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The Water Cooler (General Discussion)

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Posts

  • RatherDashingRatherDashing Registered User regular
    I guess my view is that he's not just enmeshed in US lives, he's enmeshed in Twitter itself, which bends completely to his will.

    I don't see any reason to ban links here, all the same.

  • XaquinXaquin Right behind you!Registered User regular
    I feel like anyone online enough to be part of a specific marginalized group -online- than they've probably heard of bluesky by now but maybe that's just me. fwiw, nine days ago I told all of my friends and family I'd be deleting all meta accounts in one and moving to bluesky and if they want to keep in touch here's how. Then after a week I did. I've interacted more with friends and family since I deleted meta in 9 days than I probably have in a year =p

    my 2cp, so not worth much, but communities can move and at this point probably should.

  • amateurhouramateurhour One day I'll be professionalhour The woods somewhere in TennesseeRegistered User regular
    Delzhand wrote: »
    Banning twitter links isn't on the table. Allowing a user to specify that they don't want automatic embeds for certain platforms might be.

    This is all I'd want, honestly. I just want to customize my visual experience to not see random embeds that either don't load or have stuff I'm not interested in. Just some off/on filter for a user setting would be perfect.

    are YOU on the beer list?
  • zerzhulzerzhul Registered User, Moderator mod
    Delzhand wrote: »
    Bowen wrote: »
    just being able to disable them on a per user basis will be good enough for me honestly

    if I never have to see twitter/facebook/instagram hotlinks and dcan just see a little url I'll be good

    I'll look into it! I can't promise it'll be ready by launch, but it sounds doable.

    x aside, i would absolutely love the ability to disable rich embeds as a user preference.

  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] regular
    edited January 22
    The user and all related content has been deleted.

    [Deleted User] on
  • [Deleted User][Deleted User] regular
    edited January 22
    The user and all related content has been deleted.

    [Deleted User] on
  • BowenBowen Sup? Registered User regular
    zerzhul wrote: »
    Delzhand wrote: »
    Bowen wrote: »
    just being able to disable them on a per user basis will be good enough for me honestly

    if I never have to see twitter/facebook/instagram hotlinks and dcan just see a little url I'll be good

    I'll look into it! I can't promise it'll be ready by launch, but it sounds doable.

    x aside, i would absolutely love the ability to disable rich embeds as a user preference.

    I'm okay with like... youtube, so being able to turn each one on and off would be handy.

  • Eat it You Nasty Pig.Eat it You Nasty Pig. tell homeland security 'we are the bomb'Registered User regular
    honestly with the way x/twitter have been handling access to their platform it might not be that long until they stop letting people embed tweets all on their own

    hold your head high soldier, it ain't over yet
    that's why we call it the struggle, you're supposed to sweat
  • Eat it You Nasty Pig.Eat it You Nasty Pig. tell homeland security 'we are the bomb'Registered User regular
    anyway

    will the current forum get archived or something when we move to the new one? Granted a lot of them are pithy and stupid but I've written a bunch of words here over the course of time and it feels weird to lose access to all of them

    hold your head high soldier, it ain't over yet
    that's why we call it the struggle, you're supposed to sweat
  • Undead ScottsmanUndead Scottsman Cybertronian Paranormal Eliminator Registered User regular
    Short answer is no, aside from a possibly a "best of" archive.

    Middle answer is due to several users wanting their data deleted (partially due to the current US politics), it's debatable how much of the forum would even be left by that point.

    Long answer is a big ethical discussion you can read here:
    https://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/252444/content-and-data-migration-the-social-legal-ethical-thread/p1

  • DibbitDibbit Registered User, Transition Team regular
    Short answer is no, aside from a possibly a "best of" archive.

    Middle answer is due to several users wanting their data deleted (partially due to the current US politics), it's debatable how much of the forum would even be left by that point.

    Long answer is a big ethical discussion you can read here:
    https://forums.penny-arcade.com/discussion/252444/content-and-data-migration-the-social-legal-ethical-thread/p1

    To add to this:
    These are the steps that we, the CR community, are taking in regards to the forum.
    In the end, this is not our forum, and PA can do anything they want with their data after this place shuts down.

