Breakdown of post debate opinions - hard to know what to make of this. Boris seeming prime ministerial seems like a big deal, and that's only as a consequence of fucking parliament keeping him in power. Good job lads.
I don’t know how to square those opinions. How do you find someone more trustworthy and in touch with the people, but not Prime Minister material?
Because those aren't related things? "Prime Ministerial" basically means something like "professional" but with a side of gravitas or whatever.
Like, that poll seems roughly where I'd expect the numbers to be? A bit higher for Johnson then I'd think according to any logic but I've mentally adjusted Johnson's numbers up the same way I do Trump's because people inexplicably find them not instantly revolting and I've no idea why but it's a thing.
So yeah, Corbyn more trustworthy by a bit and seen as far more in touch with the common man, but also viewed as unlikable and not really suited to the job of being a political leader.
I just can't wrap my head around the notion that anybody thinks the guy who intentionally musses his hair to look like a clueless prat has any kind of gravitas or air of authority to him. He's as ridiculous looking as Trump's fake tan and terrible comb-over/dye-job combo.
Breakdown of post debate opinions - hard to know what to make of this. Boris seeming prime ministerial seems like a big deal, and that's only as a consequence of fucking parliament keeping him in power. Good job lads.
I don’t know how to square those opinions. How do you find someone more trustworthy and in touch with the people, but not Prime Minister material?
Because those aren't related things? "Prime Ministerial" basically means something like "professional" but with a side of gravitas or whatever.
Like, that poll seems roughly where I'd expect the numbers to be? A bit higher for Johnson then I'd think according to any logic but I've mentally adjusted Johnson's numbers up the same way I do Trump's because people inexplicably find them not instantly revolting and I've no idea why but it's a thing.
So yeah, Corbyn more trustworthy by a bit and seen as far more in touch with the common man, but also viewed as unlikable and not really suited to the job of being a political leader.
I just can't wrap my head around the notion that anybody thinks the guy who intentionally musses his hair to look like a clueless prat has any kind of gravitas or air of authority to him. He's as ridiculous looking as Trump's fake tan and terrible comb-over/dye-job combo.
The British public have a very low opinion of Prime Ministers recently? Perhaps the whole "Well Corbyn does have that Geography teacher vibe going on, and I take issue with many of his policies but at least he doesn't look Prime Ministerial He's a vegan for god's sake, and no one cares what you do with a turnip!".
Tastyfish on
+1
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H3KnucklesBut we decide which is rightand which is an illusion.Registered Userregular
edited November 2019
Edit: Nevermind, I misread Tastyfish's post at first.
Breakdown of post debate opinions - hard to know what to make of this. Boris seeming prime ministerial seems like a big deal, and that's only as a consequence of fucking parliament keeping him in power. Good job lads.
I don’t know how to square those opinions. How do you find someone more trustworthy and in touch with the people, but not Prime Minister material?
Because those aren't related things? "Prime Ministerial" basically means something like "professional" but with a side of gravitas or whatever.
Like, that poll seems roughly where I'd expect the numbers to be? A bit higher for Johnson then I'd think according to any logic but I've mentally adjusted Johnson's numbers up the same way I do Trump's because people inexplicably find them not instantly revolting and I've no idea why but it's a thing.
So yeah, Corbyn more trustworthy by a bit and seen as far more in touch with the common man, but also viewed as unlikable and not really suited to the job of being a political leader.
I just can't wrap my head around the notion that anybody thinks the guy who intentionally musses his hair to look like a clueless prat has any kind of gravitas or air of authority to him. He's as ridiculous looking as Trump's fake tan and terrible comb-over/dye-job combo.
Think that is about the news that come up, like, on my very limited point of view, every single news about Corbyn is about an inner-party spat over anti-semitism or Brexit, which has the effect of making people see Corbyn as an ineffective leader. And they aren't wrong.
On the appearance front, the Trump comparison is on point. There's a basic level of craftsmanship that says that their looks are intentional. They WANT to look like that. Unlike Corbyn, that goes for the college professor look but just looks....scruffy.
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ElldrenIs a woman dammitceterum censeoRegistered Userregular
The Conservatives main Twitter feed has changed its handle to FactcheckUK and is tweeting out lies about Labour etc
I should be surprised they're being so underhanded but...
