add in payroll taxes as well i suppose, maybe another $5k
but we're not approaching $50k/employee
my total compensation (i.e. total cost to the company for my labor) is more than 50% what my pay is. that's not including liability insurance and other overhead stuff like that
this is probably less at a factory where I would expect fewer benefits, but still, probably 25-30% premium I think
Please consider the environment before printing this post.
+1
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SixCaches Tweets in the mainframe cyberhexRegistered Userregular
Why do unfunny vendors always try to make me laugh and also always call when I email asking for details they have to email?
@six is it a salesman or rep rule you have to call cause I just want an email. One guy yesterday called all three of my phones just to say he was emailing and then his email was slow
I said ok email me and hung up
It's probably some rule for inside sales. A real rep would just email you, but a real rep is also building a relationship with you. This guy wants you to agree to a meeting so he can move on.
Anyone who won't leave you alone doesn't know what they're doing or is pushing something where that doesn't matter.
I have one vendor going so hard in the paint for our printer business but we have 25 months left on our 5 year lease. He claims he's done buyouts up to FOUR YEARS out... but every other company has told me 12-15 months is max.
I finally agreed to let him meet with me again. He's been bugging me nonstop for years, I swear to god.
I hate dealing with vendors. Luckily my company has no interest in purchasing really so I just do other things mostly!
Those kind of people don't sound super fun to deal with.
The ones that make it higher know what they're doing and can be awesome. Or worse.
Six on
can you feel the struggle within?
0
Options
ChanusHarbinger of the Spicy Rooster ApocalypseThe Flames of a Thousand Collapsed StarsRegistered Userregular
Yeah a lot of people don't realize that at amazon warehouses there are these little robot pallet jacks that just go and grab pallets and move them to and from places.
Like they've replaced people to do that.
That's only going to increase.
yeah when they start costing less than $500,000 a unit, goodbye warehouse employees
shit, if they just cost 500k/10yr combining maintenance and downtime, with no risk of workers compensation, they will be a steal.
warehouse employees don't cost $50k/yr here yet
I'd say you get them down in the $300k range and it'll be over though
yeah they do; benefits, overtime, only 1 shift a day, probably only 5-6 shifts a week, workers compensation, etc.
dude i work in an actual warehouse
i know how much workers here cost
it's not $50k/yr
workers compensation is hardly even a line item, people get hurt like once every couple years
You probably pay $12 an hour if I had to guess.
But a lot of those numbers are only not numbers because of how many workers you have to offset it. But I bet "$12/hr" has a bit more to it than $25,000 a year on those spreadsheets. Like medical, that's expensive. You no longer have to pay the income taxes for your 50k a year worker, they never get hurt, or at least, they won't sue you if they do get hurt. I bet lawsuits aren't really a number in your spreadsheet either, it's just one of those costs that no one thinks about because it's not an actual dollar amount they can visualize at the end of the day.
It's the same reason my boss can't visualize the good place to spend money because the actual costs are sunk into things he's already paying so they're invisible on the expense accounts. The only thing it costs is employee time, which, may not be something one thinks about as a cost necessarily.
add in payroll taxes as well i suppose, maybe another $5k
but we're not approaching $50k/employee
my total compensation (i.e. total cost to the company for my labor) is more than 50% what my pay is. that's not including liability insurance and other overhead stuff like that
this is probably less at a factory where I would expect fewer benefits, but still, probably 25-30% premium I think
yeah warehouses don't tend to have amazing benefits packages
Allegedly a voice of reason.
+1
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Sir Landsharkresting shark faceRegistered Userregular
Yeah a lot of people don't realize that at amazon warehouses there are these little robot pallet jacks that just go and grab pallets and move them to and from places.
Like they've replaced people to do that.
