Ninja Snarl PMy helmet is my burden.Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered Userregular
edited August 2017
I don't think there was ever much of a thought given to the Metroid setting before we got to the Prime series, it's only a coincidence that the Metroid timeline before that point isn't as random and contradictory as the Legend of Zelda one, and the fact that the Metroid games tended to be direct sequels instead of completely standalone one-offs.
Most of the pre-Prime story just came from what was in the game manuals, and most of that was basic stuff like the Federation hiring Samus to go deal with Metroids/Space Pirates. All we knew was that the Space Pirates were bad and they wanted the Metroids to do bad things. It wasn't until we the tons of scannable logs in the MP games that we got to find out things like how much they feared/hated Samus, why they want all this crazy tech, how badly they failed at duplicating the morph ball, affection for murderous life-eating pets, etc.
Sakamoto claims that the Prime games aren't canon because they don't match his "vision" of Samus, but considering the Prime games are getting a sequel and his truly turd-tacular Other M is not, his awful ideas about what Samus should be like can probably be pretty safely dismissed at this point.
re: the ransoming of Samus, it was a quip from Sakamoto in an interview. Maybe there's context here culturally or because of Sak's history with the series that carries more weight than it reads as, but it seems fairly benign to me. The outlet from that tweet spun this as "METROID CANCELED FOREVER UNLESS YOU ALL ORDER THREE OF SAMUS RETURNS", nintendolife took the same quote and their lede is "Sakamoto wants to make another metroid"
“Through the development of Metroid: Samus Returns, I was able to really grasp the possibility and fun of a 2D Metroid. Like when I finished the first game, if there is another opportunity to make another Metroid, that is something that I would love to do. Of course, that really depends on how much people really want to buy a 2D Metroid.”
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Warlock82Never pet a burning dogRegistered Userregular
re: the ransoming of Samus, it was a quip from Sakamoto in an interview. Maybe there's context here culturally or because of Sak's history with the series that carries more weight than it reads as, but it seems fairly benign to me. The outlet from that tweet spun this as "METROID CANCELED FOREVER UNLESS YOU ALL ORDER THREE OF SAMUS RETURNS", nintendolife took the same quote and their lede is "Sakamoto wants to make another metroid"
“Through the development of Metroid: Samus Returns, I was able to really grasp the possibility and fun of a 2D Metroid. Like when I finished the first game, if there is another opportunity to make another Metroid, that is something that I would love to do. Of course, that really depends on how much people really want to buy a 2D Metroid.”
I mean, Prime 3 sold like shit (somehow) as did Other M. Look what happened after that...
re: the ransoming of Samus, it was a quip from Sakamoto in an interview. Maybe there's context here culturally or because of Sak's history with the series that carries more weight than it reads as, but it seems fairly benign to me. The outlet from that tweet spun this as "METROID CANCELED FOREVER UNLESS YOU ALL ORDER THREE OF SAMUS RETURNS", nintendolife took the same quote and their lede is "Sakamoto wants to make another metroid"
“Through the development of Metroid: Samus Returns, I was able to really grasp the possibility and fun of a 2D Metroid. Like when I finished the first game, if there is another opportunity to make another Metroid, that is something that I would love to do. Of course, that really depends on how much people really want to buy a 2D Metroid.”
I mean, Prime 3 sold like shit (somehow) as did Other M. Look what happened after that...
Prime 3's sales were underwhelming because it was on a console that was aimed at and mostly sold to casual gamers. Wii Sports grandmas aren't going to play Metroid. Bioshock was out at the same time on other platforms and while I think Prime 3 initially sold better, Bioshock caught on better in the long run and perhaps a lot of gamers who would have been interested in Prime 3 went to that instead. It was also first person, atmospheric, and quite a bit more compelling than Prime 3 (imo).
Ninja Snarl PMy helmet is my burden.Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered Userregular
Nintendo generally knows shit-all about what to do with the Metroid games. Super Metroid was excellent, so they tossed the franchise off to some no-name group out of Texas. People seemed to like Prime series pretty well, so they took it from Retro, took out pretty much all the first-person stuff, and handed off to a shitbird of a "writer" and everybody hated the thing. Then nothing for years before a shitty spinoff title, and then years again before a remake that ignores their brand-new hardware in favor of the DS line and also a Prime sequel.
