The community of Nano is to encourage people to keep writing and write daily and make the word counts for the day so you can finish 50K and have something that's close to a whole novel complete.
Sprints aren't for everybody, but they're awesome. It's more to counter the idea of having a word document open and then just surfing the internet and not writing for that time. Now you're held accountable for writing for that time and if you don't produce people make fun of you. Okay most people don't make fun of you, but the idea is just to focus on writing and make you write, right now instead of putting it off and saying you don't have ideas.
Plus talking about what you've written isn't very productive until you've finished it. Like you can ask questions about the general idea of what you're writing, or need some help figuring out how to work a plot point.
Also there are awful people who do stupid shit and write shitty shit piles to get 50k that don't produce anything close to a novel and reading about how proudly they shit out shit to make a word count makes me sad.
That's great and everything, but I don't really have a lot of difficulty writing words when I sit down to actually write them, so sprints don't really solve a problem that I have. And talking about your writing while you're still writing it is hugely helpful, because you can answer important questions about "where is this going" and what story am I actually writing", which can help you visualize the plot and the themes in more concrete terms. It is the cornerstone around which long-fiction writing classes and writing groups are built. It also helps tremendously with motivation! Having people tell you useful, thought-provoking things about what you're writing inspires you to write more!
In essence, being able to discuss my novel and think about it in response to people's feedback creates a very, very positive feedback loop for me, and helps remind me why I am writing (to make it readable and interesting so people will purchase it for money).
Which, as we have now both pointed out, is not the purpose of NaNo groups.
If only there was some kind of IRC group where writers hung out and talked about stuff.
Quoththe RavenMiami, FL FOR REALRegistered Userregular
If only a bunch of us were in there right now. Waiting. Watching.
And sarukun, remember that what works for you is not necessarily what works for the human race as a whole. It's like you told smof. We each have to find what works for us, gets us going and doing and writing. Sprints may not solve a problem that YOU have, but they solve a problem that like 90% of the people doing NaNo have. The reason there's a high church of NaNo where the gospel of the sprint is preached is because it works most of the time. Sprint times can be variable: some people like ten minutes, or fifteen, or a half hour. But working in huge blocks of time just doesn't fly for most folks.
And too much talking about the writing can lead to people not actually writing, which is not happy fun times. It's one thing to get help on how to move forward, but it's another to share something you wrote and ask for feedback on it. That's looking back, not forward. That's treading water, not swimming. Using that to inform the help you get to move forward is, of course, fine. And it's good if you get that positive feedback loop and it helps you, but again, doesn't work for many people that way. It's kind of like showing someone a picture of a fetus and asking whether your baby is cute. I mean, it probably WILL BE cute, but right now it's a fetus. It may even be a really cute fetus, but again, most of them aren't, so the advice is geared towards the majority. And yes, I am aware that this happens and I find it to be just as weird, so.
I'm not entirely sure what NaNo groups you're checking out, but there's this one right here that doesn't sound like anything you're describing, so don't sweat what other people might be up to and just snuggle with us. Especially Magell.
I'm very, very close to using the "person bursts into the room with a weapon" thing and I'm only 3000 words into my story. My protagonist, a fugitive, went in the wrong bank at the wrong time and is now a hostage, so I guess it would be "another person with a weapon bursts into the room."
Also there are awful people who do stupid shit and write shitty shit piles to get 50k that don't produce anything close to a novel and reading about how proudly they shit out shit to make a word count makes me sad.
This is my first Nano, so I'm trying short stories instead of a novel. I was under the impression the goal was simply to get you writing every day to form better writing habits. I've managed to do this and stay on schedule, and was proud of this fact even though I had to write some silly stories some day when my brain wasn't cooperating with my planned ones (still actual stories, not gibberish or anything, just not anything I'd plan to share with anyone).
However, though I assume you were referring to other Nano groups, seeing stuff like this is still pretty demoralizing.
0
Options
Quoththe RavenMiami, FL FOR REALRegistered Userregular
Yeah, no, he's not talking about you. Don't worry. Honestly, I think the people who do what he's discussing are a minority and to be ignored.
