they couldn't change the default physics, because that would've screwed backwards compatibility with all the user levels from LBP1.
Let's clear this up.
1. No one cares about the backwards compatibility
2. Anyone that does, has a LBP1 box sitting next to his console.
3. Backwards compatibility could have easily been maintained by altering the default physics of LBP1-created levels, to stay true to LBP1 physics. Everybody wins.
4. The majority of people that were turned off from LBP1, were turned off explicitly by the controls. This is a backwards step to accessibility, which itself is the only path to success for the franchise.
Add it up. It was just a really shitty decision to leave it as is.
again, it wasn't, not at all. there is a natural impact on control created by the inertia and gravity of the physics engine. there just is - that much is unavoidable. that was taken on board in the best possible way, in that the challenges themselves were driven by momentum and propulsion rather than stubborn, perfect accuracy
sure, a lot of people didn't understand that and are still moaning about it. that doesn't mean media molecule should compromise a winning combination to please them
there is a natural impact on control created by the inertia and gravity of the physics engine.
So you're saying this physics engine emulates physics? Yeah, I get it, it just does an awkward job of it and dilutes player control in incredibly goofy ways that (spoiler: shocking observation) most people find distracting or borderline unplayable.
that doesn't mean media molecule should compromise a winning combination to please them
If bad controls that can be adapted to over time is a winning combination, they should be striving for a losing one. Sorry, but in real life, the customer/gamer is always right, and if the first impression is a bad one no amount of anecdotal philosophizing or contrived justification can change that.
there is a natural impact on control created by the inertia and gravity of the physics engine.
So you're saying this physics engine emulates physics? Yeah, I get it, it just does an awkward job of it and dilutes player control in incredibly goofy ways that (spoiler: shocking observation) most people find distracting or borderline unplayable.
that doesn't mean media molecule should compromise a winning combination to please them
If bad controls that can be adapted to over time is a winning combination, they should be striving for a losing one. Sorry, but in real life, the customer/gamer is always right, and if the first impression is a bad one no amount of anecdotal philosophizing or contrived justification can change that.
What are you smoking, man? If a majority of players are fine with the physics, how is it at all a "Customer is always right" situation?
Also, the Customer is Always A Silly Goose is much more accurate.
InkSplat on
Origin for Dragon Age: Inquisition Shenanigans: Inksplat776
That's the only reason I (and many) find this game intriguing. A great title (now two) marred by goofiness that at this point they're going out of their way to maintain. When you don't see a LBP3, it'll be the direct result.
If you don't buy that, check the interest levels in this game vs. other triple A titles of the last year. This thread itself is a testament.
SCEE President Andrew House announced at Gamescom 2010 that the game has now sold over 4.5 million worldwide.[145]
bsjezz on
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David_TA fashion yes-man is no good to me.Copenhagen, DenmarkRegistered Userregular
edited January 2011
I don't get the physics thing. You can change gravity in LBP2. So any levels made in LBP2 that would be better with less floaty controls can have less floaty controls.
So isn't that the same as having a switch that says "LBP1", only reversed?
- an article from time of release does nothing to put things 'in perspective'. all it does is demonstrate that initial hype and critical reception was insignificant compared to the ultimate build-up of popularity, and that new franchises take time to take hold.
- pithy lineup of exclusives? you'll have to make a better argument than 'people just bought it because they have nothing better to play on their poo-ess-three!'
- that analytic is worrying but not really surprising. despite everything it does so well littlebigplanet has always flown under the radar when it comes to the mainstream. there's an odd combination in its cute visuals with its creative and technical depth that seems to alienate a great deal of people.
but if you want me to swallow that it's directly related to the 'floaty controls', you'll have to do more than throw up an arbitrary analytic
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anoffdayTo be changed whenever Anoffday gets around to it.Registered Userregular
edited January 2011
I'm not trying to get involved in this debate, but can I just say amazon has sent me an email saying my CE has shipped and I am psyched!
Would it be smart to skip class tomorrow for this game? The semester literally just started last week.
So a 2D platformer styled like an art magazine, in which you control a sentient piece of cloth, isn't as popular as a bunch of games where you get to play as a weapon-toting badass? Somehow, I find this unsurprising.
The facts are this: some gamers hate LBP's controls and physics. Some gamers (the existing fanbase) enjoy them.
For this new game, the developers chose to give the fans what they really wanted.
Alex Evans stated that the "huge emotional investment" users have made in LittleBigPlanet is the reason he does not want to ship a traditional sequel.
Because they don't want all of the user-generated content to be made obsolete, their focus would be to "expand the game without partitioning the audience".
