As was foretold, we've added advertisements to the forums! If you have questions, or if you encounter any bugs, please visit this thread: https://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/240191/forum-advertisement-faq-and-reports-thread/
Options

The Avengers! or why a Justice League film can't succeed!

1969798100102

Posts

  • Options
    Centipede DamascusCentipede Damascus Registered User regular
    When was the last time Damage Control showed up in a comic?

  • Options
    BlankZoeBlankZoe Registered User regular
    The ending to Civil War is pretty much the worst event ending ever

    Captain America gets bumrushed by an assorted group of civil servants and cries and then gives up because I'M HURTING THE REAL AMERICA

    CYpGAPn.png
  • Options
    BlankZoeBlankZoe Registered User regular
    When was the last time Damage Control showed up in a comic?
    I remember them and the Avengers dealing with an animated Chrysler Building who was a huge dick

    I think it was during the Heroic Age?

    CYpGAPn.png
  • Options
    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    Skull Man wrote: »
    the only part of civil war I really liked was ben grimm being like fuck this bullshit I'm going to france

    and then there was just a bad guy to fight and he was so happy that he has tears in his eyes as he beat the guy senseless

    And then the French superhero lady was all "and now, breakfast!" And Ben was all "I love this place"

    But yeah, the stupid gravitas around Civil War pissed me off. Oh man, Stamford was awful! Yeah? How about that time when Kang killed everyone in DC! Or when Ultron murdered the entire population of a small country! You loved the Avengers then, when they took out the baddie!

  • Options
    BlankZoeBlankZoe Registered User regular
    Oh and they rebuilt Avengers Mansion in New Avengers after Agamotto fucked it up

    CYpGAPn.png
  • Options
    EtchwartsEtchwarts Eyes Up Registered User regular
    Yeah. It really only works in a vacuum (which is how I more or less experienced it).

  • Options
    Skull ManSkull Man RIP KUSU Registered User regular
    didn't hank pymn build an avengers mansion in the psychic corpse of his dead wife

    what the hell was all that about

  • Options
    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    The worst thing about Civil War overall, though, is Iron Man

    He actually becomes a super-villain

    oh yeah, let's throw people who won't work for the government into a prison! For as long as we want! Without trial! And the prison is in a place which literally sucks the happiness out of you!

    Great work there, Tony

    Oh yeah and the horrible class warfare implications of the whole thing, with the pro-reg side being made up of all the superheroes from wealthy, priveliged backgrounds, and the anti-red dudes being regular guys.

  • Options
    BlankZoeBlankZoe Registered User regular
    Solar wrote: »
    Skull Man wrote: »
    the only part of civil war I really liked was ben grimm being like fuck this bullshit I'm going to france

    and then there was just a bad guy to fight and he was so happy that he has tears in his eyes as he beat the guy senseless

    And then the French superhero lady was all "and now, breakfast!" And Ben was all "I love this place"

    But yeah, the stupid gravitas around Civil War pissed me off. Oh man, Stamford was awful! Yeah? How about that time when Kang killed everyone in DC! Or when Ultron murdered the entire population of a small country! You loved the Avengers then, when they took out the baddie!
    I dunno

    Stamford is, like, the least of my problems with Civil War

    the public has no long-term memory when it comes to important shit. All that matters is what you have done lately. That's how it is when you are a public official, like the Avengers basically are. Ultron happened years ago man, Stamford happened right now.

