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[MENA] The Middle East and North Africa

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    LabelLabel Registered User regular
    Here's an article mentioning some of the strikes by various workers going on regarding the protests in Iran right now.

    Sugar Factory Workers Join In Strikes As Unrest In Iran Continues
    https://www.rferl.org/a/iran-sugar-strike-protests/32091328.html
    (RFE/RL is Radio Free Europe/Radio Liberty, and a US Government funded news channel, though theoretically independent.)
    Employees at the Haft Tapeh sugar factory in the southwestern Iranian city of Shush have joined in nationwide protests as demonstrators angry over the death of a young woman detained for an alleged Islamic dress-code violation continued to defy a violent crackdown by authorities.

    Prominent labor activist Esmail Bakhshi said in on Twitter on October 18 that the factory managers tried to dissuade workers from striking by depositing money into their bank accounts "but they came anyway to show honor."

    Unrest among workers in many sectors of Iran's economy is causing pressure to mount on the government after a summer of unrest over poor living conditions and a flagging economy wracked by U.S. sanctions imposed because of Tehran's nuclear program.
    There are also reports indicating that workers at the central workshop of the South Pars Gas Complex, and the Bushehr, Abadan, and Bandar Abbas petrochemical companies also have gone on strike, while those at the Asalouyeh petrochemical plant and Kangan Petro Refining Company joined on October 18.

    Meanwhile, students at various Iranian universities, including in Tehran, Gilan, and Mazandaran, continued their protests and sit-ins.

    I don't know how much Iranian society is affected by these strikes. But it's encouraging to see people standing together.

    It's still wildly unclear if the protests will lead to any real changes, though I hope they do. I have seen some shifting in the ideas and language of the protests, from objection to forced hair-covering and oppression, to outright calls for overthrow and change in society. I think more evolution in the protests may yet be needed, though. The online restrictions make it difficult to follow from afar.

    I wish good luck to the people of Iran.

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    ElkiElki get busy Moderator, ClubPA mod
    The baby had been rescued two years earlier from the rubble of a U.S. military raid that killed her parents and five siblings. After months in a U.S. military hospital, she had gone to live with her cousin and his wife, this newlywed couple. Now, the family was bound for the United States for further medical treatment, with the aid of U.S. Marine Corps attorney Joshua Mast.

    When the exhausted Afghans arrived at the airport in Washington, D.C., in late August 2021, Mast pulled them out of the international arrivals line and led them to an inspecting officer, according to a lawsuit they filed last month. They were surprised when Mast presented an Afghan passport for the child, the couple said. But it was the last name printed on the document that stopped them cold: Mast.

    They didn’t know it, but they would soon lose their baby.

    This is a story about how one U.S. Marine became fiercely determined to bring home an Afghan war orphan, and praised it as an act of Christian faith to save her. Letters, emails and documents submitted in federal filings show that he used his status in the U.S. Armed Forces, appealed to high-ranking Trump administration officials and turned to small-town courts to adopt the baby, unbeknownst to the Afghan couple raising her 7,000 miles (11,000 kilometers) away.

    https://apnews.com/article/afghan-baby-us-marine-custody-battle-b157557538b84b288a0a8415735e24ab

    Goddamn that’s a disturbing story.

    smCQ5WE.jpg
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    LabelLabel Registered User regular
    Iran is still protesting. Yesterday the IRGC leader said, 'today is the last day of riots.' Essentially threatening a severe response.

    Iranians hold large rallies in defiance of warning by Revolutionary Guards head
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/oct/30/iranians-hold-large-rallies-in-defiance-of-warning-by-revolutionary-guards-head
    Thousands of Iranians have demonstrated in defiance of a final warning by the head of the Islamic Revolutionary Guards Corps (IRGC) that he would bring protests to an end with unprecedented force.

    Rallies were held on the streets on Sunday to protest against raids on student dormitories over the weekend in which students were taken away in buses to state detention. Some were sent text messages saying they were banned from campus indefinitely.

    Some of the crowds appeared to be the largest since the protests began more than five weeks ago over the death of the 22-year-old Kurdish woman Mahsa Amini while in police custody. Amini had been arrested by the “morality police” for allegedly breaching the Islamic republic’s strict dress code for women.

    Maj Gen Hossein Salami, the IRGC’s commander-in-chief, had warned on Saturday that that would be the last day of “riots”.

    The largest gathering was at the central Tehran branch of Islamic Azad University, but other protests occurred on the university’s North Tehran campus. Security forces responded by using teargas and firing pellet guns.

    Students at Qazvin International University chanted the slogan: “From Zahedan to Shiraz, I sacrifice my life for Iran.” At Mazandaran University, the crowds chanted: “If we do not stand together, we are killed one by one.”

    This seems like the intro to the next phase. Whether they stay as protests, or fully pivot into revolution. There is plenty of rhetoric about ending the Iranian regime by the protesters, but rhetoric is not the same as action.

    I suspect they'll need to start winning fights against the IRGC, if there is to be real change.

    We shall see what happens, I suppose. I wish for the people of Iran to have good luck, whichever way things break out. They do not deserve this misery.

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    TryCatcherTryCatcher Registered User regular
    edited October 2022
    Read an interview with one of the protesters, and the issue is the bet on "fracture of the military" since personal experience says that there's nothing on this world that you can offer to a military already corrupt, disloyal and traitorous enough to oppress the population of their own country that is better than being the boot stomping on the human face, forever.

    Specially with plenty of time to purge people not with the program.

    TryCatcher on
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    daveNYCdaveNYC Why universe hate Waspinator? Registered User regular
    TryCatcher wrote: »
    Read an interview with one of the protesters, and the issue is the bet on "fracture of the military" since personal experience says that there's nothing on this world that you can offer to a military already corrupt, disloyal and traitorous enough to oppress the population of their own country that is better than being the boot stomping on the human face, forever.