That's only going to increase.
yeah when they start costing less than $500,000 a unit, goodbye warehouse employees
shit, if they just cost 500k/10yr combining maintenance and downtime, with no risk of workers compensation, they will be a steal.
warehouse employees don't cost $50k/yr here yet
I'd say you get them down in the $300k range and it'll be over though
yeah they do; benefits, overtime, only 1 shift a day, probably only 5-6 shifts a week, workers compensation, etc.
dude i work in an actual warehouse
i know how much workers here cost
it's not $50k/yr
workers compensation is hardly even a line item, people get hurt like once every couple years
bennies don't add up? my work claims it spends $300-500 on our insurance monthly
$12/hr * 40 * 52 = 24960
our insurance is like $45/wk on average, so 45 * 52 = 2340
we don't offer other benefits
vacation is factored into 52 weeks of pay
27300
even if people work 45 hours a week, it's still only 12*47.5*52+2340 = 31980
you could argue robots can work 24 hours, but we're not open and taking orders 24 hours a day and the work gets done by the end of the day every day, so there's no benefit to 24 hour robots
it's a viable solution for like amazon and walmart, but not for normal sized businesses
at least, not yet
how do you have workers at 40 hours a week with no health insurance
Please consider the environment before printing this post.
0
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OnTheLastCastlelet's keep it haimish for the peripateticRegistered Userregular
Why do unfunny vendors always try to make me laugh and also always call when I email asking for details they have to email?
@six is it a salesman or rep rule you have to call cause I just want an email. One guy yesterday called all three of my phones just to say he was emailing and then his email was slow
I said ok email me and hung up
It's probably some rule for inside sales. A real rep would just email you, but a real rep is also building a relationship with you. This guy wants you to agree to a meeting so he can move on.
Anyone who won't leave you alone doesn't know what they're doing or is pushing something where that doesn't matter.
I have one vendor going so hard in the paint for our printer business but we have 25 months left on our 5 year lease. He claims he's done buyouts up to FOUR YEARS out... but every other company has told me 12-15 months is max.
I finally agreed to let him meet with me again. He's been bugging me nonstop for years, I swear to god.
I hate dealing with vendors. Luckily my company has no interest in purchasing really so I just do other things mostly!
Those kind of people don't sound super fun to deal with.
The ones that make it higher know what they;re doing and can be awesome. Or worse.
I would be an excellent salesman because I am
#1 fun
#2 get to the point, I use few words and don't babble
#3 know my shiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiit or learn it
#4 listen
hm maybe I should be an inside sales person after all. the devil doth tempt.
0
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amateurhourOne day I'll be professionalhourThe woods somewhere in TennesseeRegistered Userregular
Shit even my job is going to be obsolete in a decade.
I mean a robot can change hard drives and rack servers and run cable and powershell scrips can pretty much do what I do now without me being here.
are YOU on the beer list?
0
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LudiousI just wanted a sandwich A temporally dislocated QuiznosRegistered Userregular
Why do unfunny vendors always try to make me laugh and also always call when I email asking for details they have to email?
@six is it a salesman or rep rule you have to call cause I just want an email. One guy yesterday called all three of my phones just to say he was emailing and then his email was slow
I said ok email me and hung up
It's probably some rule for inside sales. A real rep would just email you, but a real rep is also building a relationship with you. This guy wants you to agree to a meeting so he can move on.
Anyone who won't leave you alone doesn't know what they're doing or is pushing something where that doesn't matter.
I have one vendor going so hard in the paint for our printer business but we have 25 months left on our 5 year lease. He claims he's done buyouts up to FOUR YEARS out... but every other company has told me 12-15 months is max.
I finally agreed to let him meet with me again. He's been bugging me nonstop for years, I swear to god.
I hate dealing with vendors. Luckily my company has no interest in purchasing really so I just do other things mostly!
Those kind of people don't sound super fun to deal with.
The ones that make it higher know what they;re doing and can be awesome. Or worse.
I would be an excellent salesman because I am
#1 fun
#2 get to the point, I use few words and don't babble
#3 know my shiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiit or learn it
#4 listen
hm maybe I should be an inside sales person after all. the devil doth tempt.
#4 should be #1 and also #2.
can you feel the struggle within?
0
Options
ChanusHarbinger of the Spicy Rooster ApocalypseThe Flames of a Thousand Collapsed StarsRegistered Userregular
Basically if you live in California and you hear of a bomb going off but it's far enough away that it doesn't kill you your only option is to get the fuck out of California.
Yeah, that's not really limited to California. And places where that isn't an issue often have other things that make surviving there harder. Imagine how many people outside of Phoenix will die if there is no longer power to their AC and water delivery ends.
nuclear winter means you might actually want to be that far south
and have super insulated everything besides
0
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ChanusHarbinger of the Spicy Rooster ApocalypseThe Flames of a Thousand Collapsed StarsRegistered Userregular
Yeah a lot of people don't realize that at amazon warehouses there are these little robot pallet jacks that just go and grab pallets and move them to and from places.
