Really? 30 seconds of channeling that you can only start when she's below 20%? When there's stacking debuffs, random ice block targets, movement, and a AoE pull to worry about?
All of the weeklys will be much more managable whe the buff comes.
Sindragosa, third phase. What're you guys doing? She bugged out when the adds started respawning so we couldn't mess around too much, but we've been putting the frost tombs in two different places, alternating. As I understand it, the Tankspot way is to nuke each one hard before switching back to the boss, eliminating the need to alternate positions. Anyone tried it? How does getting your stacks to fall off work? Don't you run the risk of killing the tomb before the stacks drop off?
We were doing the same, but really ran into a problem with people getting tombed panicking and running the wrong way, putting it far away from the raid. We never had a real problem with the tombs dying too fast, the debuff would run out 2-4 seconds before the tomb died. We would have had the kill if Backlash hadn't been bugged and able to crit too, hopefully we can down her tomorrow.
Deathwhisper 25, 1st attempt. I did 6.8, another lock did about 5.5, and a third did just over 4K. We were talking in party chat & starting poking fun at the lowest lock good naturedly (he's kind of new to raiding on his lock, so we weren't expecting much out of him. We did point out that he got beat by the elem shaman in the group, though).
So, going into the 2nd attempt, I made the comment, "Hey < 3rd lock >, let's make this attempt interesting. I'll spot you 1000 dps & we'll bet 100g on who does more." He doesn't take the bet, but then does 6k!!! (good enough for 2nd overall behind my 6.8 again).
Afterwards in party chat, he says
"Yeah, that's what I can do if I pay attention, but I don't like doing that"
I mean, I've never encountered someone in a raid that openly admitted they JUST. DIDN'T. TRY.
Really? 30 seconds of channeling that you can only start when she's below 20%? When there's stacking debuffs, random ice block targets, movement, and a AoE pull to worry about?
The Sindragosa weekly does suck (especially since just killing her is hard enough that you don't need a distraction like that right now), but it's not quite so bad as it sounds. For every second that someone channels the gem, it puts a stack of a debuff on her that's shared across the whole raid, and to complete the quest you must stack it up to 100 before killing her. Nobody needs to channel that gem for the whole 30 seconds.
The Sindragosa weekly does suck (especially since just killing her is hard enough that you don't need a distraction like that right now), but it's not quite so bad as it sounds. For every second that someone channels the gem, it puts a stack of a debuff on her that's shared across the whole raid, and to complete the quest you must stack it up to 100 before killing her. Nobody needs to channel that gem for the whole 30 seconds.
You only need 30 stacks in 10m and 75 in 25m, at least according to Blizzard
We got the one for Festergut & Rotface last night. I wonder if Blizz knows/cares that you can exploit feign death/warlock portals/invis/etc to get 1 person both debuffs without ever actually killing either boss.
Thankfully, we got the easy peasy Frost Giant one last night.
I had to skip out before we got Festergut down though, so only 4 bosses dead last night. /sigh
I don't know if we were gonna get him anyway. The Healers were sucking big time.
It's funny, we have pretty much the opposite problem. Us healers can pretty much keep up (except maybe during the tank phase, but that's not my forte personally), but even if we pared down to a bare minimum of healers, there's no mathematical possibility of us beating the enrage timer. We've got maybe 2 people who can consistantly pull 7k, most of our dps is in the mid 5k's. And yet we've gotten this far anyway. Until people's gear gets better, it's just not happening. So I think the plan this week is, once we kill Saurfang, work on Blood Princes.
Monkey Ball Warrior on
"I resent the entire notion of a body as an ante and then raise you a generalized dissatisfaction with physicality itself" -- Tycho
Thankfully, we got the easy peasy Frost Giant one last night.
I had to skip out before we got Festergut down though, so only 4 bosses dead last night. /sigh
I don't know if we were gonna get him anyway. The Healers were sucking big time.
It's funny, we have pretty much the opposite problem. Us healers can pretty much keep up (except maybe during the tank phase, but that's not my forte personally), but even if we pared down to a bare minimum of healers, there's no mathematical possibility of us beating the enrage timer. We've got maybe 2 people who can consistantly pull 7k, most of our dps is in the mid 5k's. And yet we've gotten this far anyway. Until people's gear gets better, it's just not happening. So I think the plan this week is, once we kill Saurfang, work on Blood Princes.
It was just weird. Usually I'm the second tank, so I get him when he hits the hardest. We switched jobs this time, so I should be taking LESS damage but even cycling my cooldowns I was dying like a bitch.