Maybe that was a horrible, horrible business decision.
Either way, it was a pretty nice thought, wasn't it?
Yeah, I'm definitely not going to get any deeper into that argument than I already did, but I wanted to repeat what was quoted from Alex Evans:
"without partitioning the audience"
That bit is important. They said early on that they weren't interested in making a sequel if it would fragment the community. Any opinions on the matter aside, it's obviously a thought out issue that matters to the devs. I always think it's kind of awesome when developers actually care about their fans and make decisions based on that.
BACK TO THE GAME ITSELF. Holy damn. The last few days have been a euphoric blur. The variety and polish in the levels makes them a joy to play. Anyone who actually had fun playing through the story levels in the first game should have a blast in the second one.
Much of my time now has been spent building and tinkering, which is by far my favorite part of these games. Even working with imperfect knowledge of the tools, I've found that I can accomplish SO MUCH with so little work (although sometimes a lot of tinkering and troubleshooting crops up as I learn how certain things work). First thing I did was build a Javelin missile system, which was something that just refused to be properly doable in the first game.
Right now I'm working on a hit-ball-with-paddle kind of minigame (with quite a few twists), and will likely be the first level I ever really publish for others. I generally just have fun tinkering and tweaking, but putting together a functional and enjoyable finished product is far more appealing to me now with the tools available.
So yeah. WOOO game. The first one is what got me to buy a PS3, and the last few days have made me happier with that decision than ever.
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anoffdayTo be changed whenever Anoffday gets around to it.Registered Userregular
So while I played LBP1 on my friends PS3 a year or so ago (before I got actually got a PS3 for this years X-Mas present), I really wasn't at all interested in pre-ordering LBP2. But after reading about 2's game creator/editor thing, I'm looking at this in a different light. I'm a huge sucker for map making/SDK tools being released with games, so I'm thinking I going to pick it up on the way home tonight.
One question (that I feel horribly childish asking). I see that you, to put it bluntly, can get additional outfits for SackBoy. How does that shit work? Are they Unlockables/Pre-Orders/Collectors Edition only? Or can you purchase any of these off of PSN. I'll get to the point, though, can I have a SackBoy dressed as John Marston from Red Dead. Cause if so, that's so getting unlocked/bought.
Costume pieces are unlocked by playing through the single player game. Other's are preorder bonuses and others are DLC. Pretty sure there's cowboy themed costumes.
And Amazon was offering 20 dollar credit? That sucks, it wasn't offering it when I made my preorder for the collector's edition.
And Amazon was offering 20 dollar credit? That sucks, it wasn't offering it when I made my preorder for the collector's edition.
It didn't apply to the CE, but if you care to put in the effort, you might be able to get a CSR to apply the credit. The credit on the standard edition does not say anything about excluding the CE.
Got the CE from BestBuy!!! But when I put in the DLC code it says "The code you entered may not be correct or may no longer be valid". Anyone else getting this or having issues getting their CE DLC goodness?
EDIT - Quick call to Sony verifies everyone is having this issue.
Got the CE from BestBuy!!! But when I put in the DLC code it says "The code you entered may not be correct or may no longer be valid". Anyone else getting this or having issues getting their CE DLC goodness?
EDIT - Quick call to Sony verifies everyone is having this issue.
Media Molecule just tweeted to wait for the Playstation store to update.
Kyougu on
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anoffdayTo be changed whenever Anoffday gets around to it.Registered Userregular
Got the CE from BestBuy!!! But when I put in the DLC code it says "The code you entered may not be correct or may no longer be valid". Anyone else getting this or having issues getting their CE DLC goodness?
EDIT - Quick call to Sony verifies everyone is having this issue.
I just got my CE too. I got home from class and it was on my doorstep waiting for me. I'm also skipping my night class for this. I have good reason. It doesn't start until 5 tonight and my morning class is over at 12. I would have to stay on campus since I live about 30 minutes away, and I can't let Sackboy sit on my doorstep in the cold that long. It's raining too. My professor will understand Ok maybe not. But I'm allowed 2 absences before points are taken off.
I guess I'll hold off on trying to get my costumes until this gets fixed. Do they activate at a certain time or something or is it another problem?
Also, I'm interested in these level contests. We need to do these.
Got the CE from BestBuy!!! But when I put in the DLC code it says "The code you entered may not be correct or may no longer be valid". Anyone else getting this or having issues getting their CE DLC goodness?
EDIT - Quick call to Sony verifies everyone is having this issue.
Media Molecule just tweeted to wait for the Playstation store to update.
How do we know when the PS store updates? I want to run around as Daxter.
