it's definitely a position of privilege to feel safer with police around
It shouldn't be, though.
I understand the problem with stationing a heavy police presence around pride events but I honestly don't know what else cities are supposed to do in the wake of the the LGBTQ community being the target of the worst shooting in US history. "It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't" kind of situation.
Which isn't a criticism of BLM or anything for pulling out support it's just... I don't know what else the people organizing the pride event are supposed to do.
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cj iwakuraThe Rhythm RegentBears The Name FreedomRegistered Userregular
edited June 2016
Thought you all might like to know, I was in Orlando for a tournament, and I saw many, many shirts bearing 'Orlando Pride' in rainbow colors on display. A lot of solidarity all around.
It feels kind of odd that Pride here in Atlanta is celebrated in October when now June has become a national thing. We're gonna have a Canadian v. American Thanksgiving thing on our hands soon.
Ottawa's Pride events are in August, but that's mostly because the Toronto Pride events are so much crazier that it means most folks can do both. Maybe it's that kind of situation in Atlanta too?
I mean, this is frustrating. Yes, police have committed a lot of really shitty acts towards people of color, often disproportionately. There are still ongoing issues, particularly in the Bay Area, with policing and how it relates to skin color (and socioeconomic status). That said, the police have a job, which is to protect their communities. As a community that was specifically threatened with major violence, it seems only natural to include police in Pride celebrations a bit heavier than usual, and to be thankful they're there.
I'm not suggesting that BLM's voice should be diminished, but there has to be a middle ground where one can respect the police for the good and required acts they perform while still pushing for them to be better overall, and boycotting a gay pride parade because they want more security right now seems at best insensitive.
honestly im put off by police being incorporated into pride at all, beyond security. like, theyre still attacking us, theyre still killing us, theyre still arresting us on prostitution charges for having the audacity to walk in public while alive
i cant fault black lives matter, as a movement. im not really digging homonationalism becoming a thing either but thats a different discussion
and situations being what they are in the US, the need for increased security at Pride events is rational and necessary
that said
police also march in Pride events and are part of it
it's part of the increasingly gentrified, culturally privileged shift of Pride
the most recent Pride I personally went to (Toronto Pride 2014), the Toronto police had a section of the parade they marched in, as did the Canadian military
the Canadian Forces, the Toronto Police Service, and Canadian Security and Intelligence Services all had recruitment booths at Pride
considering those are all groups that have improved their treatment of queer people but still have a fuck ton of problems, that's kinda weird?
like the TPS is still shitty to trans people, trans people in the Canadian military still have a really hard time, and when I was going through the CSIS application process my sexual orientation absolutely came up as something to be reviewed from the perspective of potential risk and liability for the agency (ie is it something someone could use to blackmail me, is my spouse aware of my orientation, etc.) and it caused my CSIS interviewer to sort of passive aggressively question my marital fidelity in a way that he likely would have not if i was heterosexual
have those groups made improvements? sure
does that mean they've earned the right to march, to be a part of the community, to be cheered and hugged and thanked?
ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
and I say that as someone who is very tightly intertwined with law enforcement, the military, intelligence, and security, familialy and professionally
yeah, while I agree with the need for law enforcement in principle, the american system of policing is rotten and needs to be thrown out
it has its roots in slave-catching patrols and has always been first and foremost about "protecting" white people from poc
it's a shitty reality for a whole host of reasons, not the least being situations like SF Pride
but we white lgbt folks shouldn't be telling our black, latino, asian, etc, family that they have to put aside their problems with the police in order to celebrate their queerness just because we want to feel safer
that's the thing that's so hard about truely standing in solidarity with people who are more marginalized than you: you have to give up the safety and comfort that comes from your privilege
Yeah, a police force is a necessary thing, but the existing one still carries the many years of bigotry and general oppression like an old growth forest.
And the decentralized nature of law enforcement makes any kind of reform or even complete restructuring of existing system very, very hard.
Well no, the force we have right now, which has been a tool of oppression for many many years, is absolutely not needed. But I think most would still want law enforcement, just free of bigotry, corruption, and the laundry list of other issues.
I understand the sentiment of rebuilding the police system, but it's so unlikely to ever happen that I'd much rather see gradual progress in the current system.
The idea of having no cops at Pride is beyond me, and I say this as someone who has been harassed by racist cops before. Even if they don't really care about my life, I at least know that they'll stop an armed maniac who wants to crash the event.
Trust is earned. When police straight-up say "No" to any kind of apology for Stonewall, it's easy to see why people don't really want them at those events.