    Plus it doesn't help the populace of the Marvel Universe are assholes

    CYpGAPn.png
  • Options
    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    I mean Civil War had some decent ideas (I suppose)

    but the execution was awful

  • Options
    Skull ManSkull Man RIP KUSU Registered User regular
    but really

    really

    the worst thing about civil war is that we, as readers, were supposed to percieve these as being two sides with equal merits

    WHO DO YOU CHOOSE

    uh the people not locking up superheroes obviously

  • Options
    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    Blankzilla wrote: »
    Solar wrote: »
    Skull Man wrote: »
    the only part of civil war I really liked was ben grimm being like fuck this bullshit I'm going to france

    and then there was just a bad guy to fight and he was so happy that he has tears in his eyes as he beat the guy senseless

    And then the French superhero lady was all "and now, breakfast!" And Ben was all "I love this place"

    But yeah, the stupid gravitas around Civil War pissed me off. Oh man, Stamford was awful! Yeah? How about that time when Kang killed everyone in DC! Or when Ultron murdered the entire population of a small country! You loved the Avengers then, when they took out the baddie!
    I dunno

    Stamford is, like, the least of my problems with Civil War

    the public has no long-term memory when it comes to important shit. All that matters is what you have done lately. That's how it is when you are a public official, like the Avengers basically are. Ultron happened years ago man, Stamford happened right now.

    Plus it doesn't help the populace of the Marvel Universe are assholes

    Everyone in that comic was an asshole

    everyone except Cap, I guess, who was legit pissed at somebody trying to arrest him because he refused to enforce a law that didn't even exist yet

    oh yeah and Luke Cage who was pissed because a rich white dude came to his door when he was sitting on the sofa and told him that he worked for him now and Luke was all "yeah fuck that."

  • Options
    StraightziStraightzi Here we may reign secure, and in my choice, To reign is worth ambition though in HellRegistered User regular
    Stamford sucks anyways

    Straight deserves anything that happens to it

  • Options
    EtchwartsEtchwarts Eyes Up Registered User regular
    Yeah, the one that isn't cloning Gods for the fun of it.


    I think if they did a Civil War movie, they would definitely have to just take the basic premise of "heroes fight heroes".

  • Options
    Centipede DamascusCentipede Damascus Registered User regular
    Blankzilla wrote: »
    When was the last time Damage Control showed up in a comic?
    I remember them and the Avengers dealing with an animated Chrysler Building who was a huge dick

    I think it was during the Heroic Age?

    Wikipedia tells me that it was after World War Hulk

    gonna have to find that comic

  • Options
    BlankZoeBlankZoe Registered User regular
    Solar I ain't talking about Civil War

    I am talking about the general populace of the MU in general

    these are the people that voted in favor of giant mutant hunting robots

    CYpGAPn.png
  • Options
    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    I mean when one side of the argument are shooting tear gas canisters at teenagers for breaking up muggings

    and the other side is saying "imprisonment without trial is wrong, and we are not going to give ourselves up because that is what will happen to us."

    well

    it aint much of a choice, really.

  • Options
    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    Blankzilla wrote: »
    Solar I ain't talking about Civil War

    I am talking about the general populace of the MU in general

    these are the people that voted in favor of giant mutant hunting robots

    Oh yeah they are awful

    well, they appear to be awful en masse

    there are some okay ones

    the mayor of San Fran welcomed the X-Men there, and all that

  • Options
    Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    Blankzilla wrote: »
    Skull Man wrote: »
    the only part of civil war I really liked was ben grimm being like fuck this bullshit I'm going to france

    and then there was just a bad guy to fight and he was so happy that he has tears in his eyes as he beat the guy senseless
    Yuuuuuuuup

    Ben Grimm is the most rational, awesome person in the Marvel Universe

    How he handled Civil War was brilliant, and completely in character for Ben.
    I must have missed that with Ben Grimm. I just read the "core" issues.


    The bit with Sue leaving Reed was appropriately sad, though. That was one of those little touches I liked. They did a good job with some of those.

    And superhero insurance definitely sounds like a good idea. I'm just referring to Cap's motivations for giving up.

    It was logical for Sue to do that IMO. Though Reed was acting out-of-character during that time period.

  • Options
    EtchwartsEtchwarts Eyes Up Registered User regular
    What's really awful is that if you look at Mutant Rights as a parallel for homosexual/African-American rights, the populace of the Marvel universe are only a couple of steps more evil than the general populace of America.