    Specially with plenty of time to purge people not with the program.

    I'd guess that they're hoping for a fracture between the IRGC/Basij and the rest of the armed forces. It might be wishful thinking, but it is at least possible.

    And in further crappy news, Israel's election (fifth one in three years, '2019–2022 Israeli political crisis' is a Wiki article, so things are going swimmingly there) is tomorrow. Bibi wants back into the big chair (mostly so he can avoid/neuter his corruption trial), there's a party named Jewish Power (which has exactly the sort of policies you'd expect from a party named $ETHNIC_GROUP Power in a country where $ETHNIC_GROUP already has all the power) that might well be in the kingmaker position, and at the moment there's a hot mess of crazy since it's proportional representation with a 3.5% cutoff to get seats and of course there's a bunch of wankers running parties of various stripes who are gunning for 3.4% (or less) of the vote on principle. I also read an article saying that some of the Ultra-Orthodox parties worried about the Jewish Power assholes eating their lunch, which is just maximum fuuuuuuu.

    So tune in tomorrow to see what rough beast, its hour come round at last, slouches towards Bethlehem Jerusalem to be born.

    Shut up, Mr. Burton! You were not brought upon this world to get it!
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    TroggTrogg Registered User regular
    Likud. Jewish Home Party. Jewish Power.

    It sure is great that every western state has a policy of total and unconditional support for whatever brand of deranged nutjobs run the Israeli government. :smile:

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    daveNYCdaveNYC Why universe hate Waspinator? Registered User regular
    Everybody yeah (yeah)
    Rock your body yeah (yeah)
    Everybody yeah
    Rock your body right
    Bibi's back, alright!
    Alright!

    And that is the full amount of levity I can summon.

    Party
    Likud: 32 seats. Bibi's boys, not literally, but from what I've heard it's very much his party in the way that the Republicans are Trump's party (or would be if he weren't so stupid). Primary interest is keeping Bibi out of jail and center-right sort of crappy policies. Willing to compromise on anything in order to achieve the former.
    Yesh Atid: 24 seats. Liberal party.
    Religious Zionist Party: 14 seats. Hard right-wing. Very hard right-wing. Like 'I can't believe they're not Nazis' right-wing. Likes: Increased funding for religious (Jewish, in case you were wondering) schools. Dislikes: Same-sex marriage (probably pretty bad on other LGBTQ+ policies too). Favorite Out-Group: Arabs. Life goals: Annexation of the West Bank (officially only Area C, but...).
    National Unity: 12 seats. Center/Center-right merger of two parties,
    Shas: 11 seats. Haredi party, specifically Sephardic and Mizrahi. That would be the Iberian/North African and 'never left Roman Judea' groups, respectively. Hard core religious, interested in more money for religious schools and exemption from the draft. Shitty on LGBTQ+ like you'd expect. Used to be neutral on the Palestinian situation (fund our schools and keep us out of the army and we don't care), but they've moved to the right since then.
    United Torah Judaism: 8 seats. Haredi party, Ashkenazi flavored this time. That'd be the European group. Same rough interests as Shas. Still generally neutral on the settlements and whatnot though.

    The next two parties are secular Russian and the Arab Joint-List thingie. Five seats each, but who cares because with the bolded numbers above, Bibi gets to be PM with 65 seats out of 120. That might sound narrow, but compared to the last four years it's coming off like the UK's 80 seat Tory majority. And there's more to it than that. Previous Bibi-fests (and the previous non-Bibi government) were tight affairs that had parties that had goals and ideologies that were in direct conflict with each other. Secular groups and Shas for example fighting over funding and draft exemptions. The previous government that was basically united only in their hatred of Bibi, which fell apart when the amalgam of zionists, religious types, Arabs, and secularists ran up against policies that one of the groups just couldn't swallow. The above group of assholes though... there is minimal conflict on the big items. There's going to be fighting over who gets what ministry and pieces of the budget and all that, but there is no real conflict on the core items.
    1. Keep Bibi out of jail: That's Likud's red line and the other three parties are on board, with one of them already having floated proposed law changes. They'll support Bibi on this as long as he doesn't mess with their priorities.
    2. More money and privileges for the Haredi. This is a deal that Likud has struck in the past, and this time they don't have to worry about a coalition partner objecting.
    3. Generally horrible stuff involving Israeli Arabs, the Occupied Territories, LGBTQ+ stuff, and who know what else. This might, maybe get slowed up a little for PR purposes or to keep the USA happy, but that's 'might', 'maybe', 'slowed', and 'little'. I'm not holding out much hope as far as that goes.

    So there you go. That's the collection of horrible that will likely be in power for the next four years. Now these aren't the actual full and final results. I think there's still a few votes being counted, and it's possible that there might be some weird horse trading and knife fighting, but barring something really wacky, it's gonna be Bibi as PM with a 63+ seat coalition.

    Shut up, Mr. Burton! You were not brought upon this world to get it!
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    MillMill Registered User regular
    So bets on how quickly Bibi's shit coalition will shit the bed bad enough that countries who give no fucks about organization like AIPAC start levying punishment that can't just be ignored. Hell, checking some of the BBC reporting in regards to some of these groups, I do have to wonder if they'll manage to shit the bed bad enough, that even parts of the US political mainstream will no longer be able to pretend that Israel's ruling elite are hugely problematic and deserving of sanctions.

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    KaputaKaputa Registered User regular
    edited November 2022
    Religious Zionism wants to force all Arabs to take a loyalty test and expel them when they fail. They are an openly genocidal fascist party, as opposed to the somewhat more quietly genocidal Likud. Israeli politics is right wing generally but has moved farther and farther right. A Jewish theocracy aimed at eradication of the Palestinian population is the goal for these people.