Of course, that seemed to be the story most of the night. Our Pally Healer was sucking ass is all I can figure. (Our usual Druid was doing his usual awesome job though)
Yeah, 10 man isn't bad but 25.... We have a kitty druid that calls it out and I have no freakin clue how he does it on the fly. Then again I'm a healer so I'm bashing my face into buttons as fast as I can on that encounter.
Yeah... I think it's easier for a tank or DPS to raid lead tricky encounters like that, since usually if they get distracted it's just a slight dip in TPS/DPS, whereas a distracted healer might mean someone dies. But still I'm impressed by people who seem to have some strange zen awareness of the whole raid and the boss and any applicable adds (like our rogue calling out target swaps when we did Full House on 10-man).
I got Rankwatched once. It turns out there is some kind of bug which effects your secondary spec, if you went dual spec before a certain time, while the moon was full and your birthday fell in the third week of the month and some other things. Anyway, I appreciated the warning, thanked the guy whose rankwatch alerted me in a random heroic, then went and fixed it after the run.
Is it ego that gets people all pissed off? Who wouldn't want to know if you are not giving it your all?
Yeah, my paladin had that problem. I felt HORRIBLE for a few hours, thinking about how I'd tanked endless heroics, Ulduars, ToC25s and ToGC10s with downranked shit. But I'm glad something made me aware of the problem. And yeah you can still think, "hey, if I managed to put out enough threat with downranked shit, now I'll be an even better tank with max rank abilities!" Heh. (I still felt like shit and was embarrassed as hell about it for a few days, though.)
We got the one for Festergut & Rotface last night. I wonder if Blizz knows/cares that you can exploit feign death/warlock portals/invis/etc to get 1 person both debuffs without ever actually killing either boss.
I doubt they care since most the raid can't get away with that, and I doubt most raids are going to bother spending the time and effort to have a couple people cheese each boss to guarantee them sacks while the rest of the raid hopes they don't wipe.
But yeah, now that I've looked up what the various weeklies entail, it's pretty ridiculous how large the spectrum of difficulty is. You've got some that are both easy and let you attempt them as many times as you want (I think): Deathwhisper and the special extra boss. Then you've got others where you're fucked if you wipe: Fester and Rot and the blood wing race (hell, even if you don't wipe, this one sounds ridiculous for most raids).
I've had people ragequit heroics because rankwatch was lighting up like a christmas tree on them. I may change it from tells to reporting in party chat - waaaaay to much fun for trolling.
Since I intend to hit 80 on my Deathknight tonight (he's the last of the army to make the climb), I think I'm going to do just that. Not sure I'll use it in party, at least until I'm reasonably sure all of MY stuff is up to date, but I expect massive, soul wrenching fail or epic proportions during Heroicfest '10.
Forar on
First they came for the Muslims, and we said NOT TODAY, MOTHERFUCKER!
We got the one for Festergut & Rotface last night. I wonder if Blizz knows/cares that you can exploit feign death/warlock portals/invis/etc to get 1 person both debuffs without ever actually killing either boss.
I doubt they care since most the raid can't get away with that, and I doubt most raids are going to bother spending the time and effort to have a couple people cheese each boss to guarantee them sacks while the rest of the raid hopes they don't wipe.
But yeah, now that I've looked up what the various weeklies entail, it's pretty ridiculous how large the spectrum of difficulty is. You've got some that are both easy and let you attempt them as many times as you want (I think): Deathwhisper and the special extra boss. Then you've got others where you're fucked if you wipe: Fester and Rot and the blood wing race (hell, even if you don't wipe, this one sounds ridiculous for most raids).
For us it was handy, since we were on our alt group, and were hoping to maybe get Festergut down. When it became clear we didn't have the tanks or heals for it, we were pleased to find one of our mages had managed to retain the orange debuff when he invis'd. We just ran in, spent a minute getting the debuff from Rotface and then turned in the quest. So at least we managed to get something from those guys before we called it a night.
Since I intend to hit 80 on my Deathknight tonight (he's the last of the army to make the climb), I think I'm going to do just that. Not sure I'll use it in party, at least until I'm reasonably sure all of MY stuff is up to date, but I expect massive, soul wrenching fail or epic proportions during Heroicfest '10.
Aside from my worgens name reserve I have rogue as my last of the army. I cant find the will to get him past 75.