I just don't think Nintendo is equipped to be able to reliably and intentionally put out quality Metroid titles. The Zelda games are about as dark and serious a tone as they can regularly handle, and the Metroid setting is far darker.
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Forever Zefirocloaked in the midnight glory of an event horizonRegistered Userregular
I don't think there was ever much of a thought given to the Metroid setting before we got to the Prime series, it's only a coincidence that the Metroid timeline before that point isn't as random and contradictory as the Legend of Zelda one, and the fact that the Metroid games tended to be direct sequels instead of completely standalone one-offs.
Most of the pre-Prime story just came from what was in the game manuals, and most of that was basic stuff like the Federation hiring Samus to go deal with Metroids/Space Pirates. All we knew was that the Space Pirates were bad and they wanted the Metroids to do bad things. It wasn't until we the tons of scannable logs in the MP games that we got to find out things like how much they feared/hated Samus, why they want all this crazy tech, how badly they failed at duplicating the morph ball, affection for murderous life-eating pets, etc.
I think you're being a bit hyperbolic there
Reading the game manuals, I definitely think they put some thought into the Metroid setting, it's just harder to convey that kind of stuff in an NES and GB game. I hardly think it's coincidence at all since Metroid II directly leads into Super Metroid, it seems pretty clear they had a vision for the story. The Primes hardly add anything substantial. Mostly just bits of lore and flavor sure(some of it basically turning the Space Pirates into jokes like you mentioned, for better or worse), but after the Prime games I don't think anything's changed, it's still the Federation hires Samus to deal with Space Pirates who do bad things. Just now we know Space Pirates make bad decisions.
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Ninja Snarl PMy helmet is my burden.Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered Userregular
I'm sure the original creators sat down and thought out things like who does Samus work for and whatnot, but come on, she fights an alien race known as Space Pirates. Not big on the detail there. It's not a criticism of the creators, it just wasn't expected back then. Look at the first Zelda game, which came out in the same year as the first Metroid game; yeah, the creators thought up the setting, but there was no need for (or space for) much detail back then. Just being a space bounty hunter fighting space pirates in an "open world" game was a pretty big deal. When it was time for the next game, they just hooked its premise to whatever ended the last one.
In comparison, the Prime games convey a ton of additional info as to what is driving the Space Pirates and why Samus is the one with the equipment to actually combat them effectively without needed an army. We get to see that they are habitually brutal in their treatment of each other, willingly subject themselves to terrible experiments for the gain of themselves or the Space Pirate race, adhere to a rigid chain of command (enforced through more brutality), are far from fearless where Samus is concerned, and still do things like keeping pets (even really super-deadly ones). MP1 also expands on why the Metroids are such a potent threat, on their own or in the hands of the Space Pirates.
To me, the Prime games indicate a hell of a lot more thought given to the setting than was done by the original makers, but Retro also had the resources and space to actually include all that material so they had a reason to think it up and a way to get it in the game. Why are there different-colored Space Pirates in the previous games with different abilities? They're just sort of there in the older games, but the MP games are what go into detail about how the Space Pirates have a ton of combat tech and undergo lots of modifications of different varieties.
I think it's less that it made Space Pirates into jokes and more than it made the Space Pirates into something at all. Like, I went through Metroid and Super Metroid and I never ever guessed that the random mantis duders were Space Pirates, and in fact found out because I happened to run into the manga online something like six years later.
In Metroid Prime, Space Pirates are a group with an identity. They're rapacious, lacking in empathy, experimentative, petty, and cruel, and at the same time they're human enough to send memos or write diaries complaining about the newest horrendously dangerous scheme of High Command. They're not just "random mantis dudes" anymore.
Zelda isn't the darkest setting Nintendo can handle.
Well, ok, Breath of the Wild is pretty dark in setting, as is Majora's Mask, but those are a bit of an outlier.
Anyway, the Fire Emblem series, on average, leans more than a little bit darker than stuff like Zelda, seeing as each game is about war and doesn't shy away from death, conquering, slavery, and other such things.
