Irond WillWARNING: NO HURTFUL COMMENTS, PLEASE!!!!!Cambridge. MAModeratormod
i mean they cast sam jackson as nick fury. i don't really see that it's a big deal unless being a white guy is a really important part of the iron fist character.
i (obviously) don't follow the character, but i had always assumed he was an asian dude. his mask covered his hair and most of his face, so there weren't really any visual clues that he wasn't.
i mean they cast sam jackson as nick fury. i don't really see that it's a big deal unless being a white guy is a really important part of the iron fist character.
i (obviously) don't follow the character, but i had always assumed he was an asian dude. his mask covered his hair and most of his face, so there weren't really any visual clues that he wasn't.
Well, Sam Jackson's Nick Fury was based on the Ultimate version of Nick Fury that was based on (appearance-wise) Sam Jackson.
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i mean they cast sam jackson as nick fury. i don't really see that it's a big deal unless being a white guy is a really important part of the iron fist character.
True. When he's being trained in K'un-L'un him being white is what isolates him from everyone else who is of Asian descent. Danny doesn't have to be white but to keep this idea he can't be cast with an Asian actor. They can ignore the isolation aspect entirely or make K'un L'un international or something, of course.
i (obviously) don't follow the character, but i had always assumed he was an asian dude. his mask covered his hair and most of his face, so there weren't really any visual clues that he wasn't.
Here's an image of what he looks like under the mask.
It's really important to emphasize that if you are a master of kung fu, you better be asian.
Especially with a superhero name like Iron Fist I mean seriously
first the mandarin and now this
yeah no one thought that casting david carradine instead of bruce lee as cain in kung fu was kind of shameful in retrospect
i mean really marvel is producing so many prominent asian superheroes in their comics and movie franchises that i guess they've kind of inoculated themselves against criticism here
It's really important to emphasize that if you are a master of kung fu, you better be asian.
Especially with a superhero name like Iron Fist I mean seriously
first the mandarin and now this
yeah no one thought that casting david carradine instead of bruce lee as cain in kung fu was kind of shameful in retrospect
i mean really marvel is producing so many prominent asian superheroes in their comics and movie franchises that i guess they've kind of inoculated themselves against criticism here
Your criticism is 'the guy I assumed was asian because he knows kung fu isn't'?
Hah.
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Irond WillWARNING: NO HURTFUL COMMENTS, PLEASE!!!!!Cambridge. MAModeratormod
yeah okay. no one's going to be bothered that marvel's signature "martial arts master" movie superhero is a blonde white guy.
i mean they cast sam jackson as nick fury. i don't really see that it's a big deal unless being a white guy is a really important part of the iron fist character.
i (obviously) don't follow the character, but i had always assumed he was an asian dude. his mask covered his hair and most of his face, so there weren't really any visual clues that he wasn't.
Iron Fist is basically Bruce Wayne, if Bruce Wayne's parents weren't killed by criminals, but instead they froze to death during an expedition in the Himalayas trying to discover Shangri-La and he got raised in Shangri-La and got super kung fu powers from punching a dragon to death.
I just find it a little unproductive to start the argument of under-representation of Asians in comics and comic movies with a martial arts character. It's certainly an important issue, I don't think the solution is basically to create an asian stereotype.
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Brainiac 8Don't call me Shirley...Registered Userregular
I just find it a little unproductive to start the argument of under-representation of Asians in comics and comic movies with a martial arts character. It's certainly an important issue, I don't think the solution is basically to create an asian stereotype.
i just read over the origin story and it's kind of icky really. rich white kid is stranded among an ancient asian civilization dedicated to martial arts and learns the arts better than any of them ever could. and then, of course, all of his signature enemies are basically asian guys jealous that this white guy is better at the art/ inherited the power unjustly/ whatever.
it's kind of an ugly trope. also, it's going to look pretty tired after the recent batman trilogy was almost the exact same origin.
i get what you're saying about the asian guy knowing martial arts being something of a stereotype. but i also think the opposite - that a white guy is the Best Martial Artist In The World and Sole Inheritor Of An Ancient Chinese Power is even uglier.
it's also a missed opportunity IMO. marvel doesn't seem to have a lot of opportunities on their docket to showcase an asian lead. this is possibly one, and it could be achieved with a really minor reworking of the character/ origin - even if they wanted to keep the tycoon orphan thing.
Yea, technically it should have been "Heroes for Hire" but calling them the Defenders in this universe works.
Now, the question, who could they get for each character?
Daredevil: Jeffrey Donovan (Foggy Nelson will obviously be played by Bruce Campbell)
Luke Cage: Christopher Judge
Iron Fist: Eric Johnson
Jessica Jones: Adrianne Palicki
isn't iron fist an asian dude?