But the dungeon helpers been a godsend for gearing the other alts and getting primordial saronite for my main.
We got the one for Festergut & Rotface last night. I wonder if Blizz knows/cares that you can exploit feign death/warlock portals/invis/etc to get 1 person both debuffs without ever actually killing either boss.
I doubt they care since most the raid can't get away with that, and I doubt most raids are going to bother spending the time and effort to have a couple people cheese each boss to guarantee them sacks while the rest of the raid hopes they don't wipe.
But yeah, now that I've looked up what the various weeklies entail, it's pretty ridiculous how large the spectrum of difficulty is. You've got some that are both easy and let you attempt them as many times as you want (I think): Deathwhisper and the special extra boss. Then you've got others where you're fucked if you wipe: Fester and Rot and the blood wing race (hell, even if you don't wipe, this one sounds ridiculous for most raids).
From the sound of your post I dont think you know that only 1 person needs it for the raid to get credit.
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Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
I've had people ragequit heroics because rankwatch was lighting up like a christmas tree on them. I may change it from tells to reporting in party chat - waaaaay to much fun for trolling.
if you do this post screenshots
Dhalphir on
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited February 2010
What is "rank watch"?
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
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BeastehTHAT WOULD NOTKILL DRACULARegistered Userregular
I've had people ragequit heroics because rankwatch was lighting up like a christmas tree on them. I may change it from tells to reporting in party chat - waaaaay to much fun for trolling.
I set mine to output to party/raid almost immediately. It's funnier for everyone involved if I'm with guildies, and then if the person wants to bitch about it they can just do it in party and the rest of us can mock them, rather than bitching at me in tells.
We got the one for Festergut & Rotface last night. I wonder if Blizz knows/cares that you can exploit feign death/warlock portals/invis/etc to get 1 person both debuffs without ever actually killing either boss.
I doubt they care since most the raid can't get away with that, and I doubt most raids are going to bother spending the time and effort to have a couple people cheese each boss to guarantee them sacks while the rest of the raid hopes they don't wipe.
But yeah, now that I've looked up what the various weeklies entail, it's pretty ridiculous how large the spectrum of difficulty is. You've got some that are both easy and let you attempt them as many times as you want (I think): Deathwhisper and the special extra boss. Then you've got others where you're fucked if you wipe: Fester and Rot and the blood wing race (hell, even if you don't wipe, this one sounds ridiculous for most raids).
From the sound of your post I dont think you know that only 1 person needs it for the raid to get credit.
Nope, I was not aware of that (I've only got the Deathwhisper one personally so far), and planetes's post didn't mention it.
Knowing that, I'm almost positive that Blizzard has received reports about it by now and intends to fix it at some point -- so, yes to both knows and cares.
Ah, sorry about that -- my post wasn't clear. Not only does only 1 person need the debuff, but if you're in 25 man, you can "turn in" the quest for separate raid members (let me clarify):
If you have 30 people raiding in your 25 man (rotating in / out as needed) & you get Rotface/Festergut:
Make sure all 30 come into the instance & get the quest before engaging bosses (not sure this is absolutely necessary)
Get 2 people both buffs (through fun mechanics like FD/Invis/Warlock Portals/etc).
Make sure at least one of the people with both buffs is outside the instance when the other turns in.
Everyone who hasn't completed the quest then can zone in with the person with both buffs & complete the quest as well.
And yes, 5 frost badges & a chance for epic gems/ilvl 264 BoE's is VERY MUCH worth wiping twice, in my opinion.
edit: I have heard hearthing clears the debuff, but we did not try that mechanic.
i have rankwatch its pretty awesome and i have gotten atleast one person on it in every heroic/bg i've done. please do /rankwatch explain disable. if not its a long ass explaination that just spams the user, if u have it disables it just whisper what the spell is and what the max is.
It's a good thing rankwatch only notifies you once per spell, otherwise it'd get pretty annoying while leveling.
I'm starting to get used to it spitting warnings immediately after a level up. And if it doesn't give you a warning, it's probably not worth going to train just yet, unless there is a new spell worth learning.
End on
I wish that someway, somehow, that I could save every one of us
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Monkey Ball WarriorA collection of mediocre hatsSeattle, WARegistered Userregular
edited February 2010
Is it still spitting out false positives? I've had it go off on people who have sworn up and down they're using the correct ranks. This has happened enough times for me to suspect it was buggy, so I uninstalled it.