I think it's less that it made Space Pirates into jokes and more than it made the Space Pirates into something at all. Like, I went through Metroid and Super Metroid and I never ever guessed that the random mantis duders were Space Pirates, and in fact found out because I happened to run into the manga online something like six years later.
In Metroid Prime, Space Pirates are a group with an identity. They're rapacious, lacking in empathy, experimentative, petty, and cruel, and at the same time they're human enough to send memos or write diaries complaining about the newest horrendously dangerous scheme of High Command. They're not just "random mantis dudes" anymore.
I take it you didn't have access to the manual?
As always, everything back then is in the manuals. Even pretty wordy stuff like Link to the Past has a whole creation myth and backstory hidden away in the manual.
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Warlock82Never pet a burning dogRegistered Userregular
Wait, Kihunters are supposed to be space pirates too?! I thought they were just random wildlife that tends to show up a lot...
Don't they mean, you know, dead? Since they take the entire spaceship? At best, they'd be kind enough to leave the crew in space suits before blowing them out the airlock and taking the ship. Which is like, a few hours to live, with shallow breaths?
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Forever Zefirocloaked in the midnight glory of an event horizonRegistered Userregular
My main point is I think it's silly to say they didn't put much thought into it and that it's only a coincidence
They put a decent amount of info into the manuals, including details like those random mantis dudes are a faction of Space Pirates
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Don't they mean, you know, dead? Since they take the entire spaceship? At best, they'd be kind enough to leave the crew in space suits before blowing them out the airlock and taking the ship. Which is like, a few hours to live, with shallow breaths?
Escape pods I assume? Like, anyone who abandons ship before the pirates get on board is ignored.
OK, Okay. Don't get your pants in a bunch. But Splatoon 2 is the only one of those games you mentioned that uses something you can't take with you (a second screen), so that's not much of a counter-argument. Like, even the motion control games can be played away from home by using the kickstand and detaching the joycons can't it? There's a historical precedent for them releasing handhelds that competed against still-successful handhelds, with the public-facing claims of a "third pillar", so their marketing doesn't necessarily reflect reality. I fully expect them to support the 2DS/N3DS for at least a few more years, but I'd be surprised if they make another pure handheld after that.
It's a home console with handheld features, not a handheld with home console features and the distinction is important. It is not a handheld and to describe it as such simply inaccurate.
The difference is Nintendo wants this to be seen as a home console with portable features. That's how it's designed, that's how it's marketed, and that's why the majority of the first party games on the system are games that were previously on the WiiU or are full console experiences.
So the distinction (and the difference) is "because Nintendo says so"? :P Not very compelling. Also:
How would it be idiotic? The tech exists to do it. Why not start now? Keep supporting the latest DS models while they've still got legs under them, but put out the first wave of the future now to get people used to the idea, especially since the last pure home console was struggling. I don't think anyone's saying they're going to kill DS tomorrow, just that the Switch is clearly meant to be the first of a new combined platform business model.
And none of those quotes sound like you don't care. On the contrary, it sounds like you care deeply that everyone stay on message with Nintendo's current publicity.
uh no I made it pretty clear that the only reason why it matters is because Nintendo controls what appears on their system. They want it to primarily be a console experience so that's what it is.
And none of those quotes sound like you don't care
Yeah I'm not gonna do the thing with you where you try to sherlock holmes why I care so much when I'm clearly just stating the situation.
H3KnucklesBut we decide which is rightand which is an illusion.Registered Userregular
edited August 2017
I wasn't trying to insinuate anything other than that you seemed emotionally invested in it.
I guess I don't understand why your response to people complaining that they feel Nintendo should release handheld games on the Switch is that Nintendo has decided not to release handheld games on the Switch? It just seems kind of tautological. They're saying it's an arbitrary decision that they don't like, and your initial response seemed like you were convinced there was some practical reason it couldn't be done, so I was trying to draw out what that was.