    And the Biden administration, like the previous administrations, will eagerly aid and abet this genocide, through armaments, obfuscatory rhetoric, and diplomatic support. People would do well to remember this when the same officials and politicians arming Israel profess to be opposed to genocide in other instances.

    In other news, Saudi Arabia claims that Iran is planning a direct attack on the kingdom.

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/saudi-arabia-u-s-on-high-alert-after-warning-of-imminent-iranian-attack-11667319274

    The US pledges to go to war for them if this occurs. Saudi Arabia recently told the US to go fuck itself through an agreement with OPEC and Russia to decrease oil production, after tricking Biden into thinking they had a deal to do the opposite. That decision threatens Democratic election chances, damages the US and EU economies, and boosts Russian oil revenue, which increases their ability to fund their invasion of Ukraine. And yet the US promises to fight on the Saudis' behalf if they are attacked. Amazing stuff. Why would the Saudis not screw the US over if they know they'll get American support regardless?

    Oh, and the US has used the Iranian protests as an excuse to cancel the nuclear deal negotiations, saying they "won't waste time" on negotiation anymore. Not that Biden seemed especially interested in rejoining the treaty in the first place. Hard to distinguish Biden from Trump on this stuff; hopefully there won't be any assassinations this time.
    Mill wrote: »
    So bets on how quickly Bibi's shit coalition will shit the bed bad enough that countries who give no fucks about organization like AIPAC start levying punishment that can't just be ignored. Hell, checking some of the BBC reporting in regards to some of these groups, I do have to wonder if they'll manage to shit the bed bad enough, that even parts of the US political mainstream will no longer be able to pretend that Israel's ruling elite are hugely problematic and deserving of sanctions.
    Why would US policy change? The ethnic cleansing clearly isn't a dealbreaker, as it has been happening for many decades. The anti-woman and anti-LGBT shit is present in plenty of countries armed by the US - for example, Saudi domestic policy is just as extreme in its theocratic repression as that advocated by Religious Zionism.

    Kaputa on
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    MillMill Registered User regular
    Eh, some of the people in that coalition are pretty open about the idea of deporting Jews and non-Jews alike, if they are deemed disloyal. Throw in Bibi, not only being a giant piece of shit bigot, but also massive criminal that is trying to use the PM spot to prevent from being prosecuted and his coalition having a 4 seat margin to not burst into flames. It's very possible we do start seeing this happen because I'm pretty sure they've already started censoring academics that dare speak out against Israel's shitty polices.

    When Israel starts deporting Jewish that won't back the ruling party's bullshit, is likely when we see this hitting a bridge too far for people in the mainstream. Before someone says, "BUT MILL LOOK AT WHAT THEY DO TO THE PALESTINIANS!" I'll remind you that people have an easy time turning a blind eye to the atrocities, when they can just claim, "oh, those were just Hamas extremists and Israel has a right to defend itself." That's how they have gotten away with ignoring all the vile shit that Israel's right wing, racist government has been doing, since I've been politically aware.

    It's a differently ball game, when that government starts attacking it's own people for being insufficiently loyal. Also there are parts of that section that are waking up to what the GOP actually wants to do and if Bibi's government starts the deportations and turning a blind eye to the likely political violence that Israel's far right gets up. I see only the most stupid willing to carry water for that because anyone that is paying attention will realize it's exactly what the GOP wants to do.

    It's an open question of whether this will start to erode US support for Israel's bullshit significantly. I'll point out, that that support has been eroding for some time now because people have been less willing to turn a blind eye to it and let Israel's government to continue to justify it with "but the Jewish diaspora and the Holocaust. Sure it has been as far as it needs to be, should be, but I'm not going to let a bunch of nihilistic geese ignore any signs of progress because they have some sick need to be needlessly and toxically depressing.

    I will say, safe bet this does evaporate what little patience Europe has for their bullshit; especially, if behave as expected in regards to the likely political violence against those that aren't Jewish and any Jews that speak out against the violence and the government. Trade wise, that will fuck Israel's economy because they do enough trade with Europe for it to matter and there is n o fucking way the US is going to pick up all of that slack and in fact, you probably will see a more pronounced push by a significant chunk of the US to boycott Israel's ass.

    Sure Bibi's ass might not land in a jail cell like it should, but we might get the silver lining where some of the asshole fuckers that enabled him getting back into power will have buyers remorse, should Bibi's new coalition lead the Israeli economy into a situation that it's shit gets kicked in. Mind you, I'm looking at primarily the reaction from the US and somewhat at the European one. I'm not looking at other parts of the world I'm less familiar with, if the reaction from those two areas is negative and other countries have similar responses, well that's only going to compound how bad shit gets for Israel.

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    KaputaKaputa Registered User regular
    edited November 2022
    My post wasn't nihilistic, these questions are of deep moral import for me. Depressing, yes, but the situation itself is extremely depressing, so that will be reflected in describing it. "Needless," debateable, I feel that we (people generally but especially Americans) are morally obligated to condemn our government's support for apartheid, so I don't think it's entirely needless. "Goose," well, that's up to individual judgment I suppose.

    You're right that there has been a shift in how Americans see Israel, and that is good. However this has not translated into a shift in state policy, and I see no indication that it will, in part because US foreign policy is not primarily or even significantly determined by public opinion.

    Believe me Mill, I would much prefer to feel optimistic about this, I just do not see grounds for optimism at this time.

    Kaputa on
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    KaputaKaputa Registered User regular
    "Biden vows to 'free Iran' in West Coast campaign speech"

    I really hope this phrasing is a result of Biden’s neurological degeneration and not a threat of warfare.