Quoththe RavenMiami, FL FOR REALRegistered Userregular
Like, here's the deal. We're all here because we want to write things and/or have fun. Fun is okay. Fun is lovely. There is nothing wrong with fun. But a lot of us primarily want to tell stories, and write, and so it can be frustrating when that part takes a back seat to the fun.
There's a whole thread in the NaNo forums about dirty tricks to get to 50k. Not using contractions. Having the characters tell each other stories. Using find and replace to switch "Suddenly" for "All of a sudden." Giving characters multi-word names. Using foreign language so you can then have the characters translate it. Taking all your comments in this thread and inserting them. Some of the tricks are silly, some are weird, and some actively encourage bad writing. One person suggested inserting random spaces into words, so wri ting li ke thi s to get extra words.
Again, if that person is having fun, then who are we to judge? But reading something like that can be disheartening in its own way. Because those of us who are really trying to put out something we can work with later, even if it's a goopy pile of stinky first draft--we're trying, you know? We want to develop good habits, not bad ones. Putting words down even when you don't feel like it can be a very good habit. Writing something silly to warm up your brain: also good. Having your character quote entire real songs not written by you: not so good.
I heard a story about Roald Dahl yesterday, and how he had a strict writing routine, wrote every day, and had to rewrite Charlie and the Chocolate Factory like five times. James and the Giant Peach came out of stories he used to tell his kids at bedtime, for fun. Fun is good. Fun is awesome. But he still sat down at the end of it and did the work. He didn't worry about contractions and long character names. He worried about the fun, really, because if it's fun for you, it may very well be fun for the readers, too.
Ah, the Nano people here is the only group I've been exposed to, so I wasn't aware of the rather extreme lengths people elsewhere were going to in order to make the goal. That is rather silly since (to me) this seems like an exercise in forming better habits for oneself, so stuff like inserting random spaces to artificially inflate your word count wouldn't be very helpful.
Ah, the Nano people here is the only group I've been exposed to, so I wasn't aware of the rather extreme lengths people elsewhere were going to in order to make the goal. That is rather silly since (to me) this seems like an exercise in forming better habits for oneself, so stuff like inserting random spaces to artificially inflate your word count wouldn't be very helpful.
I find this site equal parts mean spirited and hilarious
In a coal-powered set from Road Warrior, a young student of metaphysics stumbles across an alien artifact which spurs him into conflict with supernatural monsters, with the help of a shape-shifting female assassin and her closet full of assault rifles, culminating in authorial preaching through the mouths of the characters.
and my current 3000 words and thinking. I have several characters, and have written two scenes. In the first scene, Agueda, an Arch Investigator for a future FBI-type agency, investigates the aftermath of a bar brawl and recruits a fence/hot goods guy. In the second scene, the character that caused the bar fight carnage must escape from a bank robbery before the cops arrive. He is a mere bystander who must escalate things and either insert himself into the robbers gang, or escape in some other way.
Ah, the Nano people here is the only group I've been exposed to, so I wasn't aware of the rather extreme lengths people elsewhere were going to in order to make the goal. That is rather silly since (to me) this seems like an exercise in forming better habits for oneself, so stuff like inserting random spaces to artificially inflate your word count wouldn't be very helpful.
I find this site equal parts mean spirited and hilarious
Ah, the Nano people here is the only group I've been exposed to, so I wasn't aware of the rather extreme lengths people elsewhere were going to in order to make the goal. That is rather silly since (to me) this seems like an exercise in forming better habits for oneself, so stuff like inserting random spaces to artificially inflate your word count wouldn't be very helpful.
Yeah, I mean... In some ways, it can get to be a mean sort of "you're not a REAL writer if..." pissing contest, so it's generally wiser to avoid getting all up in arms about it either way. But when people complain, that's more the stuff we're talking about. Not reasonable methods for jump-starting creativity and getting your write on, but strange sort of non-writing tricks that do nothing but boost word count.