Like they've replaced people to do that.
That's only going to increase.
yeah when they start costing less than $500,000 a unit, goodbye warehouse employees
shit, if they just cost 500k/10yr combining maintenance and downtime, with no risk of workers compensation, they will be a steal.
warehouse employees don't cost $50k/yr here yet
I'd say you get them down in the $300k range and it'll be over though
yeah they do; benefits, overtime, only 1 shift a day, probably only 5-6 shifts a week, workers compensation, etc.
dude i work in an actual warehouse
i know how much workers here cost
it's not $50k/yr
workers compensation is hardly even a line item, people get hurt like once every couple years
bennies don't add up? my work claims it spends $300-500 on our insurance monthly
$12/hr * 40 * 52 = 24960
our insurance is like $45/wk on average, so 45 * 52 = 2340
we don't offer other benefits
vacation is factored into 52 weeks of pay
27300
even if people work 45 hours a week, it's still only 12*47.5*52+2340 = 31980
you could argue robots can work 24 hours, but we're not open and taking orders 24 hours a day and the work gets done by the end of the day every day, so there's no benefit to 24 hour robots
it's a viable solution for like amazon and walmart, but not for normal sized businesses
at least, not yet
how do you have workers at 40 hours a week with no health insurance
i don't, that's in there where i said "our insurance"
Allegedly a voice of reason.
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ChanusHarbinger of the Spicy Rooster ApocalypseThe Flames of a Thousand Collapsed StarsRegistered Userregular
anyway i'm not saying this is impossible or anything like that
i'm simply rebutting the claim that replacing an employee for $50k/yr is a steal
Why do unfunny vendors always try to make me laugh and also always call when I email asking for details they have to email?
six is it a salesman or rep rule you have to call cause I just want an email. One guy yesterday called all three of my phones just to say he was emailing and then his email was slow
I said ok email me and hung up
It's probably some rule for inside sales. A real rep would just email you, but a real rep is also building a relationship with you. This guy wants you to agree to a meeting so he can move on.
Anyone who won't leave you alone doesn't know what they're doing or is pushing something where that doesn't matter.
OnTheLastCastle
I have one vendor going so hard in the paint for our printer business but we have 25 months left on our 5 year lease. He claims he's done buyouts up to FOUR YEARS out... but every other company has told me 12-15 months is max.
I finally agreed to let him meet with me again. He's been bugging me nonstop for years, I swear to god.
I hate dealing with vendors. Luckily my company has no interest in purchasing really so I just do other things mostly!
Those kind of people don't sound super fun to deal with.
The ones that make it higher know what they;re doing and can be awesome. Or worse.
I would be an excellent salesman because I am
#1 fun
#2 get to the point, I use few words and don't babble
#3 know my shiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiit or learn it
#4 listen
hm maybe I should be an inside sales person after all. the devil doth tempt.
#4 should be #1 and also #2.
i was make clever joke to myself
0
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Sir Landsharkresting shark faceRegistered Userregular
Yeah a lot of people don't realize that at amazon warehouses there are these little robot pallet jacks that just go and grab pallets and move them to and from places.
Like they've replaced people to do that.
That's only going to increase.
yeah when they start costing less than $500,000 a unit, goodbye warehouse employees
shit, if they just cost 500k/10yr combining maintenance and downtime, with no risk of workers compensation, they will be a steal.
warehouse employees don't cost $50k/yr here yet
I'd say you get them down in the $300k range and it'll be over though
yeah they do; benefits, overtime, only 1 shift a day, probably only 5-6 shifts a week, workers compensation, etc.
dude i work in an actual warehouse
i know how much workers here cost
it's not $50k/yr
workers compensation is hardly even a line item, people get hurt like once every couple years
bennies don't add up? my work claims it spends $300-500 on our insurance monthly
$12/hr * 40 * 52 = 24960
our insurance is like $45/wk on average, so 45 * 52 = 2340
we don't offer other benefits
vacation is factored into 52 weeks of pay
27300
even if people work 45 hours a week, it's still only 12*47.5*52+2340 = 31980
you could argue robots can work 24 hours, but we're not open and taking orders 24 hours a day and the work gets done by the end of the day every day, so there's no benefit to 24 hour robots
it's a viable solution for like amazon and walmart, but not for normal sized businesses
at least, not yet
how do you have workers at 40 hours a week with no health insurance
i don't, that's in there where i said "our insurance"
oh I thought that was liability
Please consider the environment before printing this post.