Nope. White guy with blonde hair.
Name Danny Rand.
what? that is the worst
they should make him an asian dude for the MU movie reboot
i mean come on
Iron Fist was one of the characters created as a direct reference to Bruce Lee.
Also considering that we took martial arts and wuxia films and turned them into the whitest versions (Van Damme, Segal, Matrix, even Star Wars) that we could for a few decades (everyone wants to forget the "White ninja" period in movies and TV), I think it'd be fair to give an Asian actor a leading role for once.
yeah okay. no one's going to be bothered that marvel's signature "martial arts master" movie superhero is a blonde white guy.
maybe he can get an asian sidekick or something.
Lol
This comment is funny because a regular team up partner/bff to Iron Fist is Shang-chi, Marvel's version of Bruce Lee.
One thing to note - Shang-chi used to be the headliner of Marvel's most popular book a ways back that lasted for more than 100 issues. Iron Fist was teamed up with Luke Cage because he couldn't sustain his own book and hasn't been able to carry a book long since.
Critical favorite that only lasted 27 issues because it was a critical favorite. It was never a big seller, even when Fraction and Brubaker were writing it.
Of all of these, I'm most excited for the Jessica Jones series. These four characters are basically the Brian Michael Bendis funpack, and that means there's a good chance that this means the show will be an adaption of Alias.
i mean they cast sam jackson as nick fury. i don't really see that it's a big deal unless being a white guy is a really important part of the iron fist character.
i (obviously) don't follow the character, but i had always assumed he was an asian dude. his mask covered his hair and most of his face, so there weren't really any visual clues that he wasn't.
Iron Fist is basically Bruce Wayne, if Bruce Wayne's parents weren't killed by criminals, but instead they froze to death during an expedition in the Himalayas trying to discover Shangri-La and he got raised in Shangri-La and got super kung fu powers from punching a dragon to death.
I just find it a little unproductive to start the argument of under-representation of Asians in comics and comic movies with a martial arts character. It's certainly an important issue, I don't think the solution is basically to create an asian stereotype.
MCU solution - Danny's Caucasian father tries to find Shangri-La and nearly freezes to death. Is found and rescued, nursed to health by a woman he falls in love with and has a kid with. Danny is now white AND Asian, everyone wins.
Also, Danny's parents are killed by whomever the antagonist is. Danny faces Shou-Lao in order to gain the power he needs to avenge their deaths. Over the course of the series learns that vengeance is not justice and begins to find a way towards inner-peace.
Kevin Feige, if you're here you can PM my royalty check.
Of all of these, I'm most excited for the Jessica Jones series. These four characters are basically the Brian Michael Bendis funpack, and that means there's a good chance that this means the show will be an adaption of Alias.
Isn't it extra racist to turn the white kung fu guy Chinese?
No, because racism isn't a two-way street based purely on the fact that it isn't a two-way street. Taking asian roles from asian actors is wrong because there's an institutionalized prejudice against asian lead roles. Taking white roles from white people isn't wrong because according to Hollywood, everything is a white role.
I seriously doubt they'll make any changes to any of the characters. One of the things that has characterized the Marvel films is that they've brought the characters - especially the heroes - onto the screen virtually unchanged from their comics versions. Even with Nick Fury, the Samuel L. Jackson version in the comic predates the movie version by a decade.
Isn't it extra racist to turn the white kung fu guy Chinese?
No, because racism isn't a two-way street based purely on the fact that it isn't a two-way street. Taking asian roles from asian actors is wrong because there's an institutionalized prejudice against asian lead roles. Taking white roles from white people isn't wrong because according to Hollywood, everything is a white role.
It's probably due to some unconcious inner racism I have, but it seems wrong to turn a Chinese inspired Caucasian character Chinese because reasons.
Let's not erase the evidence of racism, but let it serve as inspiration to create new, not always straight white male characters.
because it's an opportunity for marvel to feature an asian superhero and yeah the martial arts thing makes sense.
but no i guess you're right. there aren't enough white superheroes and it's important to stay true to the character in the comic books
...I'm not exactly sure it's the most progressive and ethnically aware casting decision to go "Oh, Martial Artist Super Hero? Gotta cast an Asian dude." or "Oh, we need an Asian super hero, make him the martial artist."
How about this; make Danny Rand native american. Removes the 'white savior' stuff, keeps the 'outcast is the chosen one' stuff, AND it helps boost a poorly represented ethnicity without stereotyping. (Whether by making the kung fu guy asian, or by making the native american guy get his powers from animal spirits or shamanism)
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i (obviously) don't follow the character, but i had always assumed he was an asian dude. his mask covered his hair and most of his face, so there weren't really any visual clues that he wasn't.