    Now, I'm not at all saying they will, as they have always been very good about these things, but it is their decision, and we have no influence over it as you basically gave away your rights to object when signing up.
    Do I think they'll sell it to open AI to train a bot army? Nope, but there are no guarantees.
    At least they've been a lot better then Reddit, who are just openly saying "Yes, we're selling access to all our posts, yes it's very lucrative, and yes, we hate it that openAI got it for free because we didn't understand what they were doing."

  • durandal4532durandal4532 Registered User regular
    I am absolutely in favor of banning Twitter embeds. Twitter has been awful for a while but it's progressed far enough beyond the pale that it distresses me anyone isn't interested in ditching it. Get off the platform, it's poison. You can't make it not poison.

    We're all in this together
  • FyreWulffFyreWulff YouRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    edited January 22
    thankfully since cr won't have a 5 person ignore limit, if people can't help but keep embedding twitter i'll just block them until they stop doing so

    now if more than 1000 of you keep embedding twitter i'm kinda screwed

    FyreWulff on
  • PhyphorPhyphor Building Planet Busters Tasting FruitRegistered User regular
    edited January 22
    FyreWulff wrote: »
    thankfully since cr won't have a 5 person ignore limit, if people can't help but keep embedding twitter i'll just block them until they stop doing so

    now if more than 1000 of you keep embedding twitter i'm kinda screwed

    Good news! There's barely a thousand people left that post more than like once a month

    Phyphor on
  • Hahnsoo1Hahnsoo1 Make Ready. We Hunt.Registered User, Moderator, Administrator admin
    Phyphor wrote: »
    FyreWulff wrote: »
    thankfully since cr won't have a 5 person ignore limit, if people can't help but keep embedding twitter i'll just block them until they stop doing so

    now if more than 1000 of you keep embedding twitter i'm kinda screwed

    Good news! There's barely a thousand people left that post more than like once a month

    Ignore everyone except Bizzaro Stormy

    8i1dt37buh2m.png
    MHWilds ID: JF9LL8L3
  • FyreWulffFyreWulff YouRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    bizarro stormy only, no bbcode, 3 stocks, final destination

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  • durandal4532durandal4532 Registered User regular
    Zek wrote: »
    FyreWulff wrote: »
    thankfully since cr won't have a 5 person ignore limit, if people can't help but keep embedding twitter i'll just block them until they stop doing so

    now if more than 1000 of you keep embedding twitter i'm kinda screwed

    This seems quite extreme to me, I really don't want to see the community divided over this. A lot of reputable people who say things worth sharing do still post on Twitter, because that's where their audience is and they're just stuck in this shitty situation. Ignoring a forum poster who embeds one of those tweets because that's the source of truth for the information seems misdirected.

    It is an algorithmic social media platform run by an extremely powerful nazi whose goal is to harm the sort of people who frequent this forum. If people are distressed by the fact that audience capture has trapped their favorite person on the platform, they should stop capturing that person by removing themselves as an audience. Network effects are real, it is important to speed them up. Hell someone somewhere on Gab is saying a nice or newsworthy thing, I'm sure. I still don't want to see shit from Gab.

    I understand that people are mourning the loss of a community that they relied upon and are reluctant to give up their certainly perfectly-pruned feeds that only show the good stuff that's still there, but this is active support of some of the worst shit that's coming and I don't want to be in a place where I see it.

    We're all in this together
  • zagdrobzagdrob Registered User regular
    I think anyone posting a tweet should be required to post a (not linked) screenshot of the tweet - and maybe that's something that can happen programmatically on the initial post so people who don't want to load the tweet can turn that off entirely.

    But definitely at this point especially with the tracking people should be able to disable rich embeds of tweets.

  • HefflingHeffling No Pic EverRegistered User regular
    zagdrob wrote: »
    I think anyone posting a tweet should be required to post a (not linked) screenshot of the tweet - and maybe that's something that can happen programmatically on the initial post so people who don't want to load the tweet can turn that off entirely.

    But definitely at this point especially with the tracking people should be able to disable rich embeds of tweets.

    What's the over/under on Elon suing us because we posted a screencap of a tweet of a sausage?

  • ZibblsnrtZibblsnrt Registered User, Moderator mod
    edited January 23
    Expendable wrote: »
    I wasn't sure where else to drop this, and I recognize that even if the answer is yes (it is almost definitely no), it's a long term sort of thing and not at all immediate.