Hit daily for today by 3pm - woo! Now only 3.5k behind, and I'm hoping I might cut that number in half this evening.
+1
Options
Brovid Hasselsmof[Growling historic on the fury road]Registered Userregular
This weekend's going to be a challenge as I have family visiting so have to do my duties there.
I think I've finally worked out some stuff about my coup which was troubling me though, which will hopefully make it easier to work on my antagonists plot.
Struggling a bit with a character I was going to kill. Feel like I want her to survive now but I can't tell if it's because her surviving suits the story better, or I'm just being a coward because I like her too much.
If you like her too much there's a good chance the reader will as well so killing her makes them feel something so it's a good choice. Alternatively kill somebody you thought was going to be a main character and have her take that place.
This weekend's going to be a challenge as I have family visiting so have to do my duties there.
I think I've finally worked out some stuff about my coup which was troubling me though, which will hopefully make it easier to work on my antagonists plot.
Struggling a bit with a character I was going to kill. Feel like I want her to survive now but I can't tell if it's because her surviving suits the story better, or I'm just being a coward because I like her too much.
Feeling attached doesn’t make you a bad writer at all. You absolutely should. You more than anybody else. But you can’t really think of it as you killing the character off. Your characters are you. They’re part of you. The villains are part of you. The heroes are part of you. The women are. The men are. All of them. They’re all made of your thoughts. In creating them, you’re kinda carving off a part of your soul and seeing what it does. Sometimes you realize that it’s the part of you that would throw himself on the grenade. Sometimes you realize it’s the part of you that goes down into the creepy root cellar like a moron. Sometimes there’s a way out and sometimes there’s not. It’s not so much deciding who lives and who dies. It’s allowing the consequences of your decisions to play out. And if it brings a tear to your eye, maybe it’s important. Maybe it’s not. But you don’t know what it says until you see it in context. That’s what first drafts are for. You can always revise it.
The community of Nano is to encourage people to keep writing and write daily and make the word counts for the day so you can finish 50K and have something that's close to a whole novel complete.
Sprints aren't for everybody, but they're awesome. It's more to counter the idea of having a word document open and then just surfing the internet and not writing for that time. Now you're held accountable for writing for that time and if you don't produce people make fun of you. Okay most people don't make fun of you, but the idea is just to focus on writing and make you write, right now instead of putting it off and saying you don't have ideas.
Plus talking about what you've written isn't very productive until you've finished it. Like you can ask questions about the general idea of what you're writing, or need some help figuring out how to work a plot point.
Also there are awful people who do stupid shit and write shitty shit piles to get 50k that don't produce anything close to a novel and reading about how proudly they shit out shit to make a word count makes me sad.
That's great and everything, but I don't really have a lot of difficulty writing words when I sit down to actually write them, so sprints don't really solve a problem that I have. And talking about your writing while you're still writing it is hugely helpful, because you can answer important questions about "where is this going" and what story am I actually writing", which can help you visualize the plot and the themes in more concrete terms. It is the cornerstone around which long-fiction writing classes and writing groups are built. It also helps tremendously with motivation! Having people tell you useful, thought-provoking things about what you're writing inspires you to write more!
In essence, being able to discuss my novel and think about it in response to people's feedback creates a very, very positive feedback loop for me, and helps remind me why I am writing (to make it readable and interesting so people will purchase it for money).
Which, as we have now both pointed out, is not the purpose of NaNo groups.
If only there was some kind of IRC group where writers hung out and talked about stuff.
What, like on the internet?
That sounds like it might be for nerds.
(where is your newsletter so I may subscribe to it.)
If only a bunch of us were in there right now. Waiting. Watching.
And sarukun, remember that what works for you is not necessarily what works for the human race as a whole. It's like you told smof. We each have to find what works for us, gets us going and doing and writing. Sprints may not solve a problem that YOU have, but they solve a problem that like 90% of the people doing NaNo have. The reason there's a high church of NaNo where the gospel of the sprint is preached is because it works most of the time. Sprint times can be variable: some people like ten minutes, or fifteen, or a half hour. But working in huge blocks of time just doesn't fly for most folks.