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    enlightenedbumenlightenedbum Registered User regular
    edited November 2022
    General statement of support for the protests in Biden's usual imprecise language.

    enlightenedbum on
    Self-righteousness is incompatible with coalition building.
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    Styrofoam SammichStyrofoam Sammich WANT. normal (not weird)Registered User regular
    Not entirely sure if America throwing its support behind the protesters is actually helping them.

    wq09t4opzrlc.jpg
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    KaputaKaputa Registered User regular
    edited November 2022
    General statement of support for the protests in Biden's usual imprecise language.
    I hope so, and if I had to bet I'd guess the same, but man, that language is dangerous in its imprecision. And the recent Saudi claim that Iran is about to attack them, accompanied with a US declaration that they will defend the KSA, has put me on edge here. Not to mention the "we won't waste time with negotiating anymore, but we will prevent Iran from developing nuclear weapons" rhetoric.

    Kaputa on
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    shrykeshryke Member of the Beast Registered User regular
    Not entirely sure if America throwing its support behind the protesters is actually helping them.

    The White House afaik has been trying to not make too big a thing of it exactly because of this. It's tough because you do want to support their efforts and highlight what is going on to the world but the american government is just not really able to do that in a helpful way for obvious reasons.

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    TastyfishTastyfish Registered User regular
    edited November 2022
    daveNYC wrote: »
    The next two parties are secular Russian and the Arab Joint-List thingie. Five seats each, but who cares because with the bolded numbers above, Bibi gets to be PM with 65 seats out of 120. That might sound narrow, but compared to the last four years it's coming off like the UK's 80 seat Tory majority. And there's more to it than that. Previous Bibi-fests (and the previous non-Bibi government) were tight affairs that had parties that had goals and ideologies that were in direct conflict with each other. Secular groups and Shas for example fighting over funding and draft exemptions. The previous government that was basically united only in their hatred of Bibi, which fell apart when the amalgam of zionists, religious types, Arabs, and secularists ran up against policies that one of the groups just couldn't swallow. The above group of assholes though... there is minimal conflict on the big items. There's going to be fighting over who gets what ministry and pieces of the budget and all that, but there is no real conflict on the core items.
    God, we can only hope.
    0t3zi3k77jgi.png


    And stay tuned for Boris's Privileges Committee inquiry in a few weeks.

    Using high office to escape crimes doesn't always pan out.

    Tastyfish on
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    thatassemblyguythatassemblyguy Janitor of Technical Debt .Registered User regular
    Kind of a cross-over with the [Fitba] thread, but this is more a political topic than a pure football one.

    Background
    The current 2022 World Cup is being hosted in Qatar, and it's the first World Cup hosted in a MENA country, which is awesome because it gives representation to a huge number of fans!

    However, there's definitely been some controversy. One of the handful, includes the treatment, and warnings against LGBTQ+ community, since these folks are technically illegal in the country with penalties being jail time or even death.

    In an interview with CNN, organizing CEO Nasser Al Khater, made a couple statements to try putting fears to rest and also ask for respect of Qatari cultural values.[1]
    I’ve said this before and I say this to you again, everybody is welcome here. Everybody is welcome here and everybody will feel safe here. Qatar is a tolerant country. It’s a welcoming country. It’s a hospitable country.
    We respect different cultures and we expect other cultures to respect ours.

    FIFA has also aligned with the Qatari organizers wishes, and cracked down on European teams that were going to wear rainbow colored, "OneLove", armbands in support of the LGBTQ+ community while they played in the World Cup.[2]
    The European teams competing at the 2022 Qatar World Cup walked back their plans to wear "OneLove" armbands in support of LGBTQ rights during the tournament, they announced Monday, after warnings from international soccer governing body FIFA that they would be penalized for doing so...FIFA warned it would issue a yellow card to any player wearing the armband. Two yellow cards in a game mean the player is sent off the field.

    The normal punishment would have been a fine for non-standard kit, but FIFA chose to use yellow cards as this would punish the players and teams in actual play in the tournament.

    Event
    In connection with this crack down on LGBTQ+ support in the World Cup, a fairly well known US Sports Journalist, Grant Wahl, was initially denied entry into the stadium for the USA-Wales game on November 21st.
    Just now: Security guard refusing to let me into the stadium for USA-Wales. “You have to change your shirt. It’s not allowed.”
    (picture)
    egybb9fcxwl7.jpg

    On December 6th, Grant made a post on his personal substack, indicating that he had been feeling bad, and was diagnosed with (probably) bronchitis.[4]
    My body finally broke down on me. Three weeks of little sleep, high stress and lots of work can do that to you. What had been a cold over the last 10 days turned into something more severe on the night of the USA-Netherlands game, and I could feel my upper chest take on a new level of pressure and discomfort. I didn’t have Covid (I test regularly here), but I went into the medical clinic at the main media center today, and they said I probably have bronchitis. They gave me a course of antibiotics and some heavy-duty cough syrup, and I’m already feeling a bit better just a few hours later. But still: No bueno.

    Fast forward to last night, December 9th, news was broke that Grant collapsed while covering the Argentina-Netherlands quarterfinal, and eventually died later. The cause of death of the 48 year-old has not been made official.

    Regardless of the official autopsy results, this is not a good look for Qatar or for FIFA to have such a high-profile death of a journalist occur days after being seen/harassed for wearing LGBTQ+ supportive clothing.


    [1] https://edition.cnn.com/2021/11/30/football/qatar-2020-world-cup-nasser-al-khater-spt-intl/index.html
    [2] https://www.cnbc.com/2022/11/21/qatar-world-cup-2022-teams-ax-pro-lgbtq-armbands-after-fifa-threats.html
    [3] https://twitter.com/GrantWahl/status/1594721724746338305
    [4] https://grantwahl.substack.com/p/world-cup-daily-day-22

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    ElkiElki get busy Moderator, ClubPA mod
    Director of non-profit focused on middle eastern policy (TIMEP).



    The military controls a large part of the Egyptian economy, but other parts of the security state aren’t exactly slouches. And so here comes this list of businesses that will now require a security clearance that is all about attaching the security state directly to all type of business they can extract some money from, and all means all. They don’t bother to make the list seem respectable and add some miscellaneous categories later, the list is bonkers from the jump.