To steer it back onto topic (somewhat); I really want to get this remake, but I don't have a New 3DS. I am hoping to get a Switch by the end of the year (birthday's in Nov, so if I can just get all my family to get me gift cards for that and Christmas...), so a port would be preferable for me. Although I'll admit the Venn diagram of people who own a switch and/or a New 3DS is probably closer to a circle, putting people who only own the Switch the fringe. I could try to get a New 3DS next year and backfill on all the games I missed, but there will probably be something new I'd rather spend whatever disposable cash I get on.
Nintendo generally knows shit-all about what to do with the Metroid games. Super Metroid was excellent, so they tossed the franchise off to some no-name group out of Texas. People seemed to like Prime series pretty well, so they took it from Retro, took out pretty much all the first-person stuff, and handed off to a shitbird of a "writer" and everybody hated the thing. Then nothing for years before a shitty spinoff title, and then years again before a remake that ignores their brand-new hardware in favor of the DS line and also a Prime sequel.
I just don't think Nintendo is equipped to be able to reliably and intentionally put out quality Metroid titles. The Zelda games are about as dark and serious a tone as they can regularly handle, and the Metroid setting is far darker.
There's so much here that's just off that I'm not even sure whether you're being facetious or actually think this.
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Forever Zefirocloaked in the midnight glory of an event horizonRegistered Userregular
Super Metroid was excellent, so they tossed the franchise off to some no-name group out of Texas. People seemed to like Prime series pretty well, so they took it from Retro, took out pretty much all the first-person stuff, and handed off to a shitbird of a "writer" and everybody hated the thing. Then nothing for years before a shitty spinoff title, and then years again before a remake that ignores their brand-new hardware in favor of the DS line and also a Prime sequel.
So what's your take on Fusion and Zero Mission, since I don't see anything that corresponds to them in that? We can ignore Prime Pinball if you want. :P
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Ninja Snarl PMy helmet is my burden.Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered Userregular
Super Metroid was excellent, so they tossed the franchise off to some no-name group out of Texas. People seemed to like Prime series pretty well, so they took it from Retro, took out pretty much all the first-person stuff, and handed off to a shitbird of a "writer" and everybody hated the thing. Then nothing for years before a shitty spinoff title, and then years again before a remake that ignores their brand-new hardware in favor of the DS line and also a Prime sequel.
So what's your take on Fusion and Zero Mission, since I don't see anything that corresponds to them in that? We can ignore Prime Pinball if you want. :P
They were obviously both excellent Metroid games, but they weren't really any kind of notable step forward for the series; Zero Mission is mostly a remake of a game which game out almost twenty years earlier. Fusion's biggest addition compared to prior games were the clumsy Samus monologues (hey, look at that, Sakamoto was the writer for that game as well...). Both of them also had brief stealth bits, which were neat but simple.
They were great games, sure, but they were basically just Nintendo aping it's prior efforts on a handheld SNES. They were quality sequels that would've fit in perfectly on a system replaced 8-10 years earlier, building on the Super Metroid's stellar foundation. I would've loved if they had kept making other games of the same type and just as good, but they seemed to just give up on quality handheld Metroid titles after Zero Mission.
And to reinforce what I was saying about Nintendo not really knowing what to do with the Metroid series, look at the last several portable installments: Federation Force (basically a Metroid game in name only), Hunters (an attempt to turn the FPS aspect of Prime into a standard FPS), and a pinball game. And what's their next Metroid release? A re-release of the second Metroid game. There's obviously Other M as well, which doesn't even need comment regarding its quality.
So unless they can find some other group to make a Metroid game for them, Nintendo's Metroid efforts seem to be restricted largely to remaking something much older or making something that isn't really even Metroid at all.
We'll see what happens with MP4, but Nintendo just does not seem to be able to wrap its collective brain around the Metroid series nearly as well as it handles many of its other properties.
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Brainiac 8Don't call me Shirley...Registered Userregular
There has been far more great to excellent Metroid games then bad ones, so Nintendo must be doing something right with the series.
Zero Mission is probably my favorite Metroid game they created, followed very closely by Super Metroid.
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Ninja Snarl PMy helmet is my burden.Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered Userregular
edited August 2017
And I loved the hell out of Zero Mission and Fusion as well (those two games alone had me keeping a GBA around for years beyond everything else), but Zero Mission was still mostly a remake and Fusion was a sequel behind the times by at least one console generation. Those aren't criticisms, they're observations.
