The SALT deduction can be charitably viewed as an incentive for blue states to cut back on paternalistic welfare and public education programs if they are unable to do so without their upper-middle class tax bases artificially taking a break on the high property taxes that support those programs by deducting them from their federal income taxes
In practice the argument looks like: If you want to have a socialist blue state that internally redistributes the surplus of its high land wealth to supporting infrastructure, education of children, healthcare and poverty programs, you should have to pay a extra tax to the federal government who can redistribute that money to irresponsible lassez-faire states in the deep south with depressed tax bases and safety nets that are more hole than rope
EDIT: To be clear this is not a persuasive argument to many "socially liberal, fiscally conservative" McMansion owners in the suburbs
Ah, I understand we've finally discovered the "double taxation" that a conservative can love.
Depends on what you consider New England. There's still one Republican Rep in New Jersey and a handful in New York.
New York and New Jersey aren't New England, they're Mid-Atlantic along with Pennsylvania.
And it does. Collins is the sole Republican.
New York...like the city maybe but that really does not apply to most (by area) of the state. Though I feel like it doesn't apply to most of Pennsylvania either really. That really feels like a regional label slapped on there by people not of the region.
Depends on what you consider New England. There's still one Republican Rep in New Jersey and a handful in New York.
New York and New Jersey aren't New England, they're Mid-Atlantic along with Pennsylvania.
And it does. Collins is the sole Republican.
New York...like the city maybe but that really does not apply to most (by area) of the state. Though I feel like it doesn't apply to most of Pennsylvania either really. That really feels like a regional label slapped on there by people not of the region.
It does not include New York in any fashion. This isn't something people outside the area decided, it's the local and long time historic definition.
Depends on what you consider New England. There's still one Republican Rep in New Jersey and a handful in New York.
New York and New Jersey aren't New England, they're Mid-Atlantic along with Pennsylvania.
And it does. Collins is the sole Republican.
New York...like the city maybe but that really does not apply to most (by area) of the state. Though I feel like it doesn't apply to most of Pennsylvania either really. That really feels like a regional label slapped on there by people not of the region.
I am confident that several employees in the Census Bureau are from New York, and have at least heard tell about Upstate.
Depends on what you consider New England. There's still one Republican Rep in New Jersey and a handful in New York.
New York and New Jersey aren't New England, they're Mid-Atlantic along with Pennsylvania.
And it does. Collins is the sole Republican.
New York...like the city maybe but that really does not apply to most (by area) of the state. Though I feel like it doesn't apply to most of Pennsylvania either really. That really feels like a regional label slapped on there by people not of the region.
It does not include New York in any fashion. This isn't something people outside the area decided, it's the local and long time historic definition.
To be clear I'm not arguing that New York is part of New England, I'm saying calling it Mid-Atlantic is not a thing that locals would do, at least not upstate.
I am confident that several employees in the Census Bureau are from New York, and have at least heard tell about Upstate.
You are of course technically correct. We should always use what government officials label a region as instead of what the residents self-identify as and ignore any protestations to the contrary.
Depends on what you consider New England. There's still one Republican Rep in New Jersey and a handful in New York.
New York and New Jersey aren't New England, they're Mid-Atlantic along with Pennsylvania.
And it does. Collins is the sole Republican.
New York...like the city maybe but that really does not apply to most (by area) of the state. Though I feel like it doesn't apply to most of Pennsylvania either really. That really feels like a regional label slapped on there by people not of the region.
It does not include New York in any fashion. This isn't something people outside the area decided, it's the local and long time historic definition.
To be clear I'm not arguing that New York is part of New England, I'm saying calling it Mid-Atlantic is not a thing that locals would do, at least not upstate.
I am confident that several employees in the Census Bureau are from New York, and have at least heard tell about Upstate.
You are of course technically correct. We should always use what government officials label a region as instead of what the residents self-identify as and ignore any protestations to the contrary.
Let's drop this please
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Kane Red RobeMaster of MagicArcanusRegistered Userregular
One thousand apologies for inadvertently starting that.
That means PB's machine recount tally is discarded, and the initial count holds, no idea what that means for a hand recount of the races are still within a quarter percent. Hopefully some news types will save me having to parse the statute.
That means PB's machine recount tally is discarded, and the initial count holds, no idea what that means for a hand recount of the races are still within a quarter percent. Hopefully some news types will save me having to parse the statute.
That means PB's machine recount tally is discarded, and the initial count holds, no idea what that means for a hand recount of the races are still within a quarter percent. Hopefully some news types will save me having to parse the statute.
From that article it says
While Broward met the deadline, it did not finish counting all of its votes before the deadline.
So they did what? They turned in numbers that were incomplete but are going to keep working on it? That is a shitty definition of "meeting the deadline"
CommunistCow on
No, I am not really communist. Yes, it is weird that I use this name.
Oddly, all the big name result trackers now list him as being declared the winner but still show the first round results (where he is losing).
New England sweeps out all Rs House reps once again.