Monkey Ball Warrior on
"I resent the entire notion of a body as an ante and then raise you a generalized dissatisfaction with physicality itself" -- Tycho
I would actually be more inclined to side with the addon; I've run into many people who swear they are using the max rank, that they trained the max rank, etc; and then later they find out they had forgotten to train something or it's only in one spec that it's the wrong rank.
The one time I got rankwatched was when I was tanking and it turned out my consecrate was one level lower on my bar in prot spec than it was on ret spec.
I imagine it especially happens for people who have a lot of spells shared between specs, like rogues and hunters.
On Tuesday they're removing normal mode ICC's limited attempts, but I don't know if that affects anyone really since the only people I've heard of running into the limit had bugged encounters.
Removing limit from normal mode this quickly seems odd. I would have expected at least another week, or just increasing the number of attempts.
And many barely geared and barely skilled groups can hit the limit easily; people who are gearing at top efficiency and studying the fights are probably unaffected.
I don't think that was part of their original plan though.
If I had to guess, the kill rate is lower than they expected, or something like that.
Honestly, most PUG or semi-PUGs don't even attempt them. Limited attempts scare the shit outta people.
And of those that do, I'm sure most run out fast. Non-hardcore runs tend to have alot of wipes on new/hard stuff due to stupid mistakes and such.
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Munkus BeaverYou don't have to attend every argument you are invited to.Philosophy: Stoicism. Politics: Democratic SocialistRegistered User, ClubPAregular
edited February 2010
It's not that it would be this soon, they wanted to make it so that the initial kills of the bosses would not be accomplished simply through brute force methods.
Munkus Beaver on
Humor can be dissected as a frog can, but dies in the process.
Seems to me that the reason they removed the limit so early is that most of the tru3 h4rdc0r3 guilds were using alt raids to test their strategies, then one shot'd stuff with their main raid. Cf. Paragon's first kill.
Seems to me that the reason they removed the limit so early is that most of the tru3 h4rdc0r3 guilds were using alt raids to test their strategies, then one shot'd stuff with their main raid. Cf. Paragon's first kill.
That too.
People were also using 10 man to train for 25 man.
I just don't think the limited attempts thing is a good idea anyway.
Although maybe limited attempts per day might be a better idea.
shryke on
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Dhalphirdon't you open that trapdooryou're a fool if you dareRegistered Userregular
edited February 2010
Can someone post, spoilered if necessary, a text summary of what happens in the Lich King fight?
Posts
All of the weeklys will be much more managable whe the buff comes.
We were doing the same, but really ran into a problem with people getting tombed panicking and running the wrong way, putting it far away from the raid. We never had a real problem with the tombs dying too fast, the debuff would run out 2-4 seconds before the tomb died. We would have had the kill if Backlash hadn't been bugged and able to crit too, hopefully we can down her tomorrow.
Deathwhisper 25, 1st attempt. I did 6.8, another lock did about 5.5, and a third did just over 4K. We were talking in party chat & starting poking fun at the lowest lock good naturedly (he's kind of new to raiding on his lock, so we weren't expecting much out of him. We did point out that he got beat by the elem shaman in the group, though).
So, going into the 2nd attempt, I made the comment, "Hey < 3rd lock >, let's make this attempt interesting. I'll spot you 1000 dps & we'll bet 100g on who does more." He doesn't take the bet, but then does 6k!!! (good enough for 2nd overall behind my 6.8 again).
Afterwards in party chat, he says
"Yeah, that's what I can do if I pay attention, but I don't like doing that"
I mean, I've never encountered someone in a raid that openly admitted they JUST. DIDN'T. TRY.
No, seriously. Just /gkick him.
The Sindragosa weekly does suck (especially since just killing her is hard enough that you don't need a distraction like that right now), but it's not quite so bad as it sounds. For every second that someone channels the gem, it puts a stack of a debuff on her that's shared across the whole raid, and to complete the quest you must stack it up to 100 before killing her. Nobody needs to channel that gem for the whole 30 seconds.
I had to skip out before we got Festergut down though, so only 4 bosses dead last night. /sigh
I don't know if we were gonna get him anyway. The Healers were sucking big time.
It's funny, we have pretty much the opposite problem. Us healers can pretty much keep up (except maybe during the tank phase, but that's not my forte personally), but even if we pared down to a bare minimum of healers, there's no mathematical possibility of us beating the enrage timer. We've got maybe 2 people who can consistantly pull 7k, most of our dps is in the mid 5k's. And yet we've gotten this far anyway. Until people's gear gets better, it's just not happening. So I think the plan this week is, once we kill Saurfang, work on Blood Princes.