Again, I wish to hell they'd kept doing more 2D sidescroller stuff with the same quality, but Nintendo dropped that trend for some reason, and their next effort is reaching back to something that came out in 1991 to remake that as well. Hopefully it should be pretty great, it just doesn't indicate a lot of creative drive involved in Nintendo's handling of the Metroid series.
There has been far more great to excellent Metroid games then bad ones, so Nintendo must be doing something right with the series.
Take out the Prime games and you have to go aaaalllll the way back to 2004 for a decent Metroid game that is actually a Metroid game. Even MP2 had some pretty questionable and obnoxious elements, and the MP series itself originated with some little minor group that was almost completely separate from the bulk of Nintendo (whose efforts one of Nintendo's "big" Metroid creators wanted ignored).
They've got some great entries in the course of the series, but Nintendo's own Metroid efforts have been pretty bad for a long time.
And I loved the hell out of Zero Mission and Fusion as well (those two games alone had me keeping a GBA around for years beyond everything else), but Zero Mission was still mostly a remake and Fusion was a sequel behind the times by at least one console generation. Those aren't criticisms, they're observations.
Again, I wish to hell they'd kept doing more 2D sidescroller stuff with the same quality, but Nintendo dropped that trend for some reason, and their next effort is reaching back to something that came out in 1991 to remake that as well. Hopefully it should be pretty great, it just doesn't indicate a lot of creative drive involved in Nintendo's handling of the Metroid series.
There has been far more great to excellent Metroid games then bad ones, so Nintendo must be doing something right with the series.
Take out the Prime games and you have to go aaaalllll the way back to 2004 for a decent Metroid game that is actually a Metroid game. Even MP2 had some pretty questionable and obnoxious elements, and the MP series itself originated with some little minor group that was almost completely separate from the bulk of Nintendo (whose efforts one of Nintendo's "big" Metroid creators wanted ignored).
They've got some great entries in the course of the series, but Nintendo's own Metroid efforts have been pretty bad for a long time.
Why? Why would you ever?
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Ninja Snarl PMy helmet is my burden.Ninja Snarl: Gone, but not forgotten.Registered Userregular
And I loved the hell out of Zero Mission and Fusion as well (those two games alone had me keeping a GBA around for years beyond everything else), but Zero Mission was still mostly a remake and Fusion was a sequel behind the times by at least one console generation. Those aren't criticisms, they're observations.
Again, I wish to hell they'd kept doing more 2D sidescroller stuff with the same quality, but Nintendo dropped that trend for some reason, and their next effort is reaching back to something that came out in 1991 to remake that as well. Hopefully it should be pretty great, it just doesn't indicate a lot of creative drive involved in Nintendo's handling of the Metroid series.
There has been far more great to excellent Metroid games then bad ones, so Nintendo must be doing something right with the series.
Take out the Prime games and you have to go aaaalllll the way back to 2004 for a decent Metroid game that is actually a Metroid game. Even MP2 had some pretty questionable and obnoxious elements, and the MP series itself originated with some little minor group that was almost completely separate from the bulk of Nintendo (whose efforts one of Nintendo's "big" Metroid creators wanted ignored).
They've got some great entries in the course of the series, but Nintendo's own Metroid efforts have been pretty bad for a long time.
Why? Why would you ever?
Because those were Retro's efforts and I was delineating between what Nintendo has done with the series in the last 15-20 years and what a small only-technically-Nintendo group did with it. It's not a criticism against the games, just classifying them with Retro rather than Nintendo.
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Warlock82Never pet a burning dogRegistered Userregular
I wouldn't dismiss the Prime games as less "Nintendo" than any other Nintendo game. The recent Donkey Kong Country games, Super Mario Strikers, Punch-Out Wii, and Luigi's Mansion Dark Moon are all Nintendo games from outside developers. But N works very closely with their partners.
