I do feel really, really bad for Hong Kong because I genuinely don't uh, see a situation where they get any concessions from the CCP. (And even if they were to get a concession, a promise from the CCP is worth less than the paper its printed on.)
"Seattle Mayor Jenny Durkan issued an executive order on Wednesday ordering demonstrators to clear the Capitol Hill Occupied Protest Zone (CHOP), just two days after one person was killed and a 14-year-old boy was injured in a shooting.
Seattle police officers on bikes and on foot began dispersing the crowd at about 5 a.m. PT, per the mayor's order.
"Anyone who remains in the area, or returns to the area, is subject to arrest," the department said on Twitter.
And by daylight, virtually the entire area was cleared. Officers were even going into bathrooms of Cal Anderson Park, looking for any stragglers."
Is this true?
Fuck
0
WeaverWho are you?What do you want?Registered Userregular
edited July 2020
Yep. They still had that whole area blocked off with cops all over when I got into work a couple hours ago.
"Seattle Mayor Jenny Durkan issued an executive order on Wednesday ordering demonstrators to clear the Capitol Hill Occupied Protest Zone (CHOP), just two days after one person was killed and a 14-year-old boy was injured in a shooting.
Seattle police officers on bikes and on foot began dispersing the crowd at about 5 a.m. PT, per the mayor's order.
"Anyone who remains in the area, or returns to the area, is subject to arrest," the department said on Twitter.
And by daylight, virtually the entire area was cleared. Officers were even going into bathrooms of Cal Anderson Park, looking for any stragglers."
Is this true?
Fuck
I mean after they killed a 16 year old it was kind of inevitable.
Sometimes I think about the chinese revolution and how they forced the upperclass into hard labor, I know that doesn't accomplish it's stated goal or anything and that it was largely used as an excuse to removed political dissidents...but sometimes *sigh*.
The CCP commits ethnic cleansing, genocide, torture, political assassination, horrific medical atrocities, indefinite detention and God knows what else on a daily basis. They're also not exactly even fucking remotely Socialist any more; they're basically a nationalist/corporate authoritarian dictatorship/oligarchy and they largely view the common person in China as either an exploitable resource or an irrelevant statistic.
They're just as bad as Putin's Nationalists, if not worse. The fight against bastards of this stripe is a worldwide one.
Sometimes I think about the chinese revolution and how they forced the upperclass into hard labor, I know that doesn't accomplish it's stated goal or anything and that it was largely used as an excuse to removed political dissidents...but sometimes *sigh*.
Re-education is a perfectly fine idea that got co-opted and twisted into "oh this is just prison again" Actual re-education and re-rehabilitation are good ideas and goals! I am very doubtful of the value of punishment in achieving these goals, however.
There's a pretty good reason that people who study the USSR have described them as State Capitalist systems instead of the self-professed claims of being either socialist or communist in function or goal.
The labels made for great propaganda, but at the end of the day an authoritarian government that isn't and will not allow itself to be answerable to its public cannot be, by the actual definition, "Socialist." You need the govern to have political agency and autonomy for that to happen. That's the point of the system.
But, thanks to decades of Cold War propaganda on both sides, "socialism" became "Oh, that's when government owns shit instead of a random group of private citizen aristocrats" instead of "the people who use the stuff own the stuff."
Basically Bakunin was right when he said a dictatorship of the proletariat would just become a tyranny of the party (or whatever it was, I forget the wording) and that is why we should embrace decentralised community socialism i.e anarcho-socialism in this TED talk I will
Basically Bakunin was right when he said a dictatorship of the proletariat would just become a tyranny of the party (or whatever it was, I forget the wording) and that is why we should embrace decentralised community socialism i.e anarcho-socialism in this TED talk I will
Have you read Russia in Flames? It is both a fascinating look at the intra-party conflicts of the Bolshevik revolution and scary as hell to me.
The Chinese government committed actually incalculable atrocities in the name of communism since 1949
I would hope that most people would not look to them as some kind of model for progress
You could say the same about the US and democracy.
Yes you could.
But I don't think anyone is looking to the current US system of political economy as a model for progress, so it seems rather irrelevant.
Many people, most of the USA citizens, I know in my personal life immediately turn to the authoritarian state capitalist hellscapes of the USSR and the CCP as the example of communism, or insist until they're actually blue in the face that the Nazis were totally socialists, just like Bernie and AOC
It would be better to say, for example, that the CCP committed horrible acts of genocide
There's a pretty good reason folks studying the USSR and "Communist" China as State Capitalist governments instead of Socialist or Communist.
The labels made for great propaganda but at the end of the day an authoritarian government that isn't answerable to it's public cannot be, by the actual definition, "Socialist." You need the governed to have political agency and autonomy for that to happen. That is the point.
But thanks to decades of Cold War propaganda on both sides, it became "oh that's when the government owns shit instead of a random group of private citizen aristocrats."
Yeah but but that's just a phase! Come 2045, they'll have reached utopia and will give away all the power to the now perfect populace
The Chinese government committed actually incalculable atrocities in the name of communism since 1949
I would hope that most people would not look to them as some kind of model for progress
You could say the same about the US and democracy.
Yes you could.
But I don't think anyone is looking to the current US system of political economy as a model for progress, so it seems rather irrelevant.
Many people, most of the USA citizens, I know in my personal life immediately turn to the authoritarian state capitalist hellscapes of the USSR and the CCP as the example of communism, or insist until they're actually blue in the face that the Nazis were totally socialists, just like Bernie and AOC
It would be better to say, for example, that the CCP committed horrible acts of genocide
Than to pretend the CCP is communist
The CCP and the USSR may not have been Actual Communists but they did things, and continue to do things, in the name of communism. That matters for getting broader support for leftist policy. At this point it's less US propaganda about the mean Communists and more the mean Communists propaganda about the benevolence of their dictatorship. And still a number of leftists do look to the actions taken by the CCP and the UsSR as a model for what the US should do to move toward communism. I'm not saying people here are doing that, but it's absolutely a thing in other circles.
