So A$AP Rocky, some artist, was in Sweden. After a concert he was followed by some men, there was a fight, he's detained on suspicion of assault, and ditto for one of the other men who assaulted his bodyguard.
Kanye West and Kim Kardashian got Trump on the phone and/or tweet, and Trump promised to speak to the "very talented" Swedish PM, to discuss getting Rocky releaseed on bail or something. Trump claims this conversation happened, and offered to cover the bail.
Had to be a pretty short one, because our constitution separates government from the court system, and it would be unconstitutional for a minister to get involved in a legal case. Also, there's no concept of bail in the Swedish legal system. A$AP Rocky is kept detained pending investigation because he's deemed a flight risk that will GTFO and never come back if released.
Welcome to European bureaucracy. You don't buy your way out with money or publicity over here.
There's also an American ex-ambassador to Sweden getting involved and making rather ignorant statements along the same lines. You'd expect a former ambassador to a country to be somewhat aware of how that country works, but here we are.
edit: the ambassador was an Obama appointee, for the record.
Justin Bieber tweeted at trump about this and also said what about those kids in cages.
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Zilla36021st Century. |She/Her|Trans* Woman In Aviators Firing A Bazooka. ⚛️Registered Userregular
So A$AP Rocky, some artist, was in Sweden. After a concert he was followed by some men, there was a fight, he's detained on suspicion of assault, and ditto for one of the other men who assaulted his bodyguard.
Kanye West and Kim Kardashian got Trump on the phone and/or tweet, and Trump promised to speak to the "very talented" Swedish PM, to discuss getting Rocky releaseed on bail or something. Trump claims this conversation happened, and offered to cover the bail.
Had to be a pretty short one, because our constitution separates government from the court system, and it would be unconstitutional for a minister to get involved in a legal case. Also, there's no concept of bail in the Swedish legal system. A$AP Rocky is kept detained pending investigation because he's deemed a flight risk that will GTFO and never come back if released.
Welcome to European bureaucracy. You don't buy your way out with money or publicity over here.
There's also an American ex-ambassador to Sweden getting involved and making rather ignorant statements along the same lines. You'd expect a former ambassador to a country to be somewhat aware of how that country works, but here we are.
edit: the ambassador was an Obama appointee, for the record.
This is like the plot of a South Park episode. WTH, 2019. :rotate:
I swear I recall there was a white person with a similar fight incident and he was allowed to leave.
My understanding of the situation is that the other guy plead guilty and paid his fine. A$AP claims innocence.
A$AP hasnt been charged yet. G Easy had a deal in 48 hours(on more(?) serious charges)
I'm not an expert of Swedish law, but there doesn't seem to be such a thing as "deals" in Swedish courts. What happened with the other guy is that he did drugs and attacked a security guard, and when he was arrested he admitted to doing it. So, they put him in court, gave him his sentence, he paid the fine, and was free to go.
A$AP claims innocence, so they're investigating the situation. He's held in captivity because he's a flight risk (Swedish supreme court, or their equivalent of it, has at some point decided that all foreign citizens are inherently a flight risk). As for not being charged yet, he is being "suspected of crimes", which in the Swedish system seems to be when there's enough to arrest you, but official charges have not yet been raised.
To further add to the situation, it's Summer vacation season so there's some understaffing going on, which is the main reason why A$AP's stay in jail has been extended by a week or two.
Again, not an expert of Swedish law, this is just my rough understanding of the situation based on what I've read about it.
HonkHonk is this poster.Registered User, __BANNED USERSregular
Rocky is probably guilty in a technical sense given how limited you are in what you can do to defend yourself here. Even if the other dudes harassed or even threw the first punch. It might be difficult to square with your world view to consider yourself guilty in that case.
There’s nothing US ambassadors or even Trump can do to get involved in the process though like Echo said. Unfortunately I wouldn’t expect Swedish law to be handling this totally unbiased either. There’s a hard on for “oh you think you can come here and do x because you’re a big deal”. Snoop gets stopped and searched and made to piss whenever he visits on the basis that being Snoop is probably cause.
Nobody will come out looking good when this is over.
I swear I recall there was a white person with a similar fight incident and he was allowed to leave.
My understanding of the situation is that the other guy plead guilty and paid his fine. A$AP claims innocence.
A$AP hasnt been charged yet. G Easy had a deal in 48 hours(on more(?) serious charges)
I'm not an expert of Swedish law, but there doesn't seem to be such a thing as "deals" in Swedish courts. What happened with the other guy is that he did drugs and attacked a security guard, and when he was arrested he admitted to doing it. So, they put him in court, gave him his sentence, he paid the fine, and was free to go.