    But would it be possible to have any images hosted by the forums, or even just in the art areas, automagically glazed to fuck the AIs? Or is the tech still at a stage where we strongly encourage it despite the art areas being login-gated?

    My understanding - others please chip in if they know better - is that glazing's effectiveness has been overstated and what effectiveness exists has been largely defeated by now. Keeping the scrapers away from the images in the first place (i.e., the login gate) is probably the best approach for now.

    Zibblsnrt on
  • LanzLanz ...Za?Registered User regular
    edited January 23
    Zek wrote: »
    FyreWulff wrote: »
    thankfully since cr won't have a 5 person ignore limit, if people can't help but keep embedding twitter i'll just block them until they stop doing so

    now if more than 1000 of you keep embedding twitter i'm kinda screwed

    This seems quite extreme to me, I really don't want to see the community divided over this. A lot of reputable people who say things worth sharing do still post on Twitter, because that's where their audience is and they're just stuck in this shitty situation. Ignoring a forum poster who embeds one of those tweets because that's the source of truth for the information seems misdirected.

    It is an algorithmic social media platform run by an extremely powerful nazi whose goal is to harm the sort of people who frequent this forum. If people are distressed by the fact that audience capture has trapped their favorite person on the platform, they should stop capturing that person by removing themselves as an audience. Network effects are real, it is important to speed them up. Hell someone somewhere on Gab is saying a nice or newsworthy thing, I'm sure. I still don't want to see shit from Gab.

    I understand that people are mourning the loss of a community that they relied upon and are reluctant to give up their certainly perfectly-pruned feeds that only show the good stuff that's still there, but this is active support of some of the worst shit that's coming and I don't want to be in a place where I see it.

    As someone who is part of one of those communities he wants to harm:

    Fuck Him. I was there first.

    bh1xruqp9vim.jpeg

    Lanz on
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  • FishmanFishman Put your goddamned hand in the goddamned Box of Pain. Registered User regular
    Hey, given that we've been able to mine post history for the year over year review, is it possible to also extract collective post times for say, the last 3 years? I thought it might be useful to have context for mod coverage to know when activity occurs.

    X-Com LP Thread I, II, III, IV, V
    That's unbelievably cool. Your new name is cool guy. Let's have sex.
  • FyreWulffFyreWulff YouRegistered User, ClubPA regular
    Zek wrote: »
    FyreWulff wrote: »
    thankfully since cr won't have a 5 person ignore limit, if people can't help but keep embedding twitter i'll just block them until they stop doing so

    now if more than 1000 of you keep embedding twitter i'm kinda screwed

    This seems quite extreme to me, I really don't want to see the community divided over this. A lot of reputable people who say things worth sharing do still post on Twitter, because that's where their audience is and they're just stuck in this shitty situation. Ignoring a forum poster who embeds one of those tweets because that's the source of truth for the information seems misdirected.

    It is an algorithmic social media platform run by an extremely powerful nazi whose goal is to harm the sort of people who frequent this forum. If people are distressed by the fact that audience capture has trapped their favorite person on the platform, they should stop capturing that person by removing themselves as an audience. Network effects are real, it is important to speed them up. Hell someone somewhere on Gab is saying a nice or newsworthy thing, I'm sure. I still don't want to see shit from Gab.

    I understand that people are mourning the loss of a community that they relied upon and are reluctant to give up their certainly perfectly-pruned feeds that only show the good stuff that's still there, but this is active support of some of the worst shit that's coming and I don't want to be in a place where I see it.

    Yeah, even if he's losing money on the endeavor, I'm reminded of the quote from Citizen Kane:

    "I did lose a million dollars last year. I expect to lose a million dollars this year. I expect to lose a million dollars next year! You know, Mr. Thatcher, at the rate of a million dollars a year, I'll have to close this place in 60 years."

    If the doors to the Nazi bar closed I wouldn't lose a wink of sleep.

    Yeah. At first, it was funny to make Elon lose tons of money but at this point he's gonna be kept afloat by Trump so might as well do the only thing that will actually kill Twitter and that is break the network effect by freeing everyone from the circular social capture of it.