I've replied to this before, but turns out that loads of other twitter accounts then pretended to be the Tories, or also Fact Check UK, and this is my favourite.
Good
Everyone on twitter should pretend to be Fact Check UK
Well done to the Tories for a needless own goal over the Twitter account thing. Seems to be the biggest thing to come out of the debate aside from people in the studio audience literally laughing in the faces of the two candidates to lead the country, which I'm sure is a great sign for things to come.
In my mind, 'Prime Ministerial' equates to someone who can tell a bare-faced lie with a self-sincerity that would fool a polygraph. So those numbers track.
Judging from the laughter when he talks about trust in politics, I think the audience thought the same way.
Looks like various Twitter people/celebrities that changed their handle to Fact CheckUK or to CCHQ to make fun of the Tories have had their accounts suspended.
Obviously the official Tory account that started all this hasn't been touched.
I would be amazed if the twitter thing had any cut through with the public. I think the Tories would be the happier party, as Corbyn didn't land any major blows, and Corbyn's lack of answer regarding whether he'd support his deal or campaign for remain after being asked 100 times will register with people for whom Brexit remains the top priority.
Really in terms of impact, only Nick Clegg has made anything of the TV debates.
Looks like various Twitter people/celebrities that changed their handle to Fact CheckUK or to CCHQ to make fun of the Tories have had their accounts suspended.
Obviously the official Tory account that started all this hasn't been touched.
It's a Twitter poll and therefore basically worthless. Corbyn, in actual meaningful polling, seems to have done better than expected, with more people saying he performed well than those saying Johnson performed well, but those same people think Johnson still won the debate by a marginal majority.
In other news apparently around a third of people under 25 aren't registered to vote, compared to 6% of pensioners, who love voting more than they love Homes Under The Hammer.
That guy is popular amongst people who can be bothered to turn up to vote, which is why he might well get in.
Johnson today seems to have accidentally announced the big Tory tax cut pledge before it was ready, which will be to raise the NI tax threshold to £12,000.
Stop freedom of movement to keep out those pesky laborers from the EU, then put "nuisance tenants" to work as field slaves? Cool, cool.
(That's not cool.)
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surrealitychecklonely, but not unloveddreaming of faulty keys and latchesRegistered Userregular
broadly theres still a big chunk of dont knows but without assuming some odd behaviour from them cons are pretty safe rn
corbyn did better than expected in the debates but really those are an exercise in damage limitation for cons because they already got the brexit party collapse they needed
Tories and the Lib Dems both suspended candidates today for various racist shithousery. Not for the first time, it rapidly becomes clear that no one checks their candidate's social media feeds very closely before they stand.
It's a Twitter poll and therefore basically worthless. Corbyn, in actual meaningful polling, seems to have done better than expected, with more people saying he performed well than those saying Johnson performed well, but those same people think Johnson still won the debate by a marginal majority.
Corbyn is likable (even for people like me who are basically liberal democrats) and he will do ok during the election. The question is does he have anywhere to go.
“Reject your sense of injury and the injury itself disappears.”
― Marcus Aurelius
Corbyn's approval rating is currently the lowest of any leader recorded going into an election. Johnson actually leads him in among the 18-25 group when they're asked who'd make the best PM. I dunno how this translates into 'likable' by any measurable yardstick. He always comes across as tetchy, petulant and wishing he was somewhere else when I see him.
He has several places to go. Back to the backbenches, into a prolonged fight for the soul of the Labour party insisting he shouldn't resign because he was elected leader, obscurity: the possibilities are endless after he loses badly.
I'm all for him stupidly self-taking down a bunch of very rich, very privileged people.
As for Corbyn, even if you don't like him personally, a lot of Labour policies are, ya know, pro people and Conservatives are entirely pro rich people. It shouldn't be that hard a distinction to make if you're remain. Unless you're in an area where the LDs stand the better chance. Any vote for anyone else is just throwing your vote away.
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Powerpuppiesdrinking coffee in themountain cabinRegistered Userregular
Regarding voting patterns: wat
Voting for the Tories is voting for brexit.
Polling shows people in favour of remaining.