It feels kind of odd that Pride here in Atlanta is celebrated in October when now June has become a national thing. We're gonna have a Canadian v. American Thanksgiving thing on our hands soon.
Atlanta Pride had a lot of people get hurt by the heat so they don't do it in June anymore.
the Canadian Forces, the Toronto Police Service, and Canadian Security and Intelligence Services all had recruitment booths at Pride
considering those are all groups that have improved their treatment of queer people but still have a fuck ton of problems, that's kinda weird?
To be fair, though, the quickest way to start chipping away at the systemic problems is to get representation into those forces, and Pride is probably a good way to aim your recruitment at more representation. That isn't to say it isn't strange or abusable, but I can certainly see why someone would think it was a good idea, without malicious intention.
@pony I can't do that because I get panic attacks when I leave the house
there's a shitload of reasons why folk can't do battle in this regard - because of work, kids, health problems, etc.
it's hard not to take that comment badly, because I sure as shit would be doing more if I was able to
real hard to call it a position of privilege
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MrMonroepassed outon the floor nowRegistered Userregular
I'm... well, not happy, but acquiescent, to have the police running security, assuming they're on their absolute best behavior and aren't harassing anyone trying to participate.
I'm gonna draw the line at inviting them to march in the parade, though. I'm not a big fan of non-queer people being invited to march in the parade "in solidarity" at all, and inviting the people who fuck up your lives on the regular to be "in solidarity" with you seems not productive.
The problem isn't really if police will do anything, but that if something DOES happen then there will be zero accountablility as the police circle the wagons and do everything to protect their own as opposed to, you know, the people they're supposed to be protecting.
The One Bad Apple excuse doesn't work too well when you fervently do everything in your power to let it keep rotting in the basket.
+11
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KwoaruConfident SmirkFlawless Golden PecsRegistered Userregular
In the DC parade I'm pretty sure the only police that actually marched were LGBT officers, which I thought was nice
Tell you what I could have done without the mile of politicians though
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Zonugal(He/Him) The Holiday ArmadilloI'm Santa's representative for all the southern states. And Mexico!Registered Userregular
I'm... I'm so tired from Seattle's Pride festivities on Saturday night.
And I was in the zone. Everyone was a new friend, everyone wanted to talk to me.
At one point a table full of women started throwing beads at me and demanded I flash them my nips.
In a bit of positive news I met someone yesterday who was immediately accepting of me, and used my preferred pronouns with no complaints. He did mess up once but immediately apologized and corrected himself. Interactions like that always make me feel better. (Which I needed, since boy howdy the dysphoria has been hitting me hard these past few days.)
In a bit of positive news I met someone yesterday who was immediately accepting of me, and used my preferred pronouns with no complaints. He did mess up once but immediately apologized and corrected himself. Interactions like that always make me feel better. (Which I needed, since boy howdy the dysphoria has been hitting me hard these past few days.)
apparently the big pride in lansing (the capital of michigan) is happening august 26. im sorta happy im not doing a west coast pride event given those are vaguely touristy now, which is a dang shame. its nice attending a pride in the midwest given ooof, historically not a font of pro lgbt sentiment
I will never understand people getting pissy over non-lgbt people being happy for what we have now and celebrating with us. This article is crap on a stick.
I will never understand people getting pissy over non-lgbt people being happy for what we have now and celebrating with us. This article is crap on a stick.
I'm always wary of that mentality, because the rationale sounds a lot like the gatekeeping arguments I've heard in Latin and transfer circles.
But at least half of the drunk people I saw on Muni leaving Civic Center yesterday weren't gay — nor, probably, were the people in this knife fight that messed up BART last night
That's a WHOLE lot of assumptions going on unless the author has some sort of queer-detecto-vision-power.
Big groupings of people always have a few scattered incidents of violence happen in them; Pride festivals aren't immune to that and it sure as hell wouldn't stop them from happening if everyone there wasn't straight.
+5
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Garlic Breadi'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm a bitch i'm aRegistered User, Disagreeableregular
I will never understand people getting pissy over non-lgbt people being happy for what we have now and celebrating with us. This article is crap on a stick.
That's not the problem and the article doesn't say it is. It's pointing out that straight people aren't celebrating with us/for us/anything. Pride's becoming just another excuse to get drunk and party. The purpose of the event means jack shit to them, much like St. Patrick's Day, Cinco de Mayo, etc.
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I believe it was one week.
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I understand the problem with stationing a heavy police presence around pride events but I honestly don't know what else cities are supposed to do in the wake of the the LGBTQ community being the target of the worst shooting in US history. "It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't" kind of situation.
