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Unusual death [chat]

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    Regina FongRegina Fong Allons-y, Alonso Registered User regular
    tyrannus wrote: »
    seriously why are we pretending that at-will employment means that protections aren't offered against people who are discriminated against based on sex, color, religion, disability now

    Because that's functionally the situation.

    Just don't create a firing pattern and you are fucking golden.

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    evilbobevilbob RADELAIDERegistered User regular
    On another note, my cat keeps sitting on me to make sure I don't go away for three days again and starts crying if I go out the front door. :(

    l5sruu1fyatf.jpg

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    ronyaronya Arrrrrf. the ivory tower's basementRegistered User regular
    tyrannus wrote: »
    seriously why are we pretending that at-will employment means that protections aren't offered against people who are discriminated against based on sex, color, religion, disability now

    because it isn't actually about protected classes, it is about an objection to discretionary conditions, of which those protected classes happen to be good examples (but unfortunately so good that they are usually already banned*) :rotate:
    *'cept one:

    GAAAAAAAAAAY

    aRkpc.gif
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    tyrannustyrannus i am not fat Registered User regular
    edited February 2013
    Senjutsu wrote: »
    tyrannus wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    Thanatos wrote: »
    So spool, you'd be okay with someone firing your wife because they found out she has fibromyalgia and don't think it's real, or firing your son because they found out that you (not him, but you) are a Christian?

    I would be angry, but yes.

    God. You'd be wrong.

    You'd have liberals supporting you if this happened.
    well he'd be stupid to because current employment laws protect people in both of those cases

    even if you're in Texas or New York
    So you don't fire them for being Christian, you fire them for No Cause

    this isn't exactly a secret stratagem in At Will states

    then you threaten to sue? you get them to settle before litigation or you take them to court and you fight that shit?

    tyrannus on
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    AManFromEarthAManFromEarth Let's get to twerk! The King in the SwampRegistered User regular
    tyrannus wrote: »
    seriously why are we pretending that at-will employment means that protections aren't offered against people who are discriminated against based on sex, color, religion, disability now

    Well spool seems to be arguing that they shouldn't be...

    so...

    Since he literally said "that's not the time government needs to step in" when it comes to firing people over political beliefs...

    Lh96QHG.png
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    ThanatosThanatos Registered User regular
    y

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    ronyaronya Arrrrrf. the ivory tower's basementRegistered User regular
    Thanatos wrote: »
    y

    z?

    :zzz: ?

    actually i should go to bed now...

    aRkpc.gif
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    ThanatosThanatos Registered User regular
    That was a long-ass post the mobile site just lost for me. God fucking dammit.

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    SenjutsuSenjutsu thot enthusiast Registered User regular
    tyrannus wrote: »
    Senjutsu wrote: »
    tyrannus wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    Thanatos wrote: »
    So spool, you'd be okay with someone firing your wife because they found out she has fibromyalgia and don't think it's real, or firing your son because they found out that you (not him, but you) are a Christian?

    I would be angry, but yes.

    God. You'd be wrong.

    You'd have liberals supporting you if this happened.
    well he'd be stupid to because current employment laws protect people in both of those cases

    even if you're in Texas or New York
    So you don't fire them for being Christian, you fire them for No Cause

    this isn't exactly a secret stratagem in At Will states

    then you threaten to sue? you get them to settle before litigation or you take them to court and you fight that shit?

    and then you lose because you're in an At Will state, the employer had no obligation to document cause for termination, stuck to the common widespread wisdom of "don't write down why you're firing the queer" so you couldn't turn up anything in discovery, and the employer was well within his At Will rights to shitcan you for "I flipped a coin and it came up tails so I fired him. Prove me wrong"

    "You'll just sue and win!" is so incredibly naive it defies belief

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    Donkey KongDonkey Kong Putting Nintendo out of business with AI nips Registered User regular
    I love that my company is headquartered in Massachusetts and hires mostly engineers with graduate degrees. Our conservative owner-CEO could fire people for political beliefs... if he wanted to kneecap his own company instantly and go out of business.

    Instead he instituted a policy where we fire people who smoke :3

    Thousands of hot, local singles are waiting to play at bubbulon.com.
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    AManFromEarthAManFromEarth Let's get to twerk! The King in the SwampRegistered User regular
    Hmm. I think sitting on that bus bench for so long before and after my interview gave me a slight sunburn.

    Curse you, Scotland, weakening my Floridaborn skin.