And too much talking about the writing can lead to people not actually writing, which is not happy fun times. It's one thing to get help on how to move forward, but it's another to share something you wrote and ask for feedback on it. That's looking back, not forward. That's treading water, not swimming. Using that to inform the help you get to move forward is, of course, fine. And it's good if you get that positive feedback loop and it helps you, but again, doesn't work for many people that way. It's kind of like showing someone a picture of a fetus and asking whether your baby is cute. I mean, it probably WILL BE cute, but right now it's a fetus. It may even be a really cute fetus, but again, most of them aren't, so the advice is geared towards the majority. And yes, I am aware that this happens and I find it to be just as weird, so.
I'm not entirely sure what NaNo groups you're checking out, but there's this one right here that doesn't sound like anything you're describing, so don't sweat what other people might be up to and just snuggle with us. Especially Magell.
Long Beach was the one I got my feet wet with, most of the other ones are kind of a hike for me to get to (LA and Irvine).
In fact the 5 minute trick was one I got from a therapist when I was writing my thesis and suffering from depression and dreadful writer's block. They said just write for 5 minutes first thing in the morning before you do anything else (I would go pee first but that's it). Just 5 minutes. And if you achieve those 5 minutes and you don't feel like writing any more that day then don't. You achieved your 5 minute goal. But if you do feel like writing more then just keep going until you are done. After a few days I increased it to 10 minutes, and then 15 minutes. And some days that really was all I wrote and I would just goof off the rest of the day. But many days I wrote way more than that.
I like this a lot.
=_= yeah, that's four posts.
sarukun on
0
Options
Quoththe RavenMiami, FL FOR REALRegistered Userregular
I may have forgotten that it's November and the subsequent writing shenanigans that should accompany this month.
Part of me feels like it's too late to write anything now, and part of me feels like everything I come up with is terrible but all of me knows that I'm just making excuses because I lost my writing partner and all around safety net.
It's good to see people kicking on at this, you guys are kind of inspirational...but you know said in a way that doesn't make me seem lame.
I'm really enjoying writing this bit. My two leads will soon have sex for the first time, but right now they both think the other one just wants to be friends. The anticipation is quite fun, since the reader knows they both want each other, but the characters don't.
I feel a bit silly posting an excerpt since y'all are writing space/fantasy/sci-fi and I am writing trashy romance, but here goes:
Natalie kicked her shoes off as soon as they were in the door and went for the sofa.
"We should get you something to eat," Alex was saying, rummaging in the kitchen. "Frozen pizza?"
"Perfect," she said flicking the tv on. She flicked through a few different channels before settling on Sportscenter. She thought sport was a safe bet, nothing too emotional.
Alex came and sat down next to her, taking off his shoes and socks. "I feel like this is a tracks and hoodie kind of occasion, do you mind if I go change?"
Natalie smiled her assent and turned back to the television. Even his feet were gorgeous. How does a person have sexy feet, she wondered. Well, if anyone could, Alex Rojas would. She tried to pay attention to the basketball highlights and stop thinking about Alex's feet.
When he came back he was carrying some clothes. "For you, if you want to change," he said. "Sorry, they're mine, so they will be huge on you, but I thought you might want the option."
"Thanks," she said taking the clothes as he went back to the kitchen. She pulled her singlet off and was still pulling the sweatshirt over her head when Alex came back in. He watched her for a moment before stepping back into the kitchen unseen. "Do you want hawaiian or pepperoni?"
"Pepperoni," she said once she had the sweatshirt on. It smelled like him and she had to resist pulling it up over her face and inhaling.
Alex came back to the sofa and they watched the hockey highlights together. He found it harder to keep his hands off her now that she was wearing his sweatshirt. Which seemed stupid, he thought. You would think it would be easier now that she was more covered, but she looked so damn sexy in those skin tight jeans, her bare feet pulled up under her, her long hair spilling down the back of his sweatshirt. He had never wanted her more, but he knew this was not the right moment. Keep it together, Alex.