And Amazon was offering 20 dollar credit? That sucks, it wasn't offering it when I made my preorder for the collector's edition.
It didn't apply to the CE, but if you care to put in the effort, you might be able to get a CSR to apply the credit. The credit on the standard edition does not say anything about excluding the CE.
So wait, the CE was effectively $40 more than the standard edition then?
FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUU
Oh well, too late now, my copy should be on my doorstep in mere hours.
Basically the game, a sackboy plushie, game/book ends, and 11 costumes and 5 psn avatars. The costumes are basically all the pre-order bonuses from different places, and a jak and a daxter costume just for CE.
Got the CE from BestBuy!!! But when I put in the DLC code it says "The code you entered may not be correct or may no longer be valid". Anyone else getting this or having issues getting their CE DLC goodness?
EDIT - Quick call to Sony verifies everyone is having this issue.
I just tried my promo code with the same results. I was about to ask this too when I saw your post. Glad to find it's not just me. Between this and GoW3 I was beginning to think I was CE cursed. Guess I'll just have to play as regular ol' sack boy for now.
Edit: I believe the PSN store usually updates between 6pm and 7pm eastern standard.
they couldn't change the default physics, because that would've screwed backwards compatibility with all the user levels from LBP1.
Let's clear this up.
1. No one cares about the backwards compatibility
2. Anyone that does, has a LBP1 box sitting next to his console.
3. Backwards compatibility could have easily been maintained by altering the default physics of LBP1-created levels, to stay true to LBP1 physics. Everybody wins.
4. The majority of people that were turned off from LBP1, were turned off explicitly by the controls. This is a backwards step to accessibility, which itself is the only path to success for the franchise.
Add it up. It was just a really shitty decision to leave it as is.
Let ME clear some stuff up for you.
1. Fuck you, you don't speak for everyone.
2. See 1.
3. People who did enjoy the first LBP don't want to learn two ways of controlling the character. If Team Meat released an update for Super Meat Boy that changed the way he controlled, that would be stupid. It would be stupid here as well.
4. Citation needed. Where are you stats? Maybe, see 1. (fuck you)
Add it up, you don't know shit about game development, franchise development, marketing, or probably anything else.
Gihgehls on
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anoffdayTo be changed whenever Anoffday gets around to it.Registered Userregular
edited January 2011
So I've only played for a little bit so far, but this is what I know right now. Grapple hook + bounce pads = fun. I'm excited to see the kind of levels people come up with these. I'm hoping I can come up with some fun levels myself.
they couldn't change the default physics, because that would've screwed backwards compatibility with all the user levels from LBP1.
Let's clear this up.
1. No one cares about the backwards compatibility
2. Anyone that does, has a LBP1 box sitting next to his console.
3. Backwards compatibility could have easily been maintained by altering the default physics of LBP1-created levels, to stay true to LBP1 physics. Everybody wins.
4. The majority of people that were turned off from LBP1, were turned off explicitly by the controls. This is a backwards step to accessibility, which itself is the only path to success for the franchise.
Add it up. It was just a really shitty decision to leave it as is.
Let ME clear some stuff up for you.
1. Fuck you, you don't speak for everyone.
2. See 1.
3. People who did enjoy the first LBP don't want to learn two ways of controlling the character. If Team Meat released an update for Super Meat Boy that changed the way he controlled, that would be stupid. It would be stupid here as well.
4. Citation needed. Where are you stats? Maybe, see 1. (fuck you)
Add it up, you don't know shit about game development, franchise development, marketing, or probably anything else.
While I do feel that Leetful is being critical, almost to the point of trolling, this may be a little harsh.
Let's just ignore him, maybe, and not crap up the thread with pointless arguing.
Grapple hook? Time for some GOOD Spider-Man fan levels.
And about the comment of "people" not caring about backwards compatibility. How about all that fuckin' DLC people bought in the first one? I want my stuff in 2 without having to rebuy it, thanks.
Mystic Terrapin on
Nintendo Network ID: Ghostosaurus
3DS FC: 0774-4319-6018
PSN:GallantJay
And Amazon was offering 20 dollar credit? That sucks, it wasn't offering it when I made my preorder for the collector's edition.
It didn't apply to the CE, but if you care to put in the effort, you might be able to get a CSR to apply the credit. The credit on the standard edition does not say anything about excluding the CE.
So wait, the CE was effectively $40 more than the standard edition then?
FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUU
Oh well, too late now, my copy should be on my doorstep in mere hours.
Correct, which is why I went with the standard. If you ordered the CE through Amazon, you can try to hassle the CSRs into giving you the credit, though.