  • XaquinXaquin Right behind you!Registered User regular
    not sure if this was covered or where or if I just missed it or forgot ....

    how is the image hosting working in the new forums? same as here?

    do I need a flickr account or something similar to pull from?

  • minor incidentminor incident publicly subsidized! privately profitable!Registered User, Transition Team regular
    Xaquin wrote: »
    not sure if this was covered or where or if I just missed it or forgot ....

    how is the image hosting working in the new forums? same as here?

    do I need a flickr account or something similar to pull from?

    The actual backend hosting solution is still up in the air to some degree I believe (but that's nothing a user would ever have to see or know about). The user facing side works exactly like it does here on Vanilla, basically.

    Hell, New Jersey, it said on the letter. Delivered without comment. So be it!
  • XaquinXaquin Right behind you!Registered User regular
  • PhyphorPhyphor Building Planet Busters Tasting FruitRegistered User regular
    Fishman wrote: »
    Hey, given that we've been able to mine post history for the year over year review, is it possible to also extract collective post times for say, the last 3 years? I thought it might be useful to have context for mod coverage to know when activity occurs.

    In theory, any answer is just a few selects away. What are you interested in, when most people are active? That's likely just going to be unsurprising though, corresponding to a peak around the US timezones afternoon/evening

  • FishmanFishman Put your goddamned hand in the goddamned Box of Pain. Registered User regular
    Phyphor wrote: »
    Fishman wrote: »
    Hey, given that we've been able to mine post history for the year over year review, is it possible to also extract collective post times for say, the last 3 years? I thought it might be useful to have context for mod coverage to know when activity occurs.

    In theory, any answer is just a few selects away. What are you interested in, when most people are active? That's likely just going to be unsurprising though, corresponding to a peak around the US timezones afternoon/evening

    More like 'what would be a good distribution of mod active hours to ensure we have sufficient coverage to match posting habits,'. Like, as one of the NZ/Aus timezone members, I know we've felt like our active hours weren't well covered even when we did have supposedly numerous moderation. I just wonder whether there's metrics or data to see an hourly breakdown of activity, that could then inform a sort of idea of what a good distribution of moderation coverage might be.

    E.g. if we had a dozen mods, would that be 7 across peak US times, 3 sort of Europe-ish, and 2 for Oceania/Asia (they wouldn't have to be based in those locales, just regularly active at those times).

    X-Com LP Thread I, II, III, IV, V
    That's unbelievably cool. Your new name is cool guy. Let's have sex.
  • localhjaylocalhjay Registered User regular
    Re: we should stop using Twitter because it is owned by an alt right shithead

    I have bad news about all the other sites you probably use

  • durandal4532durandal4532 Registered User regular
    localhjay wrote: »
    Re: we should stop using Twitter because it is owned by an alt right shithead

    I have bad news about all the other sites you probably use

    It isn’t worldly and clever to use cynicism to excuse supporting Musk, it’s just capitulation.

    There is, I hope at least, a general consensus here that excitedly posting the latest updates from stormfront or gab wouldn’t be tolerated even though other websites are also owned by bad people.

    I understand that this is uncomfortable, I just don’t have much sympathy for that fact when the arguments in support of continuing to mainline a nazi’s idea of what news matters amounts to ‘no one’s perfect and I don’t feel like finding cute animal pictures elsewhere’.

    We're all in this together
  • XaquinXaquin Right behind you!Registered User regular
    localhjay wrote: »
    Re: we should stop using Twitter because it is owned by an alt right shithead

    I have bad news about all the other sites you probably use

    what's up with bluesky? I paid for cohost until it went under =/

  • LanzLanz ...Za?Registered User regular
    edited January 23
    The problem with posting content from Stormfront or Gab is that you’re going to be, you know, posting literal Nazi shit

    Is this literal Nazi shit?

    p0uo01ucutaj.jpeg
    94eu9la9k5v7.jpeg
    533773qguaf5.jpeg
    in2npkr1cv4a.jpeg
    7aym1f8n6r80.jpeg
    iek2fop7rofs.jpeg
    zjg8h9yzin2z.jpeg
    jh8keebgam7y.jpeg

    Lanz on
  • XaquinXaquin Right behind you!Registered User regular
    if it's on twitter it's presumably giving ad revenue to nazi shit?

    either way it's keeping it afloat with user numbers

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  • localhjaylocalhjay Registered User regular
    localhjay wrote: »
    Re: we should stop using Twitter because it is owned by an alt right shithead

    I have bad news about all the other sites you probably use

    It isn’t worldly and clever to use cynicism to excuse supporting Musk, it’s just capitulation.