    Lh96QHG.png
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    tyrannustyrannus i am not fat Registered User regular
    Senjutsu wrote: »
    tyrannus wrote: »
    Senjutsu wrote: »
    tyrannus wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    Thanatos wrote: »
    So spool, you'd be okay with someone firing your wife because they found out she has fibromyalgia and don't think it's real, or firing your son because they found out that you (not him, but you) are a Christian?

    I would be angry, but yes.

    God. You'd be wrong.

    You'd have liberals supporting you if this happened.
    well he'd be stupid to because current employment laws protect people in both of those cases

    even if you're in Texas or New York
    So you don't fire them for being Christian, you fire them for No Cause

    this isn't exactly a secret stratagem in At Will states

    then you threaten to sue? you get them to settle before litigation or you take them to court and you fight that shit?

    and then you lose because you're in an At Will state, the employer had no obligation to document cause for termination, stuck to the common widespread wisdom of "don't write down why you're firing the queer" so you couldn't turn up anything in discovery, and the employer was well within his At Will rights to shitcan you for "I flipped a coin and it came up tails so I fired him. Prove me wrong"

    "You'll just sue and win!" is so incredibly naive it defies belief

    i didn't say you'd win

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    AManFromEarthAManFromEarth Let's get to twerk! The King in the SwampRegistered User regular
    tyrannus wrote: »
    Senjutsu wrote: »
    tyrannus wrote: »
    Senjutsu wrote: »
    tyrannus wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    Thanatos wrote: »
    So spool, you'd be okay with someone firing your wife because they found out she has fibromyalgia and don't think it's real, or firing your son because they found out that you (not him, but you) are a Christian?

    I would be angry, but yes.

    God. You'd be wrong.

    You'd have liberals supporting you if this happened.
    well he'd be stupid to because current employment laws protect people in both of those cases

    even if you're in Texas or New York
    So you don't fire them for being Christian, you fire them for No Cause

    this isn't exactly a secret stratagem in At Will states

    then you threaten to sue? you get them to settle before litigation or you take them to court and you fight that shit?

    and then you lose because you're in an At Will state, the employer had no obligation to document cause for termination, stuck to the common widespread wisdom of "don't write down why you're firing the queer" so you couldn't turn up anything in discovery, and the employer was well within his At Will rights to shitcan you for "I flipped a coin and it came up tails so I fired him. Prove me wrong"

    "You'll just sue and win!" is so incredibly naive it defies belief

    i didn't say you'd win

    :rotate:

    Lh96QHG.png
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    Regina FongRegina Fong Allons-y, Alonso Registered User regular
    You'd have to have a pattern of firing people who all shared a protected trait, or just leave incriminating emails or racist sticky notes scattered around to be vulnerable to a lawsuit.

    It's really hard to prove your were fired for an illegal reason even in not-at-will states.

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    nexuscrawlernexuscrawler Registered User regular
    In at will states the burden is on you to prove you were terminated illegally. Your only real chance in court is if the company cares enough about PR to settle to avoid a public lawsuit

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    bloodyroarxxbloodyroarxx Casa GrandeRegistered User regular
    Serious business here tonight

    anyways official PS4 specs right form the horses mouth
    Data released by Sony.

    Main Processor
    Single-chip custom processor
    CPU : x86-64 AMD “Jaguar”, 8 cores
    GPU : 1.84 TFLOPS, AMD next-generation Radeon™ based
    graphics engine

    Memory
    GDDR5 8GB

    Hard Disk Drive
    Built-in

    Optical Drive
    (read only)
    BD 6xCAV
    DVD 8xCAV
    I/O
    Super-Speed USB (USB 3.0) 、AUX

    Communication
    Ethernet (10BASE-T, 100BASE-TX, 1000BASE-T)
    IEEE 802.11 b/g/n
    Bluetooth® 2.1 (EDR)

    AV output
    HDMI
    Analog-AV out
    Digital Output (optical)
    *Specifications are subject to change without notice.

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    ArchArch Neat-o, mosquito! Registered User regular
    Isn't it Sony who announced basically "no more used games"

    Im trying to find an excuse for not being excited at all at the latest console release

    I guess I just dont really see the point of consoles anymore

    I feel like a dedicated, proprietary gaming platform is a relic we should let die

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    SenjutsuSenjutsu thot enthusiast Registered User regular
    tyrannus wrote: »
    Senjutsu wrote: »
    tyrannus wrote: »
    Senjutsu wrote: »
    tyrannus wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    Thanatos wrote: »
    So spool, you'd be okay with someone firing your wife because they found out she has fibromyalgia and don't think it's real, or firing your son because they found out that you (not him, but you) are a Christian?

    I would be angry, but yes.

    God. You'd be wrong.