  • Options
    Skull ManSkull Man RIP KUSU Registered User regular
    also that one drunk newspaper lady was a huge bitch

  • Options
    Centipede DamascusCentipede Damascus Registered User regular
    Skull Man wrote: »
    didn't hank pymn build an avengers mansion in the psychic corpse of his dead wife

    what the hell was all that about

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Janet_Van_Dyne
    Secret Invasion
    Janet was among the Mighty Avengers who were fighting heroes from the Skrull ship. She was later seen with the rest of the Avengers heading to New York to confront the Skrulls. While fighting the Skrulls, the true purpose of the serum that the Skrull Hank Pym gave her was revealed. After Queen Veranke was thought to be dead, Skrull Pym pressed a button that made Jan increase in size rapidly. She realized the "new" particles Pym gave her were turning her into a bio-bomb. Jan was seen growing to huge size, emitting black-purple energy, and about to explode. Janet tried to flee the battlefield trying to take as many Skrulls with her as possible. To save the humans, Thor killed her to put her out of her misery, vowing to avenge her.

    In the Siege crossover, using dimensional technology Hank Pym established a headquarters known as the Infinite Avengers Mansion in a realm called "Underspace". He soon deduced that this was the dimension to which Thor sent the dying Janet Van Dyne. He believes that Janet was transformed into a massive celestial entity, with the Mansion seemingly residing within her eye.

  • Options
    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    Oh God Sally Floyd

    "But Cap what do you know about Myspace and Nascar?!?"

  • Options
    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    The best thing now is that nobody uses Myspace any more, thus making the entire point even more vacuous and irrelevant

  • Options
    BlankZoeBlankZoe Registered User regular
    To be honest I think the SHRA and the Mutant Registration Act are both pretty good ideas

    If you have people running around that can shoot lasers out of their eyes or create fire with their mind or throw your car 3 miles

    well

    you should probably keep track of them

    I mean we know the superheroes are good people and won't fuck over the common man

    but in-universe all the Marvel U has to go by is a promise that "hey we are never going to go evil or something" when a bunch of heroes have totally had a evil/dark period

    the problem is how they went about it. Don't force them to suddenly become SHIELD Agents, don't make them give up their secret identity or if you have to, make it so that they give it up to another hero they trust that works for SHIELD or something. Don't fucking throw anyone who disagrees with the act in jail in another fucking dimension what the hell.

    CYpGAPn.png
  • Options
    Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    Yeah, the one that isn't cloning Gods for the fun of it.


    I think if they did a Civil War movie, they would definitely have to just take the basic premise of "heroes fight heroes".

    It'll most likely end up "heroes fight government".
    Solar wrote: »
    I mean when one side of the argument are shooting tear gas canisters at teenagers for breaking up muggings

    and the other side is saying "imprisonment without trial is wrong, and we are not going to give ourselves up because that is what will happen to us."

    well

    it aint much of a choice, really.

    Which was made worse by Marvel trying to milk the current political climate for credibility. Then they were erratic in what they believed and what the SHRA meant. It all depended on the writer's opinion. There was no attempt by editorial to keep anything consistent. :evil:

    The only title I liked during Civil War was Ms. Marvel. That dealt with the correct implications on both sides and that both had their good arguments.

    Harry Dresden on
  • Options
    PiptheFairPiptheFair Frequently not in boats. Registered User regular
    the best thing about civil war is that we got world war hulk and planet hulk because of it

  • Options
    DouglasDangerDouglasDanger PennsylvaniaRegistered User regular
    superhero comics should be divorced from current affairs
    the metaphors are always juvenile and ham-fisted and it makes the stories seem really dated in just a few years

  • Options
    Centipede DamascusCentipede Damascus Registered User regular
    superhero comics should be divorced from current affairs
    the metaphors are always juvenile and ham-fisted and it makes the stories seem really dated in just a few years

    Like that time when Doctor Doom cried because of 9/11.