    1: Shops that sell no-alcoholic carbonated beverages.
    2: Supermarkets
    3: Hypermarkets
    4: Mini-markets
    5: Markets of any kind (could have started with this one, honestly)
    6: Tea shops, cafes, cafeteria
    7: Places that serve hot or cold drinks
    and so on

    You know, for security. #23 is “businesses that offer wedding design services.” #77 is “businesses that sell paper or cardboard.” Again, require a security clearance. That’s how your grow your economy.

    smCQ5WE.jpg
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    FencingsaxFencingsax It is difficult to get a man to understand, when his salary depends upon his not understanding GNU Terry PratchettRegistered User regular
    Is Al-Sisi worse than Mubarak, or is it just recency bias?

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    ElkiElki get busy Moderator, ClubPA mod
    Fencingsax wrote: »
    Is Al-Sisi worse than Mubarak, or is it just recency bias?

    He is. They have similarities, both didn’t tolerate any direct criticism in media, both needed a certain amount of manufactured reverence (their pictures and murals everywhere), and both used the police to torturer dissidents and opposition.

    But Mubarak seemed to tolerate a certain level of deviation. Not because he’s a good guy, but the philosophy during his years was people needed to blow off steam elsewhere and some outlets were needed. For example, Egyptian cinema and TV was allowed to make a string of popular dramas about corruption (as long as the target was a minister at the highest and you made it clear that corruption never goes beyond that). You were definitely allowed to beat up on his prime minister, which was the whole point of his prime ministers and their underlings. They were the people failing Mubarak, yeah things are bad but Mubarak himself is good.

    But Sisi desires total control. Everything is good, there is nothing for you to complain about, and that’s the main change from the Mubarak years. He even cracked down on any hint of sex in TV, and instituted a “family values” censorship campaign.

    And I think long term of effects of all his instincts is that he’ll never get any negative feedback on anything he or the government are doing unless/until a catastrophic failure happens.

    smCQ5WE.jpg
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    thatassemblyguythatassemblyguy Janitor of Technical Debt .Registered User regular
    Kind of a cross-over with the [Fitba] thread, but this is more a political topic than a pure football one.
    Background
    The current 2022 World Cup is being hosted in Qatar, and it's the first World Cup hosted in a MENA country, which is awesome because it gives representation to a huge number of fans!

    However, there's definitely been some controversy. One of the handful, includes the treatment, and warnings against LGBTQ+ community, since these folks are technically illegal in the country with penalties being jail time or even death.

    In an interview with CNN, organizing CEO Nasser Al Khater, made a couple statements to try putting fears to rest and also ask for respect of Qatari cultural values.[1]
    I’ve said this before and I say this to you again, everybody is welcome here. Everybody is welcome here and everybody will feel safe here. Qatar is a tolerant country. It’s a welcoming country. It’s a hospitable country.
    We respect different cultures and we expect other cultures to respect ours.

    FIFA has also aligned with the Qatari organizers wishes, and cracked down on European teams that were going to wear rainbow colored, "OneLove", armbands in support of the LGBTQ+ community while they played in the World Cup.[2]
    The European teams competing at the 2022 Qatar World Cup walked back their plans to wear "OneLove" armbands in support of LGBTQ rights during the tournament, they announced Monday, after warnings from international soccer governing body FIFA that they would be penalized for doing so...FIFA warned it would issue a yellow card to any player wearing the armband. Two yellow cards in a game mean the player is sent off the field.

    The normal punishment would have been a fine for non-standard kit, but FIFA chose to use yellow cards as this would punish the players and teams in actual play in the tournament.

    Event
    In connection with this crack down on LGBTQ+ support in the World Cup, a fairly well known US Sports Journalist, Grant Wahl, was initially denied entry into the stadium for the USA-Wales game on November 21st.
    Just now: Security guard refusing to let me into the stadium for USA-Wales. “You have to change your shirt. It’s not allowed.”
    (picture)
    egybb9fcxwl7.jpg

    On December 6th, Grant made a post on his personal substack, indicating that he had been feeling bad, and was diagnosed with (probably) bronchitis.[4]
    My body finally broke down on me. Three weeks of little sleep, high stress and lots of work can do that to you. What had been a cold over the last 10 days turned into something more severe on the night of the USA-Netherlands game, and I could feel my upper chest take on a new level of pressure and discomfort. I didn’t have Covid (I test regularly here), but I went into the medical clinic at the main media center today, and they said I probably have bronchitis. They gave me a course of antibiotics and some heavy-duty cough syrup, and I’m already feeling a bit better just a few hours later. But still: No bueno.

    Fast forward to last night, December 9th, news was broke that Grant collapsed while covering the Argentina-Netherlands quarterfinal, and eventually died later. The cause of death of the 48 year-old has not been made official.

    Regardless of the official autopsy results, this is not a good look for Qatar or for FIFA to have such a high-profile death of a journalist occur days after being seen/harassed for wearing LGBTQ+ supportive clothing.


    [1] https://edition.cnn.com/2021/11/30/football/qatar-2020-world-cup-nasser-al-khater-spt-intl/index.html
    [2] https://www.cnbc.com/2022/11/21/qatar-world-cup-2022-teams-ax-pro-lgbtq-armbands-after-fifa-threats.html
    [3] https://twitter.com/GrantWahl/status/1594721724746338305
    [4] https://grantwahl.substack.com/p/world-cup-daily-day-22

    Pointed out by Elki in the [Football] Thread, but wanted to follow-up here too.
    Elki wrote: »
    NEW YORK (AP) — Grant Wahl died of an aneurysm in his heart when he was stricken while covering a World Cup match last weekend, according to an autopsy of the well-known American soccer writer.

    Wahl’s wife, Dr. Céline Gounder, said Wednesday that an autopsy was conducted by the New York City Medical Examiner’s Office.