A$AP claims innocence, so they're investigating the situation. He's held in captivity because he's a flight risk (Swedish supreme court, or their equivalent of it, has at some point decided that all foreign citizens are inherently a flight risk). As for not being charged yet, he is being "suspected of crimes", which in the Swedish system seems to be when there's enough to arrest you, but official charges have not yet been raised.
To further add to the situation, it's Summer vacation season so there's some understaffing going on, which is the main reason why A$AP's stay in jail has been extended by a week or two.
Again, not an expert of Swedish law, this is just my rough understanding of the situation based on what I've read about it.
The other guy did illegal drugs and assaulted someone.
ASAP rockey got in a fight with people who followed him and his bodyguard out of a bar, down the street, and threw the first punch. ASAP and his bodyguard tried to de-escalate as this was happening.
It looks a lot like there was some difference between the two defendents with regards to how the legal system is treating them
Europeans likes to arrest american rappers on spurious charges. Freddie Gibbs was arrested in France in 2016 for raping someone in Austria in 2015 then acquitted of all charges 3 months later.
I'm skeptical A$AP is guilty, but it's the Kanye+Kim calling the president that just makes me want to hang my head
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reVerseAttack and Dethrone GodRegistered Userregular
I swear I recall there was a white person with a similar fight incident and he was allowed to leave.
My understanding of the situation is that the other guy plead guilty and paid his fine. A$AP claims innocence.
A$AP hasnt been charged yet. G Easy had a deal in 48 hours(on more(?) serious charges)
I'm not an expert of Swedish law, but there doesn't seem to be such a thing as "deals" in Swedish courts. What happened with the other guy is that he did drugs and attacked a security guard, and when he was arrested he admitted to doing it. So, they put him in court, gave him his sentence, he paid the fine, and was free to go.
A$AP claims innocence, so they're investigating the situation. He's held in captivity because he's a flight risk (Swedish supreme court, or their equivalent of it, has at some point decided that all foreign citizens are inherently a flight risk). As for not being charged yet, he is being "suspected of crimes", which in the Swedish system seems to be when there's enough to arrest you, but official charges have not yet been raised.
To further add to the situation, it's Summer vacation season so there's some understaffing going on, which is the main reason why A$AP's stay in jail has been extended by a week or two.
Again, not an expert of Swedish law, this is just my rough understanding of the situation based on what I've read about it.
The other guy did illegal drugs and assaulted someone.
ASAP rockey got in a fight with people who followed him and his bodyguard out of a bar, down the street, and threw the first punch. ASAP and his bodyguard tried to de-escalate as this was happening.
It looks a lot like there was some difference between the two defendents with regards to how the legal system is treating them
The difference being that the other guy admitted he was guilty, whereas A$AP claims innocence.
Also, who escalated what and who threw the first punch are the kind of things that are taken into consideration during sentencing, not before a trial. Right now all they've got is a bunch of people who committed assault on each other in jail while the police and/or the prosecutor investigates what happened and what kind of charges are appropriate.
Also whether or not A$AP Rocky is guilty, there's literally video footage of the fight.
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HonkHonk is this poster.Registered User, __BANNED USERSregular
Europeans likes to arrest american rappers on spurious charges. Freddie Gibbs was arrested in France in 2016 for raping someone in Austria in 2015 then acquitted of all charges 3 months later.
I'm skeptical A$AP is guilty, but it's the Kanye+Kim calling the president that just makes me want to hang my head
If you have the option to run in a straight line away you can’t punch back is the thing. So he’s probably guilty in the sense that it’s something he’ll probably end up convicted for. That’s how it is.
Europeans likes to arrest american rappers on spurious charges. Freddie Gibbs was arrested in France in 2016 for raping someone in Austria in 2015 then acquitted of all charges 3 months later.
I'm skeptical A$AP is guilty, but it's the Kanye+Kim calling the president that just makes me want to hang my head
If you have the option to run in a straight line away you can’t punch back is the thing. So he’s probably guilty in the sense that it’s something he’ll probably end up convicted for. That’s how it is.
Yeah, the American version of "self defense" is not universal. And "stand your ground" is not even close to normal.
In Australia, for example, even if you're in your own home, and you're legally permitted to own a firearm, it's an offense to use it.
The notion that you can be convicted of "self-defense" is kind of mind boggling to me. And that's probably an american-centric view, but like, that make no sense
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reVerseAttack and Dethrone GodRegistered Userregular
The notion that you can be convicted of "self-defense" is kind of mind boggling to me. And that's probably an american-centric view, but like, that make no sense
In Scandinavian countries, the idea behind self-defense is that you are allowed to defend yourself from immediate harm, but after that you're supposed to remove yourself from the situation. Escape, as opposed to stay and fight.
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HonkHonk is this poster.Registered User, __BANNED USERSregular
You can do as much violence as the situation calls for in order to defend yourself, which unless you are surrounded by walls on all sides is often zero.