Posts
If only there was some kind of IRC group where writers hung out and talked about stuff.
{Twitter, Everybody's doing it. }{Writing and Story Blog}
And sarukun, remember that what works for you is not necessarily what works for the human race as a whole. It's like you told smof. We each have to find what works for us, gets us going and doing and writing. Sprints may not solve a problem that YOU have, but they solve a problem that like 90% of the people doing NaNo have. The reason there's a high church of NaNo where the gospel of the sprint is preached is because it works most of the time. Sprint times can be variable: some people like ten minutes, or fifteen, or a half hour. But working in huge blocks of time just doesn't fly for most folks.
And too much talking about the writing can lead to people not actually writing, which is not happy fun times. It's one thing to get help on how to move forward, but it's another to share something you wrote and ask for feedback on it. That's looking back, not forward. That's treading water, not swimming. Using that to inform the help you get to move forward is, of course, fine. And it's good if you get that positive feedback loop and it helps you, but again, doesn't work for many people that way. It's kind of like showing someone a picture of a fetus and asking whether your baby is cute. I mean, it probably WILL BE cute, but right now it's a fetus. It may even be a really cute fetus, but again, most of them aren't, so the advice is geared towards the majority. And yes, I am aware that this happens and I find it to be just as weird, so.
I'm not entirely sure what NaNo groups you're checking out, but there's this one right here that doesn't sound like anything you're describing, so don't sweat what other people might be up to and just snuggle with us. Especially Magell.
Also, this is by far the most prose I've written in about a decade. Feels. Good. Man.
Then what do you use I Need a New Drug for if not love scenes?
This is my first Nano, so I'm trying short stories instead of a novel. I was under the impression the goal was simply to get you writing every day to form better writing habits. I've managed to do this and stay on schedule, and was proud of this fact even though I had to write some silly stories some day when my brain wasn't cooperating with my planned ones (still actual stories, not gibberish or anything, just not anything I'd plan to share with anyone).
However, though I assume you were referring to other Nano groups, seeing stuff like this is still pretty demoralizing.
There's a whole thread in the NaNo forums about dirty tricks to get to 50k. Not using contractions. Having the characters tell each other stories. Using find and replace to switch "Suddenly" for "All of a sudden." Giving characters multi-word names. Using foreign language so you can then have the characters translate it. Taking all your comments in this thread and inserting them. Some of the tricks are silly, some are weird, and some actively encourage bad writing. One person suggested inserting random spaces into words, so wri ting li ke thi s to get extra words.
Again, if that person is having fun, then who are we to judge? But reading something like that can be disheartening in its own way. Because those of us who are really trying to put out something we can work with later, even if it's a goopy pile of stinky first draft--we're trying, you know? We want to develop good habits, not bad ones. Putting words down even when you don't feel like it can be a very good habit. Writing something silly to warm up your brain: also good. Having your character quote entire real songs not written by you: not so good.
I heard a story about Roald Dahl yesterday, and how he had a strict writing routine, wrote every day, and had to rewrite Charlie and the Chocolate Factory like five times. James and the Giant Peach came out of stories he used to tell his kids at bedtime, for fun. Fun is good. Fun is awesome. But he still sat down at the end of it and did the work. He didn't worry about contractions and long character names. He worried about the fun, really, because if it's fun for you, it may very well be fun for the readers, too.
By somewhere between a country mile and a country nautical mile
Drug use montages.
Or scenes where something that isn't drugs is used as an analogue for drugs.
Why I fear the ocean.
I find this site equal parts mean spirited and hilarious
http://bestofnanowrimo.tumblr.com/
I'm looking at this,
and mostly laughing-- see
and my current 3000 words and thinking. I have several characters, and have written two scenes. In the first scene, Agueda, an Arch Investigator for a future FBI-type agency, investigates the aftermath of a bar brawl and recruits a fence/hot goods guy. In the second scene, the character that caused the bar fight carnage must escape from a bank robbery before the cops arrive. He is a mere bystander who must escalate things and either insert himself into the robbers gang, or escape in some other way.