    “Grant died from the rupture of a slowly growing, undetected ascending aortic aneurysm with hemopericardium,” she wrote on her husband’s website, referring to the wall that surrounds the heart. “The chest pressure he experienced shortly before his death may have represented the initial symptoms. No amount of CPR or shocks would have saved him. His death was unrelated to COVID. His death was unrelated to vaccination status. There was nothing nefarious about his death.”

    https://apnews.com/article/world-cup-sports-health-soccer-new-york-city-dd2429362303ccf056e4a9f19ea9064d

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    The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/dec/20/taliban-ban-afghan-women-university-education

    The Taliban has not only banned Univeristy education for women, they've just banned all education for Women.

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/afghanistans-taliban-ban-all-education-for-girls-11671642870

    Including primary school.

    Not sure what to say about this other than unsurprised and seeing red, and... I wish there was something, anything that could actually be done, because this is disgusting (to put it kindly). Hopefully some kind of international pressure can be brought to bear, but i honestly don't know what would work or could work.

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    IncenjucarIncenjucar VChatter Seattle, WARegistered User regular
    edited December 2022
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/2022/dec/20/taliban-ban-afghan-women-university-education

    The Taliban has not only banned Univeristy education for women, they've just banned all education for Women.

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/afghanistans-taliban-ban-all-education-for-girls-11671642870

    Including primary school.

    Not sure what to say about this other than unsurprised and seeing red, and... I wish there was something, anything that could actually be done, because this is disgusting (to put it kindly). Hopefully some kind of international pressure can be brought to bear, but i honestly don't know what would work or could work.

    I expect women only get education back when men need the money badly enough. :(

    Incenjucar on
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    DarkPrimusDarkPrimus Registered User regular
    I hadn't been holding my breath expecting massive reform, but some Taliban officials, including one who had been a key negotiator in the US withdrawal, had publicly advocated for allowing women's education a number of months ago, so I'd still had some small hope that they wouldn't do what they just did.

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    The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    DarkPrimus wrote: »
    I hadn't been holding my breath expecting massive reform, but some Taliban officials, including one who had been a key negotiator in the US withdrawal, had publicly advocated for allowing women's education a number of months ago, so I'd still had some small hope that they wouldn't do what they just did.

    I was reading somewhere - i think in the guardian link that there were some leaks indicating this coming down the pipe, and the leakers were believed to be internal taliban folk hoping to cause international outcry to get it stopped.

    Which... did not happen.

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    ElkiElki get busy Moderator, ClubPA mod
    It was definitely an internal fight that some Taliban lost, somewhat slowly. At the core of it is the fact they never kept the schools open out of an egalitarian ideal. The people who initially kept the schools open had sold others on the idea that if they do certain things, the Taliban will be treated as a legitimate government and there will be direct benefits for doing so. Perhaps that was too optimistic, but regardless they failed to deliver any of the things they promised. And so, unfortunately, the schools are shutting down.

    I doubt an international outcry would have changed the outcome. Afghanistan was already isolated, the only thing that could matter is the strength of the Pakistani reaction, and only so much.

    smCQ5WE.jpg
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    The Zombie PenguinThe Zombie Penguin Eternal Hungry Corpse Registered User regular
    Elki wrote: »
    It was definitely an internal fight that some Taliban lost, somewhat slowly. At the core of it is the fact they never kept the schools open out of an egalitarian ideal. The people who initially kept the schools open had sold others on the idea that if they do certain things, the Taliban will be treated as a legitimate government and there will be direct benefits for doing so. Perhaps that was too optimistic, but regardless they failed to deliver any of the things they promised. And so, unfortunately, the schools are shutting down.

    I doubt an international outcry would have changed the outcome. Afghanistan was already isolated, the only thing that could matter is the strength of the Pakistani reaction, and only so much.

    Thanks for this perspective - This is honestly an area i know very little on, so other than generalized sad faces, i'm woefully underinformed.

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    RoyceSraphimRoyceSraphim Registered User regular
    shryke wrote: »
    Not entirely sure if America throwing its support behind the protesters is actually helping them.

    The White House afaik has been trying to not make too big a thing of it exactly because of this. It's tough because you do want to support their efforts and highlight what is going on to the world but the american government is just not really able to do that in a helpful way for obvious reasons.

    Its the same thing Obama went through during the green protests.

    This would move the dial, but only if America's hands were clean. America meaning the state and the people.

    Foreign interference being an tried and true boogyman.

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    ElkiElki get busy Moderator, ClubPA mod
    edited February 2023
    The Gamhoriya editorial they’re referring to has since been deleted, but this is some nasty exchange between the Egyptians and Saudis, through their respective mouth pieces. Especially the Egyptian side of it.
    “Don’t let the paupers and the naked, who have only recently donned splendorous garments, insult Egypt – a country that is the object of admiration and the mother of the world, because of its long history, its present and future, its civilization, its victories and its people, a symbol of great people … These lowlifes who have just reached fame have no right to insult their masters. They are nothing but empty air that will blow away with the next light breeze. Countries that are no older than my youngest son have no right to speak about Egypt except politely, and with respect and appreciation. Even if they can buy votes, the trumpets of dwarves and mercenaries, they cannot buy history, the present and the future.” Thus thundered Abdul Raziq Tawfiq, editor in chief of the state-owned Egyptian newspaper Al-Gomhuria, who is considered to be close to President Abdel Fattah al-Sissi, in an unusually sharply worded article published last Thursday.

    Tawfiq is not just another blogger. He was and remains the flesh of the regime’s flesh and his writing reflects at least the thinking, if not the actual words, of the presidential palace in Cairo. Tawfiq doesn’t say which countries he is referring to as the “paupers” who have covered their naked loins with fine clothes, but the target of his attack is obvious to all: Egypt’s “little sisters” – the Gulf countries and, specifically, Saudi Arabia and Kuwait.