The notion that you can be convicted of "self-defense" is kind of mind boggling to me. And that's probably an american-centric view, but like, that make no sense
Well, it's to avoid things like the Treyvon Martin killing where it is strongly suspected that "self-defense" was an excuse for murder.
Europeans likes to arrest american rappers on spurious charges. Freddie Gibbs was arrested in France in 2016 for raping someone in Austria in 2015 then acquitted of all charges 3 months later.
I'm skeptical A$AP is guilty, but it's the Kanye+Kim calling the president that just makes me want to hang my head
If you have the option to run in a straight line away you can’t punch back is the thing. So he’s probably guilty in the sense that it’s something he’ll probably end up convicted for. That’s how it is.
Yeah, the American version of "self defense" is not universal. And "stand your ground" is not even close to normal.
In Australia, for example, even if you're in your own home, and you're legally permitted to own a firearm, it's an offense to use it.
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Pretty sure we're allowed to use proportional violence, so if you have a gun and have reason to believe the attacker is using or is about to use a gun, then it's legal to retaliate.
We are allowed to use proportional violence, the statement that we can't use firearms to defend ourselves is incorrect. You can't purchase a firearm with the intent of only self defence, though.
On topic - good on the Swedish for not bowing to the pressure on this; it's good to see that they don't just buckle under at the first hint of pressure. It's not like Trump will remember this for more than a month, anyway.
We are allowed to use proportional violence, the statement that we can't use firearms to defend ourselves is incorrect. You can't purchase a firearm with the intent of only self defence, though.
On topic - good on the Swedish for not bowing to the pressure on this; it's good to see that they don't just buckle under at the first hint of pressure. It's not like Trump will remember this for more than a month hour, anyway.
Fixed that for you. Trump only gave a shit as long as he had to. Which I think was two minutes. Maybe less.
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KoopahTroopahThe koopas, the troopas.Philadelphia, PARegistered Userregular
Iranian intelligence authorities said Monday they had arrested 17 spies hired by the U.S. government's Central Intelligence Agency.
“All 17 spies are Iranian nationals,” the director of the counter-espionage of the Islamic Republic intelligence ministry said at a press conference. The name of the director was not disclosed.
Those arrested worked as staff at sensitive centers in the country, including “economic, nuclear, infrastructural, military and cyber fields or their counterpart private sector," according to the Iranian intelligence press release.
Some of the spies who declined to cooperate with the Islamic Republic intelligence after their arrest have been sent to the judiciary and their cases are being processed. Their sentences will be either execution or a long imprisonment, the intelligence director said.
This doesn't seem good at all, especially with the drone getting shot down stuff from earlier.
It's just as likely they are politically inconvenient Iranian nationals as they are actual recruited sources and agents. It's also possible that the charges are completely fabricated or exaggerated.
What the over/under on how long till we find out that the spies were uncovered due to Trump admin incompetence? I say less than a week.
It wouldn’t be the first time they burned spies.
Well it's Iran, so even money that the "spies" were just people who did something they didn't like.
It's a common accusation they use against both Iranian nationals and foreign nationals who are inconvenient like environmental activists, journalists etc.
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Metzger MeisterIt Gets Worsebefore it gets any better.Registered Userregular
From what I've read Trump has categorically denied that the event even took place, which bodes ill for those involved.
having trouble posting links, but the guardian has Mike Pompeo basically saying, "it's up to the U.K. to deal with Iran. Guess first official real moment of our abrogating our role in Bretton Woods.
Between the 2000 mile out USS Abraham Lincoln force (2-3 day response time, maybe less?) and the newly arrived USS Boxer force the US military has over 10,000 personnel operating in the region and is projecting a ton of force.
Even if public statements are saying that we aren't prepared to get involved over this particular incident, we just had a large fleet show up and immediately down a drone. It looks like the US is prepared to escalate far beyond what Iran is able to respond to.
In this video the President threatens to nuke Afghanistan.
Well, he says could 'wipe it off the face the Earth' in 10 days if he wanted to "win" that war; which is damning our nuclear arsenal with low praise if that was his meaning.
I think the more relevant take away is that he doesn't understand any of the goals that would need be met to call Afghanistan a "win".
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Metzger MeisterIt Gets Worsebefore it gets any better.Registered Userregular
He doesn't realize we're not actually at war with the nation.
I believe he's meeting with the head of Pakistan today who was demanding some kind of response to the amount of lives and money pakistan has lost in aiding the US in afganistan.
I would like some money because these are artisanal nuggets of wisdom philistine.
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Justin Bieber tweeted at trump about this and also said what about those kids in cages.
pleasepaypreacher.net
My understanding of the situation is that the other guy plead guilty and paid his fine. A$AP claims innocence.