I wouldn't dismiss the Prime games as less "Nintendo" than any other Nintendo game. The recent Donkey Kong Country games, Super Mario Strikers, Punch-Out Wii, and Luigi's Mansion Dark Moon are all Nintendo games from outside developers. But N works very closely with their partners.
All true except Donkey Kong was Retro which IS Nintendo.
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I wouldn't dismiss the Prime games as less "Nintendo" than any other Nintendo game. The recent Donkey Kong Country games, Super Mario Strikers, Punch-Out Wii, and Luigi's Mansion Dark Moon are all Nintendo games from outside developers. But N works very closely with their partners.
All true except Donkey Kong was Retro which IS Nintendo.
Retro was also Nintendo for Prime 2 and 3. "But was it NINTENDO?" Is the question, I think.
As far as I can tell, they were in constant contact with Nintendo even through the first Prime game, so I'm not sure the distinction matters much.
I had the thing bookmarked on Amazon and checked everyday but apparently they went up for sale and sold out everywhere without me even realising they were available. Amazon really need to sort out their listings, they still have a collectors edition listing that doesn't go anywhere.
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Warlock82Never pet a burning dogRegistered Userregular
I had the thing bookmarked on Amazon and checked everyday but apparently they went up for sale and sold out everywhere without me even realising they were available. Amazon really need to sort out their listings, they still have a collectors edition listing that doesn't go anywhere.
Something weird has been going on with Amazon lately. I think the SNES Classic was the same deal, where it went up under a different listing at 4am. Meanwhile I wasn't even able to preorder Guardians of the Galaxy 2 there because they were sold out (literally how? Not even a special edition, just the normal Bluray), they are slowly phasing out the 20% off game discount for prime members, etc.
Like, apparently they sold out a month ago. But I've been searching everyday and it's never shown any listing other than the regular game. But when I manually go through everything I find the real listing, now unavailable of course.
Fuck this, I'm getting 100% on board the fuck limited editions train.
The amiibos they will probably make more of, but they'll almost certainly never make more than the 10,000 collectors editions despite the million people clamouring to get one.
Rami on
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BrodyThe WatchThe First ShoreRegistered Userregular
Artificial scarcity for the win. I for one welcome our societies inevitable collapse, and the ushering in of actual scarcity.
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Pre-ordered the (EU) limited edition of Samus Returns. Turns out there's only one store in Norway that sells it, so it was a bit of a scavenger hunt, but it should arrive in a couple of weeks.
Rather expensive, though; ca 100 USD, regular was ca 50 (inkl. taxes). At least I got free shipping.
I just saw the regular Samus Amiibo for $8 at TRU and picked it up. I've never bought an amiibo before. Didn't realize you need a friggin peripheral to use it with a 3DS XL.
So... actually fuck all this.
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H3KnucklesBut we decide which is rightand which is an illusion.Registered Userregular
I just saw the regular Samus Amiibo for $8 at TRU and picked it up. I've never bought an amiibo before. Didn't realize you need a friggin peripheral to use it with a 3DS XL.
So... actually fuck all this.
Regular 3DS XL or New 3DS XL? I thought the New models have the NFC functionality built in?
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Most of the pre-Prime story just came from what was in the game manuals, and most of that was basic stuff like the Federation hiring Samus to go deal with Metroids/Space Pirates. All we knew was that the Space Pirates were bad and they wanted the Metroids to do bad things. It wasn't until we the tons of scannable logs in the MP games that we got to find out things like how much they feared/hated Samus, why they want all this crazy tech, how badly they failed at duplicating the morph ball, affection for murderous life-eating pets, etc.
Sakamoto claims that the Prime games aren't canon because they don't match his "vision" of Samus, but considering the Prime games are getting a sequel and his truly turd-tacular Other M is not, his awful ideas about what Samus should be like can probably be pretty safely dismissed at this point.
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I mean, Prime 3 sold like shit (somehow) as did Other M. Look what happened after that...
Prime 3's sales were underwhelming because it was on a console that was aimed at and mostly sold to casual gamers. Wii Sports grandmas aren't going to play Metroid. Bioshock was out at the same time on other platforms and while I think Prime 3 initially sold better, Bioshock caught on better in the long run and perhaps a lot of gamers who would have been interested in Prime 3 went to that instead. It was also first person, atmospheric, and quite a bit more compelling than Prime 3 (imo).