    “I do not know why the strength and ability of the great Egyptian army causes them to go mad and become hateful,” the editor Tawfiq wrote. “That is the kind of position we would expect from our traditional and historic enemy [i.e., Israel] …The strength and toughness of our soldiers, the best in the world, caused it to lose its sanity and balance and confuse its calculations... If Egypt were weak and submissive they [other Arabs] would not talk like that. To our misfortune, there are idiots who are blinded by money, who do not understand that if something bad befalls Egypt, they will not be unable to exist a moment longer because they are meaningless and insignificant items and hollow palm trunks.”

    https://www.haaretz.com/middle-east-news/egypt/2023-02-06/ty-article/.premium/the-paupers-and-the-naked-are-tired-of-bailing-cairo-out/00000186-22ef-df0e-a9df-3fef3de40000

    It wasn’t printed in Al Ahram, but it’s not that much of a difference; might as well have sent it through an embassy. Everyone knew the end of unconditional Saudi/Gulf aid was coming, so I didn’t think the end of it would leave the government so bitter.

    Elki on
    smCQ5WE.jpg
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    TroggTrogg Registered User regular
    Sisi's mad Ozymandian project of building a new capital city in the desert was never going to be economically self-sustaining. Egypt needs a constant supply of foreign money to build their imaginary city and also pay the bills for the rest of the country. Foreign investors are inevitably going to ask: if we invest in this mess, where's the payoff?

    Egypt's easy access to foreign money is coming to an end. After that well runs dry, the "Sisiopolis" project will collapse. I don't know what happens next but it will be very rough for Egyptians.

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    honoverehonovere Registered User regular
    Pretty bad earthquake in Turkey and Syria
    .
    https://edition.cnn.com/2023/02/05/europe/earthquake-hits-turkey-intl-hnk/index.html

    Over 2000 reported dead so far and with how the numbers are rising probably way more.
    To make things worse there's also a winter storm in the area with several inches if snow

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    Captain InertiaCaptain Inertia Registered User regular
    edited February 2023
    That area of Syria is also mostly under rebel control and being regularly air-struck by Syrian forces and was already without adequate medical access or food

    Also just as people were beginning rescue efforts, a 2nd quake 90% as powerful as the first (I don’t know the math on the log scale, first was 7.8 second was 7.5) hit almost the same area

    Captain Inertia on
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    jothkijothki Registered User regular
    edited February 2023
    That's a recipe for a mess, yeah. If the government moves in it's never going to leave, and the rebels aren't going to want to lose entirely because of a random earthquake.

    jothki on
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    Jealous DevaJealous Deva Registered User regular
    IIRC weren’t the areas hit Turkish controlled “rebel” areas?

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    TTODewbackTTODewback Puts the drawl in ya'll I think I'm in HellRegistered User regular
    edited February 2023
    The total death toll in Syria is 820. The Syrian Arab News Agency (SANA) reports 430 deaths across government-controlled areas and the "White Helmets" group, officially known as the Syria Civil Defense, reported 390 deaths in opposition-controlled areas.

    The quake was large enough to affect both sides.

    Edit: It was updated.
    The total death toll in Syria rose to 968. Syria’s state-run news agency SANA reported 538 across government-controlled areas and the "White Helmets" group, officially known as the Syria Civil Defense, reported 430 deaths in opposition-controlled areas

    TTODewback on
    Bless your heart.
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    JusticeforPlutoJusticeforPluto Registered User regular
    Elki wrote: »
    The Gamhoriya editorial they’re referring to has since been deleted, but this is some nasty exchange between the Egyptians and Saudis, through their respective mouth pieces. Especially the Egyptian side of it.
    “Don’t let the paupers and the naked, who have only recently donned splendorous garments, insult Egypt – a country that is the object of admiration and the mother of the world, because of its long history, its present and future, its civilization, its victories and its people, a symbol of great people … These lowlifes who have just reached fame have no right to insult their masters. They are nothing but empty air that will blow away with the next light breeze. Countries that are no older than my youngest son have no right to speak about Egypt except politely, and with respect and appreciation. Even if they can buy votes, the trumpets of dwarves and mercenaries, they cannot buy history, the present and the future.” Thus thundered Abdul Raziq Tawfiq, editor in chief of the state-owned Egyptian newspaper Al-Gomhuria, who is considered to be close to President Abdel Fattah al-Sissi, in an unusually sharply worded article published last Thursday.

    Tawfiq is not just another blogger. He was and remains the flesh of the regime’s flesh and his writing reflects at least the thinking, if not the actual words, of the presidential palace in Cairo. Tawfiq doesn’t say which countries he is referring to as the “paupers” who have covered their naked loins with fine clothes, but the target of his attack is obvious to all: Egypt’s “little sisters” – the Gulf countries and, specifically, Saudi Arabia and Kuwait.



    “I do not know why the strength and ability of the great Egyptian army causes them to go mad and become hateful,” the editor Tawfiq wrote. “That is the kind of position we would expect from our traditional and historic enemy [i.e., Israel] …The strength and toughness of our soldiers, the best in the world, caused it to lose its sanity and balance and confuse its calculations... If Egypt were weak and submissive they [other Arabs] would not talk like that. To our misfortune, there are idiots who are blinded by money, who do not understand that if something bad befalls Egypt, they will not be unable to exist a moment longer because they are meaningless and insignificant items and hollow palm trunks.”

    https://www.haaretz.com/middle-east-news/egypt/2023-02-06/ty-article/.premium/the-paupers-and-the-naked-are-tired-of-bailing-cairo-out/00000186-22ef-df0e-a9df-3fef3de40000

    It wasn’t printed in Al Ahram, but it’s not that much of a difference; might as well have sent it through an embassy. Everyone knew the end of unconditional Saudi/Gulf aid was coming, so I didn’t think the end of it would leave the government so bitter.