Well, Sam Jackson's Nick Fury was based on the Ultimate version of Nick Fury that was based on (appearance-wise) Sam Jackson.
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Especially with a superhero name like Iron Fist I mean seriously
first the mandarin and now this
I mean I just assumed he was asian so the MCU better conform to my assumptions.
True. When he's being trained in K'un-L'un him being white is what isolates him from everyone else who is of Asian descent. Danny doesn't have to be white but to keep this idea he can't be cast with an Asian actor. They can ignore the isolation aspect entirely or make K'un L'un international or something, of course.
Here's an image of what he looks like under the mask.
http://watchman1985.wordpress.com/2009/09/12/305/
yeah no one thought that casting david carradine instead of bruce lee as cain in kung fu was kind of shameful in retrospect
i mean really marvel is producing so many prominent asian superheroes in their comics and movie franchises that i guess they've kind of inoculated themselves against criticism here
So, you want the first featured asian hero to be the martial arts guy?
These words you've put in my mouth, they taste funny.
Your criticism is 'the guy I assumed was asian because he knows kung fu isn't'?
Hah.
maybe he can get an asian sidekick or something.
Iron Fist is basically Bruce Wayne, if Bruce Wayne's parents weren't killed by criminals, but instead they froze to death during an expedition in the Himalayas trying to discover Shangri-La and he got raised in Shangri-La and got super kung fu powers from punching a dragon to death.
Lol
This comment is funny because a regular team up partner/bff to Iron Fist is Shang-chi, Marvel's version of Bruce Lee.
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That's not how you spell Luke Cage.
Luke Cage and Jessica Jones having
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oh come on now, don't be so anal. :P
Shang-chi is the dude he hangs out with when he's not around Luke Cage.
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i just read over the origin story and it's kind of icky really. rich white kid is stranded among an ancient asian civilization dedicated to martial arts and learns the arts better than any of them ever could. and then, of course, all of his signature enemies are basically asian guys jealous that this white guy is better at the art/ inherited the power unjustly/ whatever.
it's kind of an ugly trope. also, it's going to look pretty tired after the recent batman trilogy was almost the exact same origin.
i get what you're saying about the asian guy knowing martial arts being something of a stereotype. but i also think the opposite - that a white guy is the Best Martial Artist In The World and Sole Inheritor Of An Ancient Chinese Power is even uglier.
it's also a missed opportunity IMO. marvel doesn't seem to have a lot of opportunities on their docket to showcase an asian lead. this is possibly one, and it could be achieved with a really minor reworking of the character/ origin - even if they wanted to keep the tycoon orphan thing.
yeah cause that's great, guy's black best friend isn't about so he goes and gets himself an asian.... something seems off there to me.
Iron Fist was one of the characters created as a direct reference to Bruce Lee.
Also considering that we took martial arts and wuxia films and turned them into the whitest versions (Van Damme, Segal, Matrix, even Star Wars) that we could for a few decades (everyone wants to forget the "White ninja" period in movies and TV), I think it'd be fair to give an Asian actor a leading role for once.
One thing to note - Shang-chi used to be the headliner of Marvel's most popular book a ways back that lasted for more than 100 issues. Iron Fist was teamed up with Luke Cage because he couldn't sustain his own book and hasn't been able to carry a book long since.
Critical favorite that only lasted 27 issues because it was a critical favorite. It was never a big seller, even when Fraction and Brubaker were writing it.
Which is a shame, because it was a great book.
MCU solution - Danny's Caucasian father tries to find Shangri-La and nearly freezes to death. Is found and rescued, nursed to health by a woman he falls in love with and has a kid with. Danny is now white AND Asian, everyone wins.
Also, Danny's parents are killed by whomever the antagonist is. Danny faces Shou-Lao in order to gain the power he needs to avenge their deaths. Over the course of the series learns that vengeance is not justice and begins to find a way towards inner-peace.
Kevin Feige, if you're here you can PM my royalty check.
Which is where the butt sex comes in.
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bam
problem solved
It's probably due to some unconcious inner racism I have, but it seems wrong to turn a Chinese inspired Caucasian character Chinese because reasons.
Let's not erase the evidence of racism, but let it serve as inspiration to create new, not always straight white male characters.
(Which is happening, slowly but surely)
It kinda is
Exactly, a big part of Iron Fist's character is that he was an outcast due to his race.
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...I'm not exactly sure it's the most progressive and ethnically aware casting decision to go "Oh, Martial Artist Super Hero? Gotta cast an Asian dude." or "Oh, we need an Asian super hero, make him the martial artist."
I don't think we accomplish that by, you know, putting people in stereotypical roles.
it's not like daredevil's ethnicity really has much to do with his character all
like the kind of arguments that get made for "why not black spider-man?" apply here
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Donald Glover for Daredevil?
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