    There is, I hope at least, a general consensus here that excitedly posting the latest updates from stormfront or gab wouldn’t be tolerated even though other websites are also owned by bad people.

    I understand that this is uncomfortable, I just don’t have much sympathy for that fact when the arguments in support of continuing to mainline a nazi’s idea of what news matters amounts to ‘no one’s perfect and I don’t feel like finding cute animal pictures elsewhere’.

    Not really trying to be clever, I'm pointing out the old truth "no ethical consumption under capitalism" and once you start going down this road, you quickly realize that indeed everything you probably use day to day or enjoy in some way upholds systems ideologies you probably detest and find problematic. So yes, if you want to draw your personal line at twitter that's fine, but expecting the rest of the internet to fall behind that line you're drawn for yourself is a bit much

    Going deeper, would say we should stop using YouTube?
    Because here's the CEO hanging out with Ben Shapiro and other alt right podcasters right before the election
    cmctbpkqfz02.jpg

    Where's the Google CEO during the inauguration? Oh right next to the other assholes CEOs?
    w11cjwthdv2m.jpg
    Better stop using um... Everything powered by google

    And I mean, I certainly hope you don't use Amazon in any capacity, wether directly or through their hosting servers in AWS.
    Current Amazon CEO is kissing the ring as we speak
    https://x.com/ajassy/status/1881460165523996873?

    Should I keep going or

  • ToxTox I kill threads Dilige, et quod vis facRegistered User regular
    And speaking of Amazon, definitely don't ever link Washington Post articles either

    maybe the real panopticon was the friends we made along the way
  • LanzLanz ...Za?Registered User regular
    Douglas wrote: »
    Twitters actually bleeding money at a hilarious rate, so if you use it or share tweets, you actually costing Elon money

    We should all join Twitter, post in twitter, and embed tweets of our posts in every forum thread

    From October:

    https://www.socialmediatoday.com/news/x-formerly-twitter-could-post-a-significant-loss-in-2024/730370/
    To put that $2.9 billion total in context, in 2022, the final year before Elon took over at the app, Twitter generated $4.4 billion in revenue, predominantly, again, through ad revenue. In 2023, Musk’s first year at the company, that declined to around $3.4 billion, with ad revenue dropping significantly.

    So it would be another significant decline, if these estimates are correct.

    Further complicating this is X’s debt service costs, which came as part of Musk’s takeover deal. In order to purchase Twitter, Elon borrowed a portion of the $44 billion cost ($13b) from various banks, and attached the debt from those loans to the company itself, avoiding personal liability. At present, debt servicing is set to cost X $1.2 billion per year.

    Take away $1.2 billion from X’s $2.9 billion in total revenue, and that doesn’t leave a lot for X to pay its various other costs, let alone make a profit.

    As such, growing the business, at this stage, seems very unlikely, and there’s a very real possibility that X is going to be running at a significant loss for the full year. That’s why X is now pushing other avenues for potential intake, like selling @handles for hundreds of thousands of dollars each, and offering ad credits for brands willing to pay for X Premium.

    Of course, X is now a private company, and we don’t have full insight into its actual operating data, so we don’t know the full details of its financial performance. But we do know that advertisers are still avoiding the app, with Musk’s political commentary seemingly prompting more and more hesitation in ad sales.

    Which will leave the business in a precarious situation, and could lead to a shutdown of the entire project.

    That’d probably be part of the reason Musk kept ownership private, because the financial reporting requirements of a publicly traded company would reveal that he’s run the fucking thing into the ground financially, because his prerogatives don’t actually align with making money (he’d like to, but remember he’s a dipshit whose failed at multiple businesses where other owners tossed him out on his ass before he could bring the company down and his only “success” has come from discovering how to scam the government and other people out of billions through Tesla and Spaxe X contracts (Tesla primarily makes its revenue from carbon credits)

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