Which isn't a criticism of BLM or anything for pulling out support it's just... I don't know what else the people organizing the pride event are supposed to do.
They're just trying to ensure maximum visible skin.
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honestly im put off by police being incorporated into pride at all, beyond security. like, theyre still attacking us, theyre still killing us, theyre still arresting us on prostitution charges for having the audacity to walk in public while alive
i cant fault black lives matter, as a movement. im not really digging homonationalism becoming a thing either but thats a different discussion
like, the police need to exist
lawful societies basically require them, like, conceptually?
and situations being what they are in the US, the need for increased security at Pride events is rational and necessary
that said
police also march in Pride events and are part of it
it's part of the increasingly gentrified, culturally privileged shift of Pride
the most recent Pride I personally went to (Toronto Pride 2014), the Toronto police had a section of the parade they marched in, as did the Canadian military
the Canadian Forces, the Toronto Police Service, and Canadian Security and Intelligence Services all had recruitment booths at Pride
considering those are all groups that have improved their treatment of queer people but still have a fuck ton of problems, that's kinda weird?
like the TPS is still shitty to trans people, trans people in the Canadian military still have a really hard time, and when I was going through the CSIS application process my sexual orientation absolutely came up as something to be reviewed from the perspective of potential risk and liability for the agency (ie is it something someone could use to blackmail me, is my spouse aware of my orientation, etc.) and it caused my CSIS interviewer to sort of passive aggressively question my marital fidelity in a way that he likely would have not if i was heterosexual
have those groups made improvements? sure
does that mean they've earned the right to march, to be a part of the community, to be cheered and hugged and thanked?
ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
ehhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
and I say that as someone who is very tightly intertwined with law enforcement, the military, intelligence, and security, familialy and professionally
not revived, "cleaned-up" or whatever
it's always been super awful in this exact same way
we need something entirely different
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it has its roots in slave-catching patrols and has always been first and foremost about "protecting" white people from poc
it's a shitty reality for a whole host of reasons, not the least being situations like SF Pride
but we white lgbt folks shouldn't be telling our black, latino, asian, etc, family that they have to put aside their problems with the police in order to celebrate their queerness just because we want to feel safer
Steam | Twitter
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And the decentralized nature of law enforcement makes any kind of reform or even complete restructuring of existing system very, very hard.
nevermind
The idea of having no cops at Pride is beyond me, and I say this as someone who has been harassed by racist cops before. Even if they don't really care about my life, I at least know that they'll stop an armed maniac who wants to crash the event.
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To be fair, though, the quickest way to start chipping away at the systemic problems is to get representation into those forces, and Pride is probably a good way to aim your recruitment at more representation. That isn't to say it isn't strange or abusable, but I can certainly see why someone would think it was a good idea, without malicious intention.
there's a shitload of reasons why folk can't do battle in this regard - because of work, kids, health problems, etc.
it's hard not to take that comment badly, because I sure as shit would be doing more if I was able to
real hard to call it a position of privilege
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I'm gonna draw the line at inviting them to march in the parade, though. I'm not a big fan of non-queer people being invited to march in the parade "in solidarity" at all, and inviting the people who fuck up your lives on the regular to be "in solidarity" with you seems not productive.
The One Bad Apple excuse doesn't work too well when you fervently do everything in your power to let it keep rotting in the basket.
Tell you what I could have done without the mile of politicians though
And I was in the zone. Everyone was a new friend, everyone wanted to talk to me.
At one point a table full of women started throwing beads at me and demanded I flash them my nips.
So tired...
Awww I'm really happy to hear this!
golly that sure is some racism in the comments
i mean i don't make a habit of reading comments
that's some Bad Internet
but those comments, woof
I will never understand people getting pissy over non-lgbt people being happy for what we have now and celebrating with us. This article is crap on a stick.
I'm always wary of that mentality, because the rationale sounds a lot like the gatekeeping arguments I've heard in Latin and transfer circles.
Twitter
That's a WHOLE lot of assumptions going on unless the author has some sort of queer-detecto-vision-power.
Big groupings of people always have a few scattered incidents of violence happen in them; Pride festivals aren't immune to that and it sure as hell wouldn't stop them from happening if everyone there wasn't straight.
That's not the problem and the article doesn't say it is. It's pointing out that straight people aren't celebrating with us/for us/anything. Pride's becoming just another excuse to get drunk and party. The purpose of the event means jack shit to them, much like St. Patrick's Day, Cinco de Mayo, etc.