    You'd have liberals supporting you if this happened.
    well he'd be stupid to because current employment laws protect people in both of those cases

    even if you're in Texas or New York
    So you don't fire them for being Christian, you fire them for No Cause

    this isn't exactly a secret stratagem in At Will states

    then you threaten to sue? you get them to settle before litigation or you take them to court and you fight that shit?

    and then you lose because you're in an At Will state, the employer had no obligation to document cause for termination, stuck to the common widespread wisdom of "don't write down why you're firing the queer" so you couldn't turn up anything in discovery, and the employer was well within his At Will rights to shitcan you for "I flipped a coin and it came up tails so I fired him. Prove me wrong"

    "You'll just sue and win!" is so incredibly naive it defies belief

    i didn't say you'd win

    without the threat that you'd win (and there's zero threat unless the employer is too shit-stupid to live), there will be no settlement

    you'd be hard pressed to find anyone who'd even take the case, because if you don't have your hands on some kind of written evidence, lawyers know you have no money (you are, after all, unemployed) and that they have no hope of a percentage of a settlement they have no leverage to obtain

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    ronyaronya Arrrrrf. the ivory tower's basementRegistered User regular
    I shall moan that objecting that protected-class enforcement is terrible, also doesn't seem like a terribly plausible motivation for the amount of objection to at-will employment out there

    aRkpc.gif
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    tyrannustyrannus i am not fat Registered User regular
    Senjutsu wrote: »
    tyrannus wrote: »
    Senjutsu wrote: »
    tyrannus wrote: »
    Senjutsu wrote: »
    tyrannus wrote: »
    spool32 wrote: »
    Thanatos wrote: »
    So spool, you'd be okay with someone firing your wife because they found out she has fibromyalgia and don't think it's real, or firing your son because they found out that you (not him, but you) are a Christian?

    I would be angry, but yes.

    God. You'd be wrong.

    You'd have liberals supporting you if this happened.
    well he'd be stupid to because current employment laws protect people in both of those cases

    even if you're in Texas or New York
    So you don't fire them for being Christian, you fire them for No Cause

    this isn't exactly a secret stratagem in At Will states

    then you threaten to sue? you get them to settle before litigation or you take them to court and you fight that shit?

    and then you lose because you're in an At Will state, the employer had no obligation to document cause for termination, stuck to the common widespread wisdom of "don't write down why you're firing the queer" so you couldn't turn up anything in discovery, and the employer was well within his At Will rights to shitcan you for "I flipped a coin and it came up tails so I fired him. Prove me wrong"

    "You'll just sue and win!" is so incredibly naive it defies belief

    i didn't say you'd win

    without the threat that you'd win (and there's zero threat unless the employer is too shit-stupid to live), there will be no settlement

    you'd be hard pressed to find anyone who'd even take the case, because if you don't have your hands on some kind of written evidence, lawyers know you have no money (you are, after all, unemployed) and that they have no hope of a percentage of a settlement they have no leverage to obtain
    god dammit

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    SenjutsuSenjutsu thot enthusiast Registered User regular
    You'd have to have a pattern of firing people who all shared a protected trait, or just leave incriminating emails or racist sticky notes scattered around to be vulnerable to a lawsuit.

    It's really hard to prove your were fired for an illegal reason even in not-at-will states.

    yeah to be clear it's really easy to create a thin veil of justification even in Not-at-will states

    but the abuses become even easier and even more incentivized in At Will states

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    AManFromEarthAManFromEarth Let's get to twerk! The King in the SwampRegistered User regular
    I mostly just don't think employers should have that much power over their workers. Small business owners are not gods among men. Them getting pissed off at me should not be all the reason they need to fire me if I am good at my job and not harming the company.

    Lh96QHG.png
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    AManFromEarthAManFromEarth Let's get to twerk! The King in the SwampRegistered User regular
    We shouldn't make being Andy Bernard ok.

    Lh96QHG.png
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    bloodyroarxxbloodyroarxx Casa GrandeRegistered User regular
    Arch wrote: »
    Isn't it Sony who announced basically "no more used games"

    Im trying to find an excuse for not being excited at all at the latest console release

    I guess I just dont really see the point of consoles anymore

    I feel like a dedicated, proprietary gaming platform is a relic we should let die

    No, no one announced an anti used games platform.

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    skippydumptruckskippydumptruck begin again Registered User regular
    I don't know what is happening but I don't like it.

    bonin

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    ArchArch Neat-o, mosquito! Registered User regular
    I don't know what is happening but I don't like it.

    bonin

    electionerection.com

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    Donkey KongDonkey Kong Putting Nintendo out of business with AI nips Registered User regular
    edited February 2013
    Arch wrote: »
    Isn't it Sony who announced basically "no more used games"

    Im trying to find an excuse for not being excited at all at the latest console release

    I guess I just dont really see the point of consoles anymore

    I feel like a dedicated, proprietary gaming platform is a relic we should let die

    No, no one announced an anti used games platform.