Susan Collins is now the only New England Republican in either house.
edit
Since I got dunked on NY is now 20-5 with two up in the air (Collins-R) and (Tenney-R) are each within about 1% (leading and trailing respectively). NJ went to 11-1. So the states pretty universally considered Northeastern will be (if my math is right) 52-6 with 2 up in the air. Polarization society is polarized.
That means PB's machine recount tally is discarded, and the initial count holds, no idea what that means for a hand recount of the races are still within a quarter percent. Hopefully some news types will save me having to parse the statute.
From that article it says
While Broward met the deadline, it did not finish counting all of its votes before the deadline.
So they did what? They turned in numbers that were incomplete but are going to keep working on it? That is a shitty definition of "meeting the deadline"
It's been updated since your post, now says:
While Broward met the deadline, it did not finish counting all of its votes before the deadline.
Joe D’Alessandro from the elections office said that not all duplicated mail-in ballots were included in the upload. “I uploaded by 3 o’clock, like I’m supposed to,” D’Alessandro said.
Also now answers my hand count question:
If the state orders a manual recount in the Senate race, Palm Beach County will recount 5,900 over-votes and under-votes
But also notes that Nelson lost 1200 votes.
And I guess Nelson is suing to get all the ballots hand counted?
Nelson attorney Marc Elias said in a tweet that his suit claims a hand recount of all the ballots is required because of a systemic machine failure during the machine recount.
So we seem to be even further from a resolution here.
Only problem is if this seat DOES go to Nelson, the Pubs are probably going to lawsuit the shit out of it to prevent him from being seated for as long as possible.
Only problem is if this seat DOES go to Nelson, the Pubs are probably going to lawsuit the shit out of it to prevent him from being seated for as long as possible.
Only problem is if this seat DOES go to Nelson, the Pubs are probably going to lawsuit the shit out of it to prevent him from being seated for as long as possible.
Looks like they have until Sunday to submit the final tally of hand counted votes, and the winner will be certified on Tuesday. For Senator and Ag Commissioner.
Still not likely to go our way, but at least it will be more accurate. Probably.
Looks like they have until Sunday to submit the final tally of hand counted votes, and the winner will be certified on Tuesday. For Senator and Ag Commissioner.
Still not likely to go our way, but at least it will be more accurate. Probably.
First test of the statutory procedure with an added dash of court ordered deviations.
Looks like they have until Sunday to submit the final tally of hand counted votes, and the winner will be certified on Tuesday. For Senator and Ag Commissioner.
Still not likely to go our way, but at least it will be more accurate. Probably.
Hand counting that many votes in that short of a time frame?
Looks like they have until Sunday to submit the final tally of hand counted votes, and the winner will be certified on Tuesday. For Senator and Ag Commissioner.
Still not likely to go our way, but at least it will be more accurate. Probably.
Hand counting that many votes in that short of a time frame?
The "manual recount" just calls for manual inspection of over/under votes, then adds them.
However, Nelson is apparently requesting what you said; which is not even a thing in the statute, IIRC.
(c) The canvassing board shall submit on forms or in formats provided by the division a second set of unofficial returns to the Department of State for each federal, statewide, state, or multicounty office or ballot measure. The returns shall be filed no later than 3 p.m. on the 5th day after any primary election and no later than 3 p.m. on the 9th day after any general election in which a recount was ordered by the Secretary of State.
If the canvassing board is unable to complete the recount prescribed in this subsection by the deadline, the second set of unofficial returns submitted by the canvassing board shall be identical to the initial unofficial returns and the submission shall also include a detailed explanation of why it was unable to timely complete the recount.
However, the canvassing board shall complete the recount prescribed in this subsection, along with any manual recount prescribed in s. 102.166, and certify election returns in accordance with the requirements of this chapter.
So, if Palm Beach or Broward didn't finish counting, they were supposed to submit their original unofficial count...
Looks like they have until Sunday to submit the final tally of hand counted votes, and the winner will be certified on Tuesday. For Senator and Ag Commissioner.
Still not likely to go our way, but at least it will be more accurate. Probably.
First test of the statutory procedure with an added dash of court ordered deviations.
I'm sure it will go swimmingly.
I mean, when has a vote recount ever run into trouble in Florida?
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ButtersA glass of some milksRegistered Userregular
Out of all the disenfranchisement techniques applied so far the "signature match" one has got to be the most outrageous. I couldn't sign my name the same way twice if you pointed a fucking gun to my dog's head.
I feel that Democrats should start preemptively declaring the existence of a recount as a great victory in itself. We want to make sure this is taken as us cheering for successful democracy and not the Democrat winning.
I submitted an entry to Lego Ideas, and if 10,000 people support me, it'll be turned into an actual Lego set!If you'd like to see and support my submission, follow this link.
Out of all the disenfranchisement techniques applied so far the "signature match" one has got to be the most outrageous. I couldn't sign my name the same way twice if you pointed a fucking gun to my dog's head.