  • Options
    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    Well I mean that depends

    There were some really great comics written in the sixties and seventies which were allegories or even just directly about the Civil Rights Movement and Vietnam and so on.

    Sometimes (like every time Millar does it) they are awful, but sometimes they can be pretty good, just like with everything else.

  • Options
    DouglasDangerDouglasDanger PennsylvaniaRegistered User regular
    i don't know... with the sliding timeline Marvel and DC use with their main continuities, linking things to specific current events makes things really dated and hard to reconcile.

  • Options
    Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    Blankzilla wrote: »
    To be honest I think the SHRA and the Mutant Registration Act are both pretty good ideas

    If you have people running around that can shoot lasers out of their eyes or create fire with their mind or throw your car 3 miles

    well

    you should probably keep track of them

    I mean we know the superheroes are good people and won't fuck over the common man

    but in-universe all the Marvel U has to go by is a promise that "hey we are never going to go evil or something" when a bunch of heroes have totally had a evil/dark period

    the problem is how they went about it. Don't force them to suddenly become SHIELD Agents, don't make them give up their secret identity or if you have to, make it so that they give it up to another hero they trust that works for SHIELD or something. Don't fucking throw anyone who disagrees with the act in jail in another fucking dimension what the hell.

    Agreed, Blank.
    superhero comics should be divorced from current affairs
    the metaphors are always juvenile and ham-fisted and it makes the stories seem really dated in just a few years

    Like that time when Doctor Doom cried because of 9/11.

    :lol:

  • Options
    Skull ManSkull Man RIP KUSU Registered User regular
    world war hulk was so good

    not a huge fan of planet hulk mostly because it was like ah, all this shit, damn it

  • Options
    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    Well, those comics from the sixties are always going to look and feel somewhat dated. The fashion, the language, the technology, it's inevitable really. Adding it references to events at the time is part of what makes them cool, legit pieces of literature with honest social commentary going on in them. I'm happy for comics to feel a little dated in the future as long as they do a good job of portraying the now, and I feel that if they tap into something which deep and important enough, and portray that well, then they won't feel any more dated than they otherwise would.

  • Options
    Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    edited May 2012
    Skull Man wrote: »
    world war hulk was so good

    not a huge fan of planet hulk mostly because it was like ah, all this shit, damn it

    I liked the idea of WWH, though I had some criticisms with how it dealt with things. Had they made it more of a grey area between the Illuminanti and the Hulk I would have enjoyed it more. That and the heroes not on the Hulk's side act like stupid rookies to be the Hulk's punching bags.

    Harry Dresden on
  • Options
    Skull ManSkull Man RIP KUSU Registered User regular
    acting like cap was out of touch because he didn't have a myspace was a hideously sour note though

  • Options
    SolarSolar Registered User regular
    Yeah that was incredibly sour

    which is why it needs to be done well. If it fails, it fails hard

  • Options
    wirehead26wirehead26 Registered User regular
    superhero comics should be divorced from current affairs
    the metaphors are always juvenile and ham-fisted and it makes the stories seem really dated in just a few years

    Like that time when Doctor Doom cried because of 9/11.

    I got so, so angry when I read that. So angry.

    I'M NOT FINISHED WITH YOU!!!
  • Options
    Skull ManSkull Man RIP KUSU Registered User regular
    haha oh wait I got that backwards

    sorry

    planet hulk was the one with all the gladiator stuff right? that was the good one

    it was world war hulk I didn't like

  • Options
    Harry DresdenHarry Dresden Registered User regular
    Skull Man wrote: »
    haha oh wait I got that backwards

    sorry

    planet hulk was the one with all the gladiator stuff right? that was the good one

    it was world war hulk I didn't like

    Yeah, that's correct.

This discussion has been closed.