0
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amateurhourOne day I'll be professionalhourThe woods somewhere in TennesseeRegistered Userregular
I mean it doesn't have to be. I worked at best buy and would gladly recommend cheap chrome books and such to people instead of expensive macbooks or tablets or whatever when all they wanted was web surfing.
Ideally sales is figuring out the best product to fit a person's needs when they aren't sure what products are available. The people who want to sell the 80 year old woman a MacBook when she literally only uses Facebook are pretty terrible though.
+3
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ChanusHarbinger of the Spicy Rooster ApocalypseThe Flames of a Thousand Collapsed StarsRegistered Userregular
Yeah a lot of people don't realize that at amazon warehouses there are these little robot pallet jacks that just go and grab pallets and move them to and from places.
Like they've replaced people to do that.
That's only going to increase.
yeah when they start costing less than $500,000 a unit, goodbye warehouse employees
shit, if they just cost 500k/10yr combining maintenance and downtime, with no risk of workers compensation, they will be a steal.
warehouse employees don't cost $50k/yr here yet
I'd say you get them down in the $300k range and it'll be over though
yeah they do; benefits, overtime, only 1 shift a day, probably only 5-6 shifts a week, workers compensation, etc.
dude i work in an actual warehouse
i know how much workers here cost
it's not $50k/yr
workers compensation is hardly even a line item, people get hurt like once every couple years
bennies don't add up? my work claims it spends $300-500 on our insurance monthly
$12/hr * 40 * 52 = 24960
our insurance is like $45/wk on average, so 45 * 52 = 2340
we don't offer other benefits
vacation is factored into 52 weeks of pay
27300
even if people work 45 hours a week, it's still only 12*47.5*52+2340 = 31980
you could argue robots can work 24 hours, but we're not open and taking orders 24 hours a day and the work gets done by the end of the day every day, so there's no benefit to 24 hour robots
it's a viable solution for like amazon and walmart, but not for normal sized businesses
at least, not yet
how do you have workers at 40 hours a week with no health insurance
i don't, that's in there where i said "our insurance"
oh I thought that was liability
you are
Allegedly a voice of reason.
+1
Options
SixCaches Tweets in the mainframe cyberhexRegistered Userregular
Why do unfunny vendors always try to make me laugh and also always call when I email asking for details they have to email?
six is it a salesman or rep rule you have to call cause I just want an email. One guy yesterday called all three of my phones just to say he was emailing and then his email was slow
I said ok email me and hung up
It's probably some rule for inside sales. A real rep would just email you, but a real rep is also building a relationship with you. This guy wants you to agree to a meeting so he can move on.
Anyone who won't leave you alone doesn't know what they're doing or is pushing something where that doesn't matter.
OnTheLastCastle
I have one vendor going so hard in the paint for our printer business but we have 25 months left on our 5 year lease. He claims he's done buyouts up to FOUR YEARS out... but every other company has told me 12-15 months is max.
I finally agreed to let him meet with me again. He's been bugging me nonstop for years, I swear to god.
I hate dealing with vendors. Luckily my company has no interest in purchasing really so I just do other things mostly!
Those kind of people don't sound super fun to deal with.
The ones that make it higher know what they;re doing and can be awesome. Or worse.
I would be an excellent salesman because I am
#1 fun
#2 get to the point, I use few words and don't babble
#3 know my shiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiit or learn it
#4 listen
hm maybe I should be an inside sales person after all. the devil doth tempt.
#4 should be #1 and also #2.
i was make clever joke to myself
That's what I was doing too
hi5
can you feel the struggle within?
+1
Options
Sir Landsharkresting shark faceRegistered Userregular
heh, your insurance is an order of magnitude less than my family plan
Please consider the environment before printing this post.
add in payroll taxes as well i suppose, maybe another $5k
but we're not approaching $50k/employee
how much does it cost to train your employees?
do you keep training them? What about if they leave, do you train new workers?