    So many feelings about this.

    On the one hand I love people telling off the Saudis.

    On the other, Egypt's government isn't the best either.

    And while it is a very hilarious insult, it also kinda misses the point point that the reason that Egypt speaks Arabic and is Muslim is because of Arabian history.

    I've always found it kind of odd that Egypt mostly seems in recent years to just follow the lead of Saudi Arabia, when by all accounts it should be a regional power in its own right. Maybe we're seeing the start of a split and a more "independent" Egypt?

    Of course, it's also never good news when two regional powers start exchanging words like this with each other. I guess we'll have to see how it pans out.

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    KrieghundKrieghund Registered User regular
    Pretty sure the main reason Egypt isn't the main regional power is that SA is the favored child of the US in that sphere. Also, they got beat down by Israel.

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    JusticeforPlutoJusticeforPluto Registered User regular
    Krieghund wrote: »
    Pretty sure the main reason Egypt isn't the main regional power is that SA is the favored child of the US in that sphere. Also, they got beat down by Israel.

    There is a lot to be said about why the US historically chose to closely ally with Saudi Arabia (short version: we really hate socialists, and lots of other Arab nations were claiming to be socialist), but a big part of why they are a regional power and why the US puts up with their various "shenanigans" is because they have oil. Their oil makes them an economic power house to the extend that if the US didn't shower them with weapons someone else would, or they would just buy them off the open market.

    And while Egypt did get "beat down" by Israel in '67, by '73 they were able to either win or force Israel into a draw depending on your position. Losing a war can be detrimental to a countries international standing, military might, economy etc. However, I don't think Egypt's loss in '67 really hurt them in the long run. They lose land, which they got back. Their army got mauled, but the Soviets resupplied them. If its a prestige thing than at least Egypt tried out of Arab solidarity? I don't think the Saudi's sent more than a token force. Think of Germany, they were on the losing side of the two biggest wars in human history and are still a regional power.

    Perhaps most importantly: the last time the Egyptians and Israelis went to war was 50 years ago. Unless you are an Israeli or Egyptian nationalist I don't think either nation's performance in said wars effects how people see them today.

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    Jealous DevaJealous Deva Registered User regular
    edited February 2023
    Elki wrote: »
    The Gamhoriya editorial they’re referring to has since been deleted, but this is some nasty exchange between the Egyptians and Saudis, through their respective mouth pieces. Especially the Egyptian side of it.
    “Don’t let the paupers and the naked, who have only recently donned splendorous garments, insult Egypt – a country that is the object of admiration and the mother of the world, because of its long history, its present and future, its civilization, its victories and its people, a symbol of great people … These lowlifes who have just reached fame have no right to insult their masters. They are nothing but empty air that will blow away with the next light breeze. Countries that are no older than my youngest son have no right to speak about Egypt except politely, and with respect and appreciation. Even if they can buy votes, the trumpets of dwarves and mercenaries, they cannot buy history, the present and the future.” Thus thundered Abdul Raziq Tawfiq, editor in chief of the state-owned Egyptian newspaper Al-Gomhuria, who is considered to be close to President Abdel Fattah al-Sissi, in an unusually sharply worded article published last Thursday.

    Tawfiq is not just another blogger. He was and remains the flesh of the regime’s flesh and his writing reflects at least the thinking, if not the actual words, of the presidential palace in Cairo. Tawfiq doesn’t say which countries he is referring to as the “paupers” who have covered their naked loins with fine clothes, but the target of his attack is obvious to all: Egypt’s “little sisters” – the Gulf countries and, specifically, Saudi Arabia and Kuwait.



    “I do not know why the strength and ability of the great Egyptian army causes them to go mad and become hateful,” the editor Tawfiq wrote. “That is the kind of position we would expect from our traditional and historic enemy [i.e., Israel] …The strength and toughness of our soldiers, the best in the world, caused it to lose its sanity and balance and confuse its calculations... If Egypt were weak and submissive they [other Arabs] would not talk like that. To our misfortune, there are idiots who are blinded by money, who do not understand that if something bad befalls Egypt, they will not be unable to exist a moment longer because they are meaningless and insignificant items and hollow palm trunks.”

    https://www.haaretz.com/middle-east-news/egypt/2023-02-06/ty-article/.premium/the-paupers-and-the-naked-are-tired-of-bailing-cairo-out/00000186-22ef-df0e-a9df-3fef3de40000

    It wasn’t printed in Al Ahram, but it’s not that much of a difference; might as well have sent it through an embassy. Everyone knew the end of unconditional Saudi/Gulf aid was coming, so I didn’t think the end of it would leave the government so bitter.

    So many feelings about this.

    On the one hand I love people telling off the Saudis.

    On the other, Egypt's government isn't the best either.

    And while it is a very hilarious insult, it also kinda misses the point point that the reason that Egypt speaks Arabic and is Muslim is because of Arabian history.

    I've always found it kind of odd that Egypt mostly seems in recent years to just follow the lead of Saudi Arabia, when by all accounts it should be a regional power in its own right. Maybe we're seeing the start of a split and a more "independent" Egypt?

    Of course, it's also never good news when two regional powers start exchanging words like this with each other. I guess we'll have to see how it pans out.

    Interestingly it seems like Egypt has tried to focus on an independent non-arabic identity in the past few years with things like pushing for more construction of Coptic churches and more identification with the pre-islamic Egyptian past. It certainly hasn’t been to the exclusion of Islam, with the government often building new Churches and Mosques side by side and using rhetoric like saying that the Christian and Islamic past of Egypt go hand in hand, but its a huge 180 from what government policy has been in the past.

    Edit: And just to be clear that’s not to say that Copts are not still persecuted, just that the government has been more likely in the last few years to try to at least make the appearance of tolerance and recognition.

    Jealous Deva on
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