The Chinese government committed actually incalculable atrocities in the name of communism since 1949
I would hope that most people would not look to them as some kind of model for progress
You could say the same about the US and democracy.
Honestly that’s a really good point because for a shitton of Americans, this country has never been a democracy.
Hell, how many states, for how many decades, still forbade even recognized citizens from voting if they weren’t a landowner throughout the 19th century?
America has never really, truly, been “free”
White Supremacy instead served as a potent drug to craft the illusion of freedom
Lanz on
+4
OrcaAlso known as EspressosaurusWrexRegistered Userregular
"Seattle Mayor Jenny Durkan issued an executive order on Wednesday ordering demonstrators to clear the Capitol Hill Occupied Protest Zone (CHOP), just two days after one person was killed and a 14-year-old boy was injured in a shooting.
Seattle police officers on bikes and on foot began dispersing the crowd at about 5 a.m. PT, per the mayor's order.
"Anyone who remains in the area, or returns to the area, is subject to arrest," the department said on Twitter.
And by daylight, virtually the entire area was cleared. Officers were even going into bathrooms of Cal Anderson Park, looking for any stragglers."
Is this true?
Fuck
I mean after they killed a 16 year old it was kind of inevitable.
Trigger happy fuckers with guns ruin everything yet again.
Posts
"Seattle Mayor Jenny Durkan issued an executive order on Wednesday ordering demonstrators to clear the Capitol Hill Occupied Protest Zone (CHOP), just two days after one person was killed and a 14-year-old boy was injured in a shooting.
Seattle police officers on bikes and on foot began dispersing the crowd at about 5 a.m. PT, per the mayor's order.
"Anyone who remains in the area, or returns to the area, is subject to arrest," the department said on Twitter.
And by daylight, virtually the entire area was cleared. Officers were even going into bathrooms of Cal Anderson Park, looking for any stragglers."
Is this true?
Fuck
I mean after they killed a 16 year old it was kind of inevitable.
Current data indicate that it was completely different vehicle and that those children were innocent of any wrongdoing.
http://www.fallout3nexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=16534
Tankies gonna tank.
This, plus or minus driving around the area real fast which is more kid jackassery than violent crime
Ok thank you
Hard to get some unbiased news about the area
Sometimes I think about the chinese revolution and how they forced the upperclass into hard labor, I know that doesn't accomplish it's stated goal or anything and that it was largely used as an excuse to removed political dissidents...but sometimes *sigh*.
They're just as bad as Putin's Nationalists, if not worse. The fight against bastards of this stripe is a worldwide one.
Re-education is a perfectly fine idea that got co-opted and twisted into "oh this is just prison again" Actual re-education and re-rehabilitation are good ideas and goals! I am very doubtful of the value of punishment in achieving these goals, however.
The labels made for great propaganda, but at the end of the day an authoritarian government that isn't and will not allow itself to be answerable to its public cannot be, by the actual definition, "Socialist." You need the govern to have political agency and autonomy for that to happen. That's the point of the system.
But, thanks to decades of Cold War propaganda on both sides, "socialism" became "Oh, that's when government owns shit instead of a random group of private citizen aristocrats" instead of "the people who use the stuff own the stuff."
I would hope that most people would not look to them as some kind of model for progress
You could say the same about the US and democracy.
Rock Band DLC | GW:OttW - arrcd | WLD - Thortar
Why the whataboutism?
Yes you could.
But I don't think anyone is looking to the current US system of political economy as a model for progress, so it seems rather irrelevant.
Have you read Russia in Flames? It is both a fascinating look at the intra-party conflicts of the Bolshevik revolution and scary as hell to me.
Many people, most of the USA citizens, I know in my personal life immediately turn to the authoritarian state capitalist hellscapes of the USSR and the CCP as the example of communism, or insist until they're actually blue in the face that the Nazis were totally socialists, just like Bernie and AOC
It would be better to say, for example, that the CCP committed horrible acts of genocide
Than to pretend the CCP is communist
Yeah but but that's just a phase! Come 2045, they'll have reached utopia and will give away all the power to the now perfect populace
The CCP and the USSR may not have been Actual Communists but they did things, and continue to do things, in the name of communism. That matters for getting broader support for leftist policy. At this point it's less US propaganda about the mean Communists and more the mean Communists propaganda about the benevolence of their dictatorship. And still a number of leftists do look to the actions taken by the CCP and the UsSR as a model for what the US should do to move toward communism. I'm not saying people here are doing that, but it's absolutely a thing in other circles.
http://www.fallout3nexus.com/downloads/file.php?id=16534
You really just need a twitter to post your stream of conscious shit
Honestly that’s a really good point because for a shitton of Americans, this country has never been a democracy.
Hell, how many states, for how many decades, still forbade even recognized citizens from voting if they weren’t a landowner throughout the 19th century?
America has never really, truly, been “free”
White Supremacy instead served as a potent drug to craft the illusion of freedom
Maybe don't be a dick? You don't have to engage with every post. It's not like this is D&D and every post has to be topical.
Fucking monstrous
Trigger happy fuckers with guns ruin everything yet again.
I am well aware that this is not debate and discourse, I have been posting on this subforum for like a decade
There was very little if any malice in my post; it would be helpful to all parties involved if Royce had an outlet, like many of us do
It read as if there was malice, or at least anger to me, hence why I reacted. You may not have intended it, but that's how I received it.
what would you like to be done about the fact that you read malice where there was none
Maybe we could all be rad to each other instead? Or am I asking for too much.