How to square the difference?!
about 20% of tories are remainers who vote tory because mental boom
but also different electorates - a substantial chunk of people who voted in brexit ref have never voted in ges
ge turnout weighting is different to referendum weighting is different to generic population sentiment
this all sounds incredibly dumb and vaguely reminiscent of gerrymandering.
people get to vote in some things but not others right
and that can be predictable?
Unsure about that, isn't anyone that can vote in a GE also a person that can vote on a referendum and vice versa?
The gerrymandering bit might have been a bit too much, I read weighted votes and that doesn't sound legitimate to me but I'll obviously need to go look up how that actually works.
Regarding voting patterns: wat
Voting for the Tories is voting for brexit.
Polling shows people in favour of remaining.
How to square the difference?!
about 20% of tories are remainers who vote tory because mental boom
but also different electorates - a substantial chunk of people who voted in brexit ref have never voted in ges
ge turnout weighting is different to referendum weighting is different to generic population sentiment
this all sounds incredibly dumb and vaguely reminiscent of gerrymandering.
people get to vote in some things but not others right
and that can be predictable?
Unsure about that, isn't anyone that can vote in a GE also a person that can vote on a referendum and vice versa?
The gerrymandering bit might have been a bit too much, I read weighted votes and that doesn't sound legitimate to me but I'll obviously need to go look up how that actually works.
I think scheck meant you weight the polls differently based on whether certain demographics are likely to vote, which is predictable and predictably different based on whether the vote is in a referendum or a GE, and different from population sentiment which would not be weighted at all
The same data would lead to a different measurement of population sentiment from its prediction of referendum result from its prediction of parliament seats
Yeah, it isn't that any demographic has votes that count more or anything like that. It is that certain demographics vote at a much higher percentage than others. So when you poll folks you might say that 90% of the 60+ crowd responses equal votes in that direction while only 40% of the <30 crowd responses turn into actual votes.
There is no government/legal action at work, just the rate at which people turn their opinions into actual votes.
Yeah, it isn't that any demographic has votes that count more or anything like that. It is that certain demographics vote at a much higher percentage than others. So when you poll folks you might say that 90% of the 60+ crowd responses equal votes in that direction while only 40% of the <30 crowd responses turn into actual votes.
There is no government/legal action at work, just the rate at which people turn their opinions into actual votes.
One way polls screw up is when they screw up the weight. Generally, when the youth vote increases.
Corbyn's approval rating is currently the lowest of any leader recorded going into an election. Johnson actually leads him in among the 18-25 group when they're asked who'd make the best PM. I dunno how this translates into 'likable' by any measurable yardstick. He always comes across as tetchy, petulant and wishing he was somewhere else when I see him.
He has several places to go. Back to the backbenches, into a prolonged fight for the soul of the Labour party insisting he shouldn't resign because he was elected leader, obscurity: the possibilities are endless after he loses badly.
I think my reaction to Corbyn is idiosyncratic probably due to him reminding me a bit of my dad. Clearly polling disagrees with me.
“Reject your sense of injury and the injury itself disappears.”
― Marcus Aurelius
Posts
I just can't wrap my head around the notion that anybody thinks the guy who intentionally musses his hair to look like a clueless prat has any kind of gravitas or air of authority to him. He's as ridiculous looking as Trump's fake tan and terrible comb-over/dye-job combo.
The British public have a very low opinion of Prime Ministers recently? Perhaps the whole "Well Corbyn does have that Geography teacher vibe going on, and I take issue with many of his policies but at least he doesn't look Prime Ministerial He's a vegan for god's sake, and no one cares what you do with a turnip!".
Think that is about the news that come up, like, on my very limited point of view, every single news about Corbyn is about an inner-party spat over anti-semitism or Brexit, which has the effect of making people see Corbyn as an ineffective leader. And they aren't wrong.
On the appearance front, the Trump comparison is on point. There's a basic level of craftsmanship that says that their looks are intentional. They WANT to look like that. Unlike Corbyn, that goes for the college professor look but just looks....scruffy.
Good
Everyone on twitter should pretend to be Fact Check UK
Burn it to the ground
"How can you trust Boris to deliver Brexit on time? He can't even keep up with a debate schedule!"