What about insurance in case they break things or cost the company money?
What about heating/cooling your warehouse or toilet facilities, etc?
Those are things you absolutely do not have to think about with robot workers, but they are a a cost that is not salary.
you guys act like this isn't literally part of what i do
It wasn't part of your calculations, though.
I'm not acting like it's not part of what you do, just that managers and executives completely brainfart around this stuff sometimes because it's not a number on a balance sheet, it's not part of payrolls, but it's a cost to having a human workforce.
You probably, as a manager of warehouse workers, do not think about liability or toiletries, but it's a huge cost. Think of how much toilet paper people like AH go through when they eat gas station food. Now imagine that's the entirety of your workforce doing that because they don't have good health insurance and have shitty pay and benefits.
not a doctor, not a lawyer, examples I use may not be fully researched so don't take out of context plz, don't @ me
Yeah a lot of people don't realize that at amazon warehouses there are these little robot pallet jacks that just go and grab pallets and move them to and from places.
Like they've replaced people to do that.
That's only going to increase.
yeah when they start costing less than $500,000 a unit, goodbye warehouse employees
shit, if they just cost 500k/10yr combining maintenance and downtime, with no risk of workers compensation, they will be a steal.
warehouse employees don't cost $50k/yr here yet
I'd say you get them down in the $300k range and it'll be over though
yeah they do; benefits, overtime, only 1 shift a day, probably only 5-6 shifts a week, workers compensation, etc.
dude i work in an actual warehouse
i know how much workers here cost
it's not $50k/yr
workers compensation is hardly even a line item, people get hurt like once every couple years
bennies don't add up? my work claims it spends $300-500 on our insurance monthly
$12/hr * 40 * 52 = 24960
our insurance is like $45/wk on average, so 45 * 52 = 2340
we don't offer other benefits
vacation is factored into 52 weeks of pay
27300
even if people work 45 hours a week, it's still only 12*47.5*52+2340 = 31980
you could argue robots can work 24 hours, but we're not open and taking orders 24 hours a day and the work gets done by the end of the day every day, so there's no benefit to 24 hour robots
it's a viable solution for like amazon and walmart, but not for normal sized businesses
at least, not yet
Errr, the robots can run lights out. Unless you pack every order that comes in that business day they'll have shit to do overnight when you don't have anybody there. That sort of running is automation's bread and butter and a huge way it justifies it's capital costs.
If you have like a really hard peak flow that doesn't leave any backlog I can see humans being more scalable, though you've got to get those part time workers who are happy with 4 hour shifts or whatever.
add in payroll taxes as well i suppose, maybe another $5k
but we're not approaching $50k/employee
how much does it cost to train your employees?
do you keep training them? What about if they leave, do you train new workers?
What about insurance in case they break things or cost the company money?
What about heating/cooling your warehouse or toilet facilities, etc?
Those are things you absolutely do not have to think about with robot workers, but they are a a cost that is not salary.
you guys act like this isn't literally part of what i do
It wasn't part of your calculations, though.
I'm not acting like it's not part of what you do, just that managers and executives completely brainfart around this stuff sometimes because it's not a number on a balance sheet, it's not part of payrolls, but it's a cost to having a human workforce.
You probably, as a manager of warehouse workers, do not think about liability or toiletries, but it's a huge cost. Think of how much toilet paper people like AH go through when they eat gas station food. Now imagine that's the entirety of your workforce doing that because they don't have good health insurance and have shitty pay and benefits.
dude some of these guys don't even flush much less wipe
Allegedly a voice of reason.
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Sir Landsharkresting shark faceRegistered Userregular
heh, your insurance is an order of magnitude less than my family plan
Well maybe if you weren't so keen on family planning being "have sex and lots of kids" it would be cheaper Shark!
Did you ever think of that!?
When you were doing it?
DID YOU!?
I can state with 100% confidence that I did not think about that while doing it
Please consider the environment before printing this post.
+4
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HonkHonk is this poster.Registered User, __BANNED USERSregular
My friend who works in a warehouse tipped and spilled a shipment of dialysis fluid. That was probably expensive for the company.