A$AP hasnt been charged yet. G Easy had a deal in 48 hours(on more(?) serious charges)
I'm not an expert of Swedish law, but there doesn't seem to be such a thing as "deals" in Swedish courts. What happened with the other guy is that he did drugs and attacked a security guard, and when he was arrested he admitted to doing it. So, they put him in court, gave him his sentence, he paid the fine, and was free to go.
A$AP claims innocence, so they're investigating the situation. He's held in captivity because he's a flight risk (Swedish supreme court, or their equivalent of it, has at some point decided that all foreign citizens are inherently a flight risk). As for not being charged yet, he is being "suspected of crimes", which in the Swedish system seems to be when there's enough to arrest you, but official charges have not yet been raised.
To further add to the situation, it's Summer vacation season so there's some understaffing going on, which is the main reason why A$AP's stay in jail has been extended by a week or two.
Again, not an expert of Swedish law, this is just my rough understanding of the situation based on what I've read about it.
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There’s nothing US ambassadors or even Trump can do to get involved in the process though like Echo said. Unfortunately I wouldn’t expect Swedish law to be handling this totally unbiased either. There’s a hard on for “oh you think you can come here and do x because you’re a big deal”. Snoop gets stopped and searched and made to piss whenever he visits on the basis that being Snoop is probably cause.
Nobody will come out looking good when this is over.
The other guy did illegal drugs and assaulted someone.
ASAP rockey got in a fight with people who followed him and his bodyguard out of a bar, down the street, and threw the first punch. ASAP and his bodyguard tried to de-escalate as this was happening.
It looks a lot like there was some difference between the two defendents with regards to how the legal system is treating them
I'm skeptical A$AP is guilty, but it's the Kanye+Kim calling the president that just makes me want to hang my head
The difference being that the other guy admitted he was guilty, whereas A$AP claims innocence.
Also, who escalated what and who threw the first punch are the kind of things that are taken into consideration during sentencing, not before a trial. Right now all they've got is a bunch of people who committed assault on each other in jail while the police and/or the prosecutor investigates what happened and what kind of charges are appropriate.
Also whether or not A$AP Rocky is guilty, there's literally video footage of the fight.
If you have the option to run in a straight line away you can’t punch back is the thing. So he’s probably guilty in the sense that it’s something he’ll probably end up convicted for. That’s how it is.
Yeah, the American version of "self defense" is not universal. And "stand your ground" is not even close to normal.
In Australia, for example, even if you're in your own home, and you're legally permitted to own a firearm, it's an offense to use it.
In Scandinavian countries, the idea behind self-defense is that you are allowed to defend yourself from immediate harm, but after that you're supposed to remove yourself from the situation. Escape, as opposed to stay and fight.
Well, it's to avoid things like the Treyvon Martin killing where it is strongly suspected that "self-defense" was an excuse for murder.
Rock Band DLC | GW:OttW - arrcd | WLD - Thortar
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Pretty sure we're allowed to use proportional violence, so if you have a gun and have reason to believe the attacker is using or is about to use a gun, then it's legal to retaliate.
On topic - good on the Swedish for not bowing to the pressure on this; it's good to see that they don't just buckle under at the first hint of pressure. It's not like Trump will remember this for more than a month, anyway.
Fixed that for you. Trump only gave a shit as long as he had to. Which I think was two minutes. Maybe less.
This doesn't seem good at all, especially with the drone getting shot down stuff from earlier.
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It wouldn’t be the first time they burned spies.
Battlenet ID: MildC#11186 - If I'm in the game, send me an invite at anytime and I'll play.
Well it's Iran, so even money that the "spies" were just people who did something they didn't like.
It could just as easily be people that trump didn't like.
Man I hate that we've reached a point where that's a real possibility.
It's a common accusation they use against both Iranian nationals and foreign nationals who are inconvenient like environmental activists, journalists etc.
Even if public statements are saying that we aren't prepared to get involved over this particular incident, we just had a large fleet show up and immediately down a drone. It looks like the US is prepared to escalate far beyond what Iran is able to respond to.
In this video the President threatens to nuke Afghanistan.
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IS HE NOT MERCIFUL?
Well, he says could 'wipe it off the face the Earth' in 10 days if he wanted to "win" that war; which is damning our nuclear arsenal with low praise if that was his meaning.
I think the more relevant take away is that he doesn't understand any of the goals that would need be met to call Afghanistan a "win".
Brown people live there
Fail to win itself without us being willing to put in the effort and face the consequences of actually conquering and pacifying all of it?
He doesn't realize we're not actually at war with the nation.
I believe he's meeting with the head of Pakistan today who was demanding some kind of response to the amount of lives and money pakistan has lost in aiding the US in afganistan.
pleasepaypreacher.net