50 million times better written, but the point of this change it what comes after, and we haven't seen that yet.
I thought Marvel licensing its IP out the wazoo is what saved it from bankruptcy, plus a few well-timed and high quality movies (X-Men & Spiderman).
You're not wrong when you say this, but that sort of thing is only a short term fix unless the publishing side gets its act together and returns to being self-sufficient.
when it comes down to it it's a move that seems like it was destined to alienate and piss off readers, so why do it in the first place?
I'm going to do you a huge favor and go ahead and ignore your analogy and answer this question instead.
Because that's his job.
He has to decide if its worth it for the long term creative health of the character. He clearly thinks it is, I'm not convinced but we don't know what they are doing with it yet. If no editor/writer was willing to take chances like that then we would have nothing but pretty fucking boring stories.
People were furious at first when Bucky came back. Now, not so much.
Granted the Winter Soldier story was 50 million times better written, but the point of this change it what comes after, and we haven't seen that yet.
Was Winter Soldier Brubaker's idea or Quesada's?
I know the Death of Captain America was Quesada's idea, at least.
Anyway, I'd like to hear about the merits of the decision from someone who's actually going to write Amazing Spider-Man when it's weekly.
But Decimation wasn't a retcon or even a change for the X-Men so much as a change for hundreds of ancillary characters that affects the X-Men, so it's not really the same thing.
It was a massive change in status quo for the entire X-Men corner of the universe. It's not exactly the same thing no, but it's still an editorial creative choice that was polarizing to a lot fans. And it was done for the same reason.
when it comes down to it it's a move that seems like it was destined to alienate and piss off readers, so why do it in the first place?
I'm going to do you a huge favor and go ahead and ignore your analogy and answer this question instead.
Because that's his job.
He has to decide if its worth it for the long term creative health of the character. He clearly thinks it is, I'm not convinced but we don't know what they are doing with it yet. If no editor/writer was willing to take chances like that then we would have nothing but pretty fucking boring stories.
People were furious at first when Bucky came back. Now, not so much.
Granted the Winter Soldier story was 50 million times better written, but the point of this change it what comes after, and we haven't seen that yet.
fair enough, but if you ask me, there was more than enough material that jms had supplied, between the unmasking and the other, for some at least decent stories before reverting all the way to the beginning in such a horrible way
I actually though the unmasking was JoeQ's call too, I don't know why they undid that so soon.
Although I guess if they are going to go through all the trouble of a deal with the devil and all that it makes even less sense for Peter to forget about asking him to fix the secret identity issue.
Maybe he felt he backed himself into a corner? I dunno.
Retconning out the JMS run just sucks. MJ could've been deleted and I'd have been happy trying to figure out how her absence changed the events Pete went through. I liked some of the changes JMS made, and I refuse to believe that MJ was so damn important that her absence erases them all.
What's perhaps most amazing to me is that Joe Q approved the organic shooters and the reconciliation of Peter and MJ after they had already split. I don't really understand the point of either of those moves at this point.
Kyle
Kyle
Stop signing your posts, we know who you are because we aren't stupid and can easily see your name to the left.
On topic:
I just want to know what the impact is going to be on non-spidey books. (i.e. New Avengers) Will he still be on those teams? Do those teams want a teenager running around with them?
Posts
Geeze, this just gets worse and worse. Then again, the way things keep going, maybe they'll retcon it within the year, like they seem to keep doing. Every time they get a good or neat idea, off it goes before it even touches the ground.
I actually have liked a number of the changes Spider-man's had over the past few years. Aunt May knowing the truth, the new powers, working as a teacher, even the Iron Spider costume.
This... this isn't even change. It's more like unchange. If I want classic Spidey, I have my choices. I can read Ultimate Spider-man, I can read Marvel Adventures Spider-man, hell, I can even get The Essential Spider-man. Not to mention the multimedia spin-offs like the movies, cartoons, etc.
I get PLENTY of classic Spider-man. Why refute change in the one that needs it most? I like progression, seeing how things unfold and play out and change over time. This is just rewinding and hitting the damn pause button.
The unmasking thing, ok, so they blew that and wanted to put the genie back in the bottle, but they already more or less did that with the Scarlet Spiders. This is just overkill.
As cliche' as it is, I want this to all be a dream. Because a good cliche'd dream is better than a sucky reality.
...such as "reality" applies here.
Like Mega Man Legends? Then check out my story, Legends of the Halcyon Era - An Adventure in the World of Mega Man Legends on TMMN and AO3!
Not to say no one does, but I don't think the equation is as simple as the one provided.
Like Mega Man Legends? Then check out my story, Legends of the Halcyon Era - An Adventure in the World of Mega Man Legends on TMMN and AO3!