Grapple hook? Time for some GOOD Spider-Man fan levels.
That's basically all I tried to do in the beta.
I... need to devote a lot more time if that's to happen.
Mostly I spent my time trying to figure out how to make a sackbot run away from me, but wait at certain intervals to let Spidey catch up. Probably a lot easier than how I ended up doing it.
David_T on
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anoffdayTo be changed whenever Anoffday gets around to it.Registered Userregular
edited January 2011
I just saw someone as Clank. I'm going to try to use my code now.
Posts
Let's clear this up.
1. No one cares about the backwards compatibility
2. Anyone that does, has a LBP1 box sitting next to his console.
3. Backwards compatibility could have easily been maintained by altering the default physics of LBP1-created levels, to stay true to LBP1 physics. Everybody wins.
4. The majority of people that were turned off from LBP1, were turned off explicitly by the controls. This is a backwards step to accessibility, which itself is the only path to success for the franchise.
Add it up. It was just a really shitty decision to leave it as is.
sure, a lot of people didn't understand that and are still moaning about it. that doesn't mean media molecule should compromise a winning combination to please them
So you're saying this physics engine emulates physics? Yeah, I get it, it just does an awkward job of it and dilutes player control in incredibly goofy ways that (spoiler: shocking observation) most people find distracting or borderline unplayable.
If bad controls that can be adapted to over time is a winning combination, they should be striving for a losing one. Sorry, but in real life, the customer/gamer is always right, and if the first impression is a bad one no amount of anecdotal philosophizing or contrived justification can change that.
What are you smoking, man? If a majority of players are fine with the physics, how is it at all a "Customer is always right" situation?
Also, the Customer is Always A Silly Goose is much more accurate.
Fatal to sales, clearly not review scores.
That's the only reason I (and many) find this game intriguing. A great title (now two) marred by goofiness that at this point they're going out of their way to maintain. When you don't see a LBP3, it'll be the direct result.
If you don't buy that, check the interest levels in this game vs. other triple A titles of the last year. This thread itself is a testament.
So isn't that the same as having a switch that says "LBP1", only reversed?
To put things in perspective, an article relevant to the time of release -
http://www.destructoid.com/littlebigplanet-sales-are-lacking-sackboy-develops-a-drinking-problem-114548.phtml
And if you doubt the overall interest in LBP2, have a quick google trends -
http://www.google.com/trends?q=littlebigplanet+2,+dead+space+2,+batman+arkham+city,+dragon+age+2,+max+payne+3&ctab=0&geo=all&date=all&sort=2
- an article from time of release does nothing to put things 'in perspective'. all it does is demonstrate that initial hype and critical reception was insignificant compared to the ultimate build-up of popularity, and that new franchises take time to take hold.
- pithy lineup of exclusives? you'll have to make a better argument than 'people just bought it because they have nothing better to play on their poo-ess-three!'
- that analytic is worrying but not really surprising. despite everything it does so well littlebigplanet has always flown under the radar when it comes to the mainstream. there's an odd combination in its cute visuals with its creative and technical depth that seems to alienate a great deal of people.
but if you want me to swallow that it's directly related to the 'floaty controls', you'll have to do more than throw up an arbitrary analytic
Would it be smart to skip class tomorrow for this game? The semester literally just started last week.
So a 2D platformer styled like an art magazine, in which you control a sentient piece of cloth, isn't as popular as a bunch of games where you get to play as a weapon-toting badass? Somehow, I find this unsurprising.
The facts are this: some gamers hate LBP's controls and physics. Some gamers (the existing fanbase) enjoy them.
For this new game, the developers chose to give the fans what they really wanted.
Maybe that was a horrible, horrible business decision.
Either way, it was a pretty nice thought, wasn't it?
I'll now repost the awesome trailer from the previous page, for anyone who missed it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aXIKsMH2MpY
Like.. how did they link the character animations together? My mind is so blown by the possibilities of that.
You could make Legend of Zelda. Or Final Fantasy. Or Mega Man. Not just in Little Big Planet graphics, but really.
"without partitioning the audience"
That bit is important. They said early on that they weren't interested in making a sequel if it would fragment the community. Any opinions on the matter aside, it's obviously a thought out issue that matters to the devs. I always think it's kind of awesome when developers actually care about their fans and make decisions based on that.
BACK TO THE GAME ITSELF. Holy damn. The last few days have been a euphoric blur. The variety and polish in the levels makes them a joy to play. Anyone who actually had fun playing through the story levels in the first game should have a blast in the second one.