Thank you for posting this, I enjoyed it a lot last year, but forgot to bookmark it.
{Twitter, Everybody's doing it. }{Writing and Story Blog}
Yeah, I mean... In some ways, it can get to be a mean sort of "you're not a REAL writer if..." pissing contest, so it's generally wiser to avoid getting all up in arms about it either way. But when people complain, that's more the stuff we're talking about. Not reasonable methods for jump-starting creativity and getting your write on, but strange sort of non-writing tricks that do nothing but boost word count.
http://nanowrimo.org/forums/reaching-50-000/threads/119752?page=1
{Twitter, Everybody's doing it. }{Writing and Story Blog}
I think I've finally worked out some stuff about my coup which was troubling me though, which will hopefully make it easier to work on my antagonists plot.
Struggling a bit with a character I was going to kill. Feel like I want her to survive now but I can't tell if it's because her surviving suits the story better, or I'm just being a coward because I like her too much.
{Twitter, Everybody's doing it. }{Writing and Story Blog}
If you kill them, you can't make them suffer any more.
Why I fear the ocean.
What, like on the internet?
That sounds like it might be for nerds.
(where is your newsletter so I may subscribe to it.)
Long Beach was the one I got my feet wet with, most of the other ones are kind of a hike for me to get to (LA and Irvine).
I like this a lot.
=_= yeah, that's four posts.
That story got rejected anyway so poop, butts, etc.
Fuck the haters, Quoth.
There are other people who will buy words.
Part of me feels like it's too late to write anything now, and part of me feels like everything I come up with is terrible but all of me knows that I'm just making excuses because I lost my writing partner and all around safety net.
It's good to see people kicking on at this, you guys are kind of inspirational...but you know said in a way that doesn't make me seem lame.
I feel a bit silly posting an excerpt since y'all are writing space/fantasy/sci-fi and I am writing trashy romance, but here goes:
"We should get you something to eat," Alex was saying, rummaging in the kitchen. "Frozen pizza?"
"Perfect," she said flicking the tv on. She flicked through a few different channels before settling on Sportscenter. She thought sport was a safe bet, nothing too emotional.
Alex came and sat down next to her, taking off his shoes and socks. "I feel like this is a tracks and hoodie kind of occasion, do you mind if I go change?"
Natalie smiled her assent and turned back to the television. Even his feet were gorgeous. How does a person have sexy feet, she wondered. Well, if anyone could, Alex Rojas would. She tried to pay attention to the basketball highlights and stop thinking about Alex's feet.
When he came back he was carrying some clothes. "For you, if you want to change," he said. "Sorry, they're mine, so they will be huge on you, but I thought you might want the option."
"Thanks," she said taking the clothes as he went back to the kitchen. She pulled her singlet off and was still pulling the sweatshirt over her head when Alex came back in. He watched her for a moment before stepping back into the kitchen unseen. "Do you want hawaiian or pepperoni?"
"Pepperoni," she said once she had the sweatshirt on. It smelled like him and she had to resist pulling it up over her face and inhaling.
Alex came back to the sofa and they watched the hockey highlights together. He found it harder to keep his hands off her now that she was wearing his sweatshirt. Which seemed stupid, he thought. You would think it would be easier now that she was more covered, but she looked so damn sexy in those skin tight jeans, her bare feet pulled up under her, her long hair spilling down the back of his sweatshirt. He had never wanted her more, but he knew this was not the right moment. Keep it together, Alex.
I'm pretty sure that doesn't make any sense.
Also, my character woke up, had a shower and started making breakfast. 25K woo!
Actually wait, you can't be. I have never not found another person's feet horrifying.
and then i'll turn off the internet and write, write all day, only turning it back on to check word counts
I am reading Gene Wolfe's Peace and want to talk with someone about it
i didnt do this
im the worst