He approved them getting back together because a seperated or divorced Peter is not what he wanted, if that was all then we wouldnt be jumping through these ridiculous hoops in this storyline to get to the new status quo.
No, this is not what this is about at all. Quesada has been on record for years that he hates the fact that Spider-Man is married and thinks it's one of the biggest mistakes Marvel ever made and that if he could find a way to undo it he would. This has nothing to do with movie tie-ins.
he's already Editor in Chief
What irks me is that the Unmasking is going to be undone. Like I understand that it was gunna happen eventually, but it just seems like it happened way too soon. Sorta cheapened one of the big plot points and events of Civil War.
Perhaps i haven't spent enough time around comic books, but i'm confused by an industry where the powers that be will let you fuck around with the product and anger the consumers just because it gets you hard.
No he didn't
He's the EiC of comics, that's it. That in no way saved MARVEL at all.
And this is comic books, impotent nerd rage is commenplace.
Ok you're right, I guess the fact that they went from declaring bankrupty to being in the best financial position since before the 90s crash all while he's been in charge is mere coincidence.
You know, I think I'm actually more pissed off about undoing the unmasking than anything else. OMD cheapens the hell out of a great subplot of the Civil War in one fell swoop.
that's the vibe I'm getting from all this bullshit
He has had it out for the marriage because it doesn't fit his personal view of what Spider-Man should be.
How SHOULD this look? Because that what Sars Boy said is exactly what it looks like.
From his point of view, the marriage handicaps him creativley, so he wants to get rid of it. And the guy is in charge so it's his call to make.
I mean when was the last time Spider-Man comics were really great? Now thats it's over and being retconned people sure seem to be all about JMS' run but while it was going on I remember so much fucking bitching about how lame the "Spider-Totem" shit was or what a terrible crossover "The Other" was, etc etc.
Quesada has a pretty good track record, in my eyes at least. The mutant overpopulation was another one of his pet issues that he wanted to "fix." Plenty of people bitched about Decimation but look at the X-books right now, they are the best they have been in 20 years.
Does One More Day suck? hell yes it does, it's a terrible story. But it's a means to an end. I don't agree with how it was done but it's done now. So now Quesada has to show me it was worth it. The Brand New Day team is exciting (to me) and so I'm ready to give it a shot.
Norman Osborn's resurection was almost as terrible if not just as terrible as One More Day, but nobody fucking it remembers it now they just know that Norman is alive and being an awesome villian in good stories.
most of us are just annoyed that every single thing he did, both good and bad, seems to be getting retconned
and just because he has the power to do so doesn't mean he should do it. hitler had the "authority" to do what he did, but does that mean he should have done it? hell no. while this isn't anywhere near as extreme as that situation, when it comes down to it it's a move that seems like it was destined to alienate and piss off readers, so why do it in the first place?
Really, the Spider-Man marriage not as serious as WWII? Are you sure?
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Heck, her dad too.
3DS: 1607-3034-6970
I'm going to do you a huge favor and go ahead and ignore your analogy and answer this question instead.
Because that's his job.
He has to decide if its worth it for the long term creative health of the character. He clearly thinks it is, I'm not convinced but we don't know what they are doing with it yet. If no editor/writer was willing to take chances like that then we would have nothing but pretty fucking boring stories.
People were furious at first when Bucky came back. Now, not so much.
Granted the Winter Soldier story was 50 million times better written, but the point of this change it what comes after, and we haven't seen that yet.
You're not wrong when you say this, but that sort of thing is only a short term fix unless the publishing side gets its act together and returns to being self-sufficient.
Was Winter Soldier Brubaker's idea or Quesada's?
I know the Death of Captain America was Quesada's idea, at least.
Anyway, I'd like to hear about the merits of the decision from someone who's actually going to write Amazing Spider-Man when it's weekly.
And the Decimation was his idea.
It was a massive change in status quo for the entire X-Men corner of the universe. It's not exactly the same thing no, but it's still an editorial creative choice that was polarizing to a lot fans. And it was done for the same reason.
fair enough, but if you ask me, there was more than enough material that jms had supplied, between the unmasking and the other, for some at least decent stories before reverting all the way to the beginning in such a horrible way
Although I guess if they are going to go through all the trouble of a deal with the devil and all that it makes even less sense for Peter to forget about asking him to fix the secret identity issue.
Maybe he felt he backed himself into a corner? I dunno.
Kyle
On topic:
I just want to know what the impact is going to be on non-spidey books. (i.e. New Avengers) Will he still be on those teams? Do those teams want a teenager running around with them?
And I think everyone's overreacting here. Like, a lot.