I just don't think Nintendo is equipped to be able to reliably and intentionally put out quality Metroid titles. The Zelda games are about as dark and serious a tone as they can regularly handle, and the Metroid setting is far darker.
I think you're being a bit hyperbolic there
Reading the game manuals, I definitely think they put some thought into the Metroid setting, it's just harder to convey that kind of stuff in an NES and GB game. I hardly think it's coincidence at all since Metroid II directly leads into Super Metroid, it seems pretty clear they had a vision for the story. The Primes hardly add anything substantial. Mostly just bits of lore and flavor sure(some of it basically turning the Space Pirates into jokes like you mentioned, for better or worse), but after the Prime games I don't think anything's changed, it's still the Federation hires Samus to deal with Space Pirates who do bad things. Just now we know Space Pirates make bad decisions.
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In comparison, the Prime games convey a ton of additional info as to what is driving the Space Pirates and why Samus is the one with the equipment to actually combat them effectively without needed an army. We get to see that they are habitually brutal in their treatment of each other, willingly subject themselves to terrible experiments for the gain of themselves or the Space Pirate race, adhere to a rigid chain of command (enforced through more brutality), are far from fearless where Samus is concerned, and still do things like keeping pets (even really super-deadly ones). MP1 also expands on why the Metroids are such a potent threat, on their own or in the hands of the Space Pirates.
To me, the Prime games indicate a hell of a lot more thought given to the setting than was done by the original makers, but Retro also had the resources and space to actually include all that material so they had a reason to think it up and a way to get it in the game. Why are there different-colored Space Pirates in the previous games with different abilities? They're just sort of there in the older games, but the MP games are what go into detail about how the Space Pirates have a ton of combat tech and undergo lots of modifications of different varieties.
In Metroid Prime, Space Pirates are a group with an identity. They're rapacious, lacking in empathy, experimentative, petty, and cruel, and at the same time they're human enough to send memos or write diaries complaining about the newest horrendously dangerous scheme of High Command. They're not just "random mantis dudes" anymore.
Well, ok, Breath of the Wild is pretty dark in setting, as is Majora's Mask, but those are a bit of an outlier.
Anyway, the Fire Emblem series, on average, leans more than a little bit darker than stuff like Zelda, seeing as each game is about war and doesn't shy away from death, conquering, slavery, and other such things.
Fire Emblem, meanwhile, is all about those tragic deaths and relationships and whatnot.
I take it you didn't have access to the manual?
As always, everything back then is in the manuals. Even pretty wordy stuff like Link to the Past has a whole creation myth and backstory hidden away in the manual.
Don't they mean, you know, dead? Since they take the entire spaceship? At best, they'd be kind enough to leave the crew in space suits before blowing them out the airlock and taking the ship. Which is like, a few hours to live, with shallow breaths?
They put a decent amount of info into the manuals, including details like those random mantis dudes are a faction of Space Pirates
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Escape pods I assume? Like, anyone who abandons ship before the pirates get on board is ignored.
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uh no I made it pretty clear that the only reason why it matters is because Nintendo controls what appears on their system. They want it to primarily be a console experience so that's what it is.
Yeah I'm not gonna do the thing with you where you try to sherlock holmes why I care so much when I'm clearly just stating the situation.
Resident 8bitdo expert.
Resident hybrid/flap cover expert.
I guess I don't understand why your response to people complaining that they feel Nintendo should release handheld games on the Switch is that Nintendo has decided not to release handheld games on the Switch? It just seems kind of tautological. They're saying it's an arbitrary decision that they don't like, and your initial response seemed like you were convinced there was some practical reason it couldn't be done, so I was trying to draw out what that was.
To steer it back onto topic (somewhat); I really want to get this remake, but I don't have a New 3DS. I am hoping to get a Switch by the end of the year (birthday's in Nov, so if I can just get all my family to get me gift cards for that and Christmas...), so a port would be preferable for me. Although I'll admit the Venn diagram of people who own a switch and/or a New 3DS is probably closer to a circle, putting people who only own the Switch the fringe. I could try to get a New 3DS next year and backfill on all the games I missed, but there will probably be something new I'd rather spend whatever disposable cash I get on.