Choose Your Own Chat 1 Choose Your Own Chat 2 Choose Your Own Chat 3
Judging from the laughter when he talks about trust in politics, I think the audience thought the same way.
Choose Your Own Chat 1 Choose Your Own Chat 2 Choose Your Own Chat 3
Obviously the official Tory account that started all this hasn't been touched.
Really in terms of impact, only Nick Clegg has made anything of the TV debates.
FFS
Steam | XBL
Choose Your Own Chat 1 Choose Your Own Chat 2 Choose Your Own Chat 3
(Jessica Simor is a barrister who is pro-remain.)
That guy is popular amongst people who can be bothered to turn up to vote, which is why he might well get in.
Choose Your Own Chat 1 Choose Your Own Chat 2 Choose Your Own Chat 3
Choose Your Own Chat 1 Choose Your Own Chat 2 Choose Your Own Chat 3
Stop freedom of movement to keep out those pesky laborers from the EU, then put "nuisance tenants" to work as field slaves? Cool, cool.
(That's not cool.)
corbyn did better than expected in the debates but really those are an exercise in damage limitation for cons because they already got the brexit party collapse they needed
Choose Your Own Chat 1 Choose Your Own Chat 2 Choose Your Own Chat 3
Corbyn is likable (even for people like me who are basically liberal democrats) and he will do ok during the election. The question is does he have anywhere to go.
― Marcus Aurelius
Path of Exile: themightypuck
He has several places to go. Back to the backbenches, into a prolonged fight for the soul of the Labour party insisting he shouldn't resign because he was elected leader, obscurity: the possibilities are endless after he loses badly.
Choose Your Own Chat 1 Choose Your Own Chat 2 Choose Your Own Chat 3
I'll believe he will when I actually see him do it; but on the other hand, you know, fuckin' McCluskey.
Steam | XBL
if they lose mccluskey is on his way out
hes out of step with the membership and increasingly so with the corbyn-supporting younger lot
no no, dig up stupid
Regarding voting patterns:
wat
Voting for the Tories is voting for brexit.
Polling shows people in favour of remaining.
How to square the difference?!
about 20% of tories are remainers who vote tory because mental boom
but also different electorates - a substantial chunk of people who voted in brexit ref have never voted in ges
ge turnout weighting is different to referendum weighting is different to generic population sentiment
this all sounds incredibly dumb and vaguely reminiscent of gerrymandering.
I'm all for him stupidly self-taking down a bunch of very rich, very privileged people.
As for Corbyn, even if you don't like him personally, a lot of Labour policies are, ya know, pro people and Conservatives are entirely pro rich people. It shouldn't be that hard a distinction to make if you're remain. Unless you're in an area where the LDs stand the better chance. Any vote for anyone else is just throwing your vote away.
people get to vote in some things but not others right
and that can be predictable?
Unsure about that, isn't anyone that can vote in a GE also a person that can vote on a referendum and vice versa?
The gerrymandering bit might have been a bit too much, I read weighted votes and that doesn't sound legitimate to me but I'll obviously need to go look up how that actually works.
That was quick.
Sky news is a TV news station.
I think scheck meant you weight the polls differently based on whether certain demographics are likely to vote, which is predictable and predictably different based on whether the vote is in a referendum or a GE, and different from population sentiment which would not be weighted at all
The same data would lead to a different measurement of population sentiment from its prediction of referendum result from its prediction of parliament seats
There is no government/legal action at work, just the rate at which people turn their opinions into actual votes.
First past the post voting. When leave is voting for one party and remain splits between 2 or 3 party leave wins.
One way polls screw up is when they screw up the weight. Generally, when the youth vote increases.
I think my reaction to Corbyn is idiosyncratic probably due to him reminding me a bit of my dad. Clearly polling disagrees with me.
― Marcus Aurelius
Path of Exile: themightypuck
(Sooz Kemper is a singer and comedian and a better speller than the Metro editor, unless it's on purpose which I'm not ruling out)
a typo probably not long for this world, sadly, but as of me posting this it's still up at: https://metro.co.uk/2019/11/20/ralf-little-suspended-twitter-pretending-tory-party-press-office-11187105