    That doesn't mean it's not happening, since it would be moronic to announce. We'll just have to see who is bold enough to try it. My money is on the Japanese company though.

    Donkey Kong on
    Thousands of hot, local singles are waiting to play at bubbulon.com.
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    Regina FongRegina Fong Allons-y, Alonso Registered User regular
    I'm with Thanatos. Small businesses are a sacred cow that needs to be tipped.

    And not tipped like you don't tip at Starbucks.

    Tipped like we do it here in pigfuckistan.

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    CambiataCambiata Commander Shepard The likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered User regular
    Thanatos wrote: »
    So spool, you'd be okay with someone firing your wife because they found out she has fibromyalgia and don't think it's real, or firing your son because they found out that you (not him, but you) are a Christian?

    You do realize that if an employer doesn't like one of his or her employees for some reason, valid or invalid, that they can and will figure out a way to get them fired while following union rules to the letter?

    I can remember one such firing at my union job. The actual incident that got him fired was so trivial that no one else would have gotten in trouble for it: Management had passed out to every employee one of those toy screaming monkey things (why they thought this was a good idea in the first place I cannot guess). This particular employee took his monkey and pinned it to his cubicle wall, one thumbtack in each of the monkey's wrists, which could appear as a crucifix if you were looking for a reason to be offended. The next day the employee was fired for breach of company policy. Everyone knew the real reason he was fired was because management didn't like him.

    "If you divide the whole world into just enemies and friends, you'll end up destroying everything" --Nausicaa of the Valley of Wind
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    ArchArch Neat-o, mosquito! Registered User regular
    Arch wrote: »
    Isn't it Sony who announced basically "no more used games"

    Im trying to find an excuse for not being excited at all at the latest console release

    I guess I just dont really see the point of consoles anymore

    I feel like a dedicated, proprietary gaming platform is a relic we should let die

    No, no one announced an anti used games platform.

    ??????

    But like I said, this is just me finding an excuse

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    CambiataCambiata Commander Shepard The likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered User regular
    "If you divide the whole world into just enemies and friends, you'll end up destroying everything" --Nausicaa of the Valley of Wind
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    Regina FongRegina Fong Allons-y, Alonso Registered User regular
    Pigfuckistan will be the name of my bands* first album.


    *Catastrophic Toilet Paper Integrity Failure is my bands name in case anyone forgot.

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    evilbobevilbob RADELAIDERegistered User regular
    Isn't PC already the anti used games platform?

    l5sruu1fyatf.jpg

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    SarksusSarksus ATTACK AND DETHRONE GODRegistered User regular
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    skippydumptruckskippydumptruck begin again Registered User regular
    boniiiiin

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    EddyEddy Gengar the Bittersweet Registered User regular
    edited February 2013
    In at will states the burden is on you to prove you were terminated illegally. Your only real chance in court is if the company cares enough about PR to settle to avoid a public lawsuit

    Not only is the burden on you, but the case will likely never go to court since there has literally been no functioning NLRB for the past two years (republicans filibustering appointments till the end of tiiime), and there are a whole lot of legal loopholes employers can use to block or infinitely delay arbitration should you be lucky enough to have grievance procedures. And any financial remedy to you has any money you've made in the intervening time period deducted from the settlement

    so

    good luck lol

    Eddy on
    "and the morning stars I have seen
    and the gengars who are guiding me" -- W.S. Merwin
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    Regina FongRegina Fong Allons-y, Alonso Registered User regular
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    AManFromEarthAManFromEarth Let's get to twerk! The King in the SwampRegistered User regular
    If the new generation of consoles really does make it so you can't play used games that'll basically be the end of my video game hobby. Or at least, it will be once my 360 dies.

    Lh96QHG.png
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    CambiataCambiata Commander Shepard The likes of which even GAWD has never seenRegistered User regular
    Sarksus wrote: »

    And that is going to be my band's name when I have one.

    "If you divide the whole world into just enemies and friends, you'll end up destroying everything" --Nausicaa of the Valley of Wind
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    Regina FongRegina Fong Allons-y, Alonso Registered User regular
    evilbob wrote: »
    Isn't PC already the anti used games platform?

    We do get Steam sales though.

    Just be like me and be so hopelessly behind the curve of new video games that everything you're ready to play is on sale.

This discussion has been closed.