Much of my time now has been spent building and tinkering, which is by far my favorite part of these games. Even working with imperfect knowledge of the tools, I've found that I can accomplish SO MUCH with so little work (although sometimes a lot of tinkering and troubleshooting crops up as I learn how certain things work). First thing I did was build a Javelin missile system, which was something that just refused to be properly doable in the first game.
Right now I'm working on a hit-ball-with-paddle kind of minigame (with quite a few twists), and will likely be the first level I ever really publish for others. I generally just have fun tinkering and tweaking, but putting together a functional and enjoyable finished product is far more appealing to me now with the tools available.
So yeah. WOOO game. The first one is what got me to buy a PS3, and the last few days have made me happier with that decision than ever.
I've booked Friday (UK release date) off work. These factors may be linked.
I'm guessing we should wait a few weeks to give everyone a chance to unlock materials and stuff.
Today is the day, gentlemen!
Jealouseeeeeee! I have it
One question (that I feel horribly childish asking). I see that you, to put it bluntly, can get additional outfits for SackBoy. How does that shit work? Are they Unlockables/Pre-Orders/Collectors Edition only? Or can you purchase any of these off of PSN. I'll get to the point, though, can I have a SackBoy dressed as John Marston from Red Dead. Cause if so, that's so getting unlocked/bought.
And Amazon was offering 20 dollar credit? That sucks, it wasn't offering it when I made my preorder for the collector's edition.
It didn't apply to the CE, but if you care to put in the effort, you might be able to get a CSR to apply the credit. The credit on the standard edition does not say anything about excluding the CE.
NintendoID: Nailbunny 3DS: 3909-8796-4685
EDIT - Quick call to Sony verifies everyone is having this issue.
3DS: 1521-4165-5907
PS3: KayleSolo
Live: Kayle Solo
WiiU: KayleSolo
3DS FC: 0774-4319-6018
PSN:GallantJay
I didn't have a PS3 for LBP1, so this is all so new and exciting for me.
Media Molecule just tweeted to wait for the Playstation store to update.
I guess I'll hold off on trying to get my costumes until this gets fixed. Do they activate at a certain time or something or is it another problem?
Also, I'm interested in these level contests. We need to do these.
How do we know when the PS store updates? I want to run around as Daxter.
3DS FC: 5343-7720-0490
So wait, the CE was effectively $40 more than the standard edition then?
FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFUUUU
Oh well, too late now, my copy should be on my doorstep in mere hours.
http://www.amazon.com/LittleBigPlanet-2-Collectors-Playstation-3/dp/B003O6ED7S/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=videogames&qid=1295374685&sr=8-1
Basically the game, a sackboy plushie, game/book ends, and 11 costumes and 5 psn avatars. The costumes are basically all the pre-order bonuses from different places, and a jak and a daxter costume just for CE.
debating on buying this today or hoping that my best buy marks it down enough a few months from now when not all of them sell
3DS FC: 5343-7720-0490
I just tried my promo code with the same results. I was about to ask this too when I saw your post. Glad to find it's not just me. Between this and GoW3 I was beginning to think I was CE cursed. Guess I'll just have to play as regular ol' sack boy for now.
Edit: I believe the PSN store usually updates between 6pm and 7pm eastern standard.
Let ME clear some stuff up for you.
1. Fuck you, you don't speak for everyone.
2. See 1.
3. People who did enjoy the first LBP don't want to learn two ways of controlling the character. If Team Meat released an update for Super Meat Boy that changed the way he controlled, that would be stupid. It would be stupid here as well.
4. Citation needed. Where are you stats? Maybe, see 1. (fuck you)
Add it up, you don't know shit about game development, franchise development, marketing, or probably anything else.
While I do feel that Leetful is being critical, almost to the point of trolling, this may be a little harsh.
Let's just ignore him, maybe, and not crap up the thread with pointless arguing.
And about the comment of "people" not caring about backwards compatibility. How about all that fuckin' DLC people bought in the first one? I want my stuff in 2 without having to rebuy it, thanks.
3DS FC: 0774-4319-6018
PSN:GallantJay
Correct, which is why I went with the standard. If you ordered the CE through Amazon, you can try to hassle the CSRs into giving you the credit, though.
NintendoID: Nailbunny 3DS: 3909-8796-4685
That's basically all I tried to do in the beta.
I... need to devote a lot more time if that's to happen.
Mostly I spent my time trying to figure out how to make a sackbot run away from me, but wait at certain intervals to let Spidey catch up. Probably a lot easier than how I ended up doing it.
edit: It works now. Downloading costumes.
3DS FC: 0774-4319-6018
PSN:GallantJay