I wonder if it had any consequences at the hospitals. It's not impossible. They once thought that I was allergic to morphine and when I was in the hospital I got ketogan as a substitute, but then one truck had tipped which meant that they ran out of ketogan for several weeks and I got some third grade bullshit painkiller that didn't work instead.
Posts
my total compensation (i.e. total cost to the company for my labor) is more than 50% what my pay is. that's not including liability insurance and other overhead stuff like that
this is probably less at a factory where I would expect fewer benefits, but still, probably 25-30% premium I think
Those kind of people don't sound super fun to deal with.
The ones that make it higher know what they're doing and can be awesome. Or worse.
it doesn't happen often enough to think about
how much does it cost to train your employees?
do you keep training them? What about if they leave, do you train new workers?
What about insurance in case they break things or cost the company money?
What about heating/cooling your warehouse or toilet facilities, etc?
Those are things you absolutely do not have to think about with robot workers, but they are a a cost that is not salary.
yeah warehouses don't tend to have amazing benefits packages
how do you have workers at 40 hours a week with no health insurance
I would be an excellent salesman because I am
#1 fun
#2 get to the point, I use few words and don't babble
#3 know my shiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiit or learn it
#4 listen
hm maybe I should be an inside sales person after all. the devil doth tempt.
I mean a robot can change hard drives and rack servers and run cable and powershell scrips can pretty much do what I do now without me being here.
#4 should be #1 and also #2.
you guys act like this isn't literally part of what i do
nuclear winter means you might actually want to be that far south
and have super insulated everything besides
i don't, that's in there where i said "our insurance"
i'm simply rebutting the claim that replacing an employee for $50k/yr is a steal
robot employees require maintenance
in a dusty warehouse, probably constant maintenance
Baggage handlers are the best argument for automating every job possible
i was make clever joke to myself
oh I thought that was liability
fair enough.
You haven't watched Fear The Walking Dead.
That plan will fail.
I mean it doesn't have to be. I worked at best buy and would gladly recommend cheap chrome books and such to people instead of expensive macbooks or tablets or whatever when all they wanted was web surfing.
Ideally sales is figuring out the best product to fit a person's needs when they aren't sure what products are available. The people who want to sell the 80 year old woman a MacBook when she literally only uses Facebook are pretty terrible though.
you are
That's what I was doing too
hi5
It wasn't part of your calculations, though.
I'm not acting like it's not part of what you do, just that managers and executives completely brainfart around this stuff sometimes because it's not a number on a balance sheet, it's not part of payrolls, but it's a cost to having a human workforce.
You probably, as a manager of warehouse workers, do not think about liability or toiletries, but it's a huge cost. Think of how much toilet paper people like AH go through when they eat gas station food. Now imagine that's the entirety of your workforce doing that because they don't have good health insurance and have shitty pay and benefits.
Not with that attitude
robots are actually incredibly sensitive to temperature variation -- heating and cooling means parts with tight tolerances moving out of alignment
also you'd still want to carry insurance on them in case of fire, theft, earthquake etc
Errr, the robots can run lights out. Unless you pack every order that comes in that business day they'll have shit to do overnight when you don't have anybody there. That sort of running is automation's bread and butter and a huge way it justifies it's capital costs.
If you have like a really hard peak flow that doesn't leave any backlog I can see humans being more scalable, though you've got to get those part time workers who are happy with 4 hour shifts or whatever.
dude some of these guys don't even flush much less wipe
um get a Roomba for the dust and a maintenance robot duh
Well maybe if you weren't so keen on family planning being "have sex and lots of kids" it would be cheaper Shark!
Did you ever think of that!?
When you were doing it?
DID YOU!?
family plans are insane
even spousal insurance is insane
though mostly because your employer only covers the 50% of your benefit and not the rest of your family's
those sneaky robot thieves mirite
Listen, chanus
First imagine a warehouse
It's a big high-ceilinged building with shelves of products and wrapped pallets everywhere, okay
I can state with 100% confidence that I did not think about that while doing it
I wonder if it had any consequences at the hospitals. It's not impossible. They once thought that I was allergic to morphine and when I was in the hospital I got ketogan as a substitute, but then one truck had tipped which meant that they ran out of ketogan for several weeks and I got some third grade bullshit painkiller that didn't work instead.