It was just weird. Usually I'm the second tank, so I get him when he hits the hardest. We switched jobs this time, so I should be taking LESS damage but even cycling my cooldowns I was dying like a bitch.
Of course, that seemed to be the story most of the night. Our Pally Healer was sucking ass is all I can figure. (Our usual Druid was doing his usual awesome job though)
Yeah... I think it's easier for a tank or DPS to raid lead tricky encounters like that, since usually if they get distracted it's just a slight dip in TPS/DPS, whereas a distracted healer might mean someone dies. But still I'm impressed by people who seem to have some strange zen awareness of the whole raid and the boss and any applicable adds (like our rogue calling out target swaps when we did Full House on 10-man).
Yeah, my paladin had that problem. I felt HORRIBLE for a few hours, thinking about how I'd tanked endless heroics, Ulduars, ToC25s and ToGC10s with downranked shit. But I'm glad something made me aware of the problem. And yeah you can still think, "hey, if I managed to put out enough threat with downranked shit, now I'll be an even better tank with max rank abilities!" Heh. (I still felt like shit and was embarrassed as hell about it for a few days, though.)
But yeah, now that I've looked up what the various weeklies entail, it's pretty ridiculous how large the spectrum of difficulty is. You've got some that are both easy and let you attempt them as many times as you want (I think): Deathwhisper and the special extra boss. Then you've got others where you're fucked if you wipe: Fester and Rot and the blood wing race (hell, even if you don't wipe, this one sounds ridiculous for most raids).
I am a freaking nerd.
For us it was handy, since we were on our alt group, and were hoping to maybe get Festergut down. When it became clear we didn't have the tanks or heals for it, we were pleased to find one of our mages had managed to retain the orange debuff when he invis'd. We just ran in, spent a minute getting the debuff from Rotface and then turned in the quest. So at least we managed to get something from those guys before we called it a night.
Aside from my worgens name reserve I have rogue as my last of the army. I cant find the will to get him past 75.
But the dungeon helpers been a godsend for gearing the other alts and getting primordial saronite for my main.
From the sound of your post I dont think you know that only 1 person needs it for the raid to get credit.
if you do this post screenshots
WOOOOOOOOOOO
(10 man but still!)
I set mine to output to party/raid almost immediately. It's funnier for everyone involved if I'm with guildies, and then if the person wants to bitch about it they can just do it in party and the rest of us can mock them, rather than bitching at me in tells.
Knowing that, I'm almost positive that Blizzard has received reports about it by now and intends to fix it at some point -- so, yes to both knows and cares.
If you have 30 people raiding in your 25 man (rotating in / out as needed) & you get Rotface/Festergut:
Make sure all 30 come into the instance & get the quest before engaging bosses (not sure this is absolutely necessary)
Get 2 people both buffs (through fun mechanics like FD/Invis/Warlock Portals/etc).
Make sure at least one of the people with both buffs is outside the instance when the other turns in.
Everyone who hasn't completed the quest then can zone in with the person with both buffs & complete the quest as well.
And yes, 5 frost badges & a chance for epic gems/ilvl 264 BoE's is VERY MUCH worth wiping twice, in my opinion.
edit: I have heard hearthing clears the debuff, but we did not try that mechanic.
I'm starting to get used to it spitting warnings immediately after a level up. And if it doesn't give you a warning, it's probably not worth going to train just yet, unless there is a new spell worth learning.
The one time I got rankwatched was when I was tanking and it turned out my consecrate was one level lower on my bar in prot spec than it was on ret spec.
I imagine it especially happens for people who have a lot of spells shared between specs, like rogues and hunters.
Origin: KafkaAU B-Net: Kafka#1778
And many barely geared and barely skilled groups can hit the limit easily; people who are gearing at top efficiency and studying the fights are probably unaffected.
I figure that's the reason.
If I had to guess, the kill rate is lower than they expected, or something like that.
Honestly, most PUG or semi-PUGs don't even attempt them. Limited attempts scare the shit outta people.
And of those that do, I'm sure most run out fast. Non-hardcore runs tend to have alot of wipes on new/hard stuff due to stupid mistakes and such.
Origin: KafkaAU B-Net: Kafka#1778
That too.
People were also using 10 man to train for 25 man.
I just don't think the limited attempts thing is a good idea anyway.
Although maybe limited attempts per day might be a better idea.