There's so much here that's just off that I'm not even sure whether you're being facetious or actually think this.
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I wish we got this in the US : (
That keychain is rad
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They were obviously both excellent Metroid games, but they weren't really any kind of notable step forward for the series; Zero Mission is mostly a remake of a game which game out almost twenty years earlier. Fusion's biggest addition compared to prior games were the clumsy Samus monologues (hey, look at that, Sakamoto was the writer for that game as well...). Both of them also had brief stealth bits, which were neat but simple.
They were great games, sure, but they were basically just Nintendo aping it's prior efforts on a handheld SNES. They were quality sequels that would've fit in perfectly on a system replaced 8-10 years earlier, building on the Super Metroid's stellar foundation. I would've loved if they had kept making other games of the same type and just as good, but they seemed to just give up on quality handheld Metroid titles after Zero Mission.
And to reinforce what I was saying about Nintendo not really knowing what to do with the Metroid series, look at the last several portable installments: Federation Force (basically a Metroid game in name only), Hunters (an attempt to turn the FPS aspect of Prime into a standard FPS), and a pinball game. And what's their next Metroid release? A re-release of the second Metroid game. There's obviously Other M as well, which doesn't even need comment regarding its quality.
So unless they can find some other group to make a Metroid game for them, Nintendo's Metroid efforts seem to be restricted largely to remaking something much older or making something that isn't really even Metroid at all.
We'll see what happens with MP4, but Nintendo just does not seem to be able to wrap its collective brain around the Metroid series nearly as well as it handles many of its other properties.
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Again, I wish to hell they'd kept doing more 2D sidescroller stuff with the same quality, but Nintendo dropped that trend for some reason, and their next effort is reaching back to something that came out in 1991 to remake that as well. Hopefully it should be pretty great, it just doesn't indicate a lot of creative drive involved in Nintendo's handling of the Metroid series.
Take out the Prime games and you have to go aaaalllll the way back to 2004 for a decent Metroid game that is actually a Metroid game. Even MP2 had some pretty questionable and obnoxious elements, and the MP series itself originated with some little minor group that was almost completely separate from the bulk of Nintendo (whose efforts one of Nintendo's "big" Metroid creators wanted ignored).
They've got some great entries in the course of the series, but Nintendo's own Metroid efforts have been pretty bad for a long time.
Rocket League isn't really my jam, but god damn this looks good.
Why? Why would you ever?
Because those were Retro's efforts and I was delineating between what Nintendo has done with the series in the last 15-20 years and what a small only-technically-Nintendo group did with it. It's not a criticism against the games, just classifying them with Retro rather than Nintendo.
Kinda weird narration, but I kinda like it too...
But I guess an ad that just went "Yup, it's a metroid game, you know the drill" wasn't going to pass muster.
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Retro was also Nintendo for Prime 2 and 3. "But was it NINTENDO?" Is the question, I think.
As far as I can tell, they were in constant contact with Nintendo even through the first Prime game, so I'm not sure the distinction matters much.
I had the thing bookmarked on Amazon and checked everyday but apparently they went up for sale and sold out everywhere without me even realising they were available. Amazon really need to sort out their listings, they still have a collectors edition listing that doesn't go anywhere.
Something weird has been going on with Amazon lately. I think the SNES Classic was the same deal, where it went up under a different listing at 4am. Meanwhile I wasn't even able to preorder Guardians of the Galaxy 2 there because they were sold out (literally how? Not even a special edition, just the normal Bluray), they are slowly phasing out the 20% off game discount for prime members, etc.
Fuck this, I'm getting 100% on board the fuck limited editions train.
The amiibos they will probably make more of, but they'll almost certainly never make more than the 10,000 collectors editions despite the million people clamouring to get one.
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Rather expensive, though; ca 100 USD, regular was ca 50 (inkl. taxes). At least I got free shipping.
So... actually fuck all this.
Regular 3DS XL or New 3DS XL? I thought the New models have the NFC functionality built in?