The paper tried to claim that the the signature issue has to deal with people with bad penmanship and I thought that was the horse shittiest of horse shit. Like I want to say 80% of people have illegible signature. This is purely disenfranchisement with a bullshit fig leaf.
Bullshit.
I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.
I broke my hand a few years ago and my signature isn’t in the same star system as it is when I registered. I don’t even try anymore. It’s now just something that looks like an ‘A’ if you cross your eyes with a scribble afterwards.
Battlenet ID: MildC#11186 - If I'm in the game, send me an invite at anytime and I'll play.
MSNBC are reporting that Boward County missed the recount deadline by 2 minutes and that therefore none of their votes will be counted towards the final tally.
Guys honestly I think you might want to just go ahead and bring UN observers in for 2020 because holy fucking shit an entire county in Florida just got disenfranchised over a two minute deadline after a solid week of every bullshit delay tactic possible being thrown at them.
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Luxury!
This makes the New England Delegation 100% Democrat aside from Collins, right?
*Edit*
It does, unless you want to quibble about Independents.
Ah, I understand we've finally discovered the "double taxation" that a conservative can love.
New York and New Jersey aren't New England, they're Mid-Atlantic along with Pennsylvania.
And it does. Collins is the sole Republican.
Pema Levy is a reporter with Mother Jones and if you're interested in what's going on in Florida she's a veritable font of election information.
New York...like the city maybe but that really does not apply to most (by area) of the state. Though I feel like it doesn't apply to most of Pennsylvania either really. That really feels like a regional label slapped on there by people not of the region.
It does not include New York in any fashion. This isn't something people outside the area decided, it's the local and long time historic definition.
I am confident that several employees in the Census Bureau are from New York, and have at least heard tell about Upstate.
So is this still the initial count, with the machine (and maybe hand) one coming later, margins permitting?
To be clear I'm not arguing that New York is part of New England, I'm saying calling it Mid-Atlantic is not a thing that locals would do, at least not upstate.
You are of course technically correct. We should always use what government officials label a region as instead of what the residents self-identify as and ignore any protestations to the contrary.
Let's drop this please
No, Broward finished the recount, but Palm Beach missed the deadline.
https://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/politics/fl-ne-broward-palm-first-recount-20181115-story.html
That means PB's machine recount tally is discarded, and the initial count holds, no idea what that means for a hand recount of the races are still within a quarter percent. Hopefully some news types will save me having to parse the statute.
Didn't a Judge give them until the 20th?
From that article it says So they did what? They turned in numbers that were incomplete but are going to keep working on it? That is a shitty definition of "meeting the deadline"
New England sweeps out all Rs House reps once again.
Susan Collins is now the only New England Republican in either house.
edit
Since I got dunked on NY is now 20-5 with two up in the air (Collins-R) and (Tenney-R) are each within about 1% (leading and trailing respectively). NJ went to 11-1. So the states pretty universally considered Northeastern will be (if my math is right) 52-6 with 2 up in the air. Polarization society is polarized.
QEDMF xbl: PantsB G+
It's been updated since your post, now says:
Also now answers my hand count question:
But also notes that Nelson lost 1200 votes.
And I guess Nelson is suing to get all the ballots hand counted?
So we seem to be even further from a resolution here.
Marc Elias is Nelson's recount lawyer
Voters have more time if their ballots were not counted due to "signature mismatch"
QEDMF xbl: PantsB G+
52-47 is better than 53-47
*shrug*
Very true, I didn't think of it that way.
http://amp.bradenton.com/news/politics-government/state-politics/article221700880.html
Looks like they have until Sunday to submit the final tally of hand counted votes, and the winner will be certified on Tuesday. For Senator and Ag Commissioner.
Still not likely to go our way, but at least it will be more accurate. Probably.
First test of the statutory procedure with an added dash of court ordered deviations.
I'm sure it will go swimmingly.
Hand counting that many votes in that short of a time frame?
The "manual recount" just calls for manual inspection of over/under votes, then adds them.
However, Nelson is apparently requesting what you said; which is not even a thing in the statute, IIRC.
So, if Palm Beach or Broward didn't finish counting, they were supposed to submit their original unofficial count...
Then continue counting?
That gives me hope. Or am I misreading that?
I mean, when has a vote recount ever run into trouble in Florida?
The paper tried to claim that the the signature issue has to deal with people with bad penmanship and I thought that was the horse shittiest of horse shit. Like I want to say 80% of people have illegible signature. This is purely disenfranchisement with a bullshit fig leaf.
Bullshit.
pleasepaypreacher.net
Exactly, and like signatures that match too nicely are actually more likely forged versus the general drift of most peoples hand written signature.
pleasepaypreacher.net
I broke my hand a few years ago and my signature isn’t in the same star system as it is when I registered. I don’t even try anymore. It’s now just something that looks like an ‘A’ if you cross your eyes with a scribble afterwards.
Battlenet ID: MildC#11186 - If I'm in the game, send me an invite at anytime and I'll play.